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Bindery
So why is labour membership hugely up then?
It’s not. They reckon they’ve lost 100,000+ members since the general election
And let’s not mention the polling
Anyone going to answer my questions?
Who’s the next Kim?
Whilst membership is up (but rapidly declining) it is no reflection of electability. My preference for the next leader is someone who is more electable than JC. I like JC a lot but i can see he has some significant flaws (inability to respond quickly, embarrassing over brexit).
To answer your question binners: Yvette Cooper would be my choice, or a returning Andy Burnham.
Now answer mine: What is your plan to democratically rectify the state this country is in?
If you hate the current tory gov and want a better labour party than the one we have now, why not join the party so you can have a say in who the new leader should be??
I did at least, just not the Labour Party.
I did at least, just not the Labour Party.
Good. I'm not saying Vote Labour here, i'm advocating being democratically involved if you want to see a change, irrespective of what you want that change to be.
This country needs an electable labour government, desperately.
Unfortunately, not only is Corbyn far from that, the changes occurring in the party under him are taking them further and further away from power. Any opposition worthy of the name would be twenty points clear in the polls and on for a Blair style landslide victory
With Corbyn - Consolidating the influence of his 70’s throwback comrades ain’t a great look to the wider electorate, as the polling and recent results shows.
I did the 3 quid membership to vote for Andy, and if he’d have got in then I firmly believe we’d now have a labour government and Brexit wouldn’t be happening
I think Yvette Cooper would be a great leader, and a great PM. So obviously, in the present Labour Party, she hasn’t s prayer.
The party seems determined to return to the early 80’s and permanent opposition. And that is very very bad news for all of us
I remember when I first noticed Tom Watson early in the Corbyn days, he did some stuff that I can't remember but gave me a fairly quick dislike of the man.
More recently, I find him to be the voice of sense, unity and moderation within the Labour party. It seems to me that he might actually be capable of bringing the party together and putting the boot into the current govt.
So I'm stuck between him having a bad history but looking like a good politician right now.
Yvette Cooper, Andy Burnham, David Milliband, probably even Keir Starmer would all be eminently electable types in my view and might enourage me to vote labour.
I'd encourage those who want to see a more electable opposition to be involved where they can as it will only be changed from the inside.
Anyone who joins the labour party will just be giving Corbyn a clear mandate to carry on doing nothing.
I’ve heard from friends who’ve recently left that the atmosphere within the Labour Party is now so toxic that you’d have to be a masochist to go in there as a non-believer in the cult of Jeremy.
It’s got all the hallmarks of Militant in the early 80’s, except Militant never got its hands on the steering wheel. They have now and the party has gone careering off to electoral irrelevance
Personally I can only see, if things carry on as they are, a huge SDP scale defection by moderate labour MPs like Watson, as there is no way that Corbyn’s cabal that have colonised the party are going to change course, or give it up.
And if that happens, a lot of labour voters are already ahead of them. On Brexit, for example, the Lib Dem’s unambiguous pro remain position is why they’re polling above labour. Something which i’m Sure is giving pause for thought among many non-coby ire labour MP’s - is: the vast majority of them
Personally I can only see a huge SDP scale defection by moderate labour MPs like Watson, as there is no way that Corbyn’s cabal that have colonised the party are going to change course, or give it up.
I keep expecting this too, some Political correspondents are saying them same thing, but it's not happened yet - it always seems to be a case that a handful are expected, only at the 11th hour it doesn't happen.
There's been talk of a lot of threats of de-selection for non-believers, they may jump as MPs and join the Lib Dems (Change UK seems to have faltered) rather than try to gain re-election under another party.
Labour relies a lot on Party loyalty, consider Newport West recently had a by-election, they voted 56% leave in the EU ref one of the larger margins in the UK, but the Labour candidate they elected as their MP is a vocal remainer and campaigned to have a 2nd Ref and to remain. Have the people of Newport swung that far, or would they vote for a Pig in a red rosette.
Yvette Cooper, Andy Burnham, David Milliband, probably even Keir Starmer would all be eminently electable types
They would indeed, but they have no chance since the Momentum rule changes.
John McDonnell pretty much named Corbyn's potential successors in Nick Robinson's Political thinking podcast:
Rebecca Long-Bailey
Emily Thornbury
Richard Bergen
Kate Osamor
It will be one of them.
The only way I can see that it turning out differently is if more than one candidate from McDonnell/Abbot/Corbyn's wing of the party stood and split the vote while the moderates put up one candidate. I can't imagine Momentum will be dumb enough to let that happen.
Jess Phillips or Keir Starmer would make me vote for Labour again.
Anyone who joins the labour party will just be giving Corbyn a clear mandate to carry on doing nothing.
This. Very much this.
Jess Phillips or Keir Starmer would make me vote for Labour again.
Ditto, both seem to be fine individuals.
Although they'd have to have chance of winning in my constituency as my priority would be to get the current waste of oxygen Tory out.
Katia Adler on the BBC Brexitcast is just commenting that the present Tory party leadership contest is proving a handy distraction for the Labour Party as there is presently complete turmoil behind the scenes and things are most definitely coming to a head.
I did the 3 quid membership to vote for Andy, and if he’d have got in then I firmly believe we’d now have a labour government and Brexit wouldn’t be happening
Or this one?
https://twitter.com/AndyBurnhamGM/status/806563566526537728
Yes, that Andy Burnham.
You’re going to tell me he supported going into Iraq next, aren’t you?
You’re going to tell me he supported going into Iraq next, aren’t you?
Nope, I've got very little interest in that. I will say though that there is very little evidence that he would have stopped brexit had he won the leadership. The very opposite in fact, we'd probably be out by now as he would have supported May's deal and voted it through.
So most Labour members are in favour of remain and should be listened to but are also lunatics and should be ignored at all costs.
What are the momentum rule changes to stop a 'Blairite' being a candidate?
... Or maybe had a Labour leader who would actually have turned up for the referendum campaign in the first place Daz? Instead of seeing it as an opportunity to kick back on the allotment for a couple of months and taken on a spectators role
An oft repeated theme ever since, that spawned the much used hashtag
#wheresjeremy
And let’s not mention the polling
Anyone going to answer my questions?
I will - Labour ahead on a good chunk of the polls save yougov.
Britain Elects has an aggregate tracker that puts *currently* Labour 3pts ahead of the Tories.
https://britainelects.com/polling/westminster/
I don't know who does a more bullshit job on Labour you or the papers.
Polling ahead of the Tories?
But still on 18%?
You’ve taken into consideration the other factors, right?
Prepare for the glorious socialist government comrades...
As a relatively independent observer...
Ransos = Labour supporter
TJ = Labour supporter
Binners = Labour supporter
This. This is what Corbyn is doing. He's a ****ing liability.
Plus Kerley = Labour supporter (or was) who doesn't particularly agree with any of the 3 you have listed but then surely that is typical. Just because we want the same general intentions of a party we are not going to all agree on how a party is led. Take Brexit out of it and we would probably be closer aligned.
Pook.
A very interesting observation.
Time for a lot of people to join the Lib Dems including Mr Watson.
Time for a lot of people to join the Lib Dems including Mr Watson.
If they did, I'd vote for the Lib Dems. If there was to be an election tomorrow I don't know who I'd vote for - none of the major parties inspire much confidence. Maybe I'd vote for the Green Party…
The bottom line is that every day Corbyn has been leader of the Labour Party has delivered a Tory government.
And he’s been busy ensuring this remains the case. It’s absolutely inexplicable to me that anyone can defend him given that the Labour Party is presently polling 18% against this total shambles of a government.
And has anyone heard from him recently? The silence is, as always, deafening
There is, to all intents and purposes, no official opposition in this country at present. When we’ve never needed one more. And the blame for that lies squarely at the feet of Jeremy Corbyn
Time to go and spend more time with your courgettes, grandad
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jul/09/tom-watson-weaken-labour-party-centrists-jeremy-corbyn
Dawn Foster eats Binners for lunch.
"But the end result of Watson et al’s constant attacks will not be electoral success under another Labour leader, but a Tory victory. And the people who need a Labour government to change their lives and communities are unlikely to forgive people like him."
?...
They're is so much wrong about Foster's opinion piece it's almost funny. Almost.
They’re [sic] is so much wrong about Foster’s opinion piece
Well, don't keep us in the dark - tell us what, so we can share in the enlightenment.
Tj
Not a labour supporter since the antics in Scotland. Just a seeker after truth
Burnham a despicable racist and brexiteer.
Couper politically unelectable
Starmer is a good candidate
Starmer is a good candidate
He strike me as being a Libdem lost at sea in the Labour Party. He's been banging his anti-Brexit drum for three years whilst been constantly 'corrected' by JC's apparatchiks for being off message...
After watching Panorama last night I don't think anyone is left in any doubt who the real labour leader is...
Seamas Milne
enlightenment
I think it is she who would like to think is enlightened. Being of a religious bent suggests to me somone who is inclined to believe the unverifiable, illogical, and just plain wrong.
She also said Watson didn't offer any ideas on ways forward. He has offered plenty.
But you know, that was just the first paragraph.
Just my opinion, but it's as good as hers.
To be fair to her, that article does give a fascinating insight into the paranoid delusional worldview of the tinfoil hat wearers in the Corbynite bunker
Well I see your overlord Mr Watson is yet again trying to fiddle with procedure by demanding info from Jenny Formby.
Cancer patient by the way.
But yeah you keep on bobbing on about all the other vapour.
This right wing bunk head keeps confusing what is intereference in party policy. Depending what day it is. Or what Twitter poll he's conducting.
If we're Corbynites you must be ****sons.
She also said Watson didn’t offer any ideas on ways forward.
He's only interested in obstruction.
So she's right.
So these are the people Tom Watson is so anxious to support:
The partisan tone was set from the opening shot. A young woman whose name was not revealed tearfully claimed to have been abused with antisemitic taunts at a Labour Party conference.
The decision not to disclose their interviewee’s identity is understandable in the circumstances. It would have discredited the whole narrative Panorama was trying so hard to build.
The woman’s name is Ella Rose, a senior official in the Jewish Labour Movement (JLM), an organisation representing Jewish and non-Jewish members of Labour at the forefront of attacks on Corbyn. Rose has a secret past too: she once worked at the Israeli embassy in London.
Yup - these people want to make Labour less anti isreal so the antisemitism is the attack line. Of course there will be some in a group of people that large and it needs to be dealt with - but its being blown right out of proportion because of Corbyns support for fairness for palestinians
Compere this to the treatment of outright racists in the Tory party - one of whom is going to end up leader. Read what
Warsi has had to say about islamophobia in the torty party and look at the silence in the media
I don't disagree with anything in the previous post (whether pro Israel equals anti Palestinian is moot, though pro the current govt certainly is. But the rw media are always going to find a stick to beat labour with whilst letting Tories off the hook. It's the utter ineptitude of Corbyn and his ites in handling this (kicking out them as needs kicking/basic media strategy) that dismays. (I'm no Watson fan fwiw. Remaining heavyweights are on the back benches.)
the Lib Dems have only existed for about 30 years
Errrr... That's not strictly true is it?
The current iteration of the party may be about 33 years old... But the liberal party has existed in some form or other for about 300 years.
Of course, Palestine is the number one issue for the electorate of the UK.
That's why it's so important to focus on it.
CFH - so you think labour should become pro isreal / anti palestine just to please the right wing press?