[Closed] OK, so if there's a recession on, why can't I recruit any staff ?

I was talking to a DPD van driver the other day. Same self-employed basis etc. He was stressed and unhappy. The goalposts move a little each month. He's being squeezed to do more work for less money. He gets fined if he calls in sick. Doesn't sound a decent life. I think I may have found out why van drivers seem to be angry roadhogs! If I was forced to drive a van in my current condition then a crash might be in the offing. I can't ride my bike because my balance and spatial awareness are affected. And I LOVE riding my bike!

and yet with your great wage and employment practices you still cant recruit I AM OUTRAGED
PS

you'll see people working self employed jobs for 12 - 13000 a year, 50 hour weeks. what we're offering isn't that at all.

how do you now that the wage is advertised ? you don't because so far it hasn't been

Well thats your answer - people will assume its rubbish and not worth applying for as you are ashamed to quote the wage.

for surte the crap terms and conditions / self employed will not help but I think thats your major issue.

40 drops a day in rural Devonia or in Exeter/Plymuff?

Sounds like a bit of a cold to me

I was talking to a DPD van driver the other day. Same self-employed basis etc. He was stressed and unhappy.

i had a franchise at DPD. i made over 40,000 two years running. i got squeezed for being sick, i got no holiday pay. i didn't care, i was still making good money.

as for stressed and unhappy, all multi droppers are stressed and unhappy, that's how the job is, sometimes it's horrible. i've never met a single one that didn't bitch and moan.

40 drops a day in rural Devonia or in Exeter/Plymuff?

next one up is in tavistock, so mainly urban but i guess 25% would be rural which could be on dartmoor, nice route by the look of it.

It's a bit worse than a cold, not as serious as 'flu. A virus of some sort.

I recon that 19.5k to drive a van is loads, I've just started work as a Doctor and I'm only earning 21 grand before tax. Makes you think it wasn't really worth the effort!

Firing someone for a day on the sick is a bit dramatic though and if it's an industry norm, I don't know, I'm not sure if I can see why the OP is having problems

i'm not really going to fire someone for being sick ds, i just said it to play to the gallery.

i do find some of the reaction on here to be a bit pathetic though. what can i get for not working seems to be more of a motivation than what can i get if i work a bit harder.

i've done really well for myself as a self employed driver.

JY, I think we are singing from the same hymn sheet here, or at least regardless if I had or hadn't opened my mouth earlier, I would be here whole heartedley supporting what you have said, and I think teej is starting to see my point too.

I know exactly what people get paid. I used to be a process/engineering manager on the shop floor charged with increasing throughput/quality and essentially profit. I argued with my superiors that increasing wages upwards from minimum wage would increase quality, whilst they were spending millions on new kit and unproven new processes I wanted to increase wage bill by 100k a year to got bigger gains in profitability. On the shop floor I could see how unhappy people were with crap pay and crap conditions.

No one listened, I know that business went under a few years ago. Anyway I run my own show now and only get paid reasonably because I provide something not everyone can provide. For now.

My point to the OP was saying 19k a year is good money is essentially mis selling becasue it isnt good money, it si actually around about the statistical average for Devon. I understand many of you are happy with this level of pay, fine, but do you not appreciate someone banging the drum to say you should be paid more? I don't care if you do or you don't, I will still do it anyway because its better for me if you get paid more.

Makes you think it wasn't really worth the effort!

snot often that STW can drive me to drink but I'm glad I got given a bottle of vino for guiding last week.. 😐

edit: 🙂

toys19 - Member
My point to the OP was saying 19k a year is good money is essentially mis selling becasue it isnt good money, it si actually around about the statistical average for Devon.

benjamins11 - Member

I recon that 19.5k to drive a van is loads, I've just started work as a Doctor and I'm only earning 21 grand before tax. Makes you think it wasn't really worth the effort!

If I was paid 22 k ayear whilst still in training I would be thrilled, and the fact is it goes up to 27k in year two and more again after so please don't talk such bollox. And the moment you go over your 40 hrs you get more pay, mr multidrop will not get overtime.

[url= http://www.nhscareers.nhs.uk/details/Default.aspx?Id=553 ]drs pay scale[/url]

My point to the OP was saying 19k a year is good money is essentially mis selling becasue it isnt good money, it si actually around about the statistical average for Devon.

😆

yeah sure it is. a priceless gem that earns you a banana.

[img] [/img]

You do know the meaning of the word "average"?

No I just used the word for meaningless effect, please enlighten me.

Unemployment rate for UK is 7.7%
Overall for Devon it's around 5%, quite a bit lower. As other posters have said, if it was advertised in the Midlands, you'd have it filled instantly. The only way you are gonna get decent drivers in that area is to poach from other companies in the same area. You're gonna have to make the job more attractive and the most popular way is to pay more. You haven't advertised the wage and it's true, most unadvertised wages are perceived rightly or wrongly to be crap.

i'm not really going to fire someone for being sick ds, i just thought i'd play to the gallery.

yeah sure it is. a priceless gem that earns you a banana.

Well it seems that monkeys pay bananas not peanuts, still just as bad.

I provided you with the link above from 2006 that showed average earnings in Devon were 19k. Can you not read? Or does a verified survey not cut any ice with you. I guess your preference is unproven anecdote.

Don simon -If the pay is good, the company is good and has a good reputation and the job is good you won't have any problems

Exactly

You're not getting any applicants because it's a crap job to do. Anything with a decent quantity of rural drops is an absolute nightmare. I also fail to see how you made £40,000/yr out of working for DPD unless you had 5 or 6 vans on the go if not more.

I did courier work for a long time working for my brother inlaws business and I would not do it again for any amount of cash. Enjoyable when your young, but hard hard work.

yeah but as already said it doesn't take 5 years to learn to drive a van, lots of graduate jobs start at 19.5k. 19.5k is really not a bad wage for an essentially unskilled job.

p.s. doctors are 'in training' for about 10 years post qualification - we are seeing patients and prescribing drugs and the NHS couldn't function without us, so to say that you would be chuffed to earn that whilst you were 'in training' shows little understanding of whats going on.

evidence, shmevidence.

devon has loads of exremely rich residents and semi residents that earn loads and skew the average totals. reality is that centuries of non unionised labour mean that wages across the west country are pathetically low, as all semi literate, average workers like myself will tell you.

You're not getting any applicants because it's a crap job to do.

Not if you're an experienced driver it's not.

Anything with a decent quantity of rural drops is an absolute nightmare.

no it's not but i respect your right to be wrong all the same

I also fail to see how you made £40,000/yr out of working for DPD unless you had 5 or 6 vans on the go if not more.

so i'm lying because you're not in posession of all the facts ?

you are aware that this makes you look a bit of a prat aren't you ?

fwiw, myself and others made shedloads as we took on our contracts just on the cusp of the advent of internet mobile phone sales and the collection of faulty phones. drivers that had the ambition to be self employed made a fortune. those that were more concerned with sick pay just ended up with longer days for a little overtime a week.

Good: of high quality; excellent.
average:a typical amount, rate, degree, etc.; norm.

HTH

doctors are 'in training' for about 10 years post qualification - we are seeing patients and prescribing drugs and the NHS couldn't function without us, so to say that you would be chuffed to earn that whilst you were 'in training' shows little understanding of whats going on.

I've just started work as a Doctor and I'm only earning 21 grand before tax.

about what a junior HO is worth. 😉

What are the hours that you're asking them to do? Start and rough finishing times?

My CV is going in on Monday to a company in an area where unemployment is under 2% and guess what? The wages are decent compared to similar work in other areas of the country where unemployment is high. I'm doing a Tebbit and 'getting on my bike'.

Yeah sure the pay at the end is good. The point remains though that 19.5k is knocking on the door of early graduate money so I don't think its bad pay ergo somebody should want to do it.

It is a crap job, even if you're experienced (i was) there are many better paying driving jobs out there with far better hours. Rural roads, especially around holiday times are a nightmare - I know this my route was mainly rural roads. You still didnt say how many vans you had to make £40k/yr.

Only a prat would start calling people a prat because they didnt agree with them.

benjamins11 - Member

Yeah sure the pay at the end is good. The point remains though that 19.5k is knocking on the door of early graduate money so I don't think its bad pay ergo somebody should want to do it.
Posted 4 minutes ago # Report-Post

I think this actually shows that you have no idea what is going on - in your own job. The reason why your starting salary is average is that you are an as yet unproven worker, if you make it through the first year then you will be worth more, but you are still essentially a trainee. Almost all grad training programs start on average wages, and accelerate. Mr multidrop, if he even makes 19k, will find it hard to do much better.

about what a junior HO is worth

Of course I understand that, don't be so aggressive. I still think 19.5k with no specific qualifications is not unreasonable.

Of course I understand that, don't be so aggressive. I still think 19.5k with no specific qualifications is not unreasonable.

p.s. doctors are 'in training' for about 10 years post qualification - we are seeing patients and prescribing drugs and the NHS couldn't function without us, so to say that you would be chuffed to earn that whilst you were 'in training' shows little understanding of whats going on.

And you couldn't function without the nurses/midwives telling you what to look for and prescribe.

Of course I understand that, don't be so aggressive.

You were the one who said I had no understanding of what was going on, I just passed your statement back.

Brief summary then..

So the general concensus is that 19k is crap..
The facts are that for millions of people 19k is very acceptable..

There also seems to be a vibe that these folk that survive in the 12 - 20k salary bracket have in some way brought it on themselves and should fight for more..?

There was also briefly a mention from one poster that no-one from STW could survive on 19k

ok.. so now can we finally lay to rest the myth that STW is full of working class heroes bravely soldiering on..
have we finally realised that the working class work hand to mouth with no time or money for luxuries.. they literally live to put bread on the table.. same as they always have and always will..
and that once you climb out of that trap you are middle class..?

never mind all this crap about 'my grandad was a miner so I'm working class'
or.. 'I work a 40 hour week for my 32k and holiday and sick pay.. the fact that I work makes me working class..'

once you have realised that many of the youths in this country have only this future to motivate them away from a life of crime.. it's easy to see why they have no respect for the middle class majority that are encouraging them to live within the law..

It is a crap job, even if you're experienced (i was) there are many better paying driving jobs out there with far better hours. Rural roads, especially around holiday times are a nightmare - I know this my route was mainly rural roads

so you couldn't hack it. some people can. i did/can/would.

You still didnt say how many vans you had to make £40k/yr.

one.

This £400 pw is that after all expenses? Wondering how Devon compares to London. What sort of hours would you need to do to earn that. Is work contract or ad hoc?

We continually recruit drivers and have a pretty big churn rate. Recruiting drivers is not a problem, recruiting good drivers is the problem. Our top drivers probably clear £800 per week whereas drivers at the bottom end who work short days and take the odd day off sometimes end up making a loss on the week.

yunki - Member

Brief summary then..

So the general concensus is that 19k is crap..
The facts are that for millions of people 19k is very acceptable..

There also seems to be a vibe that these folk that survive in the 12 - 20k salary bracket have in some way brought it on themselves and should fight for more..?

There was also briefly a mention from one poster that no-one from STW could survive on 19k

ok.. so now can we finally lay to rest the myth that STW is full of working class heroes bravely soldiering on..
have we finally realised that the working class work hand to mouth with no time or money for luxuries.. they literally live to put bread on the table.. same as they always have and always will..
and that once you climb out of that trap you are middle class..?

never mind all this crap about 'my grandad was a miner so I'm working class'
or.. 'I work a 40 hour week for my 32k and holiday and sick pay.. the fact that I work makes me working class..'

once you have realised that many of the youths in this country have only this future to motivate them away from a life of crime.. it's easy to see why they have no respect for the middle class majority that are encouraging them to live within the law..

Yunki I think you have pretty much, in a longhand way, said what I said.
I know lots of people live on 19k. I don't think they should have to, and there is little room for luxury.
I do not think anyone brought it upon themselves, as I mentioned before I reaped the benefit of education through supportive family, friends and community, both moral and financial. Not everyone has access to this.

So the general concensus is that 19k is crap..

I don't think that's the general census at all - toys thinks it is but he is not based in the real world and just likes to pontificate (I'd bet lots he'll post again here as he can't stand not having the last word) so the number of posts with that opinion maybe high but the number of post[b]ers[/b] is not.

And can we stop thinking in delineated working/middle/upper classes please - the reality is far more complicated with much greyer lines.

I hope the op can sort out his advert/ recruitment process and get someone for the job as that sounds like the issue not in the income.

I lived and worked in tavistock (mid devon) in the early/mid 90's and earned 2.75 an hour 396 per month take home making wetsuits in a factory in Lewdown (late teens, early 20's) I ran a car, rented a room etc, I could read a map, drive a car/7.5 ton truck etc. I'd of bit my tight arm off to double my salary (taking into account inflation)

My point is - as an expat. is life that easy in Devon now that one can cruise into a job that i would killed for in those days or have we come to expect more from life?

Oh, and i only had 4 channels on me TV too, if that's any help.

I hope the op can sort out his advert/ recruitment process and get someone for the job as that sounds like the issue not in the income.

thanks convert, i hope so too. interviewing someone at 10.30.

....so ' unskilled ' workers only deserve low pay?
That seems the fact that gets repeated here.

Regardless of how hard they work. Regardless if its back breaking work. If they were not lucky enough to be in the position to afford to go to university - then they deserve low paid work.

I 'm obviously in the minority then. Because i think a hard days work deserves a decent wage. There are plenty of jobs deemed as unskilled that ' highly skilled ' proffesionals would not be physically able to do.

With access to university being more biased to the rich/well off. Things are only going to get worse.

"drive a car/7.5 ton truck etc"

Not these days of course. I am wondering when all the post 97 licenses start to catch up with industry.

tm, could it be the time of year? all those tourists on the road means it could take hours extra to get around...

best of luck anyway..

mooman - Member

....so ' unskilled ' workers only deserve low pay?
That seems the fact that gets repeated here.

Regardless of how hard they work. Regardless if its back breaking work. If they were not lucky enough to be in the position to afford to go to university - then they deserve low paid work.

I 'm obviously in the minority then. Because i think a hard days work deserves a decent wage. There are plenty of jobs deemed as unskilled that ' highly skilled ' proffesionals would not be physically able to do.

With access to university being more biased to the rich/well off. Things are only going to get worse.

I agree. It's particularly galling that the bin man who has to lift and stink all day gets paid not much when a head teacher who fiddles around with bits of paper and phone calls all day gets an awful lot.