[Closed] Pistorius

Has to be guilty

Who wakes up at 2am and doesnt notice their Mrs isnt in bed with them, and also who in a proper full on relationship locks the toilet door when they are going for a wee in the middle of the night

Well I suppose it's possible that's totally inaccurate and nobody has ever decided to correct it 🙄

To be honest, sometimes when I wake up at 2am I'm somewhat confused.

Did you hear about the bloke who strangled his wife whilst dreaming? (that's not a joke btw.. horrific case)

I'm coming round to the idea that they had a blazing row, she locked herself in the loo, probably to phone someone - he flipped out - shot her, then immediately realized what he'd done - and worked out the burglar story to cover his arse.

The fact that most affluent white South Africans are gun mad, and paranoid about being burgled just made it easier for him to fabricate a story...

I did, horrible indeed.

I've also urinated down the stairs of my parents house happy in the knowledge that I was at a urinal, on christmas eve, and was discovered by mum. She nearly strangled me.

That's not what he's saying though is it? He was conscious.

I'd go for the flew into a rage theory, crime of passion type thing but he's as guilty as sin.*

*(Internet based shoddy assumption - I'm pretty sure pepole with more access to facts are going to make this decision)

There's a bit of no-man's land between conscious and asleep, tbh. See the numerous stories on here of people whose wives/gfs put them in the doghouse for something they did in a dream.

I can see why he'd try and concoct a story to cover it up, even if he was confused at the time - it sounds like an even lamer excuse.

COme on Molgrips, what have you done?

What have I done? I hit my wife once (very gently) in the chest whilst fast asleep - cannot remember what I was dreaming though!

I find his whole defence very difficult to believe, as does everybody else...this does not mean he won't walk, I think he will.

I think he's genuinely remorseful, but I also think he's turning it on a bit for the court.

Was just ribbing you, not looking for an actual confession.

I think his remorse is pretty genuine, at least for the demise of his own carrer, reputation and celebrity but it doesn't change [/s]the fact[s] my conjecture that he killed her in a rage. If he was all that remorseful about her death he should have have pleaded to guilty to manslaughter (again no idea if such a thing exists in SA and CBA reading the wiki link) He's killed her and flushed his life down the toilet because of his ego, off to the big house.

I think under English law he would be guilty of murder in both cases.

I suppose South African law is different?

Yes. For a start, it's a Roman-Dutch law jurisdiction, hence no jury and addressing everything to the judge. What he's guilty of and the measure to get there is both different from common law generally and from English law specifically.

There's a bit of no-man's land between conscious and asleep, tbh. See the numerous stories on here of people whose wives/gfs put them in the doghouse for something they did in a dream.

Mrs North and I were staying in a not-especially-nice hotel room in San Francisco many years ago. I'd got a bit jittery after we'd walked in the end stages of an armed robbery earlier. Middle of the night and I'm startled by something. A silhouetted figure lunges towards me, and I grab it by the hair and hit it before it dawning on me who it was and what I'd done....

And who the hell lets off 4 shots through a closed bathroom door without knowing who is in there? burglar or not, they cant pose much of a threat in a locked bathroom.

Don't judge it by British standards. My colleague returned to the UK from SA after he decided the violence was too great. After one occasion where people were shooting at his house, his wife was advised by the police to shoot to kill and to make sure there was evidence (ie a hole in the ceiling) where she'd fired a warning shot. They were happy that didn't need to have been before they'd dealt with the intruders. They also offered to leave old knives with her so she could cut her arms to ensure it looked like a personal attack.

It's a country where you have to check your firearm in before you get on a flight, but is otherwise happy for you to be armed as you wander around.

So, we need to see this in context. Gun crime and attacks on the home are high in the minds of many people in SA. I can see why he's arguing it as he is (I have no opinion on his guilt).

Maybe he did it in a blind fury?

EDIT: not saying that excuses him at all, but maybe he can't control his anger and now realises the gravity of what he's done.

This is the nearest to my own belief; as it happens I was in Johannesburg when it happened and as you would expect, it was discussed in every meeting I attended over the next few days. Without exception my customers (mostly white Afrikaaner woman) said it was "'roid rage" and that he was known in local Afrikaaner society as a bit of a gun nut.

Whatever; that woman judge looks to be no fool and I bet she's not taken in by his histrionics. I notice that he looks less chiselled and softer in the face than a year ago - could that just be because he's stopped training and put on weight or he's given up the steroids?

compare

He put four shots through a closed door with the intention of killing the person behind it.

with

"So you accidentally shot at the intruders..?"

he's doing everything he can to avoid admitting responsibility for anything - he's basically saying 'everything was an accident, i didn't even mean to pull the trigger' - which would get him off manslaughter too.

However, he's clearly got an anger management problem and he's also a bit prone to shooting guns (which he tries to avoid admitting responsibility for too) - so he's walking a tightrope of 'not me guv'nor' vs 'hang on, you're prone to this sort of thing'.

So, 'beyond reasonable doubt', given the crime scene has been messed with, means this is going to be a rough ride (and strangely compelling).

Poor Reeva's family - sincerely - what a nightmare.

Mrs North and I were staying in a not-especially-nice hotel room in San Francisco many years ago. I'd got a bit jittery after we'd walked in the end stages of an armed robbery earlier. Middle of the night and I'm startled by something. A silhouetted figure lunges towards me, and I grab it by the hair and hit it before it dawning on me who it was and what I'd done....

Wonder if he's had a Neuro investigate the possibility of a Night Terror or Fontal Lobe/Temporal Lobe dysfunction?

Cruzcampo 's indication is probably the most obvious route the event took, and the simplest , which may well be the truth, sadly only OP knows the truth.

For me his defence is increasingly making him look like Vicky Pollard:

"Did you kill your girlfriend?"

"No, but yeah, but no, but yeah, 'cos you see what happened was there was this whole other thing what happened earlier when reeva and I was down the town with these other boys and shut up you weren't even there or nothing and stop giving me those evils and I've never even fired a gun apart from that one time when I accidentally fired it at my girlfriend 4 times and I was asleep then anyway and it was the intruders what done it... "

Guilty.

In the OP version, during the whole episode Reeva makes no sound, even though she is in the bathroom when he is outside it and he is screaming. Just not probable.

He is also being tried on a secondary count of culpable homicide, where having admitted to killing her, the prosecution only have to prove negligence. Punishable by minimum of 6 years in prison.

He's going to prison.

sadly only OP knows the truth.

You're saying Molgrips did it?

His voice is starting to grate me now.

His voice is starting to grate me now.

Some of his posts irritate me as well... We are talking about Molly arent we.

I like the addition of "Mi Lady" after every sentance that comes out of his mouth.

Nice touch.

Shows respect that.

Don't pick on Molgrips,he often awakes confused.

[i]I like the addition of "Mi Lady" after every sentance that comes out of his mouth.

Nice touch.

Shows respect that
[/i]

But is he wearing a tie?

[quote=bikebouy said]I like the addition of "Mi Lady" after every sentance that comes out of his mouth.
Nice touch.
Shows respect that.

[img] [/img]

They played a soundbite of an exchange between Pistorius and Nel on t'radio yesterday, and he came [i]that[/i] close to saying he had been briefed to say he pulled the trigger accidently. He's as guilty as a puppy sitting next to a pile of poo.

[quote=Fantombiker ]He is also being tried on a secondary count of culpable homicide, where having admitted to killing her, the prosecution only have to prove negligence. Punishable by minimum of 6 years in prison.
He's going to prison.

Did he plead not guilty to that? 😯 If so it might explain the course of the defence, but it would appear to be a big, big mistake.

Thought I heard some reporter say even if he got cleared on these charges he would stll end up being tried for murder, which confused me.

I like the addition of "Mi Lady" after every sentance that comes out of his mouth.

Nice touch.

Shows respect that.

Prosecutor asks the question, defendant replies to the Judge instead.

Is that normal? It'd wind me up. I'd say listen you loathsome little shitehawk I'm the one speaking to you- answer to me.

catvet - Member
Cruzcampo 's indication is probably the most obvious route the event took, and the simplest , which may well be the truth, sadly only OP knows the truth.

Why thankyou catvet 😀 The way they adjourned todays hearing early will leave OP on a knifeedge all weekend, stress levels on Mondays reopening are going to be through the ceiling.

hora - member
Prosecutor asks the question, defendant replies to the Judge instead.

Is that normal? It'd wind me up. I'd say listen you loathsome little shitehawk I'm the one speaking to you- answer to me.

I guess as there is no jury, and its the judge who decides the outcome everything is directed at her. The mi lady bit does tickle me!

The mi lady bit does tickle me!

Indeed, a high profile white, (by all accounts) arrogant afrikaner male being super deferential to a black female judge is rather satisfying to hear!

He's a creep.

Your in bed, you hear something that wakes you up, next thing "everyone" does is roll over and shake the person next to them " wake up did you hear that?"

Unless you know the girl isn't in bed, obvs

and also who in a proper full on relationship locks the toilet door when they are going for a wee in the middle of the night

Not me, but our bedroom sink is not behind a door, so this might not be entirely representative.

What emsz said. So you think you hear a burglar (he claims he heard the bathroom window open) Me - I would locate anybody else in the house first, and the cat, and probably make sure my bikes are safe.

Not pull a gun.

And why would a burglar lock themselves in the toilet ?? Nerves ??

None of it seems in any way likely.

I can't listen to it on radio 4 driving home anymore, too much shouting at the radio, which is even more pointless than shouting at the TV.

Prosecutor asks the question, defendant replies to the Judge instead.

Is that normal? It'd wind me up. I'd say listen you loathsome little shitehawk I'm the one speaking to you- answer to me.

It would be perfectly good etiquette here to do that.

Has any of the prosecution bothered checking the size of the bathroom window and asking him why he thought a burglar might get a ladder and squeeze in there rather than taking the easier route via the patio doors?

Prosecutor asks the question, defendant replies to the Judge instead.
Is that normal? It'd wind me up. I'd say listen you loathsome little shitehawk I'm the one speaking to you- answer to me.

convert - Member

The mi lady bit does tickle me!

Indeed, a high profile white, (by all accounts) arrogant afrikaner male being super deferential to a black female judge is rather satisfying to hear!

Indeed. I can imagine generations of ethnic Africans totally understanding Pistorius's POV, erm... well possibly not.
I do wonder what the appetite of the African peoples POV is in this case for a conviction, a conviction whether he's guilty or not.

Maybe its designed to flatter, to make her feel important. Incase shes wavering, unsure she'll then find him not-guilty?

This reminds me in some ways of OJ Simpson. Different parallels but a celeb defending himself. One we KNOW did it and one we know did it..the only thing that seperates them is premeditation?

He's been well directed, that's all.

Direct all submissions and remarks to the bench and not the opposing advocate.

Just normal court etiquette.

I guess, I suppose in some way he's belittling the Prosecution by not refering his answers to them, but the Judge.

Mi Lady. 😉

Maybe its designed to flatter, to make her feel important.

Who would be anything other than polite to the person who could put you in jail for 30 + years?

his story seems to be unraveling under pressure from the prosecutor, his "I shouted to her to call the police" when she was only feet away was not met with a reply! not even a "hang on, wait till I've finished on the loo"

He addresses the judge in the same way that British MPs address the Speaker, not each other.

Either she's an extremely astute and respected judge or she's a political appointment for the reasons mentioned above - a white man of the discredited Afrikaaner tribe causing havoc in what is now a black African country deserves to be judged by a black judge.... or it was thought that a white male judge would be unlikely to be seen as impartial... who knows, but it's interesting.