Enough, I get it.
I don’t even want to ride my bike anymore in case one of you happen to be riding the trails, I know that there’s several members living in my area and I’m sure one of them is responsible for the the “coke and hookers” prank played on me over several months at the beginning of lockdown. Your comments do have an effect on people’s daily life, they’re extremely hurtful and harmful.
You think it’s all a joke, even 3 moderators have joined in trolling, harassing and using emotive, derogatory, harmful, and offensive language. One post has inferred that I should commit suicide “I think some of faerie’s problems on his forum might stem from these sorts of difficulties with social interaction, difficulties that won’t go away no matter how much medical intervention you throw at them.” several have told me that if I don’t like the harassment and the bigotry then essentially I shouldn’t go out or on the Internet.
I get it, I’m not welcome.
Can you all please stop now and forget I ever existed.

I think it’s time to let the police decide.

https://www.cps.gov.uk/crime-info/cyber-online-crime

We’re now running on to the 3rd day of harassment over multiple threads, which is being encouraged by mods and I’ve reported numerous posts but no action has been taken.
*Edit

“Virtual mobbing takes place when a number of individuals use social media or messaging to make comments to or about another individual, usually because they are opposed to that person’s opinions. The volume of messages may amount to a campaign of harassment.”
https://www.cps.gov.uk/crime-info/cyber-online-crime

Grum, I get the picture that I am unwelcome here. Thank you for adding your voice to the many others clarifying me as an outsider both on the forum and in the cycling community.

Cougar you are a representative of the magazine on the forum and as a moderator you have a duty of care towards forum users and maintain the magazines forum rules.
You abandon these rules on any thread about protected characteristics to support bigotry and harass users that don’t take your view point, you are the most prolific voice of bigoted views. You’ve used emotive words such as ludicrous and melodramatic and to describe my opposing arguments and me as a person to get it “into my skull”, you’ve twisted my words and then called me a liar. Forum rules clearly don’t apply to you, you have employed gaslighting techniques and you encouraged and allowed others to harass myself and others. I repeatedly tried to leave the thread, but was called back by several users to defend my position, leaving me in an awkward situation where I’m dammed if I do and dammed if I don’t. Yet you are surprised that I reacted and it’s an abuse of your position.
I have remained polite and answered each question to the best of my ability, without using emotive words to belittle and undermine your personality although I have called out your behaviour. You have never apologised to me (I’d have screenshot it for posterity) for anything that you have said in any of the situations and have continued to slate my character when I was unable to defend myself, as is evident on the thread about previous forum users when I was banned and last night when the thread was closed and then reopened by yourself so that you could continue with others to try and shame me
I do take screenshots of what I and others say for evidence of discrimination and harassment towards myself and other minorities within the cycling community. I have been entirely open and honest about my situation and shared details which are extremely personal, yet you just don’t give a crap about others feelings and use your platform for hate and harassment. And again you try to shame and silence me for doing so and paint me as an outsider who is unwelcome, which is gaslighting.
As this is the 3rd time that you have done so, you make it very, very clear that you don’t welcome anyone on the forum who is a minority and opposed to discrimination.

Tomhoward, I don’t look for the worst in people they write that for themselves. Did you just post to put me down and add to my harassment from the many sycophants? That would be a bit shit, wouldn’t it?

Cougar I offered you an apology at the time, which you have repeatedly used as a weapon against me to prove that you are right and have used it again here. I didn’t single you out and included many other examples from other users, however you are in a position power being a moderator and have demonstrated a few times that you are not as unbias as you believe yourself to be, allowing discriminatory comments to stand whilst deleting and banning people who contradict you.
Tonight you have orchestrated a witch hunt against me and slandered my character, you have never expressed regret over any of your previous comments as I have had the good grace to do before.
It seems a weak response (doesn’t it?) but I am sorry that this has caused you emotional angst, having experienced it myself I really wouldn’t wish it on anyone but have you considered how Rachel or Jon felt? Rachel was begging for the abuse to stop, but you in your position as moderator allowed it to continue.
I’m unsure if there’s any BAME voices but I have spoken of my deep concerns for my children in a world with so much hate and ignorance and it also gives me sleepless nights.
You’ve been attacking me when I’ve had no right of reply, so I took to another platform where we are both equal and I can defend myself.

Have you all had a good laugh at my expense? I’m glad that I’ve provided your evening entertainment at my personal expense.
“Imagine taking the Internet so seriously”
Things said on the Internet have real life consequences and carry on into our day to day lives. How many of you have met with people from the forum for a ride, beer or to travel the country to help someone in need?
How many of you discuss the issues and opinions expressed on this forum with your friends and family?
Issues regarding gender identity, misogyny and race affects people in the real world too and are not just the topic du jour that we can put down our devices and walk away from.
I see that Cougars post defaming me is still standing without an apology or moderation. So here is a link below to my post that he replied to, as you can see that it was he who joined the thread and I did not stalk him. I was upset that I had received a ban for calling out bigotry although the onus was put on me indirectly saying that someone would be an “ejit” and hypocritical if they would disallow a black person to be equated with a monkey but would allow a gif portraying black people as lazy. I was labelled a bully and banned for that. I raised the issue on twitter as I wasn’t allowed to reply here, highlighting the discrimination on the forum as Cycling UK had partnered with STW for their inclusion campaign and felt that anyone who doesn’t fit the expected profile is unwelcome in cycling.
I can see the lengths that Mark and the STW team have recently been making a huge effort to promote cycling as a welcoming and inclusive sport to people from all sorts of backgrounds and beliefs. It’s a great shame that threads like this have a shadow cast over them because people can’t see past their own circumstances and can’t empathise with people whose circumstances are not our norm. The toxicity has driven people who would enrich our lives with different perspectives have been driven away from the magazine and possibly even cycling. I have tried to provide a voice for those who aren’t here to defend themselves and have been silenced on more than one occasion because my humane views are unpopular.
Someone asked that if I’m so easily offended why don’t I just stay in. The answer to that is that I do, I’m autistic and vulnerable as I cannot read facial expressions, take comments and conversation literally and I don’t recognise when I’m in a dangerous situation, I was raped because of my naivety. My life is purely virtual where I can connect at a safe distance and my bike is my escape, but I don’t even feel comfortable doing that anymore.
Cheers guys.

@WeAreCyclingUK @UCI_MTB @SRtRCScotland @SRTRC_England @SwanAutism, @singletrackmag even published an article about my anti bigotry and weaponised my autism by referring to me as a "bot".
Discrimination is more than just hate, it's apathy, ignorance, power, privilege pic.twitter.com/1HJDbpGNIh

— Aweeshoe (@aweeshoe) May 14, 2019

@scotroutes, are you jumping on the wagon? I should have put quote marks as that was an accusation against me

Woah! Steady on there cougar, those allegations are libelous slander and untrue. Anyone else would be banned for your attack.

You launched a targeted smear campaign across social media CC:ing half the Western world, targeting STW generally and me personally, based on a misunderstanding. When I finally got it into your skull that you’d made a mistake you apologised and thanked me for the role I provide here – quietly via PM where no-one else could see your climb-down. I can give you a screenshot of that for your collection if you like.

Yes, I took to twitter to highlight the bigotry on the forum and cc’d in Cycling UK as they had just launched their cycling inclusion campaign. I was silenced on here but you can’t crush me on twitter, cycling and human rights are two things I’m passionate about and it deeply saddens me to see the largest mtb magazine in Europe being so demeaning and exclusive and unwelcoming towards minorities.
YOU were the one who then made contact with me on twitter, I go by my old profile name on it and I had no way of knowing who you are on that platform.

You say you are one of the least prejudice people yet you were blaming “Asians” playing in the park for the spread of covid, you’ve used the N*word on the forum and attempted to justify it, you think it banter to equate black people to monkeys and call people P* and none of your views have been in support of minorities.

How do you think Rachel felt when she begged for the bigotry to stop, how do you think I feel now that you have the sycophants on board?
The only time I’ve reached out to you was to apologise, but you even used that against me and now YOU’RE playing the victim. Grow up

Thank you Kelvin, I appreciate your kind words.
I’m going to have a cuppa and take a step away from the character assassination before I get another ban.

No cougar, I’ve never made offensive comments about transgender people. I did however point out the bigotry regarding gender, misogyny and racism on the forum, including yours for which I received a ban because my sense of humanity is extreme and unpopular. The second one came after I pointed out your racism again under a different profile, and the connection was made to me.
I have only ever promoted compassion and equality towards others.
Again, you are demonstrating gaslighting and I learnt early on to take screenshots for evidence which I can provide in situations when false accusations are made against me on a public forum.
As I’ve pointed out before that these threads follow a particular pattern, remember the Danny Baker thread?
The same is happening here although it’s a different topic. Hop on guys and belittle the one who has the courage to say it’s not all right, then if I’m to break you can be satisfied in the knowledge that I’m just an angry woman with a chip on her shoulder and you can carry on in the safety of your echo chamber without challenge.

I’m not berating you, don’t be melodramatic.

That’s berating – To scold or condemn vehemently and at length, it’s beginning to look like you have a grudge against me. Trivialising an individual and discrediting to others in an attempt to get them to side with you are also indicators of gaslighting.

I’m well versed in protected characteristics as part of my job

Your previous posts suggests otherwise.

I have entertained the idea that she could have used an older brothers ID, but I concluded that it would be elaborate and unlikely for someone to go to such lengths.
I’ve posted with an answer to questions I’ve been asked, looking back at the quote I think you are referring to it was in response to Dissonance’s query not yours. The main focus of my argument has been the Equality Act, which I’ve referenced frequently as it influences other legislation, including the licensing and gambling act . Others have provided more information and an account of lived experiences regarding the acquisition of ID and you are conflating the two.
You being a moderator is relevant as it gives you power over regular forum users. I have to be very careful as to what I say because I will face retribution, I can’t call you melodramatic or a liar as I’d be banned for doing so. It feels like I’m being goaded into doing so, I’ve said several times that I’ve said my piece and that I’ve nothing further to add to the discussion, yet I receive further questions asking for more. If I don’t answer then my view point is invalid and if I do it’s irrelevant.

Cougar, I thought we all had to abide by rule one.
I posted in response to questions which were directed to me, even you asked me for evidence regarding the Equality Act and how it is applied to licensing laws, yet now you are berating me for providing it and saying that government legislation and guidelines are irrelevant. If you were well versed in protected characteristics as a moderator you’d be less inclined to deny discrimination has occurred and provide support to those who do experience it and express it on the forum, yet you always explain it away allowing others to do the same until the person who has objected is silent.

Gaslighting is the act of manipulating someone

Are you not even reading what you’re posting?

“They tell you or others that you are crazy.

This is one of the most effective tools of the gaslighter, because it’s dismissive. The gaslighter knows if they question your sanity, people will not believe you when you tell them the gaslighter is abusive or out-of-control. It’s a master technique.”

Thanks Cougar, I forgot my place but don’t put words in my mouth. I haven’t been been banging on about birth certificates or proof of gender, I’ve not even mentioned them. I’ve simply been promoting human rights and how they apply to the law. The random bits of guidance are because they refer to legislation, which is law. I have said several times that the company has recognised their mistakes and learned their lessons, which is why I can’t understand why some people are saying that they would repeat the same mistakes.
This discussion is taking the course of previous conversations regarding discrimination and I’ve learnt to step back when the gaslighting begins. I hope that what I’ve said provides some support to those who are discriminated against and something to think about for those who aren’t.

This is from Midlothian licensing board “7.3 The Board will, at all times, have due regard to the Equality Act 2010 and any
subsequent and similar legislation and to the need to: –
 eliminate unlawful discrimination, and
 promote equality of opportunity.”

This one is from another piece of government guidance, although good practice guidelines aren’t law in themselves they can be used in court to demonstrate discrimination or malpractice, like ACAS.

” Good Practice 5: Accept a range of ID other than a birth certificate –
you do not usually need to see a GRC to amend personal details
Transgender people can change most of their identity documents including their passport
and driving licence early on in transition. Not all transgender people will choose to obtain
a GRC and change their birth certificate. If your business requires proof of identity, it is
therefore good practice to accept other forms of identification to avoid ‘outing’ or
embarrassing transgender people. Service providers can only ask for a GRC in very few
circumstances and it should never be asked for as proof of gender.”

Round we go again. Dissonance, that is why I posted the Home Office PDF guidance for doorstaff and explained that although they may not have intended to discriminate they still did, and that is grounds for prosecution if she chooses to take that route. Hence ‘spoons apology.
I’m not blaming the staff, there’s is a breakdown of understanding and confusion as to what’s discriminatory and what is not throughout society and Savanna has experienced that. I’m well aware of the devious tricks used to get a drink, I used to be a teenager and I’ve worked in several pubs so I know of the repercussions to bar staff for serving under agers. However, applying the Occam’s razor principle, I do think it would be extremely unlikely that someone would go to those lengths to get a drink.

The legislation doesn’t spell it out for you but it covers almost every example of discrimination that you can and can’t think of, including alcohol licensing. I’m sorry to say that ignorance and intent are not excuses that let you off the hook in those circumstances, even online.
https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/online-harms-white-paper
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=

I thought this link might be useful
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201719/ldselect/ldcomuni/299/299.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwi4l_SblNnrAhWI_qQKHXjvCXcQFjABegQIBhAE&usg=AOvVaw0Km1El2uoYYY6_sxga9a6N

Getting back on topic here’s examples of how to apply the Equality Act to various situations
Equality Act 2010, Part 2, Chapter 2, Section 19
“19 Indirect discrimination
(1) A person (A) discriminates against another (B) if A applies to B a provision, criterion or practice which is discriminatory in relation to a relevant protected characteristic of B’s.
(2) For the purposes of subsection (1), a provision, criterion or practice is discriminatory in relation to a relevant protected characteristic of B’s if—
(a) A applies, or would apply, it to persons with whom B does not share the characteristic,
(b) it puts, or would put, persons with whom B shares the characteristic at a particular disadvantage when compared with persons with whom B does not share it,
(c) it puts, or would put, B at that disadvantage, and
(d) A cannot show it to be a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim.
(3) The relevant protected characteristics are—
age;
disability;
gender reassignment;
marriage and civil partnership;
race;
religion or belief;
sex;
sexual orientation.”

I can’t find any piece of alcohol licensing legislation regarding ID which the Equality Act doesn’t apply to, can you give me a link to official guidelines or legislation where it says that her passport isn’t acceptable?
I’ve provided several pieces in support of my “opinion”, whereas I’ve only read anecdotal tales of having the wrong footwear and sunglasses; neither of which are protected characteristics.

i’d just like you to explain specifically what bit of law you are talking about which defines the action the barkeeps have taken as being discriminatory because I don’t understand why you think it is.

Are you after a page number too? I’ve provided the Home Office guide for doorstaff and the piece of legislation that it refers to, coupled with the fact that the company has apologised and is promised to provide further training; yet you still think I am wrong?
You are aware that discrimination isn’t just hate, it’s ignorance too? In some cases the ignorance is wilful, and if that ignorance results in you unintentionally committing a hate crime then the individual is responsible for the consequences. Which is why the company has apologised for their mistake.
Some people are looking for excuses to justify their prejudices, it’s getting lame

Cougar it’s rather a stretch but possible, and not what happened here.

Retro83 that PDF from the Home Office refers to the legislative Equality Act 2010 part 2, chapter 1, section 7 which is law. Would you like me to post a link to it?
I think a few people would benefit from reading it.

Sorry, this thread has reminded me of Allthegear. I hope that she is well.

Lol. It’s one thing getting a fake ID with all the tipex, photocopying and cutting a photo to size to get a drink, and quite another to changing your actual appearance and gender to get a gin. She even offered to humiliate herself further and take her wig off to show that she is who her passport says she is.
The same arguments in favour of prejudice are being recycled, despite evidence to show that what they did is wrong. According to the law a refusal in this situation is clearly discriminatory, which is why she’s received an apology. Arguing against it just demonstrates how set people are in their ways and unable to extend empathy to those they don’t understand.

Apart from Kelvin, did anyone read the link to the Home Office guide for IDing trans customers?

“Transphobic hate crime

Any criminal offence which is perceived, by the victim or any other person, to be
motivated by hostility or PREJUDICE on the basis of a person’s actual or perceived
transgender identity, is a hate crime.
Hate crimes are particularly traumatic for victims. A customer who feels that
they are the victim of a transphobic hate crime may need your help and support,
including if they (or another person) wish to report it to the police.”

Prejudice is not necessarily intended but is often used in decision making. I’ll ask again, do you really believe that a young woman would use a male passport and claim she was transgender by cutting her hair and wearing a wig just to have a drink down the pub?
Or is it just a convenient excuse that means you don’t have to step out of your comfort zone?

Common sense has been mentioned a few times but not many are applying it.

Possibly.
Since that scenario would probably result in me as the bar person getting the sack but be the company paying the bill.

“In some circumstances, those
workers may be held personally liable for any unlawful discrimination or
harassment they engage in.” Home Office

…end of!!When a company can receive a fine or worse for swrving underage kids then the staff did exactly the right thing.

So instead you’d rather go to court and be sued for breaching the Equality Act?

“It is unlawful to refuse a service, or provide a worse standard of service,
because a person is intending to undergo, are undergoing, or have
undergone gender reassignment. For example, this means that stopping
a trans person from using the toilet they feel is appropriate to them
may create a risk of legal action being taken against the pub, club or
venue you work at.
It is also unlawful for a business to unlawfully discriminate against or
harass someone because they intend to undergo, are undergoing, or
have undergone gender reassignment. A business can be held legally
responsible for unlawful discrimination or harassment carried out by
its workers during their employment. In some circumstances, those
workers may be held personally liable for any unlawful discrimination or
harassment they engage in. ”

I guess that’s why the company has apologised and is making an effort to educate staff. Hmm, do I upstage you with a mic drop?

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.sia.homeoffice.gov.uk/Documents/sia-ds-trans-guide.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwi1pLzildfrAhVESRUIHWLiBTU4ChAWMAB6BAgHEAE&usg=AOvVaw0ZlUisBi654k6bmgc8L4lA

Which they’ve apologised for and learnt from. Obviously they’ll never be a politically savvy as you, but what more do you want?

So why are people arguing that they’d make the same mistake?
Do you really think I’m that knowledgeable, or are you just having a petty dig because I’m more aware of social injustice and eloquently showing compassion and empathy towards people who aren’t like me?

“Remember when we were kids and didn’t see color?”
This is the song that Diversity danced to:- Black Lives Matter – Dax

This thread will help you to have a better understanding https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/help-me-explain-why-all-lives-matter-is-not-the-same-as-blm/

Robj20, a bit of both then. My opinions are educated and informed rather than being based on my personal prejudices. Have a wee look at my profile, there’s links to my experiences and thoughts.

*Edit, have a wee read of the George Floyd thread

Robj20 seriously?
Are you trolling or completely ignorant to the difficulties that people who experience racism have?

So you guys think that a young woman would cut their hair, wear a wig, claim they are trans and use a male passport just to get into a bar underage?
Bit elaborate is it not?
She explained why she doesn’t look like that and that the passport was her official ID, which demonstrated that she’s old enough. As has been said earlier there are many reasons as to why she may not have updated her passport. Yet the bar staff still refused her, which is clearly discrimination based in ignorance.
Where does that leave people who are gender fluid?
At home?

Changing your gender on official documents sounds quite complicated and some of the requirements appear contradictory, never mind the cost. If the individual hasn’t had surgery they also need a letter from their gp to say that they have lived as that gender and that the change is permanent, but what if you are still exploring who you are?
And maybe waiting for acceptance from colleagues, family and friends before making a transition to permanently assuming a different gender?
I understand that barstaff have to be vigilant of underage drinkers because of the consequences, but do you really think that a young lad would go to the effort of dressing up as a young woman just to get into a pub?
It takes a lot of strength and courage to make such huge changes to your appearance, I can imagine that the knock back has damaged her confidence further. It’s good to see that ‘spoons is acting compassionately and taking action by providing training.

@theotherjonv, thank you for providing your insight and all the best to your son.

Changing your passport or driving licence

Wow! That’s the first time a dance has moved me to tears, it was so powerful and encapsulated the issues perfectly. Ashley Banjo is a genius and a hero for highlighting racial injustice and using his platform to good effect.
It was BGT which brought the dance troupe Diversity to the nations attention when they beat Susan Boyle in 2009, who raised the profile of issues surrounding autism. The background of the contestants is usually a consideration for viewers when voting, they love an underdog.
As long as they see the cause as worthy, relatable, and something that they could perhaps experience. Racial injustice is something that a minority of people in the UK can relate to and understand. Some might say that the BGT audience is the demographic which needs targeted to raise the awareness of the social injustice towards people who experience racism in our society. BLM is not about one man, George Floyd (Jacob Blake, Breonna Taylor, Daniel Prude, Barry Gedeus, Ahmaud Arbery, Sheku Bayoh…) it’s about the systemic racism present in our society which affects people every day in a harmful and discriminatory way. BLM is not a fashion statement that is fleeting, there’s been centuries of campaigning for equality and it’s about time we acknowledge the issues and recognise our participation in them.

Are we watching genocide unfold?
Explained away as the victims fault for previous, non compliance, being in the wrong area, driving and even just being black (skin colour = morals according to the misinformed), and arguing my word choice because they feel alienated by the truth.
In the UK we may not have the death rate but we have equal levels of racism, with the government encouraging the statue protectors.

Countzero, I’m wondering what aspects you considered when writing your post. Whilst the caste system is an ancient social structure it was the British who formalised it and made it central to our administration there. Between 1860 and 1920 we segregated Indians by caste, giving the better jobs to christians and whiter looking people. We changed the policy after social unrest and protests to give lower castes some work in the government, which became illegal in 1948… When India became independent. British successive governments still use divide and rule, and blame BAME people for all our woes.
Like you said, it is unfashionable to have brown skin, even here in Britain unless you’ve paid at least a month’s salary for it.
As for slavery; yes even Europeans were enslaved along the Barbery coast, although the figures were estimated using an unorthodox manner previous academics have put it in the 10s of thousands at the most. If it were around a million, European slavery is still a small, small fraction of the Atlantic slavery committed by the British which a conservative estimate puts at about 12 million.

Ah, well played Malvern Rider. Thanks for pointing it out, I’m autistic so the humour went over my head initially. In response to the above question here’s a checklist:
1. Do you know a minor celebrity or government official?
2. Pick a letter of the alphabet to use as a user name, Q is taken.
3. Join a proud boys or bois club.
4. Pick a minority to blame.
5. Create a story that’s neither provable or unprovable.
6. Hashtag simple meaningless acronym that’s no longer than two syllables.

They take advantage of the National Character, David

That’s an interesting choice of words, David Hume wrote a paper “Of National Characters”. He said of the English “We may often remark a wonderful mixture of manners and characters in the same nation, speaking the same language, and subject to the same government: And in this particular the ENGLISH are the most remarkable of any people, that perhaps ever were in the world.”
To which he added the footnote “I am apt to suspect the negroes to be naturally inferior to the whites”

Adele’s now getting it for ‘cultural appropriation’ for her hair-do. Blimey, will Michelle Obama get it for straightening hers (like many black women)?

The two aren’t comparable, black women have had to adopt Western styles as their natural hair is seen as unprofessional and unruly. There’s a huge amount of pressure on black women to lighten their skin too, all to fit in to a western ideal of what’s considered beautiful and wholesome. Adele’s received a lot of support from Jamaicans and black people in Britain and they recognise that difference between appropriation and celebration.

I lost my job not long before lockdown so it gave me much needed breathing space to reassess my direction, without the worry of having to find work. The peace at the beginning was noticeable, I’d never really noticed the traffic noise until it was gone and the slower pace of life was bliss. I feel for those who have been living with financial concerns and separation, the isolation must have been compounded with concerns.
As an autistic single parent it’s allowed me to participate in events that I wouldn’t ordinarily have the time or money to go to, having gigs in the garden. The family time was absolute quality, the kids didn’t have the anxieties of school and learnt new skills, and no arguments! We have missed out on a holiday, which would have been our first abroad in years but they don’t see it as a loss as so few people managed to get away.
Restrictions on movement did compound the fear of having some psycho stalker sending coke and hookers to my door at random hours, but it brought the neighbours together and I met people that I’ve not noticed before. Lockdown also opened doors to opportunities that I’d never have dreamed of as the BLM movement rose and I spent more time on line, which I hope will affect fundamental changes.
I’m glad we’ve had the breathing space, the return to normal movement has brought with it a toxic atmosphere.