[Closed] So, Scottish Independence then. Not really wanted by Scots.

He comments on Scottish politics from Oz.

Gimme a couple of days and I'll be a lot closer than that...

For two months only you'll be able to imagine nationalistic arguments with me in your own time zone 🙂

Who's getting cold feet? Ahh yes, another Little Englander with a Big Chip desperately trying to hold on to the long gone belief that England is better.

Couldn't give a rats arse personally, but most people I speak to seem to favour independence, and not many of them are scottish. Actually, the only Scottish person I speak to regularly is terrified of the idea. Most seem slightly bemused by the concept.

And I might be about to break the internet here.....

the no campaign needs to run a positive campaign focussing on what is good about the union not what might be bad about independence.

I couldn't agree more.

not my experience at all I'm afraid to say. Been to Aberdeen more times than I care to mention and every time there's been genuine hostility based on my english accent - i'm not a cockney btw. My wife lived in Scotland for most of her teenage years and was repeatedly beaten up at school for being english, well until she hospitalised a couple of them after getting rather good at aikido.

Actually I think that's just the way many people are in Aberdeen when it comes to outsiders. I lived there for four months until the grief I was getting for being from Glasgow got to be too much of a PITA (OK, that maybe wasn't the only reason).

Why is is the English who start these threads; are you feeling unloved?

I'm a Geordie and as such, used to being unloved by Scots and English. I like it. I think a United Kingdom is better than Scotland trying to go it alone, so I take an interest in this.

Just think of the positives; how open politics in England would be; no need to create a fuel crisis just to hide corruption, because it doesn't matter! The Tories will be in power forever anyway.

I genuinely believe the 2014 date is right as there is a debate to be had about this and there is a huge undecided % . Salmond needs to be able to come up with some detail and positions and be questioned on them. Of his time in power here its a mixed bag for me. so I am listening to what is being said with interest. Scare tactics from the no camp are rubbish and will not work IMO

Scare tactics from the no camp are rubbish and will not work IMO

Agreed.

But a little more substance and a little less Braveheart from the Yes camp wouldn't go amiss either...

I really hope Scotland votes No, I also cringe everytime Dave goes near the issue and really don't think he's helping. But if the worst comes to the worst I'm firmly in favour of the border of any independent Scotland being drawn in a straight line between the Humber and the Mersey and Yorkshire on up being incorporated into Greater Scotlandshire...

...please don't leave us with Dave, please, we're sorry, what ever we did we're sorry...

I'm firmly in favour of the border of any independent Scotland being drawn in a straight line between the Humber and the Mersey and Yorkshire on up being incorporated into Greater Scotlandshire..

It is only a temp separation anyway. Once it suits England the ancestors of King Alex the first will be "roughly woo'ed" and we will be back to square one. Or WMD found in TJ's cellar (it worked before,not tj's basement,the WMD as an excuse to invade a country)

[img] [/img]

😉

oops, the Dire Straits resulted in chewed apple on monitor...

great map!

I read the article that map came from having heard my flatmate tell me how well written and researched it was. What a load of offensive, ill researched bollocks, the map made me angry in itself.

Yup, pretty much what you'd expect form a Tory publication...

the map made me angry in itself.

You need to lighten up a little, chum.

that map is just a bit unfunny and a bit crap really.

I'm undecided. Hearing that George Galloway is fighting for the union has pushed me towards a yes vote though.

The Scots need the English to hate.

without us, they'll just start fighting each other!

[img] [/img]

Couldn't give a rats arse personally,

For two months only you'll [s]be able[/s] have to put up with [s]imagine nationalistic arguments with[/s] uninformed drivel from me in your own time zone

really don't think he's helping

Zulu-Eleven - Member

The Scots need the English to hate.

without us, they'll just start fighting each other!

TandemJeremy - Member
I genuinely believe [that there] is a debate to be had about this and there is a huge undecided % . Salmond needs to be able to come up with some detail and positions and be questioned on them. Of his time in power here its a mixed bag for me. so I am listening to what is being said with interest.

Agree with that 😉 if you excuse the mild edit.

The map is mildy funny is a childish way but completely inappropriate for front cover of The Economist and at a time when proper debate is needed. Sad to see the need for dumbing down. Following Newsnight's lead?

That's England v Ireland in that picture, or North v South Ireland.

The Scots need the English to hate.

A lot of folk seem to be equating the desire for independence with "hating the English". Which is a shame and misrepresents the argument quite a bit.

Personally I don't know any Scots that hate the English.
(I was born in Glasgow and spent years living in Edinburgh and Aberdeen)

I don't hate the English the English are just w@nkers

I think Cameron is playing a blinder personally. Everytime he talks about being against Scottish independance support for it grows.

Pubicly he supports the union while privately knowing the tories will be in power in England for a generation is Scotland votes for independance.

The thing I don't understand is, why are they bringing the famous Bahamian actor Sean Connery to campaign for them?

I'm undecided. Hearing that George Galloway is fighting for the union

Probbaly becasue if there was independance we'd only have english MP's, so he'd be out of a job 😛

Doesn't Galloway represent an English constituency then?

The thing I don't understand is, why are they bringing the famous Bahamian actor Sean Connery to campaign for them?

Surely that's a Tollcross tan, and he isn't living in tax exile somewhere hot and sunny...

surroundedbyhills - Member

Devolved local powers to decide on roads, Healthcare and education make sense, but then Defence, national security and fiscal policy..not sure about that.

It sounds like good logic- but then you look at what an excellent state the economy's in, and at what our armed forces have been used for lately...

I think this might turn out to be a key point tbh... Heard Darling talking today about the economic benefits of union but we've heard nothing for years except how the economy is absolutely bollocksed. And I don't think we're seeing much evidence of the UK economy becoming rapidly unbollocksed either. So threatening scotland with economic bollocksing may not be that effective.

BigButSlimmerBloke - Member

yet you can't stop posting?

As it clearly irks you, it seems a worthwhile exercise 😉

Exports of Whisky have grown from £2.37bn in 2005 to £3.2bn last year

Will Westminster miss the tax and duty raised?

there are rumours of a "water tax" designed specifically to extract more revenue from the Scotch whisky industry.

I'm not in favor of independence as it seems to be very shortsighted, but I also plan not to be here in the next couple of years.

i think everyone has missed the most important question ever regards to independence if/when it happens....

who will Scotland send to EUROVISION 2015 !!!!!!!!!!

Darius?

And we can change the locks while he's away...

Norway has a population of about 5 million same as Scotland and seems to be doing alright. What exactly are the Scots who support the Union afraid of? Having the safety blanket of UK public spending removed?

As a Scot who's lived in England for the last 25 years I've yet to meet an English person who could give a damn whether Scotland is part of the union. Usual response is "If they want independence then why don't they just get on with it"

What exactly are the Scots who support the Union afraid of? Having the safety blanket of UK public spending removed?

As a Scot who's lived in England for the last 25 years ............

Maybe they're scared of losing the safety blanket of having England to escape to for 25 years if things aren't working out up there 😉

Maybe they're scared of losing the safety blanket of having England to escape to for 25 years if things aren't working out up there

Not sure how that would work. Eire has been independent for decades. There are still no passport controls at the border and the Irish come and go for work in the UK as they please. If an independent Scotland and the remainer of the UK were both in the EU then there would be no restrictions on the people of either country working in the other.

Not sure how that would work

it was a joke, intended to point out to the poster that there are more things that scots depend on england for than public spending subsidy (such as employment opportunity) and his own post highlighted it perfectly.

but seeing as you brought the subject up, i don't think that you can guarantee english membership of the eu indefinitely or that eu employment regs will always remain the same.

I imagine on a forum like this that most of us that post here are into outdoor pursuits. If I were from England and determined to see the back of Scotland, I may be just a bit less scathing of a country containing the vast bulk of the UK's open countryside, most of the proper mountain biking, great road biking, nearly all of it's winter sports, some of the best water pursuits and the only areas of peaceful wilderness. I understand perhaps this is not everyone here's cup of tea.

err... [b]athgray[/b] why?

It isn't like I can't go skiing and cycling in France despite it no longer being an English possession...

Logic fail... 😕

My personal view. Love Scotland although only lived 6 months there. There is some genuine chippiness both ways England <-> Scotland. I just get a bit tired of the same argument going round and round and round and round and round. I wish the Scots would make their mind up once and for all. Otherwise it will become somewhere that most English people would just like gone... a bit like Northern Ireland

[b]Stoatsbrother[/b]. Are you saying you would rather tuck into a Croque Monsieur and a glass of Chateau Neuf du Pape on a sunny terrace overlooking the piste at Chamonix, over a bacon and black pudding doubler and a can of irn bru in a rain drenched cafe at Glenshee?
Shame on you!
Seriously though, my wife and mother to my two children is from Surrey, my inlaws live there and we have some good times down there. I think that there is more in common than divides us, and I think we can gain more being together. I am a proud Scot, however don't feel the need to be independant to be more Scottish. People down South often don't understand that the government here are considered to be doing a decent'ish job, but I worry that the yes camp are being carried away by the vigour of Alex salmond more than anything else. We will have to wait and see.

Are you saying you would rather tuck into a Croque Monsieur and a glass of Chateau Neuf du Pape on a sunny terrace overlooking the piste at Chamonix, over a [s]bacon and black pudding doubler and a can of irn bru[/s] deep fried Chewit in a rain drenched cafe at Glenshee?

Oh, it's a tough choice....! 😉

I was against it at first. However, the longer I live here and the more I hear from (particularly) Mr Salmond and local people, the more I agree with independance.
I spent many years growing up and living in north west England, where Westminster based politicians and the south east focus that they had was obvious.
Scotland is even more separated - geographically, socially, economically and in thinking and outlook.
I do think there is a strong argument for 'giving it a go' on our own.

(I am shocked I hold this position by the way, I did not a few months ago...)

Yup, supporting independence crept up on me too. One big factor is that we have a government we voted for (unlike Westminster), a government generally agreed to be doing not a bad job (unlike Westminster), and a government that is actually positive about things instead of continually spreading doom (unlike Westminster). But it's not just about the current government in either Holyrood or Westminster, it's the feeling that we should be big enough to look after ourselves, for good or bad.

Oh dear god I hate these threads, they're like car crashes, we know how it's going to go but we're compelled to get involved.

Most Scots couldn't care less about actual independence we like getting on with our lives as they are at the moment (and no doubt will get on with them if the split came). You can pick a source and figure out whether we'll be Norway or Greece but no-one here has the info and those that might have appear to not be able to count to 5.

There is some Anti-English sentiment, but then there is Anti-Scot south of the border. I got slagged for being from Edinburgh last weekend even though I was back in the town i grew up in.

Quit it with the deep fried food references I only know of one place that does deep fried mars bars and that's for the tourists.

To those who want to come and enjoy the outdoors then you're welcome and even the keyboard warriors can bring their iPads but beware the sun it might burn your peely wally skin (certainly has lightened our pale blue colour to almost pink).

If Scotland does get independence how would they feel if the good people of Orkney decided they wanted to go it alone?

I dont think the rugby team will get any better whatever happens 😉