[Closed] Yay! UKIP employing Latvians to deliver their election leaflets.

El-bent - Member

My rational:

You didn't need to type any more beyond this point.

😆 I know I have some.

So there are not enough UKIP supporters to hand out the leaflets.

Looks like less of a up welling of public support than they like portray it

Rationale

Education should prepare kids for the future. Understanding Islam will be far more use than Magna Carta.

Young kids find Political/constitutional history as dull as....

Ive just used a UKIP flyer as a cat litter liner.
Anyone have a photo of Derek?

[i] but only after they've been taught enough about the UK to understand our founding principles.[/i]

Thing about the UK is that it wasn't really founded, it just sort of happened, mainly by accident. And there certainly aren't any founding principles.

From memory, Magna Carta is mainly about preserving the power of individual aristocrats, and putting down the Jews.

somewhatslightlydazed - Member

From memory, Magna Carta is mainly about preserving the power of individual aristocrats, and putting down the Jews.

So you don't know anything about the basis of the freedom of the individual and the right to trial then.

I don't want them taught about another meaningless belief.

You may think it is meaningless, I might think it is meaningless, however several billion people don't. Might be useful to be aware of this, no?

putting down the Jews.

Ah well, of course thats where constitutional history gets interesting - as the relevance of the reference to Jews in Magna Carta was of course the fact that they were main money lenders, since lending money with payment of interest was prohibited under Christian doctrine, as it still is under Islam.

So there we see the histories of big contemporary issues such as international finance, the regulation of banking, the concentration of money in the hands of the wealthy, the roots of future persecution and an exploration of the theological ties between Christianity and Islam - all these things tie into teaching an understanding of this historical bit of paper! Marvellous 😀

muddydwarf - Member
Ive just used a UKIP flyer as a cat litter liner.
Anyone have a photo of Derek?

I'm taking names here.. 😉

You and Tom will be the first into the 'showers'

Nick - Member
I don't want them taught about another meaningless belief.
You may think it is meaningless, I might think it is meaningless, however several billion people don't. Might be useful to be aware of this, no?

That's me out.
Very poor taste there derekfish.

ninfan - Member
putting down the Jews.
Ah well, of course thats where constitutional history gets interesting - as the relevance of the reference to Jews in Magna Carta was of course the fact that they were main money lenders, since lending money with payment of interest was prohibited under Christian doctrine, as it still is under Islam.

So there we see the histories of big contemporary issues such as international finance, the regulation of banking, the concentration of money in the hands of the wealthy, the roots of future persecution and an exploration of the theological ties between Christianity and Islam - all these things tie into teaching an understanding of this historical bit of paper! Marvellous

Pandering to Islam is just one irritating politically correct instance. Why Islam? Why not the Hindu Faith, or Buddism, both peaceful religions, both with representation here, but beyond that, the Magna Carta is the root of the freedoms and basis for our Justice System, which has been exported far and wide, pretty fundamental that kids know about it rather than some aggressively bigoted religion like Islam.

NURSE, he's out of his bed again!!!!!

boxelder - Member
That's me out.
Very poor taste there derekfish.

Post reported. Seriously not acceptable.

Born '74

I had a library card!

several billion people might want to come here and why UKIP supporters might not want them all here.

Yeah yeah yeah, but several billion people won't come here, however many times UKIP, BNP, EDL and you say that they want to.

[i]So you don't know anything about the basis of the freedom of the individual and the right to trial then[/i]

I know it states that no freeman can be punished except through the law of the land. But why should I give a shit? I'm a serf. And a woman.

CaptainFlashheart - Member
Post reported. Seriously not acceptable.

Really? Not even with the obvious wink? You do take yourself very seriously...

[i]Maybe, but only after they have an understanding of Magna Carta, the Civil War, [/i]

The point about history, your real history rather than the Alf Garnett/UKIP view spouted by certain people, is there might (just possibly) be more than one way of "understanding" something like Magana Carta or the Civil Wars.

But don't let proper historical debate get in the way of your propaganda.

somewhatslightlydazed - Member
So you don't know anything about the basis of the freedom of the individual and the right to trial then

I know it states that no freeman can be punished except through the law of the land. But why should I give a shit? I'm a serf. And a woman.

Yes, really. And if you think I take myself seriously, then you're not only deeply offensively unfunny, but utterly ignorant as well.

That wasn't funny. It wasn't gallows humour.

somewhatslightlydazed - Member
Maybe, but only after they have an understanding of Magna Carta, the Civil War,

The point about history, your real history rather than the Alf Garnett/UKIP view spouted by certain people, is there might (just possibly) be more than one way of "understanding" something like Magana Carta or the Civil Wars.

But don't let proper historical debate get in the way of your propaganda.

I think you may be mistaking my take on all this, seriously I'm not here to promote the likes of UKIP, I'm merely indicating why they are suddenly rising up in popularity, so, it's not 'propaganda' it's the reason through errors of Political correctness that a pendulum has been set in motion, and my over riding point is that it is to do with education or the lack of it.

I never thought i'd even come close to defending derekfish but that was clearly a joke. I myself have used the similar 'first against the wall come the revolution' joke on here, probably no funnier then but it was a joke. I hope its obvious I would never actually advocate the execution of anyone.
That is about all I could defend tho.

CaptainFlashheart - Member
Yes, really. And if you think I take myself seriously, then you're not only deeply offensively unfunny, but utterly ignorant as well.

That wasn't funny. It wasn't gallows humour.

Well I thought it was exactly 'gallows humour' as a reaction to having my picture used as a cat litter, I have to say I'm disappointed and surprised by your reaction, you are one of the posters here that I have found amusing and enlightened, so take that in the manner that it is intended.

It always staggers me that people can actually be right wing. Why on earth would you want to be unpleasant to other people, ignorant of damage you are doing to the world and generally downright mean when the alternative is being nice?

Sweepy, the 'first against the wall' trope is just that. It's non specific, non offensive. Joking about a massacre like the Holocaust? Not funny.

CaptainFlashheart - Member
Sweepy, the 'first against the wall' trope is just that. It's non specific, non offensive. Joking about a massacre like the Holocaust? Not funny.

Not wishing to irritate any further but the logic for using "Nazi-esque' gallows humour is precisely because of the parallels drawn between the rise of UKIP and fascism. It also clearly hasn't sunk in, that rather than promoting UKIP I am pointing out that it is precisely the excesses of the left that have caused it and education being just one of them.

Hell how bad is it when you have to explain a joke..

I'll be honest Flashy, is you looked deep into my posting history you would find a holocaust joke. Its the only one ive ever found funny or acceptable. I think it even got a laugh out of TJ tho he did call me evil, lightheartedly I hope.
Do take your point tho.

Joking about a massacre like the Holocaust? Not funny.

When you have to explain a joke, it isn't funny.

Really Flashy I'd never had you down as one of the 'outraged and offended'

I shall leave you to it with a quote from your very own Guardian columnist who's name I always forget..

"[i]I hate offended people. They come in two flavours - huffy and whiny - and it's hard to know which is worst. The huffy ones are self-important, narcissistic authoritarians in love with the sound of their own booming disapproval, while the whiny, sparrowlike ones are so annoying and sickly and ill-equipped for life on Earth you just want to smack them round the head until they stop crying and grow up. Combined, they're the very worst people on the planet - 20 times worse than child molesters[/i]

[i]I am pointing out that it is precisely the excesses of the left that have caused it and education being just one of them.[/i]

I don't see that the left has been any more excessive than the right (or anybody else for that matter).

e.g Ignoring Magna Carta is just as bad as turning into so sort of cornerstone of the English way of life. Michael Gove's attempt to re-invent WW1 is just as bad as basing your views entirely on "Oh what a lovely war"

I reckon part of UKIPs popularity is because the English love loonies. Just look at Boris Johnson.

Shirley with the obvious hypocrisy and logical fallacies spouted by UKIP and its collection of anti-PC heroes/ biggoted idiots (depending on your opinion)
People who vote for them are the ultimate example of poor education

derekfish - Member

The more they get criticised, particularly by the irritating politically correct left

What do you find irritating about political correctness?

How is it my youngest child having benefited from a fine state education, followed even by a spell in the private sector and all her friends, know all about the five pillars of islam, but nothing of Magna Carta - as a for instance.

No idea, did you speak to her teachers at the time?
Perhaps your daughter just isn't very bright?
Maybe she just wasn't paying attention?

Anyway, you paid for her education - you probably should have picked a better school.

Pandering to Islam is just one irritating politically correct instance. Why Islam? Why not the Hindu Faith, or Buddism, both peaceful religions, both with representation here

Buddhism isn't a religion.
Again, perhaps you both should have paid a bit more attention in school.

Personally I'd sooner they were taught about the Hindu faith, which is open and encompasses lots of teachings, but then Hindu's don't go around bleating victim on one hand whilst bombing, torturing, discriminating, hell bent on world domination with the other, but that isn't the point.

Didn't teach you or your daughter much about the history of religious conflict in India either, did they?

They even have sessions boning up on minor little things I think they should know, you know like being able to name three or four English counties

You don't seem to know much about the role religion played in Magna Carta either.
Perhaps, as ninfan says, you'd benefit from a library ticket.

kimbers - Member
People who vote for them are the ultimate example of poor education

Crikey ... that bad eh! 😯

See, Zombies on all sides.

😆

gallows humour

Facing death are you?

Poor taste, at best.

Yes, I'm wringing my hands and whining......

What I don't get is why people of a certain persuasion bang on about the importance of Magna Carta but hate the European Charter of Human Rights one is a significant document that protects the special interests of a limited group of Norman French Aristocrats and their Feudal Retainers the "Freemen", the other a document drawn up largely be the British to protect the fundamental rights and liberties of everyone. One was drawn up under duress, reneged upon almost immediately and now is 98% revoked and of little relevance, the other is in full force, internationally agreed and approved by consent and is a global bench mark.

One can see that outside of the study of early English History or constitutional law, Magna Carta is not a big deal one can see why in our country as it is today children would be aware of the central principles of a religion followed by a significant minority of the population .

Good video Ninfan but I am really not sure that they are joking about the Holocaust more that they are celebrating their Grandfathers survival .

boxelder - Member
gallows humour
Facing death are you?

We're all facing death chap, some of us are just a bit closer to it than others.. 😉

[url= http://www.deathclock.com ]Have you checked yours lately?[/url]

crankboy - Member
What I don't get is why people of a certain persuasion bang on about the importance of Magna Carta but hate the European Charter of Human Rights one is a significant document that protects the special interests of a limited group of Norman French Aristocrats and their Feudal Retainers the "Freemen", the other a document drawn up largely be the British to protect the fundamental rights and liberties of everyone. One was drawn up under duress, reneged upon almost immediately and now is 98% revoked and of little relevance, the other is in full force, internationally agreed and approved by consent and is a global bench mark.

One can see that outside of the study of early English History or constitutional law, Magna Carta is not a big deal one can see why in our country as it is today children would be aware of the central principles of a religion followed by a significant minority of the population .

Good video Ninfan but I am really not sure that they are joking about the Holocaust more that they are celebrating their Grandfathers survival .

the Magna Carta is the root of the freedoms and basis for our Justice System,

That's stretching it quite a bit. A load of rich landowners protecting themselves is closer to the truth.

Read up on the politics behind Magna Carta. Then teach your children about it.

The main political parties felt reluctant to mention the word immigration because it came with the word racist attached to it.There are a lot of people in this country concerned about immigration,whether positive or negative.UKIP is the only party to bring this to the fore and have an easily understandable policy.
The other parties vary their policies according to public opinion at voting time.
UKIP may not have a lot of policies but the public already distrust career politicians and their meaningless waffle so keeping it simple seems to have its appeal.

[url= https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7314/14133597542_bfb33ee24e_c.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7314/14133597542_bfb33ee24e_c.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/nwWo9f ]UKIP hypocrisy[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/people/75003318@N00/ ]brf[/url], on Flickr

[i]A vote for UKIP at the European parliamentary elections is a vote for children being taught more facts about Magna Carta.

Vote UKIP for obscure constitutional history in the nation's primary schools.

UKIP: your best defence against the vague religious pluralism in the current school curriculum. [/i]

Yep, sold.

joeegg - Member

The main political parties felt reluctant to mention the word immigration

Er... Immigration is a constant political football, all the main parties are at it.