[Closed] Recent immigrants make net contribution

This might be confirmation bias, but the only immigrants I know work their arses off. The whole anti immigration argument is the lamest thing ever.

Over 30% of all immigrants have university degrees.

I wonder how many of the people complaining have a similar level of education.

I have an immigrant working for me. He is tremendously hard working, contributes hugely to our economy, follows all the rules and is a pleasant and honest individual. I bet many other people can say the same about immigrants working for them.

I wish the whole country were filled with people like him.

edit: Blimey, I just forgot, I have two immigrants working for me. 😉 They're both very good guys.

This might be confirmation bias, but the only immigrants I know work their arses off. The whole anti immigration argument is the lamest thing ever.

Same as my own experiences, but seems hard to convince those who have been persuaded otherwise by some parts of the UK media. Nice to have facts to back up anecdote.

ok.. so now we have established this scientifically with facts and data can we please please use the information constructively?

I think every household should be presented with this information, and anyone expressing surprise or disbelief should be deported to.... oh I don't care actually.

What about the moon?

about half my team at work are of non uk nationalities (of about 45 people). presumably because they don't make engineers in the uk anymore? i have no idea, but they are all decent chaps.

[i]can we please please use the information constructively?[/i]

By preaching to the converted? 😉

Immigrants who arrived after 1999 were 45% less likely to receive state benefits or tax credits than UK natives in the period 2000-2011

Well quite. But that's immigration over the last 14 years. What about all the immigrants that arrived in the wake of the Second World War? You know, that little period of 54 years prior to 1999?

Yes, a large amount of them are hard workers and undoubtedly do contribute; but where I live, there's an awful lot who don't work and are quite happy to sit on their arses claiming all the benefits that they can, whilst at the same time running criminal rackets such as drug dealing, extortion, fraud, prostitution and child exploitation.

And another thing (and I know that they aren't your words), what exactly constitutes a "UK Native?" please?

but the only immigrants I know work their arses off.

I suspect then that the only immigrants you know are from Eastern Europe - that being the case, I would concur.

I also suspect that these reports encouraging immigration and multi-culturalism are largely written by immigrants themselves and also persons who have little or no exposure to towns and cities where the immigrant population (largely from the Indian subcontinent) has now exceeded the existing North-Western European, caucasian population. These towns have rapidly declining standards of living, soaring crime rates, "no-go" areas for white people and in some cases areas where the Police fear to tread unless they go in mob-handed.

I'm not totally anti-immigration, but I am for selective immigration. The population of the UK currently stands at about 63 million - it's bursting at the seams, there are millions out of work, the NHS and other services are on their uppers yet still we are happy to let in criminals and asylum seekers who have no right to be here and then spend an aeon sending them back or putting them in OUR prisons.

At the current rate, estimates are that the population of the UK will be 80 million by 2020 - how is that going to help the country to function better?

Unfortunately the morons from UKIP and Daily Mail content will continue to ignore the facts and just make up their own. Nothing will change. That's why they're morons.

Sadly, once you remove the big profits from Mail sales, they break even at best.

err, 😉

This might be confirmation bias, but the only immigrants I know work their arses off. The whole anti immigration argument is the lamest thing ever.

Same as my own experiences, but seems hard to convince those who have been persuaded otherwise by some parts of the UK media. Nice to have facts to back up anecdote.

Don't forget the torygraph LHS

Haterz gonna hate ...... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/10426202/Migrants-more-likely-to-claim-work-benefits-than-Britons.html

[i] there's an awful lot who don't work and are quite happy to sit on their arses claiming all the benefits that they can, whilst at the same time running criminal rackets such as drug dealing, extortion, fraud, prostitution and child exploitation.[/i]

go on then show us the evidence that there are more immigrants doing this than people who were born in this country...

Yes, a large amount of them are hard workers and undoubtedly do contribute; but where I live, there's an awful lot who don't work and are quite happy to sit on their arses claiming all the benefits that they can, whilst at the same time running criminal rackets such as drug dealing, extortion, fraud, prostitution and child exploitation.

As do many white anglo saxons round where I live, so a small percenage of people are scum, this is not an immigration issue.

I suspect then that the only immigrants you know are from Eastern Europe - that being the case, I would concur.

You suspect wrong. ****stani, Iranian, Iraqi, Afghan, Nigerian, Black Zimbabwian, Chinese, Japonese, Chilean, Welsh, Chech, Polish, French, Spanish, Italian are all peopel I have or do currently work with, haven't met a shirker yet. I am sure they exist, but not in my experience.

Essentially your post insinuates some form of racial bias to hard work only found in whites from europe? Is this what you are trying to say?

criminals and asylum seekers

And for just that, lumping criminals in with people fleeing for their lives, I think we can safely call your rantings the delusional racist rubbish they are.

john, i've read a few of your posts in the past. Nothing in your current one surprises me.

[i]At the current rate, estimates are that the population of the UK will be 80 million by 2020[/i]

again, evidence for this assertion?

Unfortunately the morons from UKIP and Daily Mail content will continue to ignore the facts and just make up their own. Nothing will change. That's why they're morons.

fire 'em at the moon.. from a giant cannon.. john, have you got your helmet buckled up tightly?

you're first up mate, don't worry you'll be quite safe.. there's no brown people up there

And for just that, lumping criminals in with people fleeing for their lives, I think we can safely call your rantings the delusional racist rubbish they are

This^^

It doesn't matter which country you live in, and i've lived in a few, the local "native" 🙄 population will always blame the nations problems on the immigrants. It's the easiest thing to do.

I was reading a good article in the sunday times at the weekend on the EDL. Its ironic, as I don't see anything about the EDL as being what you would call typically English (or more importantly British). Crass, ill-educated, hateful people. That's not british, do they really think that Brunel, Shakespeare, Churchill, Darwin, Lennon or the Queen would really support their view? No.

ellison - Member
I also suspect that these reports encouraging immigration and multi-culturalism are largely written by immigrants themselves and also persons who have little or no exposure to towns and cities where the immigrant population (largely from the Indian subcontinent) has now exceeded the existing North-Western European, caucasian population.

'You suspect'? So you didn't both reading the report then?

The population of the UK currently stands at about 63 million - it's bursting at the seams, there are millions out of work, the NHS and other services are on their uppers yet still we are happy to let in criminals and asylum seekers who have no right to be here and then spend an aeon sending them back or putting them in OUR prisons.

Millions out of work? I've never had an issue finding work.

Do they deliberately let criminals in? Yes the do let asylum seekers in, I agree with you on that, this is an issue, because we do not want to protect the vulnerable or help the oppressed in any way.

OUR prisons? I love how you are possessive over that. It is an awesome proposition, that we should only have prisons for our people.

I've always thought this was pretty obvious. The majority of immigrants tend to be hard working, focused people.

They have made a massive decision to leave their homeland and even this requires a certain attitude.

Isn't this just another meaningless study?

[b]Recent[/b] immigrants make a net contribution because the numbers are skewed by those who come here to do work that no-one already here is willing to do.

Potato picking in Norfolk (friend of a friend came over from China twenty years ago to do this and ended up doing ok) or computer programming in Cambridgeshire (programmers == hens' teeth).

Immigrants who have been here longer will tend to be more of a drain on society - as they age they have children, get sick, retire, and do all the other expensive things [i]that the indigenous population do[/i].

So, if you're prepared to be selective about which tranche of immigrants you examine, you can get any number you desire.

[url= http://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/oct/24/medical-tourism-generates-millions-nhs-health ]medical-tourism-generates-millions-nhs-health[/url]

as they age they have children, get sick, retire, and do all the other expensive things that the indigenous population do.

that's actually quite important isn't it, and to my mind brings a more understandable slant to the whole 'coming over here, claiming our benefits' spiel

which leads me to another theory I have which is the 'fire all pensioners to the moon from a giant cannon' which would solve the economic crisis and at the same time solve the problem of the pervading smell of wee

Logan's Run was very prescient...

I am an immigrant, as is my wife - neither of us from Eastern Europe and we work pretty hard IMO - we are both higher rate tax payers anyway. So yes - we contribute and have been for 16 years in my wife's case, 14 in mine. By the time we become a "drain on society" we will have earned that right by virtue of the taxes we have paid.

[i]By the time we become a "drain on society" we will have earned that right by virtue of the taxes we have paid.[/i]

I think this is the point that's been missed above.

It should be about being a 'net contributor' over your lifetime.

We could take a 5 year period in anyones; life in this country and label them as a 'plus' or 'minus' - it's looking at what they put in as a whole that is the issue?

Tbh, I don;t think being born here is an excuse to spend a life where you take more than you give which seems to be the view that some hold.

Arriving out of a womb in one geographical area or another is not the be all and end all of ones worth.

Sadly it won't make any different, the Mail and Express will still be turning out 'Rapid immigrant raped Diana whilst scrounging benefits' etc etc

samuri - Member

Over 30% of all immigrants have university degrees.

And that's leaving aside the 400000-odd that come here to get one- the biggest single group of immigrants.

Over 30% of all immigrants have university degrees.

I wonder how many of the people complaining have a similar level of education.

Also worth pointing out that my schooling and university education were done elsewhere - so the part of that that was subsidised by the government has NOT been paid by the UK. Almost all of my working life has been in this country - so people like me are actually way up in the balance sheet relative to those born here.

(Note that I don't believe one's financial contributions are the only aspect to citizenship - but that is what is being discussed on this thread).

And that's leaving aside the 400000-odd that come here to get one- the biggest single group of immigrants.

Don't get me started on those hard working cash rich foreigners, coming over here, contributing to our economy, paying through the nose to subsidise our education system whilst our own teenagers sit at home sponging off the state, without a qualification to rub together...

Makes me sick, etc, etc

As with all these things the averages may mask huge regional variations.

Might take a look at the underlying data to see what the regional picture looks like.

The cultural dimension immigration brings is probably worth a look too - look at the recent issues in Oxford. Certainly a very unpalatable situation going on with a mix of very unpleasant people. Whether that's worse than normal I don't know but I don't like it!

These towns have rapidly declining standards of living, soaring crime rates, "no-go" areas for white people and in some cases areas where the Police fear to tread unless they go in mob-handed.

What a load of fear mongering BS

Hardly surprising. If you have the motivation to move half-way across the world the chances are you're a motivated type.

Coming over here and taking our jobs is a classic slogan.

That does make immigration even more threatening to the idle and the 'entitled'. Wonder who they'll vote for?

What about all the immigrants that arrived in the wake of the Second World War? You know, that little period of 54 years prior to 1999?

You mean like all of those educated, middle class professional Indians and ****stani's who had been part of the Empire, had fought in the WW2 for the UK and had the funds to get out of a Country in chaos after the UK had split it up? Those lazy bastards who went on to set up succesful business, work in the NHS, lawyers, etc etc.! Scum the lot of them!

I think that's exactly the point johnellison was striving for winston_dog - that widening the date range showed an even more positive skew towards net contribution.

These towns have rapidly declining standards of living, soaring crime rates, "no-go" areas for white people and in some cases areas where the Police fear to tread unless they go in mob-handed.

I work in Burnley and while it has significant issues - it's nowhere near what you're describing.

Eg

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-23849081

People who want to be here more useful than those who do f all but moan about this country shocker.

I love how

I'm scared of brown people

no-go" areas for white people

Just because you choose not to go to places doesn't make it a no go area for everyone of your skin colour!

Thinking of the most 'ethnic' area (big high street type thing) near me (midlands city), half of the 'Asian' shops are staffed by white Eastern Europeans and me and my gf have been there plenty of times without being lynched, groomed or converted!

In my previous job, our office was in London.

With a staff of about 15 there was Iranian, Polish, Indian, South African and Belgian. All educated professional people.

To real demonstrate the diversity we even employed a jock, a scouser and a geordie.

The only useless bastard was a white, southern Englishman. Lasted 2 months.

The only useless bastard was a white, southern Englishman. Lasted 2 months.

Chatting to the SO's sisters husband who is a Kiwi, his commment was that a lot of the brits he has worked with expect a good job title, a company car, expect a good salary, expect a good pension etc. BUT didn't expect to work, they wouldn't do the crap that needed to be done, they just wanted the trappings but none of the effort.

mrmo - Member

Chatting to the SO's sisters husband who is a Kiwi, his commment was that a lot of the brits he has worked with expect a good job title, a company car, expect a good salary, expect a good pension etc. BUT didn't expect to work, they wouldn't do the crap that needed to be done, they just wanted the trappings but none of the effort.

I hope you explained that having put in all that effort civilizing the world and taming the savages, it's now right and proper that we take a bit of a rest and let the colonials pay back some of their debt.

None of us really 'native' to the UK; go back far enough, and we're all immigrants.

In the late 19th century my something*great-granddad was an Irish immigrant and married an Italian immigrant. I'm hoping that the BNP's plan to pay the repatriation expenses of the descendants of immigrants is enacted at some point 🙂