Ebikes - mixed riding groups and the hatred

Raise it on whatsapp...you already wonder if there is any way back from it.....at least you'll know.

Don't ride with those people any more, then. Ride with people from that group that you like.

This always happens with groups. Friendly group ➡ more people ➡ friction ➡ yet more people ➡ critical mass ➡ massive argument ➡ schism ➡ two happy groups.

Seriously, screw 'em, life's too short. What difference does it make what someone else rides? Arseholes.

what’s the term for this

Self-deprecation. Or, humility.

Most of our group ride ebikes and the banter and ribbing has stopped long ago. Personally I don't care as it helps pace me to go faster.
They don't flag their Strava rides as assisted which non ebikers occasionally mention.

Leave the group/find some new friends to ride with.
I’m in a WhatsApp group of 9 and I’m the only one with an ebike. They’re absolutely fine with the situation. Sound like a bunch of ***kers tbh.

It your group I’m afraid. Hoping that you’ve already pointed out the SC that’s worth 2x the Ebike.

Just sounds like 5 bellends with a chip on their shoulder

They sound like right 🔔🔚s . For the last two years I have been riding my e-bike once a week with a bunch of roadies, none of whom have an e-bike or make any snidely comments (at least not in front of me!!). In fact once a year we do a memorial ride for one of the group who died a couple of years ago, just before I joined, and who at the time was also an e-bike rider.. They joke about how he used to leave them for dust on this one particular hill, his favourite, which now forms part of the memorial ride and there is a small plaque on the fence at the top of the hill. Zero malice. Some of your group sound like right ignorant arseholes.

Move on - They are not your friends- life's way too sort of any of that shite .

They don’t flag their Strava rides as assisted

Does beg the question why not? Are they embarrassed?

Seems a bit of a dick move to join a ride platform with the original focus on segments and leaderboards and then undermine it just because they don't want to change a setting?

(as you can tell it sort of bugs me but I also recognise my lowly standing on any significant leaderboard is going to be unaffected by a few assisted bikers 😂)

Ask when the next ride is...if anyone replies positively, go ride with them.

Or leave the group and find a new group of riders that don't seem as unfriendly.

Clearly not great friends just do what I do ride by yourself or other E-Bikers.

OP
Shame it came to a head, but it sounds like you need to find another group.
I help out with an mtb beginners group, it's very mtb lite and we get all sorts of riders and bikes turning up.The only time we have a (very light hearted) go at the Ebikers, is when we have to lift their bikes over gates.😉😊

Offer to set up a crowd fund type thing so that they can buy e-bikes too

its not a reflection of owning and riding an e-bike but the people in the group. We all ride together for fun, as they they say when the fun stops... Stop.

Clearly some ebike riders can be plebs too.

Go for a ride with them. Roost past them multiple times on the eeb whilst laughing and pointing at them.
Then only ride with your ebike mate. You will get more riding in and less waiting at the top of climbs.

I have not ridden in a group of mixed conventional and ebikes but can imagine that it could be difficult for everyone to get the most enjoyment out of the rides.

Riding an ebike completely transforms the riding experience so are you sure that you are not having a big impact on the other guys enjoyment? Having someone breeze past me on climbs and then waiting impatiently for me to catch up would be pretty frustrating. I'm not saying that this is what you are doing but it might be worth considering if it is a factor.

If you want to maintain the friendships then maybe you could do rides where the ebike difference is not such a factor? - an uplift day might work well?

Seems like they're dicks with some of their own issues. Banter is a two-way street, if they're just rounding on you relentlessly it's probably time to find a group on the same wavelength.

I ride with people on EEBs and it's a laugh, the piss-taking is two way and without a hint of malice and we're all stoked to be out on bikes.

It shouldn't be hard work.

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Just done a lakes ride with me on a borrowed ebike every one had fun no one got dropped.

No falling outs...

To paraphrase goldie lookin chain

Ebikes don't cause an issue ****s do...

They sound like dicks. Some ebike riders a dicks. If you think they're dicks move on

Riding uphill on a non-ebike is hard. It can be real suffering. But if you're sharing that experience with other people, then as a shared experience it makes it lighter, mentally, all round.

You're not sharing that experience with someone who has a motor. I can easily imagine that it could take your mind away from that shared experience and make you feel a bit jealous, and subsequently, like shit.

You can't help how you feel. So if that's how riding with ebikers feels to some people, then the natural thing to do would be to stick to an analogue group.

It's shit if you've been friends with these people for a long time. Try asking them if that's ultimately the reason why they feel like that. Glib jokes and "lulz, easy for me" might really rub someone who's suffering up the wrong way.

I don't ride with ebikers. My mates all suffer on analogue bikes. One of them (the least fit of us, who can't be arsed putting in the miles) is thinking of getting an ebike. One of the group said something along the lines of "if you do then ride it on your own" to him.

I totally get why my friend wants an ebike. But I totally understand why the other said that...

I guess a lot of it is about courtesy - when I’m out with the roadies I ride only in ECO mode which means the hills can be hard. I do this on purpose and often won’t overtake for exactly the reasons Chevy says - I don’t want to demoralise anyone struggling. I deliberately don’t breeze up the hills in Turbo and wait impatiently at the top for everyone to catch up. I’m not interested in being 1st and I ride for the exercise (yes yes I know you get more exercise without the motor etc etc  but I’ve got a knackered knee). Often the fitter ones will beat me up the hills anyway. Riding courteously I minimise the risks of rubbing them up the wrong way. Worth noting I suppose that my group is a very mixed age range and is both male and female - not sure why that matters. but I reckon a group of overly competitive males would have a very different dynamic. 🤷‍♂️

Exactly the same as you oceanskipper.
Only ride in eco when out with mates and I make sure I'm in the middle of the group on climbs.

Ah I see your riding buddy has just arrived peter1979.
Left a shitty comment them deleted it.

I ride with a weekly mtb group at night in winter in the FofD. Sometimes someone rides an e-bike. No one minds or even really mentions it. I think the real bike riders secretly feel sorry for the e-bike rider, but there’s no ribbing or judgement.

I wouldn’t want to go out with a group where e-bikes formed more than half. They should go off and form their own group if that’s their thing. It’s a different sport to real bike riding.

Thing is though, I reckon it is a bit rude to show up to a group ride that had previously all been bikes on an ebike, regardless of being in eco or not. I mean, I'd want to make sure that everyone was okay with it first (and really okay with it, not "um, okay, sure") - your group obviously wasn't okay with it.

Obviously that doesn't make their response okay - but hopefully understandable.

We go out in a mixed group of mates...varying numbers of ebikes and normal bikes. Everyone takes the p@#s....everyone laughs....we're mates, that's what mates do.
I'd just mention that you love them and all that, but if things keep getting petty and nasty you're going to find some other mates who are a bit more grown up.

Why would people feel sorry for an e-bike rider? How odd. Also what’s real about a bike with without motor? Odd way of describing an old fashioned, standard bike. Surely they should be “unreal man” anyway, shouldn’t they, as they’re so hardcore an’ all. 😎😂

But I totally understand why the other said that…

So do I, it’s because they’re a dick

It sounds like there's a few people who need better friends and even more who should be better friends.

So do I, it’s because they’re a dick

I think it's okay to want to keep rides as not ebikes only. Same as "please don't turn up on a unicycle" or "please can you service your bike before next time so we don't have all of the mechanicals".

So long as people are on the same kind of pace & technical ability I don't really see how it matters what you are riding?

I'm totally happy to ride on a normal bike with someone on an ebike if they slow up on the climbs (or at least are happy to wait at the top!)

I'm totally happy to ride on an ebike with people on normal bikes and to just potter along.

As above, sounds like you need a new riding group.

@colp:

So do I, it’s because they’re a dick

Ebike or not - the inability to see things from other people's perspectives is the fastest way to get ejected from our group.

Why would people feel sorry for an e-bike rider?

Because it’s a trail ride with a sprint race at the end and the object is to rasp your lungs out and make your legs tremble. We do it because we like haring around the woods in the dark, gasping up hills with downhills as relief and reward for the hard work. You earn your pint in the Fountain. Using an e-bike kind of misses the point.

so those of you that think that ebikers should ride in their own groups what about if you have a fit racing snake and an old fat pootler in the same group?  Same issue arises.

so those of you that think that ebikers should ride in their own groups what about if you have a fit racing snake and an old fat pootler in the same group?

Not really a problem, no one minds waiting for different abilities. In my group there’s 30 year old racing snakes and 70 year old guys. What they share is the desire to ride in the same way, so perhaps pootlers need not apply.

Having someone breeze past me on climbs and then waiting impatiently for me to catch up would be pretty frustrating.

That was me on group rides generally, long before e-bikes were a thing. It can be frustrating if you're bringing up the rear guard because by the time you get to the top the fit riders have all had a nice rest and are ready to set off again.

It's funny really. When someone is the fastest rider they're all "sure, we'll wait for the slowest, it's absolutely fine. Never leave a man behind." But when the tables are turned and the former whippets are suddenly being left for dead on climbs by e-bikers saying exactly the same thing - "it's OK mate we'll wait for you" - it's suddenly a problem?

But when the tables are turned and the former whippets are suddenly being left for dead on climbs by e-bikers saying exactly the same thing – “it’s OK mate we’ll wait for you” – it’s suddenly a problem?

I guess its because those whippets have had to work for it?
Not sure there is a clear answer. I wouldnt go riding with a bunch of whippets on the grounds it would likely be a crap ride for all of us (there is a reason why those roadie clubs tend to have different groups for rides) and I couldnt blame them for being irritated if someone turns up battery powered.
Guess the trick is either to dial it back or figure out a route where pure power just means getting close and intimate with a tree.

@chevychase

In your anecdote you talked about “mates”, but mate 2 seems perfectly happy to banish mate 1 for wanting to ride an ebike as he’s struggling to keep up. Do you really know the reasons why “he can’t be arsed to put the miles in”?
So mate 2 in my opinion is a dick.

If mate 2 wasn’t a dick I’d expect him to say something like “good idea mate 1, we don’t want to lose you from the group as we’re all mates so crack on and sort an ebike”

OP, it's not you (and your e-mate) it's the rest of 'em.

This polarisation of all issues rather than compromise and nuance being the norm seems to be bleeding over from social media to real life, I'm very grateful that me and my mates can cheerfully disagree about things without getting shirty.

I guess its because those whippets have had to work for it?

So, what, it's simply jealousy? Either they don't want an e-bike in which case "working for it" is their choice; or they do want an e-bike but don't have one.

Is this a world away from single-speeders sneering at those johnny-come-latelys with their "gears"?

Not sure there is a clear answer. I wouldnt go riding with a bunch of whippets on the grounds it would likely be a crap ride for all of us

Honestly, it's why I never went back to the MNPR rides after my first one. I felt so... embarrassed about my lack of match fitness, I felt massively guilty for holding everyone else up.

He's not saying don't show up, though, he's saying don't show up on an ebike.

If the first guy was saying "I'm only happy to continue riding with you lot if I'm on an ebike" it would be one thing, but I didn't really get that impression.

But when the tables are turned and the former whippets are suddenly being left for dead on climbs by e-bikers saying exactly the same thing – “it’s OK mate we’ll wait for you” – it’s suddenly a problem?

Well, how would you feel if people started showing up on those no pedal throttle bikes? (Sur Ron's, I think?). I can see both sides of this, it does seem a little off to be irked by the dynamic change - but having electric assistance also doesn't feel like the same activity.

Oddly, I think my issue is more that the implied dynamic becomes "oh, you're a slower rider, you should get an ebike to ride with us" - that's definitely a view I've heard spoken, and that I totally disagree with.

So, what, it’s simply jealousy?

I doubt it and that comes across as a variant on the highly dubious politics of envy line.
E-bikes do change the balance of a ride and I think it where do individuals draw the line.
I think most people on the thread would agree someone turning up on a sur-ron or similar would be taking the piss a bit to much.
Then it comes down to where on that sliding scale do you decide you are no longer doing the same activity?

Since the OP says things changed over time I am curious as to what drove that change. Since they say its only occasional riding did something else piss off the other riders to make them loath ebikes in general?

@colp (and @tjagain) - see my point above about shared experience.

I'm also with @supernova on performance differences - if I'm out with someone who's much better than me that's a motivation for me to push myself harder, to improve.

Ain't like that with someone on an ebike. On long hard days when your willpower is low and you're suffering, it's easy to see how that could be demotivational.

@aidy

He’s not saying don’t show up, though, he’s saying don’t show up on an ebike.

Yep. 100%.

I think I shall join chevy on a group ride - bring along my ebike then just pootle along slower than everyone 🙂