I'm not sure about Islamic leaders coming to Russia's aid
They are more likely to see it as an opportunity to exploit the chaos themselves
Meanwhile
https://twitter.com/Global_Mil_Info/status/1569434583149551682?t=_hhCLFhOKmJYFYCNw6c00w&s=19
From what we've seen it's pretty clear that the Ukrainian armed forces have taken the Russians by surprise. I don't think that it'll be enough to do for Putin's leadership (yet), but the sheer speed of Ukraine's forces retaking theit territory is something to behold.
https://twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/status/1569175084702769152?cxt=HHwWgIDRoZ-b6sYrAAAA
ditch_jockey
Full MemberShe also reckons ‘chewk’ has been scripted by two different people, which is why he appears to have a split personality with obviously different language skills…
Nah, it's all chewkw, we've seen a few times that he can be perfectly coherent and comprehensible when he wants, it's just that most of the time he doesn't want.
I’m not sure about Islamic leaders coming to Russia’s aid
They are more likely to see it as an opportunity to exploit the chaos themselves
Countries in Central Asia are predominantly Islam even when their leaders do not behave like a true Muslim, they run the country like a "kingdom" at will. With the West (NATO as vehicle) emphasizing on democracy and human rights, that will have an effect on their power based and a threat to their "rights" to rule or their way of life. Putin is no threat to their leadership and support them. If Putin goes those leaders will be told to behave and they don't enjoy that.
Reports of clashes between Azerbaijan and Armenia.
Historically, the Turks (Ottoman) started the whole affairs there but never concluded it.
Amazing none of your friends realised you moved to top floor before you wrote a note
Yep - bot, bot, bot. Nonsensical nonsense.
I think our resident Russkie is in some way trying to insinuate that it is I (flings off cloak for the big reveal) who is the troll farm employee of the month and not him (or indeed her, I'm sure these places are big on equal opportunities). News to me, and indeed the missus..
It's interesting how these guys trip up on the small details of language. The missing 'the' before top floor being a case in point.
That being the case, there's no way I'm a Russian troll. Writing's just too damn good, you see.. 😏
What’s stopping Putin from mobilising his army? Does anyone know?
Assuming we're not being fed propaganda at the same level Russian citizens are, it seems putin doesn't even have an army to mobilise.
^^ Other than going the full monty and actually declaring a war, I suspect you are spot on. All he can do is move the ever dwindling pawns around the board.
Still going to be a bloody rough winter for Ukraine. I don't see Putin doing a U turn anytime soon. He doesn't care how many (of either nationality) he sends to the meat grinder.
what on earth is going on with this thread
Just Putin apologists huffing copium. If you go back to the start of this thread back in February it was full of claims that Ukraine should just surrender because Russian victory was inevitable. Not they're reduced to trying to distract from the reality that their boy is getting thrashed.
(From April): What comes after Putin?
It wasn't too long ago that Putin's succession was the stuff of whimsy.
Putin has a new opposition, the ultra-nationalists.
The really weird thing with the "how can we stop this war?" lefties in the West is that they completely dismiss Ukrainian agency in it all. Do they really think that Ukrainians will just accept a deal that they have no part in negotiating?
https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1569407313307394048
Not they’re reduced to trying to distract from the reality that their boy is getting thrashed.
Obvious typo, defo a bot.
Anyway, on the subject of propaganda. Has anyone figured out the surrender/no more troops claims yet.
I mean, theyre both plausible, but also both plausible to be played on by Ukraine to demoralise.
who likes to play devil’s advocate
Sort of, if it was just that then fine. But there's a lot of wild distraction nonsense thrown in. Theres a lot of coincidence with messaging and timing from decidedly unambiguous outlets too which does not help.
The really weird thing with the “how can we stop this war?” lefties in the West is that they completely dismiss Ukrainian agency in it all. Do they really think that Ukrainians will just accept a deal that they have no part in negotiating?
Good point. Its not necessarily lefties tho and if the west stops supplying weapons the equation changes but I dont see Ukraine accepting losing territory even tho the current Ukrainian borders are a recent construct
Assuming we’re not being fed propaganda at the same level Russian citizens are, it seems putin doesn’t even have an army to mobilise
According to a few of those (seemingly more reliable/informed) Twitterati, there's two reasons even if he did call out full scale war it wouldn't work.
1. There's seemingly open revolt among troops being asked to go to front line, and rumours of thousands starting to surrender or run away. What are you going to do, just have your general shoot thousands of them?
2. There isn't any kit left, there's no supply of food / clothes / basics needed. And let's not forget the overnight temperatures are dropping - in a couple of weeks the mud, cold and rain starts. Even if you had the bodies, you can't get them there and even if you did, they will be stood in t-shirt and jeans.
1. Russian collapse means central Asia would be distabilised and that is not good for their Islamic leaders and I suspect they will come to Russian aid.
What do the 'stans have to offer? I think that's as likely as Syria coming to Russia's aid, Assad is reliant on his Russian guests who aren't showing any signs of wanting to leave for UKR
Rumours that putin has fled Moscow to his country retreat.
Meanwhile it seems, sensing weakness, Azerbaijan seems to have escalated it's beef with Armenia...
https://euroweeklynews.com/2022/09/13/rbaijan-launches-an-attack/
The Stans?
Kazakhstan is expected to sell some of its crude oil through Azerbaijan's biggest oil pipeline from September, as the nation seeks alternatives to a route Russia threatened to shut, three sources familiar with the matter said.
Itll be a mixed bag in reality
At this point, it's impossible to tell what is Ukrainian psyops and what is fact. The Ukrainians apparently tracked all the Russian cellphones operating in Ukraine (i.e. Russian soldiers) and sent them a text message explaining how to surrender. The "reports" that large numbers of Russians are negotiating to surrender might be true, they might just be another attempt at demoralizing Russian troops. I hope the Russians do either surrender of flee, but best to not believe anything until it's confirmed.
Good point. Its not necessarily lefties tho
I agree, the left doesn't have a monopoly on bad takes about Ukraine. A pro Kremlin stance seems to be one thing many on the far left and far right agree on.
I think though that when @thols2 referenced 'how can we stop this war' he was referring to this event, which to be fair is organised by the left, includes no Ukrainian input on the panel but does include someone banned from entering Ukraine for his pro Kremlin views. I can imagine how enraged Ukrainians would be by this, as evidenced by some of the comments.
https://twitter.com/STWuk/status/1567539083026604034?t=l2HXrprGc75Y95BAN7xhgw&s=19
I hope the Russians do either surrender of flee, but best to not believe anything until it’s confirmed.
It'll be simpler if they flee because of the logistics involved in PoW processing, feeding, transporting, etc. There's enough to do with the logistics of dealing with the materiel left behind
Having said that it does make PoW swaps more problematic, especially as civilians have reportedly been moved to Russia
Rumours that putin has fled Moscow to his country retreat.
I think 'flee' is doing some very heavy lifting in that Link!
It's going to be a cold winter for residents left in Kharkiv.
RF just destroying infrastructure on its way out of town.
Maybe thats Putins new plan.
Blow all the infrastructure and then hand then thousands of POWs that ukraine now has to feed / heat and guard. I suppose if you are going to struggle to feed your own troops making them your enemies problem is probably a better gambit.
Wonder if ukraine could call on other states to house / help out with the POW's. Thats non-combative assistance
A lot of Ukrainian psyops with the surrender stuff, but there's probably plenty of Russians who want a way out
And with resupply lines from Belarus via Izyum now gone they will be worried
https://twitter.com/WhereisRussia/status/1569317899436978176?t=thhoa5Bt4kEryHV3j5Jljg&s=19
What's the point of Russia doing this? Is Putin having a tantrum? Has no-one ever said "no" to him before?
This just makes things worse when inevitably they have to face up to reality.
Ukraine was calling for about $300Bn in reparations a few days ago - that actually seems like quite a reasonable request. But this kind of thing just adds to the final bill for Putin's party.
this event, which to be fair is organised by the left, includes no Ukrainian input on the panel but does include someone banned from entering Ukraine for his pro Kremlin views. I can imagine how enraged Ukrainians would be by this, as evidenced by some of the comments.
Exactly. It's an embarrassment (although I am assuming they aren't going to conclude that we should send weapons and money to Ukraine so that they can expel Russian forces, if they do, credit to them.)
What do we make of Putins demand that the oligarchs fund and build their own armies?
Putin flees Moscow.
Goat deflowerers are being sent to round up Russian army deserters.
Regional deputies are issuing letter of no confidence.
There are no supplies for an army (and that’s ignoring the lack of willing volunteers).
Ukraine has struck strategic military targets in Russia.
There’s been a fair bit of chatter on all of those topics some of which may or may not be true but all seem to have some grounding in truth. So what happens now?
What are goat deflowerers?
Wild stab in the dark here, but I'm going to guess it's a derogatory term for Muslims, probably Chechens.
Enquiring minds want to know. ^^^^ 🤷♂️
ISW is reporting the surrender negotiations (caveated) - they’re usually reliable.
Thats a derogatory term for Kadyrov's Tik Tok Battalion. Ive not seen it used more generally but im sure someone has.
Id post THAT night vision video with the goat.... but id really rather not. (Which has to be faked anyway)
What’s the point of Russia doing this? Is Putin having a tantrum? Has no-one ever said “no” to him before?
Ukraine has been an embarrassment to Putin - after the breakup of the soviet union former soviet states have flourished and Russia has stagnated. particularly during the time of Putin's leadership. Ukraininans have been enjoying a much better quality of life that their Russian neighbours. So although Putin has been calling this a 'liberation' he's been destroying infrastructure and shopping malls and housing since the start - its never been the aim for life to be better there in future. But its easier to make things worse in Ukraine than it is to make things better in Russia
If you think back to the Vietnam war there was a change of strategy by the US from one for winning to one for losing with their interests in mind. The campaign of carpet bombing was nothing other than vandalism it wasn't an effort to win - they just wanted there to be nothing for the winners - it was just covering the landscape in craters and unexploded ordinance so that it would be un-farmable - a way of ensuring poverty in the country for generations to come.
I’m surprised that UA has not moved past the Oskil river and further pressed its advantage. I supposed an operational pause is needed for supply lines to catch up with the advance.
Thats a derogatory term for Kadyrov’s Tik Tok Battalion. Ive not seen it used more generally but im sure someone has.
There are loads of Ukrainian trolling memes suggesting Kadyrov has 'a fondness' for goats. The guy seems a nasty piece of work but I've not seen any evidence of that. It does sometimes seem to be extended to Chechen fighters generally, which despite the fact they have no business in Ukraine, is borderline racist and pretty unpleasant.
Yes I've seen this meme
https://twitter.com/MariuszCieslins/status/1517830002137571329?t=v3fIL_J7lP0D9zIiXJL0vQ&s=19
which despite the fact they have no business in Ukraine, is borderline racist and pretty unpleasant.
No arguing with that.
how did we get from a hypothetical Russia being defeated by Ukraine on Ukrainian territory to ‘you’ (do you mean me, Ukraine, the West) moving to to Asia and threatening China? That’s some leap and not what we were talking about.
I think Chewkw's point depends on certain conspiracist assumptions. Viz:
1. This is actually a proxy war between Russia and NATO/The USA/The West/etc etc
2. So if Russia is defeated and has settlement terms dictated to it, these terms are actually NATO/The USA's
3. Thus, if forced to accept these terms, Russia now becomes some kind of vassal state of NATO/The West
If we accept the above premise, it does logically follow that China would be unhappy with the sudden influx of US troops and Walmarts and Aircraft Carriers and branches of Dick's Sporting Goods that would shortly appear on its Siberian border. Understandably. But it's all a little bit fantastical.
Echoes of Balaklava Company and the Thin Red Line shortly?
which despite the fact they have no business in Ukraine, is borderline racist and pretty unpleasant.
They are at war, this isn't some diversity and inclusion seminar. 🤦♂️
If we accept the above premise, it does logically follow that China would be unhappy with the sudden influx of US troops and Walmarts and Aircraft Carriers and branches of Dick’s Sporting Goods that would shortly appear on its Siberian border. Understandably. But it’s all a little bit fantastical.
US companies where operating freely in Russia and Ukraine before this conflict so not sure how much will change if Russia is defeated. Apart from Starbucks and Maccies wanting their businesses back.
But it’s all a little bit fantastical.
The whole idea that NATO is a puppet-master pulling strings is mostly just a fantasy. NATO and the other U.S. alliances (Japan, South Korea, etc.) are really quite uneasy marriages of convenience. Countries bordering China and Russia don't trust them and see an alliance with the U.S. as a better choice, but they are also suspicious and resentful of the U.S. and have their own agendas that are somewhat in conflict with the U.S. agenda. If Russia, China, and North Korea weren't so belligerent, the Western liberal alliances probably would have faded away. The idea that the U.S. just snaps its fingers and its allies do its bidding has no basis in reality.
They are at war, this isn’t some diversity and inclusion seminar.
Those that consider goat ****er an insult are in fact demonising the goat ****ing community
Maybe they need to go to a diversity and inclusion workshop to learn how to be less judgemental towards people who love goats a little too much?
They are at war, this isn’t some diversity and inclusion seminar. 🤦♂️
Well thanks for explaining that to me. I'm a cheerleader for the right of Ukraine to defend their sovereignty with all the force available to them. But, Ukraine has had a problem with the extreme right in the past, and though exaggerated that has been weaponised by Putin and used as one of the trumped up reasons for the invasion. In light of that, maybe Ukrainian memes implying muslims are all fond of bestiality isn't the best ploy. Just a thought.
