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Can I breathe now ?
Surprised they didn't go for Farrell as man of the match. Thought Shingler and Navidi were damn good too.
I enjoyed that. England making more ground in defence than attack by the end. All the forwards who played 80 were out on their feet by the end. Mako was looking to touchline from about 65 mins, he put in a serious shift
Our attack went to shit in the second half.
The scramble defence got us out of a hole this week.
Wales played really well.
Well played Wales and harsh decision against you. We were bloody lucky that you botched your chances/one magnificent tackle from Underhill
The scots will be licking their lips with home advantage for the Calcutta Cup match
Still a wins a win
England should have put the game away but mistakes kept letting Wales back in.
Disappointing performance by England overall though the pack fronted up well. Unlike the Scottish forwards last week.
We'll have to be better at Murrayfield next time out. Scotland can't be as hopeless as last time.
namastebuzz comments echo'd. For all Eddie's bluster we didn't look better or fitter in the second half. They need to play the last 20 like the first 20. Ball handling skills have improved, but England need to be harder and more clinical in the last 20 for a chance to win the RWC. A 2nd half score was needed and a world beating team would have scored it.
This result could have gone Wales way, I'm now more worried vs Ireland than I was before, but I can't put my finger on why - perhaps just all round & threat is missing.
"For all Eddie’s bluster we didn’t look better or fitter in the second half."
Its not fitness really, we ended the game with two opensides and a flanker in the backrow and they were quicker. Lawes is designed to play a different game to Shingler and I doubt the plan was for Lawes to go for the 80. Englands pack is power conditioned Wales conditioned for speed much more
Ok understood.
But England couldn't mount an attack of any merit accept a one dimensional carry in the second half, whereas Wales carried and offloaded to a faster finish making 75 yards in seconds. In the theoretical final that EJ wants, the AB's would be all over England scoring 2 or 3 times in that half, but they'd have to just suck up England battering ram and watch the clock wind down. That needs to be sorted. I fear Ireland will see this and that'll be our test next month.
Krypton - you can’t play the AB when you aren’t playing the AB. Play the game, play the team, win the game. You sound like Stephen Jones in the Times!!
The right team won.
Better teams would have torn England a new one.
The TMO decision was farcical.
I’d like to see Underhill/Robshaw/BillyV as a combo, with Simmons to finish.
It was telling when Te’o replied Ford that our attacking depth disappeared. I know we wanted to plug the defensive holes, and that worked. In the end, England played the conditions better and Wales should have taken the points on offer.
Having walked the dog I don’t think it’s all doom and gloom. A win is a win and keeps Ian in th hunt.
Our attack actually looked pretty good; it was fast and accurate and caused Wales problems and out then under pressure. Some players came up with some game saving moments; Underhill’s tackle and Farrell’s turnover being two. Taking Ford off makes you realise what he brings to the attack.
We weren’t playing Italy but a confident Wales team who played some good rugby last week. If Wales has sneaked it by a point it’s he talked up as a fantastic victory and a hard fought game yet our six point win is being looked over at as a failure.
The Welsh kicking game was poor today; Brown wasn’t really out under any pressure. The rest of their game and was good.
Plenty for England to work on but I don’t think today was ty disaster that the press will portray.
Sounds good in general play dantsw13, but I think EJ wants more in the lineout.
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 16px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">Krypton – you can’t play the AB when you aren’t playing the AB. Play the game, play the team, win the game. You sound like Stephen Jones in the Times!!</span>
^^+1
I think Ireland will beat England but I can’t see Scotland coming close.
England scrum was given the benefit of the doubt by the ref a few times today.
Wales off to Dublin next!! Will be really in the shit if we dont kick better.
Having walked the dog I don’t think it’s all doom and gloom. A win is a win and keeps Ian in th hunt.
Our attack actually looked pretty good; it was fast and accurate and caused Wales problems and out then under pressure. Some players came up with some game saving moments; Underhill’s tackle and Farrell’s turnover being two.
We weren’t playing Italy but a confident Wales team who played some good rugby last week. If Wales has sneaked it by a point it’s he talked up as a fantastic victory and a hard fought game yet our six point win is being looked over at as a failure.
The Welsh kicking game was poor today; Brown wasn’t really out under any pressure. The rest of their game
AA; think you boys were given the benefit of the doubt at the breakdown; pretty unheard of for a team to only pinged once in a match. Although Itoje got away with a fair bit too.
Garces is a bit of a squiffy ref.
Based on the first 1.666 rounds - none of the 6N teams are going to win the RWC playing like that.
Based on the first 1.666 any of the 6N teams could win the WC if they can mount a defence like those on show today. (Bearing in mind that Wales haven’t beaten NZ since 1643!)
Based on the first 1.666 any of the 6N teams could win the WC if they can mount a defence like those on show today
Good defending is helped by poor attacking.
If we squeak a 1 pt victory in Scotland and beat Ireland in a 6-3 slug-a-thon, win every game up to the RWC, win the final against Argentina (who beat NZ 85/84 in the semi) some will still be saying “yeah, but NZ would have beaten you there” The all conquering 2003 team didn’t have to beat NZ.
History is written by the victors, and the road to winning the World Cup is paved with lucky escapes.
WE WON, FFS!!!!!! Wales had a right go, but we still won.
Kryton - being the best team in the world / years before the RWC wins you zip!!
I was a bit disappointed by England today. Thought they butchered an awful lot of possession. Certainly flattered to deceive. Still think they’ll beat Ireland as our defence is dodgy. Fair play to wales for keeping it within a score to the end. Still predicting an England GS.
Sweet ****ing Jesus, always entertaining to read these forums after an unpopular England victory.....
Minutes 50-65, Wales were massively on top, the fact that they only scored 3 points in that time is telling. Otherwise there was only one team in it, and by God was Farrell good today!
I only watched the first 50 mins last night, not sure I will bother with the rest for 3 points. Re the disallowed grounding. The Welsh player just gets to it compared to both hands from the defender, I think the contrast cost Wales there. That and their kicking from hand, they never found space and didn't turn the back three often. I dunno why Engerland supporters are being negative, that short carry game will chew up any team and you have at least one wide runner who can finish. Jones talks like he is smart enough to link the two, you have a year to do it.
AA - Adam Hastings is Gavins son. Looks likely to become Scotlands second choice fly half and Glasgows first next season
On the disallowed try. BBC has a nice slo mo clip of it.
Anscombe touches the ball first for sure - but while the ball is in the air? Was Anscombes had still in contact with the ball when the ball is on the ground? Not clear. Possibly even probably but it is not clear. The ref asked "try yes or no? " so the TMO needs conclusive evidence that the try was scored. the TMO cannot be sure so no try. Probably is not good enough
If it had been " any reason not to award the try?" the burden of proof is reversed
<span style="font-size: 12.8px;"> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43020285</span>
"That and their kicking from hand, they never found space and didn’t turn the back three often. "
And our high kicks werent good and when they were we were out jumped. Anscombe was poor at 15.
Looks like a lot of nothing to me.
The all conquering 2003 team didn’t have to beat NZ.
Yeah but they would have if they'd had to.
Sure, you get nothing for being the best side two years before the RWC but I think England have regressed slightly under Jones after the initial Grand Slam and 3-0 win in Australia. We're not attacking as freely. Jones says he wanted to sort out set piece/defence first then move on to attack. Fair enough but that needs to happen soon.
For all his steady performances Mike Brown is not the full back to achieve that. Jones has missed a trick by not grooming a 3rd scrum half and with Ben Youngs absent the cupboard looks bare. Danny Care does not offer the service required. The pack are great but BillyV offers that extra go ahead that they can't quite replace when he's absent.
NZ are still the benchmark. They may have had a poor year (for them) but they're rebuilding. They were missing most of their props, they unearthed some brilliant new talent and we're kidding ourselves if we think the Lions drawing the series wasn't helped by some large slices of luck. Come the RWC they'll be the side to beat - irrespective of whether England beat them in the autumn or not.
Australia will be thereabouts too. They've gone into a few RWCs with their chances written off yet have made the semis 6 times and the final 4 times. They are also the last team to beat NZ.
Just seen the Jones post match interview. Wrong shape of ball for that Jose M style of dickishness.
Compared to gats whining like a little girl i would say EJ was pretty good
“Australia will be thereabouts too.”
Not even the Australians think that 😂
Anyway...trying to muscle through the gag reflex to get first tin of the day down me, McEwans Export as well 😝. No drinking on morning Scotrail services...Good luck with that Mr Ticket Man.
For all the talk of England going for the world cup win I dont think they have enough true world class players. Itoje, B Vunipola, Watson and ...... have an excellent 23 but no Billy Whizz, Wilkinson, Johnson, Hill a world class front row type players.
Hartley spitting - looks like it’s a camera foreshortening thing. He spat the other side of the player.
Anyone else notice Farrell ‘accidentally’ knee a Welsh player in the head? Unpleasant player.
Didnt see that. Did see an england player catch Adams late with a knee to the nuts.
Pop Farrell on the world class player list, and Launchbury too.
Hoping for a good game today, that monster french pack will like the look of the smaller Scottish pack....which could mean Russell on the back foot, which isn't good. Presumably Laidlaw will box kick a lot!
I think England have regressed slightly under Jones
We're still winning games though.
The attack has looked pretty quick at times, the passing is certainly crisp but it lacks something when Ford is taken off. Brown isn't the attacking full back that Watson, but he was good yesterday. He's solid and combative.
"Pop Farrell on the world class player list, and Launchbury too."
Farrell wouldnt worry NZ, Launchbury neither
Is that the definition of world class? Are there even 15 world class players then in that case?
I think to be world-class you should be in with a good shout of being the best in the world in your position.
world class = respected and even feared by other players in the world game. It's not a best of all time list, it's not even a 'who's in the current best world 15/23' and it depends who else is around at the time.
Easier to define by recognising those that aren't world class . Those that when you see them on the field or team sheet you think WTF is he/she doing out there.