[Closed] Still Blindly Defending him Hora?

I still very much doubt he will ever admit to anything and this will rumble on forever.

So....all of the riders of the day were doping?
And Lance still beat them?
Even if Lance was doping (and he probably was), he was still the best cyclist for the period he was winning, which was a long time.

Why does the man get so much stick? He beat cancer and then carried on winning stuff FFS.
It is/was a filthy sport. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

I trust you're not a judge, warton. 😐
I saw another newspaper article with a photo of a London bus on the moon. It must have been true.

Am I right in thinking Armstrong was rigorously tested and came up negative - over and over again? Weren't there random tests? Presuming he's a 'drug cheat' how did he get away with it for so long?

Are lots of bitter ex team mates testifying the best evidence or just hearsay? I would have thought Lances lawyer could pull them to pieces .

Even if Lance was doping (and he probably was), he was still the best cyclist for the period he was winning, which was a long time.

that doesn't necessarily make him the best cyclist, it could just be that he was the best cheat.

Here we go again.....

In the words of Vic & Bob - you wouldn't let it lie!!!

Are we back here again?? As all other posts conclude it will either end up with Conviction & Denial & Appeal after Appeal
or abandoned again due to lack of credible evidence again again.

There is no smoke without fire, sometimes there is fire without smoke and sometimes there is nothing.

Rambling now!! but this one will never end until we get a time machine

That article says nothing!

I trust you're not a judge, warton

Are lots of bitter ex team mates testifying the best evidence or just hearsay

No, I'm not a judge 😀 But my point is they're not bitter team mates, some of those names are / were his best friends in the sport, Levi especially. wherever Lance went, Levi went, racing, training, eating, holidays, you name it. and he is testifying against him. That, IMO is very, very damning for LA. also, they are testifying and getting banned, albeit for 6 months.

If 10 people say they saw a man kill a man, and there are gunpowder traces on his clothes will he be found guilty? Yes. same scenario, different context. 10 people will testify he doped, blood samples from 1999, 2008 and 2009 (at least) back this up.

regarding

Am I right in thinking Armstrong was rigorously tested and came up negative

He was tested by the UCI, who he 'donated' money too, he is in business with the UCI vice president. The UCI is also responsible for promoting the sport, conflict of interest maybe? also there were traces of synthetic EPO in 1999 samples.

No, I'm not a judge But my point is they're not bitter team mates, some of those names are / were his best friends in the sport, Levi especially. wherever Lance went, Levi went, racing, training, eating, holidays, you name it. and he is testifying against him. That, IMO is very, very damning for LA. also, they are testifying and getting banned, albeit for 6 months.

[i]according to[/i]

[i]are said to have[/i]

I'm not defending him, but I'll wait until it's reporting of fact, rather than speculation

Or is it a case of testify and get away with a 6 month ban late in your career or be in deep sh1t yourself ?

Don't hate the player, hate the game

I hate them all

anyone with a link to last weeks thread? the one where hora and a few others look a bit stupid and the newby blind believers with little knowledge of the sport get a crash course?

google is a powerful tool, try landis, ashenden, Simeoni, le-mond and lance armstrong doping for starters.

Doping/cheating is all part of cycling's charm

Haven't read ther report, just that artile linked to on cycling news.

Seems strange that the four riders have admitted doping but are being allowed to continue with the season unaffected. Makes it look more and more like a witch hunt.

mikewsmith - Are we back here again?? As all other posts conclude it will either end up with Conviction & Denial & Appeal after Appeal
or abandoned again due to lack of credible evidence again again

I think this ^^^^ hits the nail on the head.

TBH, given that the article states that Hincapie, Leipheimer, Vande Velde and Zabriskie "opted not to be considered for the Olympics", it smacks very much of them copping a plea in return for testifying against Armstrong.

Dodgy stuff

they are testifying and getting banned, albeit for 6 months.

And a ban that's being suspended to the end of the current season so they can race the tour/vuelta etc... so no ban at all really...

Judge holds vials of blood showing confirmed doping for Armstrong

Until I see that. Sorry keep the press conjecture coming.

anyone with a link to last weeks thread?

Can anyone link to the FBI/Armstrong investigation thread? Looks like a few STW'ers need a reminder of deja Vu....

On which page, will everyone arrive at a consensus on Lance?

Doping/cheating is all part of cycling[s]'s charm[/s]

Going back to the thread title - is Hora his lawyer? And has he lost his sight?

all he needed to do was do what the rest of them did. every single US Postal rider spoke to the committee accept him. If he had done that (no matter what he'd said), and stopped being so pig headed about the whole thing I doubt very much we'd be where we are now.

Looks like they are all plea bargaining: go lightly on me and I'll stick one into Lance.

Now that Peter Sagan, remember you heard it here first. 🙄

Even if they do stick this one on him, it makes USADA look contemptible to allow major names to ride on after admitting doping.

don simon - Member
Now that Peter Sagan, remember you heard it here first

Oddly, have been thinking the same thing.

Oddly, have been thinking the same thing.

I still think they should have an "open" category where you can take what the hell you want. Same for the olympics, and especially pro snowboarding.

Judge holds vials of blood showing confirmed doping for Armstrong

Until I see that. Sorry keep the press conjecture coming.

there will be no judge/jury/lawyer/day in court. it's a usada panel that all olympic and non olympic U.S. professional athletes have agreed to obey by their rules. Lance wants his day in court so his legal team can get busy discrediting witnesses but he has agreed to play by usada rules. the only court he will end up in is CAS but he probably doesn't have mates there unlike the UCI.
this was all explained for the lance fans last week.

I think you're all just jealous that he's more awesome than you.

surely not as awesome as Surfmat?

Am I right in thinking Armstrong was rigorously tested and came up negative - over and over again? Weren't there random tests? Presuming he's a 'drug cheat' how did he get away with it for so long?

Just like Marion Jones

surely not as awesome as Surfmat?

[img] [/img]

On which page, will everyone arrive at a consensus on Lance?

Doping/cheating is all part of [s]cycling's charm[/s] all sports

Only cycling is about the only one to try to do anything about it.

Doping/cheating is all part of cycling's charm

ie none 🙁

or perhaps cycling has the worst track record - ther eis a long tradition of drug cheating within the sport and , it could be argued, has been an integral part of th3e sport.
Other sports have had cheats but I suspect none as endemic as cycling.
I bet there have been times when the majority of the peleton have been on drugs and all the top 10…sad but true

I don’t really understand why people still cling to the belief he was clean…it would be nice if it was true but the evidence is really mounting up – many other known drug cheats never failed a drug test – we all know the drugs he is meant to be taking could not be tested by a drugs test so it is a mute point to bring it up that he never failed a drug test – he did but he was allowed - some cream for saddle sores iirc and a dubious one with a large donation that seems to have disappeared.

this whole saga has to end sometime, how investigations have there been now? None of which could come to a verdict of guilty, no matter how much they WANTED to find him guilty. Even the US government with unlimited legal funds couldn't find him guilty. Now, I'm a pro Lance supporter, but if I wasn't then I'd be of the opinion that all these cases against him are only adding to his credibility.

Lance has already had his legacy tainted, in many peoples eyes he will never been seen as the greatest cyclist of all time (even though he is), surely for the anti Lance groups this is enough? Time to stop the witch hunt and move on FFS

So Armstrongs been found guilty then?

Doping/cheating is all part of cycling's charm
ie [s]none [/s] loads and loads

how investigations have there been now? None of which could come to a verdict of guilty, no matter how much they WANTED to find him guilty. Even the US government with unlimited legal funds couldn't find him guilty.

there have been, err, NO investigations into Armstrong. Get your facts right. The last proposed investigation, undertaken by the ADF agency had evidence, enough to prosecute, but the head of the agency pulled the plug on it, with no reason, and refused point blank to discuss it. quite a few ADF agents resigned because of it.

FBI?

So what was the US case against him?

FBI?