BikePark Wales’ cost increases

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  • BikePark Wales’ cost increases
  • Premier Icon enigmas
    Subscriber

    Just saw BPW have announced changes to their pricing, with PAYG uplift passes being replaced by £30 for half day uplifts, with day passes also going from £8 to £10 in July and uplift costs also going up.

    While I never use the PAYG passes, £30 for a half day uplift is a complete joke. You could get a full day at Cwmcarn, Antur, etc for a couple of quid more and Caersws or Hopton for less (granted they have less infrastructure).

    Also day passes doubling from £5 to £10 in five years is beyond silly. Admittedly they have huge outlays compared to most trail centres and uplift spots but I’d never pay £10 per person to ride somewhere, especially in South Wales with an unlimited choice of places to ride in the surrounding area. Seems a bit rich of them especially given the whole centre was built on the back of EU funds.

    It’s a shame as the place is great and they certainly aren’t resting on their laurels, but they really are beginning to price out some riders from going there.

    Premier Icon dynebaruk
    Subscriber

    Agree completely.  I’ve noticed the full day uplift is going to £41.50 for the day from July onwards, that’s ridiculous.

    I do love a day there and we tend to do it once every 3-4 months, but with the prices as they are now, I’ll probably save a few quid by taking my own food and drink rather than spending another tenner in the cafe.

    Yes, there are plenty of new things coming there and the trails are great, but they’re pricing some people out – especially families.

    Premier Icon vinnyeh
    Subscriber

    Cost of living Increase, isn’t it.

    Prices seem top end of fairish to me for a fun day out, plus there’s not too much competition in their particular niche of the uplift market.

    orangeboy
    Member

    For me £40 for the uplift ticket plus other cost for the day are just to high but I’m sure it won’t hurt there attendance number

    st
    Member

    Guess the PAYG thing is more hassle to them than it’s worth so they’re pushing people more to either do the whole day or pedal up.

    Aside from Antur though the set up is the most comprehensive and as the two venues offer very different experiences I’d say BPW is pretty unique (said as someone who is still on the fence about the place).

    TheBrick
    Member

    I think they have a advantage that they can get loads of people from the south days tripping but North Wales is more a weekend away.  Hence they can push the prices.

    Premier Icon russyh
    Subscriber

    It makes those of us local ish (hour 20 away) think twice heading up for the old pedal up and token uplift job!  Only able to buy half day pass at £30 on day!  Half a day being 3 hours!  So £10 pedal up fee plus £30 half day uplift makes it an expensive day!  Especially with a rip off shop and shit burger.

    They need to spend time time looking at their uplift operation rather than pushing the prices up in an attempt to reduce queues.  Shame I’m sure they will  U turn given the backlash on their facebook page

    rob8624
    Member

    This has gone down very badly with local riders.

    therag
    Member

    £90 a time now to take my two kids to do one lap, two on a good day.

    jonesyboy
    Member

    £40 seems ok when you look at the ridiculous price of most people’s bikes now. If you can afford a £4k edoooooro rig then you can afford the uplift.

    maxtorque
    Member

    I can see how the locals might not like it, but at least they are surrounded by mountains. For me, ANY  day in the mountains is going to cost at least £50 in fuel just to get there!

    bgascoyne
    Member

    The uplift price I can take. I only get there once a year if I’m lucky and its fun. But the new PAYG price is just bluntly a rip off. £30 for a half day…please! The problem is that you cant just think a week in advance, oh, lets go to BPW on the weekend and do the uplift as it gets booked out 3 months in advance. We are going in June and we booked almost 4 weeks ago and even then there were only 6 spots left on the saturday. The previous two times we have gone we have used PAYG and it was fine – we would have gone day pass if we could have got the dam things!  Time for a chair lift or even some type of rope tow could work I’m sure. I guess its a case of “we can charge want we want and people still come”

    Premier Icon enigmas
    Subscriber

    It’s the pedal pass price increase that has me annoyed most, living half an hour away I used to be up there quite often on afternoons and early mornings when it was £5/6, but £10 means you have to do a full day there to make it remotely justifiable.

    There’s always the argument that you can have a £4k gnarpoon but that’s completely missing that it’s a few hundreds of pounds a year to keep going if you’re using and looking after it properly. Then petrol etc on top and riding isn’t cheap, especially when places try and charge you a tenner to ride there.

    Premier Icon russyh
    Subscriber

    £40 seems ok when you look at the ridiculous price of most people’s bikes now. If you can afford a £4k edoooooro rig then you can afford the uplift.

    What a load of absolute garbage! Some people decide to spend their money on a bike and not a car.  The cost of their bike has absolutely nothing to do with the price anyone should pay to access BPW.  The prebooked uplift rates have barely changed its the day rates which are now a joke

    Premier Icon postierich
    Subscriber

    People pay money to ride down hills how weird!!

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    Presumably just price rising to meet demand? They always seem busy.

    Premier Icon russyh
    Subscriber

    That’s exactly how I see it Northwind.  People will pay so they will charge it.  Just hidden behind uplift queue reduction ‘noise’ truth is they just need to manage what they have more effectively.  I suspect there will be a U turn given the amount of backlash on facebook.

    Business in making as much money as possible shocker.

    Not been and won’t be rushing at those prices. Makes it an event rather than something to do at the weekend.

    escrs
    Member

    I presume the increase is due to the changes coming up at BPW

    They are going on grid for electricity and water which cant be cheap, bonus is they are looking into showers for those muddy days

    The fire road to the top is being widened in places so there are less passing points which should shave some time off the drive to the top

    They are trying out a new uplift vehicle soon and if it works out they will be buying more, those tranny’s take a beating going up that road all day every day fully loaded

    3 new trails opening soon too

    Also the cafe menu is being revamped with a new executive chef

    These things cant be cheap, i don’t mind paying £40 ish to ride there 3-4 times a year, even with fuel divided between 3 of us (£20 each) its a £60 day out, most normal people are happy to blow that on beer and a takeaway at weekends!

    More info on the changes here

    https://www.bikeparkwales.com/the-next-steps-for-bikepark-wales

    Top whining, Bravo.

    Premier Icon simon_g
    Subscriber

    I imagine they’re just fed up with the people who don’t book but then whinge about waiting longer for a PAYG lift.

    As for the cost, hard to imagine anyone spending £30+ a day to ride their £1000+ bikes is going to struggle for that.

    Premier Icon rOcKeTdOg
    Subscriber

    £10 a day doesn’t seem bad, costs £7 to park at some trail centres!

    fooman
    Member

    That’s £10 each not per car load though. For a family of 4 the uplift is even further out of reach. I’ll make ’em pedal up like last time we were there it’s quite a nice climb, though if you are allowed to pedal up the road it would be a lot easier! Anyone know?

    Premier Icon cookeaa
    Subscriber

    Clearly the PAYG pricing has been set to drive off the casual uplifters when they were regularly selling out the pre-booked day passes.

    £40 for an occasional uplift I could stomach, but not too often… Maybe once a year.

    But a tenner to pedal up? Nah, that’s taking the piss a bit, I’ve pedalled up there more than I’ve uplifted, I quite like it but at £10 I’ll visit less often…

    Ultimately I think the market will just about bare the price hikes most weekends London seems to empty out onto the M4 with fist-fulls of cash to lob about in the provinces, sad that it’s pricing people with more modest means out of regular visits.

    Hopefully more people will look to go riding elsewhere in the area at it will bolster the other centres in South Wales…

    Premier Icon russyh
    Subscriber

    I would never have a problem with a business making a profit!  They need to make money to survive and grow.  My issue is the disingenuous nature they have announced hikes.  I pedal up there usually and purchase the ‘prepaid’ cards.  It’s now ridiculous in terms of cost.  Hidden behind ‘to sort queuing issues’ as a regular user the issue is more sound how they operate the uplift!  If they looked more at their current opperarional Efficiency they would reduce queuing significantly, however it’s easier to blame the customer and increase charges. Which is pretty naive!  Still it’s their business and good luck to them, but as a more regular rider there my riding group are all ‘out’ so i guess they have sorted the queuing issue out in that regard.

    Premier Icon frogstomp
    Subscriber

    So £10 pedal up fee plus £30 half day uplift makes it an expensive day!

    The half day uplift includes pedal up for the rest of the day.

    Lots of improvements going on which inevitably cost money to implement. We were there on Friday and the improvements to the uplift fire road were already making a significant difference in turnaround times.

    At least the bridge tolls are going at the end of the year…

    TheBrick
    Member

    £40 seems ok when you look at the ridiculous price of most people’s bikes now. If you can afford a £4k edoooooro rig then you can afford the uplift.

    Some people have have £4k bikes, many don’t. Alot of people on older and second hand bikes.

    The PAYG charge and ride up is the too expensive ones IMO.  I would not want to pay £10 to ride up if I just had a hour before or two free.

    Premier Icon onewheelgood
    Subscriber

    I don’t want to interrupt all this moaning, but I’ve just had a thought – what if this charge actually reflects the cost of providing the service?

    Premier Icon zilog6128
    Subscriber

    I was there last week. With the wider road & uplift going over lunch it was the smoothest running day ever! So the improvements are great news for someone like me who goes 3-4 times a year. Plus it sounds like there’ll be the option of last minute uplift tickets, just turn up early and pay £60 for the day rather than booking 3 months in advance!!

    Sucks for locals, mind, although it sounds like they don’t actually spend much money there so you can see why they’re not the focus. It doesn’t make it clear whether the season ticket will offer 50% off these new half day passes, that might make it reasonable if you go loads!

    Rorschach
    Member

    I don’t want to interrupt all this moaning, but I’ve just had a thought – what if this charge actually reflects the cost of providing the service?

    Don’t be coming on here with your rational thought.It’s price gouging gone mad I tell thee….they’re all driving round in platinum plated Bentleys.How the hell am I going to afford a £300 cassette and upgrade to 2019 Fox 36’s at £1000 a pop if I have to pay £6 more?
    (Does suck a bit for the locals tbh,which is a shame.Because there’s barely anywhere else to ride down there).

    You wait until you only have to book a month in advance instead of 3….that’ll teach them.

    hooli
    Member

    I too think £30 for a half day is taking the mick if a full day only costs a few quid more. The other issue is you cant pre-buy a half day so you could travel there and be turned away as they have all sold out.

    Saying that, its a great place and has done so much for the area so I will still go (for the full day) and I guess it will continue to be a success regardless of the ticket price.

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Subscriber

    I don’t want to interrupt all this moaning, but I’ve just had a thought – what if this charge actually reflects the cost of providing the service?

    No-one is saying it isnt/doesn’t. That doesn’t mean people will think it’s fair or appropriate. Only time will tell really on that score, but by the looks of it, a fair few people are being put off by the cost changes. I’m a rare attendee at BPW so it doesn’t massively affect me…But by the same count, the new pricing has made me think “Sod it, i’ll just go to Afan”… If many people do that, then BPW will find their numbers drop…

    AS i say, time will tell for them if it’s the right or wrong decision.

    Motorbike trackdays have gone the same way for me, sure they’re only £20 more than they were 2 years ago.. but now a day on track means £200 start price at Silverstone and even though it’s not THAT much more, the general principal means i’ve kicked trackdays into touch rather than pay the extra £20.

    mark90
    Member

    So £10 pedal up fee plus £30 half day uplift makes it an expensive day!

    The half day uplift includes pedal up for the rest of the day.

    That’s BPW’s argument saying that they priced it as 1/2 day uplift plus pedal pass, ie 20 + 10. But you only need a half day pedal pass if you’re on 1/2 day uplift (you don’t need any pedal pass for a full day uplift). So based on BPW’s own reasoning it should be 20 + 5, and that 1/2 day pedal pass should be optional.

    However the point remains that upping the cost of a pedal pass to 10 and removing the PAYG option hits those who might pop in to ride for a couple of hours or maybe a 1/2 day or so. It also impacts those who want a leisurely few uplifts to session trails without racing the uplift busses, similarly those with kids who might only get an uplift or 2 in due to time/speed/endurance.

    I’m not convinced by all this talk of making the uplift more efficient to get more runs in. Recently when I have been there it feels like the uplift could be running quicker / more efficiently but they are running it a pace / schedule to throttle the number of runs and hence the amount of wear on the trails per paying customer. Any changes to uplift efficiency will be to get more paying customers on site not more runs per customer IMHO.

    lister
    Member

    The new changes means I can’t take my wife and 2 kids. I’ll do a couple of trips this year and ride all day and I think the day fee is reasonable for the uplift and infrastructure.

    I was hoping to take the kids in the summer and I figured we could ride up once, do half a trail and ride back up. Then do a full run to the bottom. That would be a full morning I reckon (kids don’t pay to ride in the park). The plan would then have been to get 4 uplift tickets for £16 after lunch. 1 uplift, ride half then ride back up. Full run down. Not a bad day out for them, plus there is the green and pump track.

    That plan would now cost £120. That for me is a shame and they’re putting major obstacles in the way of kids riding there.

    We can go to fod and pay £10 for 4 of us to get 1 lift which is their little treat after riding up and down all day. They love their downhills!

    I’ll still ride there but I can’t see me going with the kids.

    qwerty
    Member

    It’s a shame for us, my son & i recently discovered the joys of BPW, buying a book of 5 pre paid uplifts to use through the day.

    For us the pre paid book took a gamble with the weather out of the equation (i don’t wanna book months in advance to ride in heavy rain).

    I love a bit of climbing, my son doesn’t, & it gave us a great venue to both enjoy the trails.

    We’d usually get in 5 runs in our time there, a half day pass will probably cut this to 3 / 4 i guess.

    We live 60/75mins away & i’d committed to riding there once a month, but with our combined daily ride fees going from £56 for 5 uplifts each & a days ride pass, to £80 for half a day it’s going to stop us going (plus car fuel & food).

    As well as the additional costs involved with expanding the venue, i think they have a fair bit to recoup having been hit hard by the snow this year. I’d like to think they could make their services more efficient rather than increase the prices, but they must have looked into this & decided not.

    I was never convinced by the concept, but having ridden there i can clearly see the appeal. They have a real good thing going & some super plans to expand. Its clearly a busy venue & with it being booked out months in advance i guess they can raise the prices & still be booked up a long way in advance. Its a shame that they may risk making it too unattainable financially for regular local riders & those with less disposable cash. But they know their market and can afford to price it out of reach for some, knowing they’ll still be booked up.

    So MTB  is the new golf!

    Chipps – could we get a comment from Rowan on the front page explaining the pricing increases?

    Rorschach
    Member

    So MTB  is the new golf!

    It’s actually the new T6 SWB (204bhp) T32 Sportline (optional 19″ rims).

    Premier Icon mahalo
    Subscriber

    if im paying £40 quid i want picking up from the bottom of 50 shades / roots m / hot stepper!!

    E-bikes are the answer…..

    Rorschach
    Member

    Mr Sorrell earlier

    Premier Icon cookeaa
    Subscriber

    Actually I do wonder how many people actually bother to queue at the booth of disorganization and pay for the plain old pedal up passes, maybe I’m a mug but I’ve always been honest and paid when I’ve been, but nobody has ever really checked or challenged me to prove that I paid, there’s no car parking fee, I do wonder if people there for a half day pedal will just roll up, park and pedal as the focus is always on administering the the uplift…

    What is there in place to really to prevent them doing that?

    Even if they’re caught what can the park staff actually do?

    Ask them to leave?

    Inform them they’re not insured?

    Call them freeloaders?

    Premier Icon russyh
    Subscriber

    Good point Mahalo… get more bikes available for hire.  If I could rock up after work and have a powered pedal up that would be interesting.  Likely be £100 per pedal up mind off current pricing structure 🙂

    edlong
    Member

    I see that there as many experts in the business of running bike parks here as there are experts in the business of running a bike shop.

    With so much expertise, I’m surprised there isn’t a thriving bike park round every corner.

    Just a thought: maybe the people who run BPW actually understand the economics better than the average punter on both the supply side (what they need to charge) and the demand side (what people will pay, in sufficient numbers)?

    Crazy thought, I know.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    As the uplifts getting booked out months in advance seems to be a big bone of contention, why don’t they just stagger the release of passes and make some available closer to the day (but still beyond the useful weather forecast window) to placate the disorganised element of their customer base?

    And yeah £30 for three hours of uplift seems a bit rich, and a bit insensitive if it’s primarily targeted at the local South Wales-based riders – who’ll likely be on lower incomes than the full day pass customers driving over from Surrey in their Audis. You could even say it was a regressive pricing system in that regard.

    Premier Icon martinhutch
    Subscriber

    a new executive chef

    And obviously that means getting a load of slates to serve the burgers on, and the cost of foraging pea shoots, wild garlic and mushrooms from around the site. None of that shit comes cheap.

    The local proles simply don’t understand the kind of standards that the modern mountain-biker demands.

    Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    And obviously that means getting a load of slates to serve the burgers on, and the cost of foraging pea shoots, wild garlic and mushrooms from around the site. None of that shit comes cheap.

    Or just the job title for somebody who can deliver good quality food, variety and at speed for the right price.

    Rorschach
    Member

    With no more EU funding (thanks Brexit) on the horizon it has to start paying for itself (and future expansion).And they ain’t cheap to run.

    On the plus side.Revolution is still only £33 (but you’ll need to bring your big boy pants) and Antur is £34.50.

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