or train track and thinking “What if…?”

Reminds me of this…

Good job Hannah, my name is Joe and I take Citalopram.

Make sure you stick it out through the period as your body adjusts to it, and don’t stop taking it because you’re feeling better in a few months, I’ve been on and off AD meds a few times and really should have stuck it out the first time.

and without getting all ‘conspiracy theorist’

Nope, you crossed that line at commenting on GPs prescribing while you clearly know nothing about how these drugs are monitored by both GP practices themselves and the wider local Health bodies on who’s responsibility that falls.

By all means be shocked that depression hits so many, like obesity and other ‘lifestyle’ diseases, but if you’re angling to blame GPs about prescribing drugs that work widely, have few side-effects (and more importantly; ill effects if overdosed)  for most, please do (with respect) **** off.

I think it’s really important to talk about these things openly, if you’re comfortable doing so. I have friends who chat away on a bike ride about their perimenopause symptoms and without them, I’d have no idea what to look out for. Making something seem like less of a big deal makes it easier to talk about.
I probably should have gone on Sertraline or equivalent much sooner, but I gave therapy a really good go and just needed something to pull me out of the other side really. I take it for a severe anxiety disorder, which I’ve had for years but it became unmanageable after a particularly stressful situation at home.
I didn’t go to the doctor and say ‘hey, I’m really anxious!’ … I walked in, sat down, realised I needed to find some words and just burst into tears. It took months for me to settle into using it though – grinding my teeth, not sleeping, actually feeling more anxious than I previously did, but then one day I had this realisation that I was experiencing life as it’s supposed to be. I could read situations better, I could manage my time better, look after myself, stop stressing about minor issues, and just generally felt a balance I had never (and I really mean NEVER) had in my life.
I’m on a reduction cycle at the moment, so my next Kit List may have ‘Sertraline 25mg’ listed 🙂
Thanks for picking up on it, and more importantly all having a conversation about it. Anti depressants are not a big deal!

Lottery Winners

Not sure you can say the word Sertraline without singing the song now.

Nope, you crossed that line at commenting on GPs prescribing while you clearly know nothing about how these drugs are monitored by both GP practices themselves and the wider local Health bodies on who’s responsibility that falls.

Assuming things is very stupid and dangerous. I’ve worked with young people around drug use, both recreational and prescribed. There has been a massive increase in the prescription of certain anti-depressant/SSRI type drugs over the last couple of decades.

https://www.bmj.com/content/364/bmj.l1508

https://www.gponline.com/gps-forced-prescribe-antidepressants-young-people-denied-mental-health-support/article/1794921#:~:text=Stem4%20said%20that%20GPs%20are,long%20NHS%20CAMHS%20waiting%20lists.

And it’s no secret that mental health services have been cut to the bone, with huge increasing waiting lists. So it’s not hard to draw a correlation between the two factors, is it?

20+ years ago, I found it very hard to have anything prescribed by any GP, as they preferred then to refer people to talking therapy services. Drugs were prescribed mainly as a last resort. Now, as people have event stated on this very thread, you can literally walk in and be prescribed drugs to treat mental health issues within minutes. I find this an extremely worrying trend, and am very concerned about the long-term effects of such policies.

By all means be shocked that depression hits so many, like obesity and other ‘lifestyle’ diseases, but if you’re angling to blame GPs about prescribing drugs that work widely, have few side-effects (and more importantly; ill effects if overdosed)  for most, please do (with respect) **** off.

You really need to work on your bedside manner. I’m not ‘blaming’ anyone. The system is shit and falling apart, and GPs are doing all they can. So please take a step back and have a think about how your angry response is counter-productive to such a discussion. As I’ve said; drugs have their place in the treatment of mental health issues, and can be extremely effective. But we desperately need more talking therapy services, not simply more drugs.

There has been a massive increase in the prescription of certain anti-depressant/SSRI type drugs over the last couple of decades.

Because they work

So please take a step back and have a think about how your angry response is counter-productive to such a discussion.

Because instead of raising the discussion of prescribing anti depressants in a constructive way related to your experience, you decided instead to have a sly dig at GPs. If you want nuanced and constructive discussion I’m happy to engage,  otherwise you’ll get the appropriate response.

Enough now you two, all you’re going to do is put people off reading the thread, and that’s not helping anyone

Because they work

Of course. They are very effective for many people. But so are talking (and occupational) therapies, but those have been cut back so much they are almost non-existent in some areas. Which is extremely worrying. Increasingly, people are being told to seek private counselling rather than being referred to anything on the NHS. Many cannot afford private services. Simply talking to someone can be such an effective means of coping with crises or long term anxieties. Very often, issues can be reduced or even eliminated through such therapies, without the need to resort to prescribing drugs. This should always be an option, but sadly increasingly isn’t.

Because instead of raising the discussion of prescribing anti depressants in a constructive way related to your experience, you decided instead to have a sly dig at GPs.

Not at all. I absolutely have not had a ‘dig’ at GPs at all. So your anger is based on a totally false premise. In my experience, many GPs are not trained adequately in dealing with mental health issues, as this is not focussed on nearly enough imo. This isn’t blaming GPs, this is blaming the system, which I think we can all agree is not fit for purpose. We desperately need more resources and support for GPs, and far more mental health services than we have currently. In Tower Hamlets, there was once an entire hospital dedicated towards mental illness, and numerous services around the borough. I accessed some of these myself as a patient. They were far more effective in helping me cope with life than any drugs ever were (I got to a point with Citalopram where the drug was affecting me so much in a negative manner, that it was causing me even more anxiety and depression). I was extremely fortunate in having a GP who had an extensive background in mental health care, and she referred me to a number of excellent services, including the Portman Clinic. This was literally life changing. I haven’t had to resort to medication since. But many of those services are now gone, leaving GPs with no option but to prescribe drugs in the hope that they can help patients in the short term. This is applying a sticking plaster to an open wound, and is simply not the overall solution. Many younger people I know have been prescribed drugs after just one short visit to a GP, with no other analysis or assessment. Many are not being told of any alternatives, and if they are, they’re being told that talking therapy services can be a year or more to even see someone . So I don’t blame GPs at all; they are simply doing whatever they can to help people now, and trying to avoid people going through even more suffering. I commend them for doing what they can, but the resources they have available are appalling and totally inadequate.

If you want nuanced and constructive discussion I’m happy to engage,  otherwise you’ll get the appropriate response.

I really don’t need to engage with someone whose idea of an ‘appropriate response’ to something they’ve misunderstood, is to tell them to ‘**** off’.

Doctors are indeed prescribing more, but isn’t that realising ‘man up’/’pull your socks up’ doesn’t work as suicide rates (especially young men) are at a high level.

We’ve got some big wars on the go, massive cost of living crisis, record numbers using food banks.

The medication works and it it stops a few people contemplating jumping off a bridge, then all well and good. If it also stops people being hospitalised – all good. It’s prevention of things getting worse.

On a more immediately practical level; my belief is that many mental health issues stem from a lack of effective and appropriate socialisation. This, I feel, is a symptom of our modern society where many people live in increasingly smaller bubbles, and simply do not get to socialise with many others enough. Socialisation can really help with dealing with issues; finding others to talk to, to share problems, can be a massive support for so many. How many of us actually do that in our daily lives, or even on a regular basis? How many people on here work at a desk in front of a screen, with little contact with actual human beings? How many get time for a chat with others, outside of their work environment? How many choose activities that enable socialisation? The more people we speak to, the more likely we are to find others with whom we share similar issues and concerns etc. And talking about things can help enormously; myself and a couple of other friends have recently suffered parental bereavement, and we’ve been meeting up and chatting a lot more regularly, and sharing our thoughts. This I think has been very beneficial to all of us, as we know we’re not alone with our problems, and we have someone to share with. Ok so this is very basic and many need a far more intensive form of therapy, but it’s a start. Knowing that a mate is also feeling really shit, angry, resentful and frustrated, ‘normalises’ such feelings and helps to not feel quite so alone.

Do we talk to each other enough as a society? I come from a culture where people talk to each other a lot, but perhaps not in the right manner at all times but there is at least perhaps more scope for showing emotion.  But when do people just stop for a natter? Do we even have time to? Maybe we all need to just think about making time for that. If we start with the little things, perhaps we can go further towards dealing with the bigger things.

not sure how relevant this post is to the OP tbh and maybe (definitely) sidetracking a little, but as there are some well-informed people on it i’ll ask anyway rather than start a new thread.

some of you may remember my posts from years ago, our lads doing legal highs (and worse), us trying to get help for us all, social services being stretched, continued police and ambulance visits etc.

moving on 10 years, we now have one lad who came out the other side and is doing great, and one who didnt do so well mentally and has known nothing other than residential homes since.

back in the day i posted about the amount of meds he was on and got some pretty shocked replies as it was a proper shedload, and we thought they were just doping him up to keep him quiet (he would regularly harm himself and/or smash his room up).  we got an apology from whoever it was at the time, told theyd review his meds, but they slowly crept up again and hes back on a shedload (in our opinion).

good news is, he finally seems to be coming round to the fact that hes wasting his life, is now ‘anti-drugs’, is frustrated at the people around him causing trouble and bothering him (altho theyre just like he was) but now feels he’s ‘outgrown’ this place, and wants to work towards getting something out of life.  he’s just started exercising too, bought himself a weight bench and a few weights, and has applied to be in a ‘less severe’ residential place.  hes a pleasure to talk to now rather than the ‘dopey’ conversations we used to have which were just upsetting.

all pretty positive, but…… he wants to drop some of his meds too.  and yes, the wheels of social services run slowly, “we’ll review your meds next month’ type replies, but he just wants to get cracking.

now i know and you know, that you shouldnt drop meds just like that, but hes in the mindset that he just doesnt need these any more, theyre giving him the raging munchies at night after taking them, and hes hit 22 stone, so also thinks thats a heart attack risk.  i agree with that, and the concoction of meds that he takes is also heart attack territory we’ve been told.

so, hes decided to drop his quetiapine.  hes on 400mg a day, a 300 and a 100 tab.  hes dropped the 300 just like that and is into his third day and says he feels more focussed, has more clarity and wants to drop the other 100. (hes also on some other anti-psychotic meds too but feels the quetiapine is the problem at the moment).

i recommended if he was going to go down this route to drop the 100 first (altho i realise this goes against any medical advice but if hes going to do it anyway….) but hes so determined to ‘get better and fitter’ that hes gone for the 300mg.

yes thats a lot, and i guess the specialist advice would be ‘try 50mg at a time’ but so far he says he feels better now.

just for our peace of mind, and maybe to give him signs to watch out for, is it possible for this to continue?  could he actually drop these meds with no side-effects, or are they going to hit him in a few days/weeks time?

thanks

just for our peace of mind, and maybe to give him signs to watch out for, is it possible for this to continue?  could he actually drop these meds with no side-effects, or are they going to hit him in a few days/weeks time?

In my experience, it can be an extremely bad idea to suddenly cut meds. I would strongly urge you to encourage him to talk to the professionals he’s in contact with, and to express his desire to reduce the dosage. If they feel he’s going to do whatever he wants regardless, then maybe they’ll work with him with reduction, as this will be the lesser of evils as far as they’re concerned.

Just want to say that for your friend to be taking such a cocktail, he must have some pretty severe issues, and I really do wish him all the best and that he can come out of all this and find the health and happiness he deserves and needs.

In my experience, it can be an extremely bad idea to suddenly cut meds. I would strongly urge you to encourage him to talk to the professionals he’s in contact with, and to express his desire to reduce the dosage. If they feel he’s going to do whatever he wants regardless, then maybe they’ll work with him with reduction, as this will be the lesser of evils as far as they’re concerned.

thats what we originally told him.  i do agree with him tho they seem to be stalling, and keep pushing back meds reviews, but i told him whatever he does to keep talking to us and them, and not hide anything.  and yes, telling them what hes doing will hopefully push them to get a bit of a wiggle on.

ironically as i typed that post he just whatsapped to say he feels a bit cold turkey today.   see how it pans out…..

thanks

Stay in contact with him, as much as you can. Knowing you are there for him will be of immense importance, and help him keep focus. If he has ‘allies’, he’ll feel far less alone.

Goes without saying mate, never given up on him over all these years, not about to now.  He knows he can be honest with me, altho he doesn’t always stick to that as he thinks he’s let us down.

Goes without saying mate, never given up on him over all these years, not about to now.  He knows he can be honest with me, altho he doesn’t always stick to that as he thinks he’s let us down.

Ultimately, he’s let himself down. Forget anyone else. It’s HIM that really matters. In such situations, it’s really helpful I find, to tell people how wonderful and amazing they are as an individual, to try to help them find some vestige of self-worth to hold onto and value. So focus on someone’s individual talents and strengths (everyone has something, no matter how small and mundane it might seem). Help him focus on a ‘target’ to get better, and to achieve his own potential. Give him a reason for being.

Good advice mate, and echoes exactly what we do constantly.

Cheers

👍🏻

I’m on it – have been for nearly 2 years – my GP (who is one of my closest friends) is quite relaxed about it and continuing on it. I can’t talk to Mrs XPS about it – she’s hugely hostile / sceptical to the whole idea, which doesn’t help matters.

I’ve no idea whether it is still making a difference – I’m more on the anxiety side of things – but am in the “why not continue – don’t want to possibly make things worse” camp at the moment.

I’m on 200mg at the moment.

Not sure GP’s are supposed to prescribe controlled drugs to friends/relatives. However your GP is probably doing a good job and giving you the help you need.

Do I need to speak with someone about this?
Sad all the time
Spontaneous crying for no reason
Suicidal thoughts
History of self harm
Avoidance personality disorder
Find it hard to relax
Not sleeping
Not eating well
Struggling to get outside and enjoy myself

Yes ASAP

Do I need to speak with someone about this?

Yes, yes you should.

Having been on that miserable spiral, talk to your GP and see what help – medication and therapy – they can offer.

Do I need to speak with someone about this?

Please do! I found that talking to anyone was really difficult so didn’t. Bottled it up for years (in truth from childhood), ultimately leading to breaking point and a breakdown. My GP was amazing. Please talk to someone.

Do I need to speak with someone about this?

I think you just did. Now take the conversation to your GP and it’ll feel better just having started ‘pushing back’ against it, I would think.

Phone consultation with a GP. Was a difficult chat for obvious reasons. Going to try sertraline and some mild sleeping tablets and reducing alcohol intake.
Thanks for the gentle nudge guys

Houns, no side effects? It’s making me tired and interfering with my bowels!

singletrackmind
Do I need to speak with someone about this?
Sad all the time

yes talk to someone as soon as poss.

Re side affects (so far):

Day 1: mild dizziness/nausea within 2hrs of popping the pill.  This lasted for 2hrs

Day 2: The most awake I’ve ever been from 4am, screaming shits all day.  Massive anxiety for no reason from 3pm-bedtime.  Performed the most consistent vo2max power training session for 2 years (may be unrelated).

Day 3: Good nights sleep, feel overly anxious and slightly jittery.

Kryton57. I was prescribed 50mg

Apparently it can take up to 2 weeks to kick in. Personally, I felt the benefit from day 1.
Maybe psychological. I was pretty desperate.

Really difficult to sleep (but the anxiety was causing that anyway) – given sleeping pills but only for a few days. (Addictive they said)

herbal sleep remedies help me.
Shits yes, it messes with the microbiome     very unmotivated (no adrenaline I guess)     can sleep A LOT in the day

titrating and off – now 25mg daily last 14 days  plan to do that another 2 weeks then 25mg every 2 days

it helped me a hell of a lot in my time of need

Yeah thanks – 50mg also, my symptoms seem to mirror yours.    I’m having a tough day today but of the last 7 days I’ve had 2 where I’m not awake between 2am and 5am but have felt quite chipper otherwise.  I can tell already I’m not as snappy as I used to be, but until today I had a hefty background anxiety feeling all day for no reason.

it did occur to me yesterday you aren’t suppose to drink, which I forgot about 😳

Oh yeah I have literally never observed the “don’t drink”, bollocks to that. Clearly I am not a doctor.

Aside but sleep was mentioned, that can be a linked thing or a separate thing but good sleep is like god mode when you’re used to not having good sleep, and there’s options worth investigating there too. I got prescribed bio-melatonin, and I’m confident it helps. Honestly there’s been times when I was on a mild antidepressant where I think the melatonin would have been more impactful. Again of course ymmv but basically we treated sleep like a symptom for me for a long time and then eventually treated it like its own thing and I’m glad we switched.

Phone consultation with a GP. Was a difficult chat for obvious reasons. Going to try sertraline and some mild sleeping tablets

Your GP prescribed drugs following nothing more than a short ‘phone conversation? I find this rather disturbing if so. And it reinforces the point I made earlier in this thread. Were you offered any kind of talking therapy as an alternative?

@Singletrackmind, please ignore that last post from Brownperson, don’t let it discourage you or undermine your progress and decision or your doctor’s medical advice.

@Brownperson. STM says

Do I need to speak with someone about this?
Sad all the time
Spontaneous crying for no reason
Suicidal thoughts
History of self harm

And you go oooh, going directly to meds is disturbing, maybe get yourself on the waiting list for a bit of talking therapy instead? Maybe you meant well but you are choosing to make yourself into a problem for someone that’s having a hard enough time. Stop. That’s the civil version, if I responded to you like I want to I’d get banned.

please ignore that last post from Brownperson, don’t let it discourage you or undermine your progress and decision or your doctor’s medical advice.

Please.  People need to be properly informed as to the choices they should have regarding their own treatment. There should be a wide range of opinion and discussion should be as open as possible. You are in no position to tell anyone to ignore any opinion simply because it doesn’t agree with your own. This is exactly the kind of negative narrow mindedness which causes damage.

And you go oooh, going directly to meds is disturbing, maybe get yourself on the waiting list for a bit of talking therapy instead?

Not at all. As I’ve said; in some cases drugs can be immensely helpful. Life saving even. I am not ‘anti-drugs’. I am just concerned they are the first solution many GPs turn to.

Clearly I am not a doctor.

Clearly.

Stop. That’s the civil version, if I responded to you like I want to I’d get banned.

Wow.

The only narrow negative mindless is from you, speaking to a GP is a good idea. It can be started initially from a phonecall which can lead to a face to face if necessary, then offer various others aspects including counselling and social prescribing.

@singletrackmind please speak to someone while trying to get GP contact.

Samaritans can provide an initial route, there also may be local mental health support groups for you.

The only narrow negative mindless is from you, speaking to a GP is a good idea

Where did I say it wasn’t?

I’m merely expressing concern that a GP may have prescribed drugs after just one telephone conversation. I’m not blaming the GP, I’m disturbed that there may well be no viable alternatives.

I think people need to take a step back, be more objective and consider that others may have different experiences to their own. And that those others may have experiences, insight and knowledge they may not want to divulge on an internet forum.  If someone has an opinion different to your own, consider why, don’t just rush to judge and condemn, because that helps no-one.

**** you brownperson. This isn’t a fun talking point for you to play STW word games with, this is someone’s life.