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binners
Full Member
agree with the anger and 100% agree with criticism of the tories, but in their face of their c-ish intransigence, kinda have to lock down either way.We’re under Tier 2 lockdown now. We have been since the start of August. We were only out of lockdown for a couple of weeks. We’ve had nothing but lockdown since March.
It’s made the square root of * all difference to our infection rate.
So let’s just shut down the bits of our economy that are still open, with no financial aid
* off Boris!
The **** off stance sounds a bit silly tbh.
I'd guess given the gov have said they'll pay 80% of wages to business forced to close, sounds like there might be be an answer there..
ie. tell all business they must shut... guess would need to look into the details of that though. ie where does the authority lie in telling business to shut for eligibility.
Worth looking into I'd guess.
I’d guess given the gov have said they’ll pay 80% of wages to business forced to close
Have I missed something?
I know Liverpool are operating a top up scheme to try and make this happen for closed pubs there, but that’s not the same thing at all. Manchester are asking for an 80% government furlough scheme, as operated during the earlier “lock down”, for as long as businesses are made to close… if the gov has said that they’ll provide this, then I would expect local leaders to be more receptive towards the ramping up of their ongoing restrictions.
As an aside for those that receive it, this years Flu jab is pretty punchy. I had mine at 1pm, and now at 16:45 my arm feels like its done 5 rounds with Tyson, about 48 hrs earlier than last year.
I thought it was just me @kryton57...that was my experience too!
They haven’t said that. They’ve said they will pay 67% of the wages. Given that most people in hospitality are on minimum wage, that works out at 5.60 an hour
Fancy ‘living’ on that?
Me neither
The grants are a maximum of 3 grand a week per business. Most will get nowhere near that. How far do you think that a grand a week goes towards the costs of running a business? A city centre bar, for example. Where your overheads are the same but you have no income.
tell all business they must shut
They will never reopen.
The lockdown will end. The 80% salary thing will be stopped. And the jobs will be gone.
You're delusional if you think the Conservatives will invest the money to restart all those dead businesses.
We’re under Tier 2 lockdown now. We have been since the start of August. We were only out of lockdown for a couple of weeks. We’ve had nothing but lockdown since March.
Stolen from Twitter but worth repeating here.
We didn't have a lockdown.
We had middle class people hiding while working class people brought them things.
Is that a similar principle to the Silo in Fallout 4?
Honestly it just seemed to be the next spare term for making up a scale. Rule number one of the Team Boris pandemic handbook - no revision. Rule two - always have impenetrably vague jargon.
As an aside for those that receive it, this years Flu jab is pretty punchy. I had mine at 1pm, and now at 16:45
Had mine at 3pm...nothing so far...
Is there any evidence people were catching it from surfaces in large numbers?
Don't think so - the main transmission seems to be sustained proximity in poorly ventilated spaces, but that doesn't stop folk wiping all their shopping with dettol.
We had middle class people hiding
> cough <
There are some middle class people in health care… for example. But since we moved from “lock down” to “local measures” here, the support for working class people in roles that cannot be carried out at home, or in sectors still largely closed by law, has been steadily withdrawn… it is “post lock down” where so many workers have been left out in the cold.
Apologies for the LOLz but for fans of Friday Night Lights...
https://twitter.com/rabbitinahat/status/1317034766118551552?s=21
I’m in Greater Manchester where the pubs are still open. If I walk down to the bottom of our road, turn left and stroll a couple of hundred yards then I’m in Lancashire, where all the pubs are now shut.
I’m going to go out on a limb here and guess that my local might be a bit bloody busy this weekend. With people from all those communes of 6 people households that we didn’t know we had until recently
This is such a sad tale:
As an aside for those that receive it, this years Flu jab is pretty punchy. I had mine at 1pm, and now at 16:45 my arm feels like its done 5 rounds with Tyson, about 48 hrs earlier than last year.
Mrs stu had hers on Monday and says it's no where near as bad as previous years.
binners
Full Member
They haven’t said that. They’ve said they will pay 67% of the wages. Given that most people in hospitality are on minimum wage, that works out at 5.60 an hourFancy ‘living’ on that?
Me neither
The grants are a maximum of 3 grand a week per business. Most will get nowhere near that. How far do you think that a grand a week goes towards the costs of running a business? A city centre bar, for example. Where your overheads are the same but you have no income.
2/3rds then, what else do you think you are going to get out of it? Apart from headlines when youse become the most riddled part of the uk?
2/3rds then, what else do you think you are going to get out of it
I’d like to have a functioning economy by the time that the government has it test and trace sorted and we come out of lockdown in 2025
I agree it’s a pittance, but in reality do you think the tories are going to budge? They dont give a toss.
My concern is Team Boris are just going to sell it as all tests and fun time. I can't see how there can be back to normal; there are still going to have to be changes to behaviour. Otherwise it's just letting it rip and hoping you can spot and catch it before it takes hold. There are going to be tight margins and I suspect there will be under investment in fire fighting teams to deal with the inevitable flare ups. It would just leave us rapidly overwhelmed - again. Or we might actually find the sweet spot of monitoring, exposure and behaviour.
They dont give a toss
And if everyone just does what they say, without question, despite the shambolic way they’re going about this, they’re never going too.
good luck to yeez anyhow. Guess might be half a chance in a million youse will get something. Literally heehaw point up here in us even talking to the tories..
How are the people over 70 catching this though?
They wont be mixing within the work place, be involved within the education system, or down at the pub.
A friend of a friend works as a carer visiting people in their homes. She has a boyfriend at uni. She was working between visiting him and track and trace contacting her. Whilst self isolating she developed symptoms and tested positive. That’s how.
Sadly, it won't be long until they add Bradford, Leeds, Hudds & Sheffield to Tier 3.
Hopefully the good folk of Calderdale will be spared......
A friend of a friend works as a carer visiting people in their homes. She has a boyfriend at uni. She was working between visiting him and track and trace contacting her. Whilst self isolating she developed symptoms and tested positive. That’s how
I’m sure all of this was possible by complete adherence to the rules. You’re allowed to bubble with someone.
That role is being a key worker and wouldn’t be changed by any imposition of lockdown or any other restrictions.
Nosocomial (hospital acquire), nursing homes
Same with these.
Testing and preventative actions are currently at the highest level they have ever been and it’s an activity which wouldn’t change with an increase in restrictions or lockdown.
It’s not hard for example to consider a 70 year old, popping to the shop, not going within 2m of anyone, everyone is wearing a mask, but they pick up a bag of pasta off the shelf, that 4 days before someone with covid picked up and decided not to buy, or the shop staff had covid etc, they take it to the till, pay with cash (few over 70s like using cards)
Again if this is seen as essential shopping only, no change in restrictions is going to have any meaningful effect.
Which only leaves:
general contacts, grandchildren
The rating for Swaledale has changed to “HIGH” on the NHS App but then Gov website still says Medium? So no idea if I can visit people legally or not!
Not that I have any friends or family too visit even if I could.
This thing is combined with a relationship breakdown really is trashing my mental health in a big way now....
My parents, late 60s an array of health conditions between them, have been eating out at least once a week since sunaks scheme
Just the 2 of them or with friends, they've also been helping out my brothers with the school run
They are aware of the risks but they've definitely stopped taking things so seriously
They are aware of the risks but they’ve definitely stopped taking things so seriously
Good for them.
We didn’t have a lockdown. We had middle class people hiding while working class people brought them things.
Pretty much this. I'm a postie in Merseyside, been working flat out since it kicked off. 100+ staff milling about in a poorly ventilated office for a few hours before going out to interact with the public, touch hundreds of gates and letterboxes every day. Number who've been properly sick (as opposed to lead swinging)? Zero. This despite the shabby company we're working for abandoning any pretence at displaying an interest in the safety or health of their workforce. Any notion of social distancing or Covid workplace safety is out of the window.
I find it all quite amusing, to be honest. I did the whole lockdown thing properly first time round, fitting in local rides alongside long shifts by the letter and spirit of the rules. This time? **** it, I'll just be heading off on my no/low risk self contained overnight bivi bike rides to carefully chosen sites where I encounter nobody, like I've been doing all summer to avoid the Great British Public, who could've stood up and done the right thing but instead made a conscious decision to behave like complete ****s.
Not everyone has behaved like that. Grow up
We didn’t have a lockdown. We had middle class people hiding while working class people brought them things.
This is a sweeping generalisation and quite frankly, utter bullshit.
The governments did not institute a lockdown anyway - even at its most restrictive it stopped well short of full lockdown
This middleclass nurse went in to work as usual. My middleclass teacher friends were all in work
Just the 2 of them or with friends, they’ve also been helping out my brothers with the school run
They are aware of the risks but they’ve definitely stopped taking things so seriously
So they have been in contact with kids, who have been in contact with lots of other kids in school, and their own families, and friends, and colleagues etc.
My parents are the same. They say they have not been in contact with anyone other than a small circle of friends but they cuddle their grandchild who lives in a different area with a different family and goes to school full of 100's of other kids.
I'm not saying dont see anyone, but lots of people are unaware of how many people they are in contact with because they assume those who they do see, dont see anyone else.
no change in restrictions is going to have any meaningful effect
It will if it stops the increase in number of people infected. We need to control infection in the community to protect at risk people. Your examples show that at risk people can’t realistically be cut off from the rest of society, so we all need to act to keep the virus under control in the larger community, not act as if there is a firewall between at risk people and everyone else.
We didn’t have a lockdown. We had middle class people hiding while working class people brought them things.
As a bone fide working class person (unlike Mrs TiRed and my children), I resent this. I’ve also had someone bring me things on occasion! And I have immense respect for people who have worked hard throughout the challenges we’ve faced.
Although things look grave and it is easy to point fingers, people need to realise that most people have done the right thing. It’s just that the pathogen is highly transmissible and it doesn’t take a lot to push thing into growth. School returns were enough. Two weeks off school will help, but don’t expect the decline we had before. Halved in about three weeks and is doubling in one to two.
This, plus it was already clearly increasing gently before schools even went back. Pubs opening was the start of it. It was mostly in the younger age groups so hospitalisation and death stayed low but the virus was spreading. Schools opening just gave it enough extra to be really problematic.
China now is giving people an anti virus jab that has been tested properly and is said to be is safe. Has two parts to it.
Tired, bone fide working class man, OBE!!
So in cycling terms we're looking at team time trial mode.... a turn on the front taking the pain for long enough to make a difference followed by a turn in the wheels recovering a bit - not freewheeling, but bearable. But if we keep turns short enough that you don't blow we can overall do more than if we just sit at threshold.
Trouble is at this stage that some are being asked to do longer turns, some are failing to take a turn, and others are seeing those failing to take a turn and thinking if they don't, why should I? Our team leader's turned up in a baggy suit and is about as aero as a fly tipped sofa, and his mate's decided that he can ride an e-bike even though it's against the rules he made up. Allez allez allez.....
So in cycling terms we’re looking at team time trial mode…. a turn on the front taking the pain for long enough to make a difference followed by a turn in the wheels recovering a bit – not freewheeling, but bearable. But if we keep turns short enough that you don’t blow we can overall do more than if we just sit at threshold.
Excellent analogy.
I thought graphics were meant to make things clearer
The comments about getting reliant on 'uncle sugar' and 'sometimes you just have to sit back and let the private sector get on with it' are grotesque.
I'm not in an area of lockdown currently and my business won't be technically 'forced to close' even if we are so I'll get nowt but there's no work in it any more.
See also all sorts of people who provide services to nightclubs, festivals, conferences; av hire, sound engineers, staging, production managers etc etc
We've all been encouraged for years to be self employed or run businesses and now we have to live on the shitty benefits system they've designed to punish a tiny percentage of scammers/scroungers. We are seriously ****ed.
Meanwhile they hand out billions to their mates to pretend to supply face masks or deliver a useless test and trace system they pretend has something to do with the NHS.
I'd never heard of 'uncle sugar' until this week - I see it's another americanism. More importing of more clap trap like defunding. We've been successfully cutting the public sector budget and under investing in the welfare state for years. Uncle Sugar just seems to be a smoke screen for sorry we've lived hard and fast and left nothing for the rest of you (vaguely misquoting). Or following the strict rule of Boris and getting the war in - decades of exploitation of instead of investment in society have sown the wind and now we are reaping the whirlwind.
Tired, bone fide working class man
Son of a tradesman, single parent family and first to sit A levels and go to uni 🙂
As for the public sector, we kid ourselves what governments can really do, particularly in the short term. Short of training the army to run pcr machines (Machines magically from where?), you need business. Companies that are competent and have a track record of delivery. I have no issue with that.
Measures of competency are another thing. As is tasking the impossible. At least we seem to be following the Germans along the road to devolved testing and tracing.
A moment of inspirational analogistic communication from theotherjonv, thanks for that.
So in cycling terms we’re looking at team time trial mode…. a turn on the front taking the pain for long enough to make a difference followed by a turn in the wheels recovering a bit – not freewheeling, but bearable. But if we keep turns short enough that you don’t blow we can overall do more than if we just sit at threshold.
Agreed, only in this instance the team car has decided that the riders don't really need food, so they're keeping it back for themselves, just in case.