Building a Croix de Fer – build advice required.

Im going to start to build a Croix de Fer, its my first complete bike build and I’m trying to make it reasonably light (around 10kg is fairly light for a Croix!) but it will take on some light off road stuff (Bridleways, forestry, stonier sections).
Probably 80% road 20% off-road

I want to be able to run 28c or 30c slicks on it at high pressures (80psi) and some tyres with some edges to them for off road, probably 33-35c. I need advice on what wheels to get, preferably off the shelf if theyre good enough. Ive looked at Kinesis Crosslights, Cero ARD23 and also Fulcrum 5 racing but I’m not sure if the Fulcrums or Ceros are quite strong enough for off-road stuff? I dont want to be constantly worrying about dented rims or spokes breaking!

I’m probably going for full hydraulic setup with centre lock rotors. 105 groupset.

Also, alloy or carbon seatpost? This isnt a race machine, and the steel frame should be fairly compliant but will I feel a difference by spending the extra on a carbon post? Everything else on the bike will probably be alloy.

Any advice on build welcome. I’m well aware that the Croix is a bit of a tank, but I want the wider clearance it offers, and I’m quite keen on having something that can do a bit of everything.

Hey Rob,i built mine up 2 years ago April,I’m not sure you could do that Tbh,tank is what mine is,I’ve Stans Grail rims(road)/pro2 evos,carbon post,ism saddle,shimano785s,28mm tyre,although the bars and stem I guess are a bit weighty,their salsa cowbell2 and stem,oh and 105 group,still comes in way over 10kg from memory.
I suppose a much lighter(pricier) wheel will shred a couple of hundred grams,and maybe carbon bars/stem combo?

If you get a kinesis wheelset make sure it’s the HD version with brass nipples..

No real reason it has to be a tank… just depends on build really. The difference in weight between the Croix frame and a light road or ‘cross frame isn’t loads.

80 psi is high for 30mm tyres – how much do you weigh?

Some good options amongst the DT Swiss complete wheels etc depending on budget.

Carbon post is a good idea. If you can justify the cost it’s an upgrade I’d certainly have. Easy weight saving and adds comfort too.

Feel free to give us a shout for more info. Have done several custom specs for these and just beginning to work on my own now.

I built up an Escapade last year and I ended up ordering some handbuilt 29er wheels from Merlin with Hope Pro4 hubs and the skinniest rims they did (Mavic XM319). I’m running 32c slicks or knobblies no problems and the wheels are still running true, no adjustment needed so far. They come out about the same price as the Crosslights..
I needed a hub with a through axle front ideally which is why I went with the Hopes.

Merlin

If you haven’t bought your bars yet I would recommend the Salsa Cowbells or something similar. The slight flare on the drops really helps when off road I find but it doesn’t push the shifters out at a weird angle like the On One Midges I tried before…

Hey Rob,i was a bit hasty with that post of mine it seems I was mistaken by the looks of things,just put mine on the bathroom scales,comes in just shy of 10kg with candy 2 pedals and bottle cage,so yes with a lighter set of wheels tyre combo I’m sure you could get down too nine + maybe.
Last time it was weighed may of had fully ladden saddle bag.
Cheers.

Claimed weights for complete bikes (off the Genesis site):

CdF10 – 12.18Kg
Cdf20 – 11.9Kg
Cdf30 – 11.58Kg
Cdf-Ti – 9.8Kg

I’ve the CdF10 but I’ve gone the other way (weigh?) and it’s probably close to a kilo heavier as I’ve added mudguards and a dynamo hub. The wheels are definitely “meaty” :?

2 sets of wheels?

I have a CdA and use on road and gravel. Ive kept the wheels that came with it (somewhat hefty but strong Shimano hubs and Alex rims) with the gravel tyres on. And bought a second lighter weight set (with discs and cassette) for road. Got these second hand so not a huge expense.

Much more convenient with less compromise.

I’m coming round to the same idea. I’m gonna ditch my old cross bike which is now a road bike and get a second set of wheels.
I’m now watching this thread with interest:
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/road-disc-wheels-any-lightweight-budget-options

I’d second 2 sets of wheels if you can budget for it. It also means you can run tubeless on both. On my CdF I’m running a pair of XT hubs on Archetype rims with 40c nano’s off road (36 spoke monsters), and Hope XCs with Velocity A23 rims on 30c slicks on road. Neither are super light!

You’ll get nowhere near 10kg; the frameset is very heavy.

Thanks all for the replies, and apologies for not replying sooner. Bought a Croix 30 in last years colours so its ‘standard’ at present. Plan to buy a Carbon fork when I can get hold of one (apparently due next month), and a set of wheels. Fulcrums are still on the list, as are Cero ARD23s but I love the look of those Hunt Mason 4 Season discs. A bit above the budget though and not sure if they offer much more than the Cero’s which can be had for under £300. Cero’s listed at 23mm deep but 24mm wide 19mm internally whereas the Hunts are 27mm deep 23mm wide and 17mm internally.

I dont find much discomfort with the Alloy seatpost as its quite a forgiving frame however might search around for a reasonably priced carbon post. It weighs just over 11kg on my scales.

I have an Ally seatpost in mine, never had a comfort complaint. The wider rims might be nice if you do get some wide rubber on there at some point, the frame is not the limiting factor! The current carbon fork is not drilled for a guard at the crown, the new stock should be but its worth asking when you place the order.

If I were building one up from a frameset (or willing to change some major stuff) I’d be looking at going 650b and running a set of WTB Horizons. There’s a lovely one on LFGSS that a chap is building up in their current projects section that is probably well worth a look.

I have a set of Hunts and a set of Ksyrium discs and the Hunts are a much nicer wheel. Light, wide and the company are great to deal with if you have any issues (I had a rim tape issue). I can’t talk for Cero as I’ve not owned any, I do know that Hunt do a cheaper set and also do a 650b set too. The cheaper ones have a higher weight limit so might be better suited to off-road use.

As for seat posts, I run a Ti post in one of my bikes and the difference is certainly noticeable. However I run a smaller frame than I should and have quite a bit of post on show (fnar!). Running less post might mean the effects wouldn’t be that noticeable.

On a steel frame like this, running decent sized tyres too, there will probably be quite limited benefit in a carbon post. I’ve put a Thomson in mine, light, strong and slightly flexy, in a good way. Cheaper than a good quality carbon as well.

Wheels? Can recommend Hope with Mavic Open Pro (or X717 etc.) rims; these are going to be similar in price to your quoted examples and will be a better long term choice.

I’d think carefully about tyre pressures too; if you’re not actually racing on a given day, softer will be both more comfortable and then in time, quicker too as you’re less tired on a long ride. I tend to run 32mm at around 70psi on the road and less again for 35mm tyres.

Mine’s about 10kg with Mavic Open Pro/Hope, BB7s, 105/Sram, Ritchey bars and stem, Flite saddle and Thomson post. I used to use 28mm Gatorskins on the road, but now I just keep the 35mm cross tyres on all the time (can’t remember the brand) for comfort. I’m dead slow on the road anyway, so It doesn’t matter.

Oh, and mine is bang on 10kg with XTR pedals; large 2016 frame, colonel mustard colour. Carbon Genesis fork, flat bars, 3×10, Hope X2 brakes etc.
It’s surprisingly competent off road and has been on quite a few natural trails on its 35mm semi-slicks. Plus, last year it comfortably ticked off 8 road rides between 120 and 180 miles in a day.. it’s fair to say that I like it!

I’ve just ordered my CdF frame, and torn between which wheels to get, not sure between:
– Hope 20Five’s
– Hunt Mason 4 Season’s

What mudguards are Croix owners using over 33c CX tires? The guards I have over my 28c Continental Cotacts today look too close if I move to say 33c Rocket Rons!

I’m using some sks hybrid 50mm over 35mm Clement X’Plor with no problems. Guard had to be trimmed a little to allow clearance for the front derailleur.

Thanks, how do you find the X’plor, which do you have, and what surfaces do you mainly ride on? Was tempted by the USH for mixed riding, say 60% tarmac, 30% gravel and 10% XC.

Been offered a new pair of 33c Rocket Rons for £40 but although cheap am worried they are more XC than I want.

I’ve been presently surprised by them to be honest. They are only on the bike because they came as stock but I am in no hurry to swap them. Most of my riding on this bike is road (commute) where they roll nicely. Have also taken it off road quite a bit in fairly muddy and slippery conditions any they haven’t let me down once. Seem fairly puncture resistant and appear to give more grip than they have any real right to. Am probably going to swap them over for wtb nanos for a bikepacking trip in the summer (will have to probably remove the guards) but this will be for the additional cushioning from the wider tyres rather than out of any fear for the X’Plor’s performance.

Just a quick Croix tire update, ended up buying a pair of Schwalbe Land Cruisers are they were super cheap at CRC and seemed the right tread pattern for what I need. Had either the 35c or 40c, went for the 40c to try a bit more volume and they just fit! Tightest place is the fork, there must be ~2mm gap from the top of the tire and the steerer tube. So definately no room for anything larger. Fitted a pair of 42mm SKS Bluemels, well, after a severe chop for the front fitment and making it fit elsewhere!

I had my croix at 22.5lbs with 35c Maxis Raze and Stans Iron cross on Hope Pro 2 evos, Cowbell 2 bars and 105/Ultegra bits, and BB7s – and the Kinesis wheels are lighter.

I had a light weight titanium seatpost that had quite a bit of spring in it – definitely recommended. I had it on my equilibrium before that and thought that bike had a nice steel zing to it, then broke the post and discovered that it was the post that felt so good.

The equilibrium was only 2lbs lighter and that had rim brakes.