Ukraine

along with 14 Su-25s from Bulgaria.

Even if handed over, they’ll probably not leave the ground. They are the Eastern version of the A-10, so not much cop if the skies are still hostile

@doris5000 also membership opens doors in terms of defence procurement/development opportunities I believe, which means you’re not reliant on a former master for your kit.

I think this is a thing, but happy to stand corrected.

Again it seems to me that the policy of NATO expansion has made no difference to his behaviour other than to dissuade him to invade those countries that have joined

Totally correct. The large powers dont fight directly, as in this conflict, because it could get seriously out of hand. Which is why we arent sending 50,000 troops to the Ukraine.

FOR EXAMPLE

Belarus is quite a corrupt place, human rights are bad. Could the US, UK,France,Germany invade them to sort things out. Answer No, because they are Russia’s allies.This would bring the above nations into direct contact.

Other middle eastern countries arent affiliated to any of the superpowers which made them vulnerable FOR EXAMPLE -Say Iraq was a close ally to Russia. Could operation freedom have taken place. Well no it couldnt, because then the risk there was the US might have to come into direct conflict with Russia.

As it was Iraq wasnt allied to any superpower.

The whole Iraq thing is a completely different set of circumstances. The US supported Saddam for 10 years, so overlooked his evil regime, but thats another question about world geopolitics. Feel free to explore that one at your leisure

Afghanistan wasnt affiliated to the US, so Russia could easily invade, as they werent also affiliated to Moscow, which meant the US could invade.

So proxy wars were fought, to the detriment of those living there.

@mashr still better than nowt I suppose? Although I think the promised ground kit is more in need at the moment.

The point is, you can shame him for his reckless genocidal expansionism. Shaming him because you’ve (almost certainly incorrectly) virtually diagnosed a hormone problem is silly and undermines whatever other point you may have.

Oh, don’t worry, I was just generally wishing him ill. I’m not too bothered about the quality of my diagnosis.

But he does look a bit peaky, doesn’t he?

@doris5000
Yeah, we should be one big interlinked world. No conflict. Because eventually theres going to come a time where a fking big rock is going to be seen in the sky and we’re too busy fighting amongst ourselves over petty differences to be able to come together to stop it.

And that as they say will be it.

Ok, he’s a murderous tyrant, but he does promote Christian values so let’s overlook the other stuff.

Lauren Witzke, the Delaware GOP's candidate for Senate in 2020, has nothing but praise for Putin and "his Christian nationalist nation": "I identify more with Putin's Christian values than I do with Joe Biden." pic.twitter.com/oQ2nhlVGCR

— Right Wing Watch (@RightWingWatch) February 24, 2022

This is the sort of weapon that the Russians are using against civilians in Ukraine:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/44479/the-truth-about-russias-terrifying-tos-1a-thermobaric-rocket-launchers-now-in-ukraine

They are the Eastern version of the A-10, so not much cop if the skies are still hostile

The A-10 was always intended as an infantry close-support aircraft, and for use against armoured vehicles and infrastructure. The US airforce has been trying to get it removed from service due to their obsession with flashy fast jets and ‘stealth’ aircraft, but in a situation like is happening in Ukraine, A-10’s would actually be quite effective, especially when there are armoured convoys along with supply vehicles, including fuel, up to 64km long; a small group of A-10’s, with a full weapon load, flying at low level along the length of such a convoy, would wreak absolute havoc, in the same way that Typhoon, Tempest and Mosquitoes did again Nazi convoys and railways during WW2, and all they carried were under-wing rocket racks and 30/50mm cannon; an A-10 has its huge rotary cannon, along with the ability to carry Hellfire rockets and other large munitions.

It’s a shame there aren’t still some Skyraiders still flying, those could carry an immense weapons load, about the same as a Lancaster.

You’re a couple of pages too late for the A10 discussion, plus we got told off by @grum, so it’s off to the naughty step for you!

Christian values?

As if Jesus would order a military invasion of another country…!!!

Christian values?

As if Jesus would order a military invasion of another country…!!!

I don’t think we can say how he would react if he felt vaguely threatened by NATO, though.

“You’re a couple of pages too late for the A10 discussion, plus we got told off by @grum, so it’s off to the naughty step for you!”

Or the Airfix thread!

So proxy wars were fought

Thank you Professor Obvious. So back to Putin, Russia and the fear of NATO expansion, so his behaviour hasn’t changed because or despite NATO, you agree to that (after all it’s just standard proxy war behaviour) he’s acted with impunity along his border with no detrimental effect to himself or the oligarchs that support him . The states that have joined EU or NATO have prospered safe in the knowledge that Russia will be reluctant to invade, so again, how has NATO “expansion” put us in this position? You yourself have pointed out that it’s made no difference.

Weird conversation.

Can you guys post the sites where you are getting info on what is happening other than the obvious ones like the BBC and Sky News

cheers

I’m interested to know that with the two Oligarchs frothing about EU lies with regard to their relationship with Putin, whether thats a good thing or not – they aren’t siding from us but are they distancing from Putin as well?

Also, with cyber attacks now at UK Banks, military hardware being provided by multiple countries – its hard to see how WW3 can be avoided now. There’s some comfort in that a big part of the world is on-side, but little comfort that within 20-30 minutes of some nervous people working in a Silo pressing a button there is no world.

I’m beginning to think I should have moved out of London sooner than I planned.

try some of these –

Tweets by IAPonomarenko
Tweets by KyivIndependent
Tweets by Osinttechnical
Tweets by ThreshedThought
Tweets by RealCynicalFox
Tweets by RALee85

Sorry, the forum has ‘helpfully’ embedded all those links!

Mikeypies Peter Caddick Adams on twitter is a good source. Well balanced and insightful…

Don’t know if this is true but it could have a huge impact. Taking out their satellite intelligence
https://mobile.twitter.com/xxNB65/status/1498563301525102594?t=z-mr-g_ssSKzYuj2BzT4Ew&s=19

I have a feeling some old testament fire & brimstone would be en route.

I don’t think we can say how he would react if he felt vaguely threatened by NATO, though.

I’m getting a lot of info from reddit. But you have to take it with a healthy dose of scepticism

“I’m beginning to think I should have moved out of London sooner than I planned.”

Given that London is where most of Putin’s enablers live I reckon you’ll be safe as houses,. In fact if you’re renting, the odds are your home is already owned by a Russian.

I’m getting most of my info from on here.

Thus far, Chewkw has proven to be a better analyst than what I’ve seen on most of the BBC / Sky output etc…

Agreed, despite chewkw being an annoyance in a number of other threads his inputs here are good

I don’t know whether this is a good take or not, point is that we really have no idea about Putin’s state of mind.

Putin is indecisive. Unless the Russian army is profoundly incompetent, you have to conclude they lacked clear direction from the outset. So Putin must have failed to give clear orders. The Russian army hasn't been told what it's supposed to do.

2/4

— Arthur Snell (@SnellArthur) March 1, 2022

Although obviously not as up to date as Twitter I find the coverage from France24 & DW News much better than Sky/BBC.

Edit – I should add I’m just on a 24/7 YouTube binge cycle on the TV from Sky/BBC/DW/France24 with a few ‘Merican ones thrown in and sat with my phone in my hand looking at Twitter.

Don’t think this one was mentioned,

https://mobile.twitter.com/uaweapons

Agreed about recent posts from Chewkw in this thread. I haven’t agreed with all his points, but they have been put well, and are of interest and relevant. Credit where credit is due. Keep it up please!

Al Jazeera has a live updates page that quite concise and up to date.  FT should be on everyone’s reading list for reportage and comment, as it’s usually on the money (quite literally) and insightful.

Been round a few of those tweet threads. A Russian soldier texting his mum telling her they aren’t on an exercise and it’s a real war – shortly before being killed. He said that the locals were lying in front of tanks.

I wonder if the fact that Russian soldiers think they are the good guys or at least not the bad ones is why they aren’t just driving the tanks over the civilians*

* which IIRC was what the US did in Iraq. Anyone remember those videos of armoured convoys speeding through the cities and mashing civillian cars out of the way with the civillians still in them just driving somewhere?

Others drawing parallels with Vietnam, with the Russians doing what the US did.

Any talk about the Russian army not being prepared or not being given direction I personally am taking as western propaganda.
For me this has followed how I would expect it to have. Smaller battles to show intent, allow the civilians who are going to leave to leave. Increase the artillery strikes while bringing forward your main battle troops.
Maybe some of the logistical errors being reported are correct, but ultimately it’s always just been a matter of time before we get to the point where the mass artillery and air strikes start. This then allows pretty much free reign for the infantry and tank battalions in the city.

I may be being incredibly pessimistic, and my heart really goes out to the people in Ukraine.

I’d also say that if I was Poland I’d be a bit nervous about what Putin may be thinking he will do next.

I’m beginning to think I should have moved out of London sooner than I planned.

Just don’t move to Argyll.

I think the ‘west’ should say that all sanctions should remain in place until Putin is handed over for war crimes. Option for lamp post hanging.

I wondered earlier what the Russians would need to import for the war effort that they might find hard to get now. Semiconductors?

Earlier in the thread I asked how individuals can help. The BBC has a useful article showing charities with appeals currently in place and where the money goes – https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60562260 (although strangely the Disasters Emergency Committee aren’t involved yet).

Apparently you can also donate via the Ukrainian embassy (“With Ukraine” fund) in which case some of the money support the military, however the Ukrainian Embassy website was down (unless anyone has a working link).

— Edit —

https://withukraine.org/

@Caher the thing is, Bush and Blair are free men (and incredibly wealthy). They did very a very similar act with the invasion of Iraq.

I’m former military so absolutely not a Putin sympathiser, as British as it gets, but our invasion was pretty much based on lies.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. But being a nuclear power really gives us (and Russia and the US) impunity to behave this way. No comeback to the cowardly bastards who send the troops in, ultimately it’s the civilians who are impacted the most, taking decades to get back to the previous normality, while the rich are just richer.

For a bit of perspective on historical events which have influenced Ukrainian attitudes

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor

That’s just one. We were in Kyiv four years ago and I sh;t you not, we’d turn a new corner and there would be ANOTHER memorial to something dreadful where thousands (or more!) died. Poor buggers can’t seem to catch a break.

Two wrongs don’t make a right. But being a nuclear power really gives us (and Russia and the US) impunity to behave this way.

I was talking to someone about this recently. Can you imagine how popular the invasion of Iraq would have been if the Iraqis had looked like us, spoke the same language as us, and had access to twitter/FB/instagram/TikTok etc?

Obviously, the Russian government can counter this with their state broadcasters but surely ordinary people must be getting bombarded with almost live videos and images.

sorry if bindun, Johnson press conference.

'You’re coming to Poland, you're not coming to Kyiv… because you're afraid'

A Ukrainian reporter breaks down as she begs @BorisJohnson for a no-fly-zone over Ukraine – the PM rejects her plea as it would see the UK 'shooting down Russian planes' https://t.co/qsADEeLz3g pic.twitter.com/yAWP5Ip69T

— ITV News Politics (@ITVNewsPolitics) March 1, 2022