I think I'd go with 'service users'
Well I just tried it again, on same tablet, and the big green ad that obscured all the story is no longer...
That's good, and great to be able to read about the award - well done Deputy Ed Jenn !
Bourne is that you?
😛
Just to confirm.We are still talking about whether crown races come with headsets are'nt we?
Yes finally progress.
Disappointing that first steps were denial, closing threads, threats of bans.
Then promises that didn't hold up to scrutiny. But finally solutions, at least so it seems.
Anyone got any recommendations for a new watch. Let me know if any ideas happen to pop up!!! 😉
Well good to know I highlighted this issue on Friday morning but sweet **** all was done.
Quite frankly blaming the ad providers is poor imo, it's your site and therfore your responsibility to check it works correctly as ultimately it's your reputation on the line.
Quite frankly blaming the ad providers is poor imo, it's your site and therfore your responsibility to check it works correctly as ultimately it's your reputation on the line.
I assume you are aware how the ads work, as explained (roughly repeating whats been read) some of the pop ups have been accepted but the majority of the ads are just sourced by agencies and delivered into the site. With all this going on I've looked at the site unlogged over this week and I get ads for my local area - to expect STW to check ads for Proton cars in Australia is a bit much.
Mark posted in the threads and said they were looking at it while doing the rest of the job and being at the bike show so expecting a resolution from Friday morning by Sat night is high expectations, people pay me for software support (more than £1.49/month) and can understand that most people don't work outside office hours and that sometimes it takes longer than 10 mins to fix a problem.
Now this obviously comes across as a "P" apologist but one of the things that nobody has suggested from the "We don't like ads" camp is how would you fund something like this?
...nobody has suggested from the "We don't like ads" camp is how would you fund something like this?
I'm not in the 'no ads camp' as I don't see any ads in my laptop browser and the problematic ones have never appeared on my iOS device. I understand the need for ads, though they have been getting bigger and bigger over the last few months and make the site look one of those shitty free newsletters that end up in most people's bin without ever being looked at.
Maybe if some investment went into the site with, say, additional forums for particular topics like maintenance or user reviews or trail guides/maps. Perhaps a PM service, avatars, rep-system? If the Ps want a fancy, pleb-free zone for their circle-jerks, let 'em have it. They'll sharp bore themselves to destruction, plus it'll keep the 'public' forums fresh and a bit less déjà vu.
Take a look at the variety of forums on MTBR. Granted, they have more because their demographic is broader and more global; but it at least shows what's marketable. Ads don't need to be massive because people are there to satisfy their interest in bikes and accessories. The content is good enough to make them even more interested and they click on adverts because they're in the market for things.
there's some self important ****ing petty minded little misers in the world isn't there..?
send the complainers round to my house and I'll poke 'em all in the eye with a shitty stick..
for free! cos I'm nice 🙂
errr, why don't I experience any problems on my devices?
i m with yunki.. no problems here. bottom line stuff has to be paid for by me or advertisers i d prefer they pay. i subscribe as well, its obscenely good value obscenely good.
those who shout loudest arent necessarily right and i d prefer the bloke at the bike show concentrated on that than a couple of pop up ads..
You can either buy the P or take the Pee.
A simple choice.
If you decide to take the Pee by not paying then don't complain about ads.
yunki - Membererrr, why don't I experience any problems on my devices?
Because you are such a worthless demographic that nobody will [s]waste[/s] spend money marketing to you! 😉
Bikeradar has been doing this for a while. I've noticed it changed the way I use the site.
i.e. I don't go there any more.
[i]being logged out every few minutes[/i]
Not just me then? It doesn't matter if I'm browsing on an Android Smartphone, a Chromebook, Windows 8 at work or my wife's Android tablet, I consistently have to log in at least once every 24hrs if not sooner (I logged in last night and just had to log in again to post this). Sometimes I see the 'log in to reply', and just don't.
So is the log in / log out thing done deliberately so there are more ads seen?
* not meant in an inflammatory way just curious as i cant be arsed to read up on this
You P's have got it all wrong. Mark confirmed on one of these threads there were 10's of 1000's of page hits per month (~75k IIRC) Now that's not you lot.
Don't forget, the vast majority of the site traffic must be non P and that's what's really helping fund the site. Your pathetic £1.49 and accompanying sense of superiority is not doing it. The trite response of 'just subscribe' etc won't help as if everyone did it, the advertising would be totally non effective as you can choose to switch it off. It would then, presumably, stop. End of income stream.
Advertising is part of modern Web life it just needs to be a bit less intrusive here.
I do worry about the 'pay up of eff off' type responses.
That and overly intrusive advertising could easily make the place unwelcoming to potential newbies. Which can't be healthy.
As for advertising being enough. I'd need to see some numbers tbh.
Out of curiosity, does anybody use a paid access only forum?
Out of curiosity, does anybody use a paid access only forum?
Well, not one I'd care to mention in public. 🙂
😆
Hmmm subs vs ads.
just read this thread, i don't seem to have a problem with logging in/out. but i never get the popups everybody is talking about ( no idea why ! )
Three fish - every time the subject of sub-forums, avatars etc comes up it is thoroughly shouted down by the majority of the regular users. With good reason.
Boblo/piemonster - I've assumed that £1.49 per month has been set as [i]at least[/i] as much as the value obtained through advertising.
It would seem that some are getting a larger share of the irritation than others,would that be true? Not complaining but bit of a double whammy being a user of a certain bank and using a tab to view the site. 😥
Out of curiosity, does anybody use a paid access only forum?
No. The only one I've come across is Nikonians and I stopped using it when it went paid only. Life went on, somehow.
Has it crossed anyone's mind that this could be an evil but very deliberate plan, hatched by those evil capitalist bastards at Singletrack Towers, to have a cull of the [s]whiney, freeloading, middle-class cock bags, and they're endless petty bleating and tight-wadded sense of entitlement[/s] non-Premier members?
Mark isn't at a bike show at all. He's sat in his Todmerden mansion, surrounded by gold-plated unicorns, in a sea of bank notes, naked hookers, and piles of cocaine, swilling champagne. All paid for by the untold millions he earns from forcing advertising onto the poor, naive, unsuspecting forumites.
The bastard! He's mocking you!!
Bugger, I was hoping the Fat Bike forum was pay only.
Would have explained why I couldn't get access.
That just leaves me with the fact I tried to register with the same forum name as here, probably a mistake. Can't say I blame them.
Boblo/piemonster - I've assumed that £1.49 per month has been set as at least as much as the value obtained through advertising.
That was my guess as well.
Mark isn't at a bike show at all. He's sat in his Todmerden mansion, surrounded by gold-plated unicorns, in a sea of bank notes, naked hookers, and piles of cocaine, swilling champagne. All paid for by the untold millions he earns from forcing advertising onto the poor, naive, unsuspecting forumites.
Shit he's on to us Mark. Quick hide the Hookers, wait the coke, no wait the errrrr! Runnnnnn!
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Sly buggers hidden the lot
Three fish - every time the subject of sub-forums, avatars etc comes up it is thoroughly shouted down by the majority of the regular users. With good reason
With good reason? What does that mean? I could interpret it to mean 'because the shouty ones are so uncomfortable with change', though I have a feeling that's not what you meant. It seems sometimes like there's a cluster of users who want STW to be an exclusive little niche, like a snug in a pub, where strangers are only welcome if they sign up to 'the way'. If that's what STW want, then forums and classifieds should be subs only. If not, they need to be conscious of the atmosphere that is created by the two-tier system. As I already said in a post yesterday, the ad revenue marketing value of the statistical crowd of non-P users is worth more than many here would like to admit. The 'P' is subsidised by the footfall of 'freeloaders'; the site is dependent on the footfall of lurkers and passers-by.
The elitism coming from the pay-up-or-****-off people is grotesque, very ugly indeed. It's their self-righteous, tree-house boys' club experience that they're happy to pay for, not the basic format, which, to be fair, is about as bland as it's possible to be. It's a hang-out, not a resource. What's amazing is that anyone thinks that it's OK to charge/pay for it; however that's not really how it is coming across. It's coercive: you pay to not be saturated with advertising, not for content.
Spoke too soon.....open up STW....it's like the Book of Mormon..."hello, I'm lloyds private bank"....,shut the page and try again with the mods thread..."hello, I'm lloyds private bank, Im here to stop you reading the pages....". Two full page killer ads immediately.
Another deadline unfulfilled. So still "very poor"
As I already said in a post yesterday, the ad revenue marketing value of the statistical crowd of non-P users is worth more than many here would like to admit. The 'P' is subsidised by the footfall of 'freeloaders'; the site is dependent on the footfall of lurkers and passers-by.
Sssshhhhh, don't spoil the fluffy story with the hard, cold truth of commerce!!!
The elitism coming from the pay-up-or-****-off people is grotesque, very ugly indeed. It's their self-righteous, tree-house boys' club experience that they're happy to pay for, not the basic format, which, to be fair, is about as bland as it's possible to be.
I still don't see the pay up of go option, you can view the site with ads for free. That is the option.
As for sub forums just one for all the road crap....
... 🙂
Move along, I didn't miss read anything
The problem is that you can't. Hence all the threads about adverts covering up the content.you can view the site with ads for free
Thm - you of all people know the miracle that our truly wonderful, capitalist, consumer society has delivered unto us - and Lord knows I for one will be eternally grateful - that of 'choice'
So your choice is quite simple:
1. Subscribe - don't see any adverts
2. Don't - do*
* and then possibly exercise your right in a free society, to go on and on and on and on and on and on and on about it, starting threads of endless whiney bitching and self-entitled, huffy, faux-righteous, indignant moaning
Another deadline unfulfilled. So still "very poor"
Seriously..."deadline"? Who imposed a deadline? As far as I can see, a few people said a few people might try and get it sorted. It's the weekend FFS, go and ride your bike or go and get dressed in your whites, knock up a few sets with your mates at the tennis club and stop whinging about it already.
You see, the way I see it, I don't pay, so I don't whinge about it. I might take the piss a bit on these threads, but other than that, I don't contribute financially, so unlike, say common-sense posters like bearnecessities, there's nothing constructive to add from me. I don't or can't offer advice on bikes as I don't know anything near what many others here do. Other than continuing support on timber flooring threads or advice to anyone coming to Bristol, I bring nothing here.
So ask yourself thm, other than your economics 101 tutorials to the impertinent unwashed, what do YOU bring to justify your free use of the forum? Trolling JY passive aggressively? Trolling "the left" passive aggressively? Whinging on advertising threads? Whinging on religion threads? In the words of another mod, "your name is attached to so many moderator emails..." that one has to start wondering which of your debit or credit columns is longer. So, what [i]actual[/i] use are you here?
3 - subscribe and still have to arse about to login whenever I check in from phone and are unable to login at [i]all[/i] from a relatively sluggish networked laptop because the scripts kill the page (my personal whineycockbag issue, which I won't mention again) 😀
If we was in the same room, I'd have just sung "whineycockbag" in a mock choir voice very badly out of tune
I take it this is you thread of choice of arguing this weekend THM?
Three_Fish you really shouldn't feel like that. We appreciate all forumites on here whether they pay or not, the P members have the privilege of switching the ads off. Non P members don't have this option in built in the forums settings, they contribute to the forum with ads. As mentioned many times they not intentionally meant to be so intrusive so Mark is trying to fix these. He is being hindered by may things, it's the weekend, he's at a show, the way they appear makes it difficult to to narrow the problems ads (the ones slowing the site) as they may not be the ones members see.
If you don't want to subscribe that's fine and users choice we don't want to force that on anyone.
It's about "informed" choice Binners, .....INFORMED. So you will find me commenting when that information is distorted or untrue (see Alex Salmond for example). Many of the suck it comments are IMO I'll-informed.
Plus, I look at it from a business sense. The vague notion that any forum is some free altruistic service for which users should be eternally grateful is poppycock. It a business and good for the owners for providing it. It makes money from selling "you" indirectly to advertisers and I would hope (from a business perspective) to a lesser extent from small subs as a side line to avoid the shitty aspects - call it premium economy. The Towers have a problem if 2 is > than 1.
So I am "interested" in the way the value inputs are treated - first the ads themselves, then the threats of bans and thread closures, then the false promises and finally (so far) nothing done. Bottom line, less hits from me (considerably so) => weaker viewer stats => weaker value proposition for advertisers => business. Everyone has a choose including the Towers. For me, their response and CHOICE has been the interesting one.
Edit. This thread needs Zokes.
Just for the record, I didn't start this thread so that various people could indulge themselves.
It was merely to point out that from my (very brief) browsing and reading of the forum yesterday, I got the impression that the 'issue' had reached some kind of critical mass. I'm afraid I'm not one of the in crowd on here who seem to know the deeper meaning behind everything and conduct cliquey, nudge-nudge arguments.
I can just about turn an iPad on and use it look at the internet. I was only recently forced into using Facebook because we used to organize rides on here, but the local parkies infiltrated our thread and busted us.
So, as a confirmed technophobe who would much rather actually be riding my bike, I found that the 'issue' was becoming more intrusive. I also saw that others thought similar. I didn't pore over the previous threads, so I didn't have a minute by minute account of all the mods' whereabouts. It was merely an attempt to get a point across.
The result seems to be that the powers that be are prepared to listen, be reasonable, and actually look into doing something about it. Some usual suspects are nipping at their ankles, but hey, that was going to happen anyway.
That's enough sermonising for a Sunday morning.......
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You must have enjoyed that DD...how long has it been draft form and were you looking in the mirror? I guess many of those reports had your name on them.
As you say, much better to go for a ride and just about to do that. Tennis later tonight, thanks. BTW, Mark set the deadline and posted it here.
No drac, as above, can't see why any business would respond in this way. Simple.
Anyway happy trails...emjoy
The result seems to be that the powers that be are prepared to listen, be reasonable, and actually look into doing something about it
No drac, as above, can't see why any business would respond in this way. Simple.
Yeah Ok.
So ask yourself thm, other than your economics 101 tutorials to the impertinent unwashed, what do YOU bring to justify your free use of the forum?
He brings clicks, same as anyone else.
Can I raise a pertenant, but fairly obvious, question at this point? On a technicality...
If the forum has been rendered 'unusable' by the advertising, how are you lot managing to carry on with your incessant whining?