Torygraph
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/wildlife/4633125/Killer-cats-to-be-tagged-for-bird-study.html
and actually, ummm misqouted (seemed far to high) 😳 its animals killed per Square Km in urban areas by cats, rather than per cat.
Researchers at the University of Reading believe family pets could be responsible for killing up to 10,000 small animals annually per square kilometre in urban areas, significantly affecting some urban bird species.
richc - 10,000 per year is farcical - there's approximately 8.5 million cats (domestic and feral) in the UK, even their most excessive estimate of 200m kills per year total would suggest around 25 per year per cat, not 10,000, not sure where you got that figure.
EDIT - just seen your post, fair enough.
However unless they're hiding something, their datalogging will be utterly pointless as cats will stalk and pounce on anything from a blade of grass to a passing piece of litter. How will they separate that?
Some cats are killers and they do kill stupid amounts, but in my fairly hefty experience (and that of my family, one of whome is a pedigree cat breeder of many years) they are few and far between and often people buy pets as mousers and find they're useless.
Again, its fairly rare that cats poo ON gardens/patios but that does happen when a) theres no available soil in a reasonable distance and b) theres too many cats in an area and they seem to have their habits changed. Normal cat behaviour is to dig, poo, bury. That's beneficial for many animals and insects/plants.
There's nothing irrational about a hatred of cats. They shit in my garden, chase after my chickens, kill the frogs in my pond, and deposit half-eaten bluetits on the front door mat. I cornered one of the miscreants in my garage the other day and administered a swift boot up its backside. I don't think it'll be back for a while...
ransos - you're pathetic. There's no excuse for kicking a cat, that's just pathetic childish violence.
Does the study include flies?
your cat can catch flies! WOW! that must be one smart cat, mine used to into all sorts of shapes chasing the things around but never caught one.
No coffeeking, it's perfectly justifiable retribution. Do you think if I ask the cat nicely, it will stop killing wildlife, scaring my pets and shitting in my garden?
do you chase your chickens after theyve shat in your garden too? sorry had to be done 🙄 but honsetly, they probably are crapping in your garden becasue of smell of the chickens, either that or they are having fun with you.They shit in my garden, chase after my chickens
STATO - my cats regularly caught and ate flies?
ransos - its not justifiable at all. Do you really think your kicking it will make it think twice about coming into your garden? Dont be stupid, it'll just return when you're not there and will avoid YOU, not the garden/animals etc. All you're doing is risking injuring the cat for no gain, if you stopped to think about it first you'd realise that. You live in an environment with animals that kill other animals, crap in gardens and chase food. If you cant accept these risks maybe you should hermetically seal your garden?
Coffeking - the cat hasn't been back since. I couldn't care less if the cat gets injured or not - I will not put up with it scaring the hell out of my chickens. I should not have to put up with other people's pets' mess. Cats only exist at current densities in the environment because they are kept as pets - arguments about their behaviour being "natural" are demonstrably false.
A) You dont know the cat hasnt been back since, it's just not been back while you're there. Yes cats can see through windows and will now associate you with a kicking and stay away while you're there - well done.
B) I couldnt care less if your chickens get injured by my (imaginary in this case) cat, thats the same childish attitude but you evidently dont want it that way.
You live in a country with cats. Cats chase animals (though they generally wont attack chickens, only scare them by walking by (we used to keep chickens and cats until the neighbours mentioned they didnt like the smell or the noise)). While you might have a right to chase the cat, kicking it is cruelty and what you're doing IS illegal. And pathetic, and childish.
Big man ransos eh. I bet the neighbours love the stink from your chickens, would you be happy if one of your neighbours came round and gave it a kicking. Your family must be really proud of you.
[i] PeterPoddy - Member
Never, ever had a cat shit on the patio.
Not on yours, no.
I must have picked up half a shovelful in the year since we moved to our new house.
[/i]
that's not cat sh1t...
My chickens don't smell because I clear up their mess, and they stay in my garden. My pets do not impinge on my neighbours. I cannot say the same about theirs.
Giving it a boot may not necessarily stop it coming into my garden, but it will now leg it if it sees me - something it wouldn't do before.
Cats chasing and killing wildlife & other pets is cruel. Their mess is disgusting.
arguments about their behaviour being "natural" are demonstrably false.
wrong, arguments over the number of cats being natural is false, their behaviour is entirely natural.
My chickens don't smell because I clear up their mess, and they stay in my garden. My pets do not impinge on my neighbours. I cannot say the same about theirs.
BS - chickens smell regardless of how much they're cleaned, its just you get used to the smell. Their smell and noise will impinge on neighbours, I assure you.
Cats killing wildlife and pets is normal, sure their numbers are abnormal but it is natural all the same. Many would say keeping chickens in wire fences, collecting their eggs and never mating them is cruel and un-natural. Doesnt stop you though does it?
* cats. Pointless murdering *bags.
If I get hold of the one that keeps worrying the few songbirds we have and *ing in front of my garage, it'll get a swift Shimano winter boot * probe.
"wrong, arguments over the number of cats being natural is false, their behaviour is entirely natural."
Wrong - their behaviour is in part a product of their environment. There is nothing natural about the environment of the domestic cat.
Wrong - their behaviour is in part a product of their environment
So cats dont hunt birds in as many numbers if there are fewer cats in the area. Or cats hunt more because they're near houses/fed by humans? Which part of that makes sense on any level of logic?
eh ransos your hens do smell, they make a mess of your garden, they attract vermin whcih the cats kill. I've never been near a hen house that doesn't smell, the 'owners' don't seem to notice though.
Oh we have another big man in our midst I see. ****in songbirds, can't stand them, if they come near my house I'll take the air rifle to 'em.
I'm signing out of this argument - it's not going to go anywhere and I have work to do, plus I cant abide scum who abuse animals regardless of their reasoning. lol at gary_m, I've been woken by many a songbird (in my apparently death-trap cat infested garden!) - maybe I should take a rifle out too - maybe we can finally be rid of these pesky birds! 🙂
"So cats dont hunt birds in as many numbers if there are fewer cats in the area. Or cats hunt more because they're near houses/fed by humans? Which part of that makes sense on any level of logic?"
You claim that cats' behaviour is natural. Yet we're talking about a selectively bred, domesticated animal that is kept as a pet. Such a situation would never occur in nature. Now there's nothing different in that to a domestic chicken, except that my chickens don't shit all over my neighbours' gardens nor do they scare their pets or kill wildlife. My neighbours think the chickens are great - they bring their kids round to feed them. The only smell they make is their poo - which goes straight into a covered compost bin.
Agree coffeeking you'll never get through to idiots like that. It's like trying to explain to a bnp member why racism is wrong, its inbred and illogical and the proponents are too stupid to reason with. ****in hate birds me.
Oh we have another big man in our midst I see. ****in songbirds, can't stand them, if they come near my house I'll take the air rifle to 'em.
So you'd meet murder with murder eh? I wouldn't kill a cat for happening to exist. I might lament dippy humans feeling the need to keep pets to make up for the fact there is no wildlife to look at between their sofa and eastenders and I'm not above a bit of active discouragement, but I wouldn't kill it.
"eh ransos your hens do smell, they make a mess of your garden, they attract vermin whcih the cats kill. I've never been near a hen house that doesn't smell, the 'owners' don't seem to notice though."
What a crap argument. Even if the hen house did smell, the only way you'd notice is by standing next to it, in the middle of my garden. If cats kept their stinking mess to their owners' gardens I wouldn't be so bothered by them.
I've never seen any vermin in my garden.
ransos - cats are not selectively bred - they are just bred, much as chickens - this doesnt affect their *behaviour* as I keep saying. Your chickens encourage rats and mice, make a noise, make a smell (regardless of how much you seem to think they don't) and while they may not kill wildlife, that has no bearing on whether it is right for you to abuse a cat just because your choice of animal annoys people in other ways.
I used to think my ferrets didnt smell funny as I cleaned them daily and showered them a couple of times a week - I coudlnt smell anything, neighbours loved them too. Having moved away and left them with my parents I discovered they do actually smell, quite a lot, I just didnt realise it. Fortunately the neighbours dont mind.
As I say, none of this is important anyway, there is NO NEED to be cruel to the cat. If I were your neighbour and your chickens were noisy of a morning (as they are) and it bothered me, would you mind if I jumped over the fence and gave them a good kicking to shut them up?
ransos i beg to differ about chickens not impacting on neigbours.
My sister in law lives back to back with a small holding that keeps chickens. They have recently had to call in pest control due to the rats that are infesting all the back gardens. Turns out the feed used for the chickens was attracting the rats and keeping them well fed.
Their cocker spaniel actually caught one of the rats 🙁
"Agree coffeeking you'll never get through to idiots like that. It's like trying to explain to a bnp member why racism is wrong, its inbred and illogical and the proponents are too stupid to reason with. ****in hate birds me."
I tell you why I think that mild retribution is justified and you respond with analogies to racism, and justification for killing. A proponent of such views very definitely is too stupid to reason with...
ransos ahem, your post I believe.
'I've had 2 hens for a couple of years now. We went all middle class and bought an eglu. Overpriced, but very easy to maintain. The hens are great fun, but they will ruin your lawn, best to fence off an area of the garden for them. Never had a problem with rats but [b]did get field mice taking their food[/b], we caught them in humane traps and released them in the park. They'll try to escape when you first have them, so clip their wings.'
If you're encouraging field mice then thats not a good thing.
"ransos i beg to differ about chickens not impacting on neigbours."
I didn't say that they can't impact on neighbours, I'm saying that my ones don't. We've never had a problem with vermin, and they're not noisy in the mornings. My neighbours like the eggs and their kids enjoy feeding them.
I think it boils down to being a responsible pet owner.I would never allow our dog to roam free & go around crapping in other peoples gardens & attacking their chickens or the like.I walk him, if he has a dump I clean it up,he's on a lead 90% of the time so he doesn't effect anyone else but our family.So why do cat owners allow their cats to wonder about onto other peoples land making a mess as they go ?
Because they're irresponsible A-holes that's why & shouldn't even have pets imo..
Plus what fun is a cat,have you ever seen one fetch a stick ? ?
"did get field mice taking their food"
The field mice were there before the hens. I moved them with a humane trap.
Close but no cigar...
I think encouraging field mice in any way shape or form is a good thing. Lil tinkers.
As for being cruel to cats, my boot has never got near them, they're too quick. I'm not going to go out specifically to hunt them down. They are intelligent creatures, they get the message.
"If I were your neighbour and your chickens were noisy of a morning (as they are) and it bothered me, would you mind if I jumped over the fence and gave them a good kicking to shut them up?"
That depends. If I hear my neighbour's cat meowing in their back garden, would you mind if I jump over the fence and give it a good kicking?
[i]We've never had a problem with vermin[/i]
[i]Never had a problem with rats but did get field mice taking their food,[/i]
I'll leave it up to others to decide.
"I think encouraging field mice in any way shape or form is a good thing. Lil tinkers."
Yeah, it was a shame to have to move them, but they started taking the chickens' food.
That depends. If I hear my neighbour's cat meowing in their back garden, would you mind if I jump over the fence and give it a good kicking?
I probably would. I don't mind you shooing it off, boot or not. A lot would probably hinge on whether your neighbours mind you tresspassing on their property and frankly, if a worthless bag of **** and fur motivated you to start jumping fences and hunting down a defenceless animal for some kind of 'retribution', you have bigger problems.
Funny how all the cat owners seem to think it's perfectly fine for cats to go round defacating on other peoples gardens (our fault for not having bare soil? FFS! My garden has plenty of soil round the edge, doesn't stop em crapping in the middle the lawn) Dogs are pretty bad cos the owners are generally stood over them while they mess up the area as only they know how, but the 'couldn't give a stuff' attitude of cat owners is pretty galling.
Oh and toxoplasmosis is pretty nasty stuff, I dont have kids at the moment, but when I have I'll certainly be doing something about any cats that feel they need to relieve themselves in my garden.
I think this boils down to being accepting of others choices.
Ransos chooses to keep chickens and so his neighbours need to show acceptance of his choice (Maybe they talk about strangling your chickens behind your back)
I keep a cat and my neighbours have to show acceptance that this is my choice
My neoghbours keep dogs and i have to show acceptance of them barking from time to time.
People walk their dogs on the grass area near my house where all the local kids play. If i see them letting them shit there and not clear up behind them i have made a promise to myself to pick it up in my bare hands and wipe it all over the offending owner.
cat owners eh, selfish bastards just like their cats 😉
So anyone have any aversion to bird shit or are we all okay with that? It bugs me, but we still feed the birds, I just put up with it though. Hope the neighbours don't mind me encouraging birds.
D0NK what if these kids you're going to have want a fluffy little cat, will you come over all superior to them too.
I guess when bird shit starts spreading giardia, roundworms, salmonella, E. coli, parvovirus, coronavirus and toxoplasmosis then your neighbours might start getting bothered by it,
What bird shit I've noticed has been pretty small volume and not a nuisance, rather than a big smelly pile of turd right in the way.
If I had a roosting spot where it was causing a nuisance, I'd consider moving it. But it'd have to be pretty bad pile as I like having birds about.
We used to get a lot of seagulls about when we lived in the city centre. They're a blasted nuisance.
Just discovered this thread...
I'm in my 3rd house and it's the 1st one I don't have to deal with cat poo - probably because my previous gardens were so much smaller. I tried putting prickly rose bits down to stop the cats squatting but they just pooed on the rose bits.
As for chickens - well I have some and they don't smell, the only time I can smell anything is when I open the coop to take out the poo and even that is no where near as bad as the smell from stepping on a fresh cat poo. My neighbours love to help out when I'm out and often pop around with bits of food to give them. The only down side is they can get noisy if scared by a fox or cat but that is nothing compared to a barking dog.
Thats true, although they may be more worried about histoplasmosis, cryptococcosis, psittacosis, encephalitis that bird shit spreads.
lol at 'stepping on a fresh cat poo', do you people walk around your gardens with your eyes shut. This is pure 70's sitcom.
I put some patio cleaner down last week to get rid of the moss and cat mess. The cats must dislike it because the turds have started to appear by the front door now.
Annoying. Can't let the little lad run round the lawn because of the mess.
Shock horror.
Cat/Dog/Bird/Chicken owner in rose tinted glasses revelation. My cat/dog/bird/chicken doesnt smell. Yeah right, next you will be joining the smokers who say they dont stink either
