I pictured an elderly bloke with a grey beard, smelling strongly of wee and clutching a can of Fosters shouting it in my face.
Perhaps your time would have better spent discussing the points he raised? I don't see any extremes along these lines "anti vaxxer/masker/conspiracy/Bill Gates is the Devil" in what he actually wrote.
We’re heading towards a fascist state
We’re heading towards a fascist state
A temporary removal of rights is very frustrating, and safeguards to ensure we get them back as soon as possible is essential. I’m in full support of the Tory MPs pushing for the legislation and restrictions being reviewed in parliament every month, rather than every six months. Perhaps quarterly would be a good compromise. The executive acting unchecked, even in a pandemic, should be resisted. Just as important… we know the executive has had to bypass normal procurement rules to respond at speed… but those contracts should be examined, immediately, by a select committee… not left for a future enquiry that might never happen. A state where a small team at no10 and cabinet office can create draconian laws, and funnel state funds to companies we know nothing about, is looking like step one towards a fascist state. That isn’t to say that restrictions and quick actions aren’t required right now… but they should still involve parliamentary scrutiny, and where necessary court judgements… the small team at the heart of government should not be able to act as if their decisions are the start and end of the democratic process.
I’d like all that ^^^^^ applied to the Brexit process, new trade deals, and planning/building as well. No more centralising power with Gove, Cummings and the booster after dinner speaker.
Brexit- will remove rights.
Tories- will remove rights.
None of these things need a pandemic/plandemic/anything of hte sort, it's just what they do. Declare a specific right to be an Enemy Of The People or Elitist or Leftist or Damaging the Economy or Red Tape, and poof, there it goes. Legal aid, strike action, I can't remember many of the anti-corona-measures people being up in arms on all that
the small team at the heart of government should not be able to act as if their decisions are the start and end of the democratic process.
It's OK to make decisions at speed and in good faith in times of crisis. It's even forgivable that mistakes get made. But they must be honest mistakes, and they must be examined with the intent not of blaming but learning.
Spending millions with shell companies with no evidence in being able to deliver the products or services that they are being contracted for, is not a mistake. From ferries to facemasks, this is cronyism, pure and simple. That's why they won't be examined, and they'll get away with it, in turn that's why they do it.
In the past there'd be a hint of shame; these lot are just shameless.
Question about the new lockdown rules, specifically in Scotland. Our road clubs weekly club rides have just started again this weekend. Assume they'll need to stop if we have a limit if 6 folks meeting outdoors?
Apologies as I'm not massively up to speed with what's allowed and what's not..
Not least coz if my son is still coughing like this on Monday, they’ll send him straight home
So dont bloody send him to school like the school and gov say, get him a test and wait for it to return, most likely negative
So big yellow warnings on the news sites; don’t have a party/strain on the police force/strain on the nhs.
Of course we could question why the tories haven’t learned from many occasions beforehand that locking down on a Friday would prevent this, but I guess a chance for a burst in commerce and some extra herd immunity can’t be missed, sod the lives lost.
Just finished my home delivery shift and most customers had party/BBQ food and drink in their crates. Got back to the store and the place has been emptied of all of the same products. Drove past most of the parks around here and they were very busy, also heard a few garden parties going on too.
I'm expecting a similar spike to the one we had after the VE Day parties.
Question about the new lockdown rules, specifically in Scotland. Our road clubs weekly club rides have just started again this weekend. Assume they’ll need to stop if we have a limit if 6 folks meeting outdoors?
One other key point in the First Minister’s update: only two households of up to six people can now gather indoors or outdoors. However, the guidance adds that “You may meet outdoors with members of up to four other households at a time for exercise or activity”.
So I read that as 6 people from 4 households.
“You may meet outdoors with members of up to four other households at a time for exercise or activity”.
So I read that as 6 people from 4 households.
That would be 6 people from 5 households.
I posted on the Brexit Thread last week about my MP, the Rt Hon Simon Clarke. He quit as a minister last week, possibly related to the international law issues.
Turns out he got caught shagging at work. Wife and kid at home in his constituency.
Currently unclear how pumping your work colleagues fits within the CV19 rules. Although I'm looking forward to Barnard Castle esque mental gymnastics. Quite a few constituents probing him on this.
So dont bloody send him to school like the school and gov say, get him a test and wait for it to return, most likely negative
Yeah, I'm not that daft!
Been hitting refresh for a good 10 hrs now
Still no tests!
I’m expecting a similar spike to the one we had after the VE Day parties.
Not as big as everyone expected then?
The difference now is that it will bump the rate up in the run into flu and cold season, so at the worst possible time.
Has anyone in government said why the new measures weren't brought in yesterday? It was leaked a few days prior, wasn't it?
Stunning weather down here all weekend into next week which is lovely but worrying at the same time. However, if people are outside I suppose that's preferable to being inside before the rule of 6 kicks in.
Been hitting refresh for a good 10 hrs now
Still no tests!
Its bollocks isnt it. When the testing system fully falls over in a few weeks we are back to March.
It’s never going to go away so we are going to have to live with it so does that mean masks forever?
@richpenny Because of this ^^
I've spent the last couple of months dismayed at people who conflate mask wearing with the imposition of a fascist state. It's really not, and you would do well to think about true fascism.
Would you say that Japan, where people routinely wear masks, is a fascist state?
The hallmark of fascist dictatorship is the imposition of trivially inconvenient rules for the good of the most vulnerable in society.
Its bollocks isnt it. When the testing system fully falls over in a few weeks we are back to March.
Almost got through, apparently 12 slots in my nearest one
But when I clicked on it none left !
It's easier getting tickets to Glastonbury
I’ve spent the last couple of months dismayed at people who conflate mask wearing with the imposition of a fascist state. It’s really not, and you would do well to think about true fascism.
Would you say that Japan, where people routinely wear masks, is a fascist state?
No I wouldn't. But I don't think he was saying that either. The sentence you quoted sounds quite desperate to me. And I understand that - if the status quo holds I may never see my mother or my siblings again. Now that's an extreme example, but I think lots of people are genuinely afraid that we won't ever go back to normal. Of course, there are also people conflating wearing masks with being in a fascist state. As you imply, that's actually quite insulting.
Mask wearing has nothing to do with fascism. Preventing parliamentary scrutiny, refusing to talk to the press, giving ultimate power to an unelected person, subverting the rule of law, undermining an independent judiciary - these are all hallmarks of fascism and this government is doing all of these and more.
The hallmark of fascist dictatorship is the imposition of trivially inconvenient rules for the good of the most vulnerable in society.
Er, nope.
Preventing parliamentary scrutiny, refusing to talk to the press, giving ultimate power to an unelected person, subverting the rule of law, undermining an independent judiciary – these are all hallmarks of fascism and this government is doing all of these and more.
I think these are the hallmarks of an authoritarian regime, not just restricted to fascist ones.
Er, nope.
Did you not read the irony?
Er, nope.
This is a very welcome move:
https://www.nursinginpractice.com/latest-news/government-to-give-nurses-access-to-clear-face-masks/
Hmmm.
Sorry richpenny!
Just seen a mate, who spent the first wave panicking about his daughter and her immune suppressing transplant drugs, post a pic on FB of them and their extended family filling their living room to watch the Leeds match yesterday.
🤦♂️
At this point, it seems like a load of bobbins.
Do they have restrictions like this in Sweden?
The difference now is that it will bump the rate up in the run into flu and cold season, so at the worst possible time.
I think we've got two games this winter - what happens interns of new infections and what happens when the infected who are suffering ongoing issues from infection are impacted on by cold / flu season. We now have a new group of vulnerable people compared to previous winters.
The government has had six months to get ready for winter - instead the approach seems to have been ideological riven response which has let us with a xxxt-show. No doubt the excuse will be wave two is inevitable we are doing are best but wave two; can't be helped excuses. Thankfully some scientists are pointing we are in wave one and it's getting away from us again.
The government has had six months to get ready for winter
Indeed, and even their own announcements about what would be required before now (‘vital’ contact tracing app, hundreds of thousands of people being tested a day) have been hot air…
https://twitter.com/gabriel_pogrund/status/1305047756151627776?s=21
At this point, it seems like a load of bobbins.
What is “bobbins”?
Do they have restrictions like this in Sweden?
Measures taken in Sweden have been mostly voluntary, rather than legally enforced. They have been hit much harder than their neighbours both in terms of health an their economy. They’ve still done better than us though, in both respects. Would their “social responsibility rather than legally imposed” approach work here anyway?
It's very obvious to anyone trying to get a test that they system is not working
With a 5+ day delay on results & 1000s unable to access tests
Our case numbers will be much higher than the official case number & R number
French cases per 100,000 have gone up crazy in just over a week
https://twitter.com/GuillaumeRozier/status/1304842301781536774?s=19
Green <25 , orange 25-50, red 50+ per 100,000
We are pretty close to the 'social responsibility' approach here anyway, given the lack of serious enforcement, so you can judge for yourself
I think these are the hallmarks of an authoritarian regime, not just restricted to fascist ones.
Label it what you will....
Mask wearing has nothing to do with fascism.
So lets go with populist authoritarian?
You must 'wear a mask' but just because we tell you. We will not be telling you HOW to wear a mask to protect yourself and others. If you wish to wear a loose one or pull it down over your nose go ahead so long as you comply.
You however MUST NOT wear a mask when in a classroom (or in the houses of parliament).
Either of these rules only applies if you are not a member or "advisor" of the regime.
If that is the case feel free to test your eye-sight and you must vote for illegal bills.
Again, call it what you want... Mussolini and Hitler just picked popular sounding names for "The will of the people".
It’s very obvious to anyone trying to get a test that they system is not working
With a 5+ day delay on results & 1000s unable to access tests
Our case numbers will be much higher than the official case number & R number
Sounds like it's working as intended.
Just seen a mate, who spent the first wave panicking about his daughter and her immune suppressing transplant drugs, post a pic on FB of them and their extended family filling their living room to watch the Leeds match yesterday.
It's hardly surprising though.
She has presumably been forced into school with 1000+ other kids and not even allowed to wear a mask vs members of the family?
Our school says "we are following the scientific advice from the government"
Since when has the government issued "scientific advice"?
One of our neighbours keeps having parties. Except she is a Nurse at one of the local GP surgeries. FFS.
My son's been doing Dominoes deliveries, and he said there have been some big orders even during lockdown, but this weekend they have had a few big ones.
Lots of young people don't seem to give a shit and flock to packed pubs or house parties. If I see people hanging out and not wearing masks it's always teens/youth.
The piece in today's Times is pretty damning about the testing system, how are they getting it this wrong with the amount of our money they are spending
Curtain twitching central on here today!
Again, call it what you want… Mussolini and Hitler just picked popular sounding names for “The will of the people”.
Jeepers, now that really is a lot of old “bobbins”!
And in terms of young folk gathering, I find it difficult to be too judgemental... thinking back to when I was 18 not certain I’d still be sticking to the rules after 6 months of life-on-hold
I’d like all that ^^^^^ applied to the Brexit process, new trade deals, and planning/building as well. No more centralising power with Gove, Cummings and the booster after dinner speaker.
Well indeed but the point is that Covid is a godsend to Cummings et al - the chance to shovel masses of cash to pals without oversight and simultaneously divert from the dumpster fire that is Brexit. A few people died. Big deal.
Curtain twitching central on here today!
Your name will also go on the list! What is it?
Probably more interesting than the it's the highest number of new cases since... is we are now at the same number of daily cases as 31st March - 2nd April depending on if you are using 7 day rolling or actual daily. Anyone got an estimate of where we would be once you factor in the difference in testing regimes?
