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Strangely, Wilson had just as big a majority as Callaghan did...The Wilson Government, if you can call it that in fact had very little power and didn't achieve much, as some very minor parties held the balance of power. Accordingly not much happened until Callaghan come to power.
Though I now understand why it is you were suggesting Callaghan had something to do with ending the 3 day week, despite not becoming PM until over 2 years later.
At least not for another 4.5 years!if pushed I would say that the Unions had a right old pop at Heath, but it wasn't then relevant to continue with that strategy with a Labour government in power.
Hardly surprising really that Thatcher decided she wasn't going to suffer the same fate as her predecessors (I can't believe Tony or Gordon were/are too upset either that they're not likely to be held to ransom in the same way).
We're all missing the point. They are all the best of the worst (Politicians). The difference in a democracy is we dont overthrow and shoot our leaders regularly. Thats the only difference. The life cycle usually ends with them in a grave, in the western world though they end up enriched and alive.... unless they are Croats/Serbs. Everywhere else in Europe, murdering Politicians get away with...well murder as its a [u]just[/u] political cause....hmmmm name one good British PM. Just one in the last century who didnt leave office enriched and a terrible apart from Atlee?
hora, I don't know what on Earth you're trying to say. I don't think you know either.
Wonder if anyone commenting about Thatcher sending the "green light" through her actions is aware of the 1976 occupation and of South Thule with an Argentinian research base, nicely covered up by Gentleman Jims government, and seen by the Junta as proof of the likelihood that the British government would accede to the later 1982 invasions?
Nope, thought not!
The selling off of public housing- Giving people the chance to own their own house rather than living off the tax payer for cheap?
Giving people the chance to own their own house and [b]stealing from the tax payer in order to do so[/b]...so she could gain some votes for one election.
Come on Hora, what about everybody with the misfortune to be adult afterwards? Two days now and you're still avoiding the question...
hora - Member
The selling off of public housing- Giving people the chance to own their own house rather than living off the tax payer for cheap?
1) Is that the same as saying being left with limited options other than to take on a mortgage that you can't afford, thus culiminating in a credit/toxic debt crisis some years down the line?
2) Is that agreeing that one mans tax cut is anothers standard of living being shagged, or essentail service being cut?
The Winter of discontent was strangely the winter just before Maggie won power?
and do you know what? strangely it was caused by something very similar to the current economic crisis, which incidentally has little or nothing to do with the incumbent government either, beyond their attempts to sort it out with minimal impact on the population, see here [url= http://www.euromonitor.com/Special_Report_The_1979_vs_2008_oil_spike ]the real reason for recession?[/url] Contrast that with Thatchers blitzkreig methods, which before anyone shouts were not particualrly successful.
So if we are agreeing then thats a nice change for once Hora, but if not as I frankly expect, then you are looking at Thatchers government through rose tinted spectacles.
Could you start using the quote symbols properly dude?
Someone doing this isnt suddenly going to be a middle-class family overnight are they? It takes time to go from working-class to a proud to Tory. Stealing from the Taxpayer? Thats what a narrow-minded Tory would say.Giving people the chance to own their own house and stealing from the tax payer in order to do so...so she could gain some votes for one election.
Redistribution of wealth- Jeez I now sound like rudeboy without the 5,000 word-essay individual posts on this point.
Are you a real Doctor or one of those-love Doctor-web-sorts?
FWIW I think the biggest issue with the wholesale sell off of council housing is the lack of availability to anyone but the poorest cases. Seriously, how many kids can afford their first home nowadays? With the council house stock now greatly reduced peoples only option is to throw themselves on the mercy of private landlords!!
I blame Sarah Beeney!!!
Like I have said all along, I'm neither an apologist for one side or t'other. However, my parents lived in an old bus in a field with 3 kids before I was born. Getting given a council house was a huge leg up to them, and my father moved heaven and earth to move on from there to his own property.
I see nothing wrong with a society that helps those that need help for reasons beyond their own control. I do beleive that that help should not be an automatic bottomless pit, and that it should be an earned privilige, rather than a right.
Selling those properties off upset me deeply for this reason, and that along with flogging off all of our public bodies and various other less obvious, but equally insidious policies to fund tax cuts for her cronies were not frankly worth the price paid by this country in the long run.
Come on Hora, [b]even you[/b] know this is my own work;
Giving people the chance to own their own house and [b]stealing from the tax payer[/b] in order to do so...so she could gain some votes for one election.
So what about everybody since that one off vote grasping short term event that has had serious negative repercussions for the country she was supposed to give a shit about?
Wonder if anyone commenting about Thatcher sending the "green light" through her actions is aware of the 1976 occupation and of South Thule with an Argentinian research base, nicely covered up by Gentleman Jims government, and seen by the Junta as proof of the likelihood that the British government would accede to the later 1982 invasions?
I'm a total Thatcherite/Reaganite/Blairite hater but this interests me. Will have do some further reading...
garlic : Don't worry about it its a red herring, South Thule is a strategically unimportant nothing in the ocean. The facts are that the UN told the UK and Argentina to sort the Falklands out between themselves in 1964/5, this process had been ongoing from that time. When the Argentinians occpied it initially the UK was unaware of that fact, because of its insignificance, isolation and lack of communication. Eventually when they became aware Callaghan protested strongly, but seeking to avoid conflict and the obvious public outcry that would follow any such perceived slight he carried on with diplomatic efforts to resolve the matter and didn't make it public. He also maintained the UK's military presence in the region. In 1982, some 6 years later, immediately after withdrawing the "gunship" Argentina invaded having tested the water with South Georgia first.
If anything South Thule proves that the war was clearly unneccesary, and not the reverse.
And the UKs claim to south Thule is tenuous at best IIRC
[i]Selling those properties off upset me deeply for this reason, and that along with flogging off all of our public bodies and various other less obvious[/i]
One thing I will admit. Labour 1997+ is far far worse than the damage the Tories inflicted upon this country in the previous 15yrs or so.
Quangos exploding in growth, PFI, Capita, the illegal war in Iraq enquiry held in camera (Falklands were too but to use that as an excuse is inexcusable). Remember EU said no- dont start a war there its illegal and we ignored them, cash for Peers, buying Peerages, creation of assemblies in Wales/Scotland- yet more layers of bureacracy, selling our gold reserves at the bottom of the market, etc etc.
Labour aped the Tories to win and keep power- I shudder though as the Tories are just as bad. If only Portillo hadnt had his secret life that he didnt want exposed.... 🙁
One thing I will admit. Labour 1997+
[Yawn] what? yeah right of course, obviously? Can I go back to sleep now???
Hora - cash for peers / buying peerages is not party political - both sides have been at it and arguably the tories are worse
The Scottish Assembly has been a great success
Exploding Quangos - not the sole preserve of this government either and some of them are to attempt to get some control over the stuff that the tories privatised.
Waste of keyboard time TJ, I'd take his last post as a ner ner ne ner ner play ground style acceptance that the original discussion is over. Personally, I can't be arsed to continue with it.
Ta G - I need reminding of that daily
I note you're not trying to defend PFI, or selling off the gold at the bottom of the market (and making sure the price is further depressed before doing so), TJ!
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ 🙄
It's tough when you are a goverment employee to be honest about goverment failure, must not bite the hand that feeds.
I'm far from a fan of Brown but selling the gold didn't seem such a bad idea at the time - maybe selling it off in such a big lump was though and the timing looks rather unfortunate with hindsite...! Opinion was that gold doesn't give a return so why hold it - better to pay off debt.
I'm far from a fan of Brown but selling the gold didn't seem such a bad idea at the time
Actually it did. As did telling the market in advance that you were going to sell it, so allowing them to drop the price.
aracer - MemberI note you're not trying to defend PFI, or selling off the gold at the bottom of the market (and making sure the price is further depressed before doing so), TJ!
Not even I would defend the indefensible - not that the gold thing wa hugely significant - but still stupid [i] in hindsight[/i]
Not even I would defend the indefensible - not that the gold thing wa hugely significant - but still stupid in hindsight
Point A. We lost close to £3billion. Any employee who made a business error would face gross misconduct.
Point B. The person who made a GCSE-level schoolboy error was the Chancellor of the Exchequer. What does that say about his financial planning acumen when it comes to agreeing to PFI projects etc let alone ****ing up with such a basic commodity rule.
I suppose I should give the answer to the question "Who was the last British Prime Minister to take up office for the first time on winning a general election and to leave office for the final time immediately after losing a general election."
Clement Attlee.
Not Heath because he only stood down a week after the general election, not immediately - I've also argued before that he didn't actually lose the election, as the Conservatives won the popular vote, and if they'd managed to maintain coalitions would have stayed in government.
Wilson is the only other more recent PM to have a term in office bookended by a GE win and loss - though of course he left office for the final time when he retired and Callaghan took over (for G since he didn't reply to my last, and still not sure he realises, Wilson did have to form a coalition after the first '74 GE, but got a majority from the second, and continued as PM for another 18 months, so not a weak government at all).
The Conservative administration from '51 to '64 had four different PMs!
Anyway the point of all this is that an "unelected" PM is nothing new.
The other point arising from this is: for all those who didn't even have a try, if you know little enough of UK political history to even have a stab at this (suggesting Heath would imply you at least have some idea about political history immediately before Thatcher), how are you in any position to comment on other aspects of political history?
how are you in any position to comment on other aspects of political history?
Because everyone has the right to comment.
Everyone has the right to be wrong.
And everyone has the right to talk bollox.
Even you aracer.
And everyone has the right to talk bollox.
Thanks
Is RudeBoy's real name Martin Bishop?
Dear old Maggie! Hope she gets better soon.
yeah, we need to hate her just a little bit longer.
I support the funeral idea, but only if the 21 gun salute is pointing at the box with live rounds to make sure the old witch is really dead. After which they should drop a Kansas bungalow on it as belt & braces.
Brownfall, a work of genius. Keep watching it, it goes into full flow..
http://uk.truveo.com/brownfall/id/3664776323#
😆
i cant stand this leftie post revisionist nonsense about Maggie what have you people got against her? Just think where this country would be without her under the thumb of the of the bloody unions via the nationalised industries . She gave this country a good kick up the @rse which anyone fool could see we needed. I will mourn her passing and we are btter for her ...GOD bless Maggie may she live for another hundred years
Junkyard, somewhere a thousand hands are wringing is powering homes across the country..
People love to blame those in power rather than take responsibility for their own lives. The pit closes? Go and look elsewhere for work. Its the pit-mental that breeds resentment and racism against immigrants who have actually got off their fat asses to go looking for work. You'll see it in the old mill towns throughout the North West as well. **** your sob stories. No one owes you a living. Earn one.
Junkyard / Hora - its you guys that don't understand why she is hated.
Her deliberate policies have done damage to this country that is still not repaired.
the mass unemployment of tthe eighties did such social damage, the destruction of manufacturing industry and the deregulation of the finacial industries are [i]one[/i] of the reasons our economy is ****ed.
The damage to the NHS has just about been repaired in the backlog of unsuitable buildings and outdated equipment.
You need to learn a little and stop believing the propaganda.
She impoverished and destroyed the lives of the minority to enrich the majority. The social damage from that lives on today
The pit closes? Go and look elsewhere for work.
Have you been to Afan and Glyncwrrg, you insensitive pillock. Where exactly were they supposed to go FFS
Why don't you just stop your pathetic, ill informed prattle right there before you make yourself look a bigger prat than you already have.
she is a tw%t end of......................... off to bed now
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trailmonkey - MemberHave you been to Afan and Glyncwrrg, you insensitive pillock. Where exactly were they supposed to go FFS
Why don't you just stop your pathetic, ill informed prattle right there before you make yourself look a bigger prat than you already have.Posted 1 hour ago # Report-Post
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trailmonkey - MemberLOL at GG.
The epitomy of someone taking the internet too seriously.
Posted 4 months ago # Report-Post
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😉
i like maggie , she was good to H.M FORCES in the early 80,s.wots done is done, being spiteful and rude on an internet forum is a bit sad really, all these pages of ,nastyness, what has it achived, **** all .certanly put the overpowerd unions in its place.
When she finally dies, I feel my body may not be able to function normally without so much hate coursing through my veins.
Luckily, both her children are also utterly contemptible wastes of DNA so I intend to transfer all my long held feelings of rage, resentment and helplessness onto them instead.
Just heard this morning on Radio 4 that she was also partially responsible for the introduction of the 'Mr Whippy' aerated plastic ice cream substitute crap to the world whilst working as a chemist.
Death's too good for her.
Jeez gus, hardly evoked godwins did I. If you'd have waited another 4 months you'd have probably come up with something a little more appropriate 😉
Have you been to Afan and Glyncwrrg, you insensitive pillock. Where exactly were they supposed to go
1/10. You relocate. What did a lot of Eastern Europeans do in certain rural areas? Migrate to where the work is.
Sorry, I dont buy the moan 'work should be provided on my doorstep'.
Extreme example but you've got Rochdale with one of the highest unemployment rates in the country. 20mins from Rochdale into central Manchester.
I don't buy 'my grandfather then Father worked in the pit and so shall I. What else can I do'?
You dont have to be a blue-blooded Tory to want something better. Look at the mass migration of ****stani's/Indians to our shores etc. Why didnt they stay in their rural villages.
Sorry, who's a pillock again? If someone can relocate thousands of miles to a country with a different language and culture to find a better life why cant a Welshman move 200miles?
[url=
NSFW[/url]
This is for everybody who is counting down the time to Fatch's much anticipated bucket kicking. 😀
I can't believe the majority of you. Trying to discern a difference between the Left and the Right in this country? There is none. There are just two political ideologies. Conservative and Reactionary. You are either part of the Political Class or you aren't. The expenses issue highlighted this [it was noted that the the police were less than eager to pursue what essentially is fraud on a large scale].
Who would Jesus vote for? Not even the Greens. When the Greens did last achieve a large majority in the 90s they squandered it due to infighting. 'The democratic process' means being presented with a number of overflowing sewers and then deciding which one stinks less.
I blame Skynet. Surely it could have spared at least one Terminator to send to Grantham in 1925?
Bloody machines. 🙁
scraprider - Member
i like maggie , she was good to H.M FORCES in the early 80,s.wots done is done, being spiteful and rude on an internet forum is a bit sad really, all these pages of ,nastyness, what has it achived, **** all .certanly put the overpowerd unions in its place.
Oh really.... another bending of the truth there. CHECK YOUR FACTS. John Nott was busily cutting back the armed forces when the Falklands war kicked off. That continued afterwards.
If someone can relocate thousands of miles to a country with a different language and culture to find a better life why cant a Welshman move 200miles?
Apart from the simple fact that they have done as suggested in droves, I think the difference Hora, is that the examples you quote had little in the way of alternatives. In the example of our various denuded industries it was a deliberate policy to bring these people to their knees. For example with the coal and steel industries, we continue to this day to use and import those commodities. Thatcher simply killed the industries for political reasons, there was no actual need to do so other than that. Scandalous IMHO.