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In all this comparison of who's said what and who should be prosecuted, am I missing something? Or are wildly different standards being applied?
As I understand it, on the one side, a politician has got out their phone and written words that could be hate speech; they've then chosen to post that to the world on social media. On the other side, a politician has reposted a post that contained 20 photos, the 5th of which included the image of a T-shirt that had inappropriate content.
The first is a considered choice to say something, while the 2nd could be a very plausible mistake. They are both unacceptable, but these are not at all equivalent as I see it.
As I understand it, on the one side, a politician has got out their phone and written words that could be hate speech; they've then chosen to post that to the world on social media. On the other side, a politician has reposted a post that contained 20 photos, the 5th of which included the image of a T-shirt that had inappropriate content.
The first is whataboutery. This is the Zack Polanski thread so should be discussing the appropriateness, or otherwise, of his actions.
In all this comparison of who's said what and who should be prosecuted, am I missing something? Or are wildly different standards being applied?
It’s a very convenient distraction for farage/reform as it removes the £5millioin + funding/gifts n’ grifts from the news headlines
Rather trumpian behaviour from farage that his supporters will lap up
The first is whataboutery. This is the Zack Polanski thread so should be discussing the appropriateness, or otherwise, of his actions.
You can't discuss one without the other - especially as the other, upon posting on Socials ensured it was cropped very carefully so it looked like Polanski had posted it & hadn't been invited as a collaborator to the post.
@dazhIs that what that T shirt says?
It's says 'We're only making plans for Nigel' alongside a picture of a guillotine. Hardly incitement, just a piece of dark humour. The fact Farage has thrown his dummy out of the pram when he and his supporters spend all their time banging on about woke liberal snowflakes is highly amusing.
Polanski would have been much better off dismissing this and pointing out that Farage is no stranger to dishing out his own form of abuse and hatred and should wind his neck in. All he had to say was 'live by the sword, die by the sword' and everyone would have understood.
It's says 'We're only making plans for Nigel' alongside a picture of a guillotine. Hardly incitement, just a piece of dark humour.
Don't get me wrong - I agree with your overall sentiment. But I feel you are probably guilty of seeing it as dark humour because it aligns with your own beliefs (and mine). If it had been a T shirt of a bonfire with a hotel in the middle of it with "Burn baby burn, disco inferno" written at the bottom and a union flag t shirt wearing man holding a torch watching on.....would that be 'dark humour'? I'm not sure I'd find it funny.
If it had been a copy of a UK anti smoking campaign and "25,000 die of smoking related lung cancer" on one side and a picture of Farage with his big cigar and a "The obvious candidate" slogan on the other....I wouldn't see that as any incitement but the sentiment would be there.
There are "freedom of speech" thresholds that specifically apply to politicians.
Really? Just lucky he's not on STW. The media would be up in arms about him advocating "owning with Bombers".
But I feel you are probably guilty of seeing it as dark humour because it aligns with your own beliefs (and mine).
Of course, but I'm not trying to get hard right fascists wearing offensive t-shirts prosecuted or silenced, I'd just give them a dose of their own medicine. Honestly all the frothing and (faux) outrage about this is ridiculous, and i'm surprised Polanski has fallen into the trap of feeling like he needs to apologise or give it credence. All it required was for him to tell Farage to get on his bike and stop being a hypocrite. In the post-Starmer, Burnham-as-PM world if Polanski is to have any relevance it's going to be as the reactionary opponent to Farage who can say things which Burnham and others can't.
Calm down, even Polanski would never think he would ever be running the country. That is not his purpose.
I'll froth at the mouth if I choose. You're not the boss of me.
If it had been a T shirt of a bonfire with a hotel in the middle of it with "Burn baby burn, disco inferno" written at the bottom and a union flag t shirt wearing man holding a torch watching on.....would that be 'dark humour'? I'm not sure I'd find it funny.
The difference being that right wing non-terrorists have tried to burn asylum hotels, whereas nobody (as far as I'm aware) has tried to chop Farridge's head off.
The 'right' get to dictate the terms of what is extremism - whilst going on about free-speech all the time (calling everyone snow-flakes) and telling everyone else to pipe down.
It's not hard. Stop talking about killing politicians. Including the ones you strongly appose.
I suggest not calling them traitors either. Or issuing an actual call to arms against politicians.
Now, I don't think Polanski has ever talked about killing any politician, but he's shared something that suggests it... not the same thing... but still wrong... and he's deleted it.
The difference being that right wing non-terrorists have tried to burn asylum hotels, whereas nobody (as far as I'm aware) has tried to chop Farridge's head off.
Fair point.
A t shirt with a trebuchet set up on the cliffs of Dover lobbing rocks in the direction of a rubber dinghy with "another one bites the dust" along the bottom....pretty sure it's never happened so.....dark humour?
Polanski would have been much better off dismissing this and pointing out that Farage is no stranger to dishing out his own form of abuse and hatred and should wind his neck in
The recent murder of Anne Widdecombe notwithstanding, presumably? Any talk like that from Polanski hands the moral high ground to Farage- which he would lap up.
It's not hard. Stop talking about killing politicians.
It's not hard, stop the far right whipping up hate and incitement against vulnerable groups who can't defend themselves.
Without wanting to invoke Godwin, if you asked any normal non-extreme person if, with hindsight, it would have been better if someone had killed Hitler before he rose to power, we all know what the answer would be. The secret to fighting fascists isn't apologising to them or infringing on civil liberties to try to sensor them, it's to confront them directly with the same level of violence which they themselves incite and support.
Woody Allen nailed this in the days when he was funny
- Isaac Davis: Has anybody read that Nazis are gonna march in New Jersey? You know, I read this in the newspaper. We should go down there, get some guys together. You know, get some bricks and baseball bats and really explain things to them.
- Party Guest: There is this devastating satirical piece on that on the Op Ed page of the Times. It is devastating.
- Isaac Davis: Well, a satirical piece in the Times is one thing, but bricks and baseball bats really gets right to the point.
A t shirt with a trebuchet set up on the cliffs of Dover lobbing rocks in the direction of a rubber dinghy with "another one bites the dust" along the bottom....pretty sure it's never happened so.....dark humour?
Sure. I mean - it's not going to win a prize at The Fringe, but why not?
Lots of people are talking about Instagram. Unless I hallucinated it he also retweeted (or whatever it's called) the photo on Bluesky, I think that's where I first saw it. He retweets a lot, he's prolific. It used to mostly be about green issues until Burnham looked like he was getting in, since then the vast majority of his output has been reposting anti-Labour sentiments.
I can readily believe he saw it, thought "hah, that's amusing" and clicked repost without a second thought. Because let's face it, it is amusing.
As for the shirt,
One could pin-dance that it just says "Nigel." It's a song lyric. Any interpretation that it had anything to do with Farage would be an inference on the part of the reader. And were one to immediately conclude that he was the Nigel in question then that rather begs the question as to why one might think that.
Slightly more seriously,
Lady Guillotine has been used in political satire for decades. It's cropped up everywhere from Private Eye to the Harvard Lampoon. It wouldn't surprise me if there wasn't precedence for it being used as witty banter within Parliament. It is BLINDINGLY obvious that it's supposed to be a joke and that the beardy bloke enjoying his 15 minutes of infamy wasn't actually calling for Garage's head.
It has of course whipped up a right froth amongst those who sort their crayons in order of taste, but the predicable political and media circuses currently having a field day about it know full well that it was a joke. And I bet most of them thought it was funny, before reaching for the Outrage Hotlines.
Because let's face it, it is amusing.
You think that because you are perceptive enough to realise that nobody is actually advocating that anyone be killed. Not everyone seems able to make that distinction.
since then the vast majority of his output has been reposting anti-Labour sentiments.
This is my main problem with Polanski. Labour are not his enemy. He may have benefitted from the screaming incompetence of Starmer and his PR machine, but that's gone now. His main purpose now is to be the counterweight to Reform's extremism, but for some reason he seems less ready to take on Farage than he was with Starmer and now is with Burnham. Time for binners and his PFJ meme?
You think that because you are perceptive enough to realise that nobody is actually advocating that anyone be killed. Not everyone seems able to make that distinction.
Nonsense. Everyone is able to make that distinction, it's just that it's convenient for a lot of people to pretend that they can't.
This is my main problem with Polanski. Labour are not his enemy.
He seems to think otherwise. I can only assume that Labour is now a credible threat - moreover, his primary threat. Prior to Burnham it looked like the biggest thing standing in his way (aside from, y'know, everyone else) was Farage. The goalposts have changed.
And I said this at the start, I'm disappointed.
Now he's posting things like this.
If Andy Burnham truly wants to put politics aside to grip social care, the Greens should be at the table. Last month, I sat down listening to the experiences of carers.We need new thinking and urgent change now:m.youtube.com/watch?v=HbJJ...
— Zack Polanski (@zackpolanski.bsky.social) 2026-07-29T12:35:45.484Z
If he wants a seat at the table, maybe he should stop spending half the day throwing peanuts?
Nonsense. Everyone is able to make that distinction, it's just that it's convenient for a lot of people to pretend that they can't.
Same question I've asked above......would you rubbish it as obvious bants if the underlying tone to the humour was right wing stop the boats, drown the buggers bants?
Regardless of our level headedness we are preprogrammed to 'see' levity when we agree with the sentiment. Totally agree Reform reaction is performative OTT bollox, especially considering who/what they have defended in the past; but it was a totally unnecessary bear trap to fall into.
You don't get many right-wing satirists. I wonder why.
Lady Guillotine has been used in political satire for decades.
It has. But politics has changed. It's now genuinely dangerous for those that represent us. Of course no one (in the UK) is more to blame for that than Farage, IMHO... which is why I keep pointing it out. It's not "whataboutery", it's recognising that things are now more dangerous, including for Farage... BUT HE HAS MADE IT SO. He uses the fear of violence as a political tool. Threatens uprisings and political violence to get his way. It's utterly hypocritical for him to call for police action against Polanski (who got this and other social media use wrong).
You say that, but ...
Polanski has never talked about killing another politician, as far as I am aware. I even made that distinction in the post you quote.
Labour are not his enemy.
You might think that. But Polanski keeps saying he wants the Green Party to replace Labour. He's still acting as if that's his aim. He isn't Lucas, looking to work across party lines.
If he wants a seat at the table, maybe he should stop spending half the day throwing peanuts?
If only. It might well be time for someone else to be leader, someone who engages rather than spending all their time enraging.
he's not even a bloody MP!
Chowns is an MP though, and has been contributing to the Casey commission, and absolutely should have been invited.
. It is BLINDINGLY obvious that it's supposed to be a joke
Again, Anne Widdecombe has just been murdered. Or do we not care because, yknow she was a bit of an old witch. I'd have more respect for Polanski if he said that wearing a tee calling for the execution (however satirical) in a post shared by another politician - who has himself been on the receiving end of death threats is obviously not acceptable and just leave it there
Now, you, me, Dazh can all wear that tee,or stand next to someone wearing it, but Polanski should be judged differently.
Rayner has made it clear on Radio4 just now that MPs from all parties will be invited to contribute to the care system talks. Just an initial meeting with the big two parliamentary opposition parties today. So Chown can be involved (and should be in my opinion).
Again, Anne Widdecombe has just been murdered. Or do we not care because, yknow she was a bit of an old witch. I'd have more respect for Polanski if he said that wearing a tee calling for the execution (however satirical) in a post shared by another politician - who has himself been on the receiving end of death threats is obviously not acceptable and just leave it there
Well, no, I don't care. Sorry.
I do take your point though. It wasn't really forefront in my mind, perhaps it might have been if people had spent as much time talking about that as they have about a politician being tagged in on a photo of a man in a tee shirt. Presumably it's front and centre in British politics currently.
... sorry, that sounded more sarcastic than I intended. I do take your point.
Presumably it's front and centre in British politics currently.
Which is why Reform have leapt into action and kicked Simon Evans out of the party. I mean someone posting a photo of a Labour MP with “You dozy cow, you should be shot.” is pretty unambiguous.
They have havent they?
As for front and centre at the time ermm lets not forget Farage and "not a shot fired" a week after the murder of Jo Cox.
Polanski does come across as Farage like in many ways but he doesnt come close in terms of hypocrisy and hate spreading.
Polanski does come across as Farage like in many ways but he doesnt come close in terms of hypocrisy and hate spreading.
This is all very true but it's also the problem I have with Polanski in this instance. Being a bit better than Farage in the hypocrisy and hate stakes is a pretty low bar for a Green party leader to set.
I like Polanski but I don't think this is his finest hour.
politics has changed. It's now genuinely dangerous for those that represent us.
It has always been. Even without looking back to the olden days of speakers genuinely having to be dragged to the chair and MPs not being allowed to resign despite it being a dangerous occupation, it's well within my lifetime where MPs routinely had to check under their cars for bombs, and several were attacked and murdered not least in the Brighton bombing.
We may have had a bit of a pause after the GFA where that threat receded and eggs and milkshakes became the weapon du jour but soon after anti-war radicals stabbed and would have murdered Stephen Timms but for the prompt care he got. IDK if it's really more dangerous now or just more is known via SM and more and more people making political capital of it.
Anyway - I don't really like Liz Kershaw's views, and I've got a 'Hang the DJ' sticker on one of my record boxes upstairs (freebie with my reissued repackaged copy of Panic). Am I one of the baddies?
Brighton bombing
The 1991 mortar attack on Downing Street was the other that came to mind from that era.
it's well within my lifetime where MPs routinely had to check under their cars for bombs
True. And the laws and restrictions on “free speech” as regards supporting those that acted that way were way beyond what we have now. There’s been a period of peace since where that all changed, and restrictions and norms relaxed. But recently links between political causes and threats and harm towards politicians in the UK have become mainstream. The stuff that MPs get, and the attacks that have been prevented (or not) increasing. Some of this is Social Media, some of it hybrid warfare from abroad, some if it led by UK politicians. Politicians like Farage.
BBC.CO.UK 
