Quite a few times recently (latest one this morning) I've had to pull over to let someone aggressively tailgating past me. This has been on local roads, mostly in the blanket 20mph zone in the town I live in (been like this for thick end of a decade) and got me thinking about driving behaviours locally vs on the motorway network.
I don't drive a lot these days (WFH a lot and get trains to other city centre offices/clients with the odd drive to some more remote clients) but I had a few longish drives in November/December and what was notable was that you don't get people charging down the outside lane at 90-100mph nearly as much as what you did 20 years ago. Not sure if it is cost of fuel, more EVs on the road trying to extend range, or other factors I haven't thought of? But certainly feels nicer driving on the motorway than it used to be. Obviously there's still the odd plonka trying to set a land speed record but feels to me like it happens less often and people still tailgate on the motorway but there is more scope on multi-lane routes for them to get past.
I'm not sure if I'm just more sensitive living on a main road (in aforementioned 20mph zone) near a tight bend because I often experience it first hand pulling over ready to reverse onto my drive, or it is a general trend that others see too. The speeding seems to be fewer occurrences but more extreme in our town, if I'm out the front gardening or cleaning the car or what not it'll not take long before someone comes past at 50mph.
The tailgating happens a lot more than the excessive speed incidents locally in my view. You'd think people would be embarrassed if the car in front pulled over only to then pull back out behind them again (at a safe distance!) or at least trigger a thought as to "what just happened there?", who knows, maybe it does.. I had to do full blown emergency stop for a dog running into the road on a 30mph zone a few months ago and luckily no one was behind me, but this has made me much more actively try to let people who are too close past and on their way.
Interested in others views on driving behaviours locally vs on the motorway. Cheers
Agreed on the motorways thing (excluding the M25).
But my local roads seem to have more dithering, way-too-slow drivers in the last year or two.
And no, that doesn't mean I'm the bell end. I'm just pottering around within the speed limit in my van.
Agree on the shift in behaviours with motorway driving. I often pootle at 65-68 now and am always surprised at how rarely you get overtaken. More speed cameras I guess, especially the average speed type? And on local roads I live on a 20mph one and in my less happy days shout and shake my fist like some deranged fool at the cars passing at 40mph+. I live in hope that someone will screech to a halt and engage in a spirited conversation, that escalates to them throwing a punch and then getting into trouble. I realise that this is entirely foolish on many levels but thanks for the opportunity to share.
I have noticed over the last week or so some seriously aggressive driving around sheffield. Lots of tailgating, aggresive lane changes and speeding.
Seems like the worse the weather the more aggressive the driving is.
Yep in recent years 80mph seems to be the maximum on the motorway and I noticed on the M1 I was the fastest at 70mph for a lot of my journey today. <br />Unfortunately speed limit observation seems to have overshadowed stuff like paying attention, indicating and patience.<br /><br /><br />
Motorway speeds have settled right down. Same on big A roads like the A82 over Glencoe and the A537 Cat & Fiddle where average speed cameras have largely removed the "enthusiastic driving" nobbers although it hasn't cured the brain-dead ****s who think it's OK to close pass.
Local roads though are as lawless as ever. Shit parking, pavement driving/parking, speeding, RLJ... There's a junction near mine where there'll be at least 2 cars go through on red every single time. One of my closest ever "near miss" was cycling that road, the light went amber, I braked and the car behind missed me by mm as it sped through. I don't stop there now. Lights changing as I approach = head down and go for it cos the cars behind will be doing the same.
As spotted on the other thread where I've been having a whinge, one of my biggest gripes with Sheffield is the driving standards. The roads are smashed to bits, the actual layout is a nightmare with dead ends and one way streets everywhere, every single residential street looks like a carpark with cars parked end to end in every direction.
All this is bad enough but it's made so much worse by people's insistence on driving like utter frothing bell ends. My theory is that people spent so long stationary that every time they spot a bit of empty tarmac they absolutely bury the throttle in excitement.
I live in a 20 zone but people regularly dip off the main road to avoid the traffic lights and go blazing up the hill flat out. This is with parked cars on both sides and barely enough room to drive up the middle. The other day I saw a standoff between 2 massive SUV's, both of which were incapable of reversing up the street.
Utter cockstains everywhere.
Non-existent traffic Police on any roads other than motorways thanks to the Tories, plus smart motorways/speed cameras on gantries.
The last few years the amount of cars going through red lights has increased significantly.
I got beeped last night in the pissing rain because I was allowing some oncoming cars to drive round one stalled 5 series while the other cars in front of me were all queuing at the flooded section that had an MX5 stuck in the middle of it.
Basically the prick behind was too impatient to realise that shoving on through wouldn't halp a thing and letting some cars get through would clear the road ahead so we could all make some progress.
I also live in a 20 area with cameras and a few speed bumps to try and calm the bellends down. I regularly get tailgated while sticking to the local limit, normally by fancier cars with less ground clearance that heave on the brakes when they realise there's a speed bump, and then accelerate back up to sit in my boot.
I think I'd be ok with quitting driving TBH, certainly doing it less. Unfortunately I am not in a position to simply stop driving (yet).
People behave like this because of various factors (stress, pressure the way driving is promoted in the media) but mostly because they seldom see any challenge or consequences as a result of shitty aggressive driving so they just carry on having learned that it's socially acceptable...
Motorway driving does seem to be slower on average. At the other end of the scale it feels as though the widespread use of 20 mph limits means that drivers are letting off a bit of frustration when they get to the edge of town.
Really noticeable how awful driving standards are when the schools are out. Normally it's just packed into the hour of school run either end of the day. I'm not pointing the finger at teachers being poor drivers, but if the cap fits!
The thing that really boils my urine is how people think it's acceptable to floor it around supermarket car parks. A poor woman was killed in the local Tesco by a van. Often think they should put posters up of the aftermath of that and it might make people pause for thought.
I commute from a semi rural 20mph area via a mix of roads to another 20 mph area.
I've been doing the same route for many years and have also perceived a change.
I'm in Wales and subject to the recent 20mph restrictions which I generally agree with. There's a few local drivers who definitely don't and it's not at all unusual to have a bunch of cars behind me on the early part of the journey veering sideways trying to overtake. Although it's an A road it's pretty congested with a lot of double parking restricting the carriageway to a single lane for one particular stretch of about a mile. One particular twit in a white Focus is always SO keen to pass. There is only one stretch of road wide enough and with good enough visibility but it was really isn't a good place because it's by the very busy filling station. Fiestalad has a shot if he can though.
As for the M4, if it's dark and raining I take the alternative, the current roadworks make it too stressful for me to be bothered with. Adds maybe 5 mins to my journey but I'm spared the half-wits jostling for position through the contraflow at J48.
Often think they should put posters up of the aftermath of that and it might make people pause for thought.
I doubt the selfish knob heads would even notice them....
The tailgating happens a lot more than the excessive speed incidents locally in my view. You’d think people would be embarrassed if the car in front pulled over only to then pull back out behind them again (at a safe distance!) or at least trigger a thought as to “what just happened there?”, who knows, maybe it does
While I see more and more folk sticking(ish) to the 20mph in our locality, there seems to be a hardcore who refuse or who know better.
A year back I was unfortunate enough to bother answering a local knuckle dragger who was claiming that over 30mph was perfectly safe, as when was the last time anyone was run over on that road? (and other silly arguments). He, and a few others, genuinely though that the 20mph zone was unnecessary, unfair on drivers and would make our town much worse.
You cannot argue with stupid and you won't change everyone's selfish attitude.
I now happily sit at 20mph and ignore tailgaiters.
Motorways are fine - apart from anywhere south of Manchester...
I think there's something in this. Standards of driving particularly around residential estates and the like, that now seem to get treated like A roads, are piss poor. Yet the majority of people seem to be happy to trundle along at 60mph on motorways.
I got beeped last night in the pissing rain because I was allowing some oncoming cars to drive round one stalled 5 series while the other cars in front of me were all queuing at the flooded section that had an MX5 stuck in the middle of it.
I was overtaken last week while I stopped behind a bus to give way to oncoming traffic. Van behind passed, giving me a filthy look whilst simultaneously being angrily flashed at by aforementioned oncoming traffic.
Central South. The stupid is strong in all areas with excesses of high speed, aggression, dithering. Oh and mobile use it's like Bluetooth was never invented.
The lane discipline on the M27 is something to behold. I'd say it's currently worse than the M25, which I would generally rate as the worst for people ignoring the two empty lanes to their left. There is a section of 50mph over the Hamble River currently that if you slow down for (I do) you're taking your bodywork/life in your hands.
The only proper solution is a lot more Roads Police.
I did chuckle the other day when Mr lashed up Merc with illegal plates was peeling the illegal tints off his front windows under the watchful eye of a traffic officer. 🙂
Not sure if it is cost of fuel, more EVs on the road trying to extend range, or other factors I haven’t thought of?
EVs are generally going the fastest. If they dont need the range for their particular journey they seem happy to gun it as they will just fill up at home regardless. Of course you see the occasional hypermiler who must be doing a long journey but mostly they are motoring along in lane 3.
My guess is the proliferation of adaptive cruise control in higher end vehicles at least.
more dithering, way-too-slow drivers in the last year or two.
Oh my god, this has really been noticeable - Dribbling across junctions oblivious to the queue of cars behind them trying also to get through the lights - "Pretend you live in a city and you have to share the roads with other people..." and breathe...But yeah also the red light jumping is at epidemic levels. I got beeped at for the terrible crime of slowing to stop for an amber light turning to red...
Driving in general in the UK is so stressful now. Especially greater London, heaven forbid you make a mistake and end up in the wrong lane because the moment you put that indicator on, there will not be a room for a fag paper between the bumpers of the cars in the lane you need to merge into.
I've seen cases where entire junctions have become deadlocked because some pencil-dicked simpleton was so desperate to prevent somebody getting ahead of them that they positioned their car such that NOBODY could then get through the junction. Genius.
I was on holiday in Italy last year and it really surprised me to learn that driving in Rome was (much much) less stressful than driving in the UK. Sure, everybody thinks they are Ricardo Patrese, but everybody just gets on with it.
No-body sticks to the 20 zone where I live, not near work (Manchester). At home, the 20 is actually governed by speed bumps, but the number of folk scraping the lower bumpers/splitters it's crazy. I can only assume it's a leased car. Wide road near work, 20 zone due to school/college. Not so bad on bike as there is bit of a cycle lane and it's a wide road, but nobbers everywhere.
Driven a lot in Wales, and I'm fairly used to it with tailgaters - just leave them to it.
Everyone feeling the pressure of modern living and declining public standards - yeah I feel it.
I think its greater than just driving though.
I think I’d be ok with quitting driving TBH, certainly doing it less
+1
the more I drive the less I like it--and I passed my test in 1986!
so many obnoxious drivers about, whether it's supermarket car-parks, 20mph zones, or motorways, just so many vehicles on the roads today I guess...
one thing I cannot understand is folk blasting up to red lights and then slamming on the brakes, instead of slowing down in anticipation of the lights turning green, saves fuel and brake wear.
back in the day, when I had a Mini 850, the brakes were so rubbish it was best to avoid using them, so slowing down using the gears, or just decelerating using the throttle.
now with yer fancy motors with their better braking systems it seems to encourage 'driving on the brakes', but I'm too set in my ways to change now.
I think a reason for this is that the mouthbreathers caning along local roads don't actually have jobs, or anything useful to do, so they're not actually that likely to use motorways. They probably never drive outside a 5 mile radius of their house.
They probably never drive outside a 5 mile radius of their house.
Yep - vast majority of journeys are sub 5 miles. Where this really shows is Easter / Christmas etc when these people Use A Motorway for the first time in months and oh dear God. Utterly clueless, lost, screaming kids in the back, trying to listen to the satnav.
And then the next stage where they're fumbling around local roads to get to the relatives... 🙄
I got sworn at in a car park outside Halfords in Newport recently by a pleasant lady in a nice velour tracksuit with lots of make up in a brand new Range Rover vogue. She told me (and my 9 yr old daughter in the car that “if I can’t ****ing drive it I should ****ing sell it butt”
I pointed out to her that I was trying to drive round a corner, was in my lane, had 4 cars behind me and wasn’t able to reverse as a result. I pointed out in a cheery way that it was the case that she was on the straight, her car was straddling the white line in the middle of both lanes and she had no cars behind her and had space to reverse into. She flicked a finger at me, her daughter who was about 12 and equally caked up with make up leant over her mum from the passenger seat and told me to “**** off butt”.
my daughter who is 9 couldn’t believe it. In the end she did reverse as she had to as there was no way forward, the cars behind me were still stuck and she was obviously very keen to get into b&m.
Can't go fast round our way - the cratered roads stop any form of making progress!! 🙂
Tailgate me in a 20mph zone and you'll find yourself gradually slowing to walking pace.
Easter / Christmas etc when these people Use A Motorway
Driving down south and back at Xmas, there were way fewer lorries on the road - but everyone was still in lane 2, out of habit I suppose?
It wasn't even that busy, so it wasn't like they were gonna get boxed in. Gets tiresome repeatedly going lane 1 - lane 3 to overtake the ones doing 60.
Some absolute nobends round this way. Had some bloke tailgating and flashing because I wasn't overtaking the bloke in front and leaving enough room (it wasn't safe to do so.)
Obviously eased off to increase the distance, just to make sure. 🙂
Seems ^anecdotally^(I'm sure there's ample data to back it up) speed cameras on motorways are working. Great.
Quite obvious next step is to average speedcamera (not unsightly at all) every major road in residential places
This won't deal with the aggression/hard acceleration issue though. That needs to be dealt with through legislation perhaps black boxes for everyone? I'd back that. And eventually will disappear altogether by removing the steering wheel and pedals from all cars.
Driving in general in the UK is so stressful now. Especially greater London, heaven forbid you make a mistake and end up in the wrong lane because the moment you put that indicator on, there will not be a room for a fag paper between the bumpers of the cars in the lane you need to merge into.
Not sure about this actually! I drive through 'london' a few times a month and generally everyone knows that the layout (constantly 2lane>1lane-buslane) is crap and people are quite happy to let people merge if they indicate. But you must act instantly - or they'll close the gap. Also you need to 'london drive' as in european-style driving, where you need to just 'do' rather than 'ask to do' - again, noone really cares or gets annoyed if you 'shoulder your way in' because it's just how to drive in the city. It's (genuinely) almost never out of aggression. Whereas absolutely, that would definitely be aggressive/s*** driving in any other city/town. But London it's just 'the flow'.
Tailgate me in a 20mph zone and you’ll find yourself gradually slowing to walking pace.
One bell-end doesn't mean you have to be one too. Just drive as you would normally.
I'd agree with pretty much everything in this thread but would add that lane discipline seems to be getting worse too.
Every time I have to undertake a long journey I see more and more sat in the middle lane completely unaware of their surroundings and the issue they are causing.
Add to that I have seen some amazingly stupid drivers weaving in and out of heavy traffic, undertaking, cutting people up and generally being dangerous AF. They re unlikely to be speeding due to the traffic but ****ing hell it's terrifying.
Suspect the former is linked to the latter.
Tailgate me in a 20mph zone and you’ll find yourself gradually slowing to walking pace.
Had some bloke tailgating and flashing because I wasn’t overtaking the bloke in front and leaving enough room (it wasn’t safe to do so.)
Obviously eased off to increase the distance, just to make sure.
I do this as well, or rather drive exactly and calmly at the speed limit. There must be some drivers who think that everyone else in the world drives incredibly slowly because every time they hammer up to inch from the tailgate the car in front slows right down. No wonder they are impatient. 😀
I always stick to the twenty and thirty limits too, and the closer someone gets to my rear bumper the further below the limit I drop. The car in front of them is pretty much the only thing which can enforce speed limits, they aren't getting passed.
Amazes me how many just disappear out of sight behind me when we get to the NSL bits too, they are the '40mph absolutely everywhere' group
One bell-end doesn’t mean you have to be one too. Just drive as you would normally.
I'm not being a bell-end, it's for my own safety. If someone is going to drive stupidly close they need to go stupidly slowly in order to avoid a collision if I have to brake suddenly.
When we moved up to sunny Chesterfield circa 18 years ago we noticed the standard of driving was generally awful compared to where we used to live in the SE. Back in the SE people would cut you up but they knew they were doing it as they looked right at you. In Chesterfield people just seemed completely incompetent. Cutting you up, pulling out in front of you with no apparent knowledge that we existsed, almost like we had an invisibility cloak on.
I don’t know if it’s got better or we’ve just got used to it. But loads of pot-holes here now, meaning people are having to take random evasive manoeuvres.
A82 reminds me of driving southbound on it a few years back as the sun was setting. We got stuck behind a logging lorry, but were quite happy going along at 50 mph viewing the scenery. Left a gap in front of us so people who wanted to overtake could. The highlight was some guy in an Alfa overtaking us at warp speed and trying to do the same to the lorry as it went over one of the little bridges forcing it to move to the centre of the road. Pretty sure the Alfa driver had brown trousers after that 😂.
Type of "bridge" in question.
Motorways have definitely slowed. I think the proliferation of 50 limits and average speed cameras 2005-2015 whilst they upgraded lots to smart motorways killed off a lot of it, then smart motorways themselves. You only need a few people sticking to the limits anyway to hold up the "fast" drivers and it's calmer for everyone.
Locally I don't know, when I used to work all over the UK I'd notice different things in different areas. Birmingham had a massive issue with "car meets" blocking roads, Manchester it seemed like red lights were genuinely an optional instruction for everyone. London is OK, apart from a more concentrated percentage of genuinely bad drivers, and information overload for everyone else meaning mistakes get made.
yer fancy motors with their better braking systems it seems to encourage ‘driving on the brakes’
Remember EVs will be automatically triggering the brake lights if they are regenerating. I basically never use the brakes in mine but the brakes lights come on as it goes into regeneration mode.
In Chesterfield people just seemed completely incompetent. Cutting you up, pulling out in front of you with no apparent knowledge that we existsed, almost like we had an invisibility cloak on.
Chesterfield is an absolute traffic sewer with an appalling road layout. What bellend thought that building a triple carriageway with multiple large roundabouts through the centre of town was a good idea I will never understand.
Speaking of EVs, it annoys me when you’re stuck behind a driver of one doing 10mph less than the limit (I know, it’s a limit not a target), you reach a set of lights where there are two lanes, you pull up in the right hand lane only for them to floor it when they go green so you have no chance of overtaking, then they carry on at speed limit -10mph holding up everyone behind.
Must depend where you live. I find the driving around Glasgow to be generally OK. Having said that most of my local driving hours are probably when I'm working. Outside peak hours and in no hurry.
Even on the bike I have only had one recent incident where a swerve and brake was required to avoid the van than pulled out on me on a roundabout.
you reach a set of lights where there are two lanes, you pull up in the right hand lane only for them to floor it when they go green
they’re not flooring it, welcome to the serene world of peak torque available at 0 rpm in silence 😂
Understand how frustrating it is though, reminds me of cycle commuting in Brighton when I’d keep catching up with a slow cyclist only for them to continue through the next set of red lights 😠
