Kryton – you come across as a caring, kind person and often these types suffer from depression, stress and have a worrying personality. Good luck.
At the risk of giving the internet something to beat my up with, I think the words in bold are where I'd like to be and I do try to do things that lends themselves to that - charitable things, voluntary things etc - which I don't really talk about because in my mind the attention should be on the recipients not me. But in reality, I can be a moody selfish prick at times as part of a vicious circle with all of that stress. See "Pisces", that describes me perfectly.
I want to progress in my job not because of the extra money but because I want the extra responsibility, I want to make big decisions and have people listen to me.
This me also. I took this role because its an opportunity to own and manage a small business within a business, my business with my expertise with somebody else's investment if you like, and success/me being one of one expert in the field currently provides exactly that ^^, not least the challenge of my skills it brings. Having craved that, I'm now thinking - with the advice here - that sinking back into relative anonymity with a lower paid job may be a better thing to do. I do want to wait for the mortgage to be paid though.
I took this role because its an opportunity to own and manage a small business within a business, my business with my expertise with somebody else’s investment if you like, and success/me being one of one expert in the field currently provides exactly that ^^, not least the challenge of my skills it brings. Having craved that, I’m now thinking – with the advice here – that sinking back into relative anonymity with a lower paid job may be a better thing to do. I do want to wait for the mortgage to be paid though.
As the old saying goes, "Success has many Fathers, failure is an orphan". If you are working for an organisation you will never get the accolades / validation / respect you crave even if you are the very best at what you do and do the best job ever. There are always people all too willing to take the credit for the good times and when things screw up, they disappear like cockroaches under the fridge when a light is switched on. It's just life!
Maybe some family goal planning exercises will help you re-orientate your priorities and help you gain a new perspective on what triggers your emotional responses/reactions to work, racing, cars, holidays, biscuits etc. etc.
I don't really have anything to add to the excellent advice that's already been given . One thing that does occur to me is do you have a strong relationship with your wife . Having that support and understanding can really make all the difference in this type of situation . Good luck .
Have you done an IQ test in the past. Quite some of the things you says seem typical for(very) high) testers. Who have a different way of thinking and working you get too attached to your work/projet overthink over worry about things, don't manage to shut off/ stop worrying whilst most will be allright or is out of your hands.
Its a simplified way of saying but might be worth exploring
There's a newish growing thing in this space .- PQ... Positivity Quotient.
https://www.positiveintelligence.com/science/
Have a look at it to see if you can work out where the sources of frustration/negativity come from.
First off @Kryton57, let me congratulate you on being able to share like this. I know you've been the target of much stick in the past, usually when "banter" has just gone too far (mea culpa).
I do recognise some of your "symptoms", in particular the need for everything to be perfect, which results in over-planning and anxiety. I'm currently living with this and it prohibits me from even simple things like short bivvy trips. I wasn't always needing to have this level of control so I'm paying attention to this thread to see what I can get out of it to.
Another point you raised is your need for validation from others. I've experienced that too and I gradually weaned myself off it when I started to judge myself less harshly. In my experience there is always someone doing something better, harder, more rewarding than yourself and these are the folk you try to measure yourself against. The reality is that there are many, many more folk out there whose "achievements" will never match what you already have. You are looking up a pyramid where you are already close to the very top and trying to get up there rather than being happy where you are (I guess it's actually many pyramids).
Anyways, it's a viewpoint from someone else much less than "perfect" 😂
hofnar, you might be my new best friend if you're telling me I'm highly intellectual. I don't think I am but I am "different". Some examples; I "get" things, but I know for example how software works, what it does and how it helps people despite not being able to work it. I do mental maths in three's which apparent is a higher intellectual thing, have a very dry sense of humour which offends a lot of people, and my mental maths is quite good albeit I work things out randomly and quickly almost by accident. I'm a vey good word smith and very good with people in a professional capacity However.... I'm a socially awkward introvert, don't understand politics, am not clever at argumentative debate, have 5 c grade GSCE's because I can't study, and have the the diy capability of an angry gibbon with 25 fingers. I have strong (maybe too much?) work ethic as you say do look at myself as a "do-er". Also, leadership escapes me, I describe myself as a capable Lieutenant, a Commander Ryker or Nick Hueur often able to make those above me successful but never able to quite get there myself.
Have a look at it to see if you can work out where the sources of frustration/negativity come from.
Well I found one today, the 2 x what is possible Sales target which ensures I won't be earning half of my wages this coming year and changing me from sales director to new business rep as if by osmosis. I need to sound out others but this seems to be part of a grand cost savings plan. But I will read it, thanks.
Anyways, it’s a viewpoint from someone else much less than “perfect”
Thanks its good though. I was taken to one side by a neutral party in a fall out once, and this was explained as "not everyone is, or can be on the same rung of life ladder". Not sure why it hasn't come to mind for me lately.
Good lad kryton, it takes stones to admit you're struggling so just by crossing that rubicon you're making progress.
I'll give two bits of "advice", more observations really.
Re: you and your state of mind, you're right to want to do better and progress but that doesn't have to be money/work. Imagine if you put a solid 10-12 hours for just ONE day a week in to being Dad/Husband Kryton. (Difficult I know I'm done after about 20 minutes)
Secondly. Private Equity. They'll want their cheddar. And if theyre not getting through the anticipated channel they WILL get it via scorched earth asset stripping/grinding you into dust. I've seen close up it done to £2bn a year business which was left a smoking ruin. Thousands lost their jobs. Have one eye on the horizon.
Krypton your last post makes me think more in the same sense.
Many highly intelligent people don't see themselves as intelligent as they see/focus on the lackings and/or overthink things. Its far from a guarantee for good grades or a succesfull career as well. Or can explain poor grades but good work process. As many tend too run on talent too long, so never learn to learn in the standard way(learn by heart as a parrot) So when they need to further on its too late way harder too get.
Too strong work ethics, socially akward, just getting things, not getting leadership and so all goes in that direction.
I have started reading a book about it today but have read on this before. I would normally not share(as its often seen s bragging) but I have read on it cos I know I am. Normally I wouldn't say but none one here kno me so its fine. IMO life would be have been easier if I where not highly intelligent but then thats my personal case and opinion it can translate to some and many others but doesn't have to.
I am myself struggling with similar things I might help to know whats different and just now there are many others like you.
A quote I really like is you are not different or weird... There are just more of these normal one they are the norm cos there are more of they but that doesn't make the better than you or make you need or want to be more like the main crowd.
There is some overlay similar with Autism the Asperger variety. might be worth having a look at too.
IQ test should be quite easy and not too expensive(not really online as most are crap) Asperger is a lot harder and longer.
Question is is it worth it and do you really need to know or know exactly. It might be already worth quite a lot If you identify as one of those two or something others have mentionned. The knowing that others are like you/ similar can often be enough and as a way to embrace you beiing a bit different(like one can be different in many ways but doesn't necessarly mean less or better). Might just help you too understand yourself a bit better and focus on the points that are important for you and those around you to let go a bit more for example and make life a bit easier on yourself.
Note I am not a doctor or a health professional. But have seen people close to me go or going through the process of being tested as beining gifted and or autism Asperger. Am myself still/again on the journey of finding out, not sure if full test are worth the money and time. I guess knowing there are other people who are or work just a bit different in their head might already help a lot and help you some points to work on. Not really liking the expression work but English is not my first language points to focus on and make this a bit smoother easier to cope with or give it a place for yourself.
Private Equity. They’ll want their cheddar.
Yeah I get this, it’s my 3rd time around. It’s quite clear the cost saving measures have extended to reducing Sales commissions. Doing some mental number crunching / reading between the lines it’s clear that they’ve created an expectation of me as new business rep (hunter), whereas I’m employed as a Sales Director and am a natural account manager (farmer) all of which they know. Those in sales will understand the nuances. So, I have no accounts, three products of which I know one and that one isn’t fit for our purpose in a tier one client, and a target close to my old role in the market leader, yet with no pipeline to support it as a new entrant into a mature market. With annual leave, I’ve 9 months to make a miracle happen. I can’t afford to be doing Sales Director activities with a plan like that, and I think I need to make the Sales Director vs Sales Rep case clear to my manager as a semi protest/advanced defence against low performance in either expectation , make enough commissions to pay nexts years big bills E.g. family holiday, whilst looking for a new job in a non PE company.
@elshalimo unsurprisingly the test results were 15/85 toward the negative. A quick skim over the “Saboteurs” was intriguing, I’ll read more later.
Have you considered leaving sales? My experience of being close to it is that it would drive me crazy, and while you might find it stimulating I think it also has the potential to be very unrewarding in the long term as it's an endless project with no concrete endpoint/conclusion. Your last post is quite revealing as it's just a mash of buzzwords and business politics summing up to a very frustrating conclusion. That might be ok if you had the personality to leave it at work, at 5, and go home to your 'normal' life, but that's not you (too many hours, work at home, obsessive), so it will infect your whole life.
If it’s really as untenable as situation as you describe then why not walk? You won’t get any medals for sticking it out.
Have you considered leaving sales?
Ive a fair bit of thinking to do, and this would be one. I spent 20 years in professional services before so going back to that and managing a team with the added business knowledge I have could be good. It also appeals to me to take short term contracts into helping new sales / small business establish and grow may be rewarding.
why not walk?
My base pay is pretty good, and I’ve a family to support, so I’d prefer somewhere to go to first. I can make some extra commissions maybe up to £20k - not insignificant - before underperformance would start to become obvious so I think it’s best to do that to underpin the family bills next year.
First off @Kryton57, let me congratulate you on being able to share like this. I know you’ve been the target of much stick in the past, usually when “banter” has just gone too far (mea culpa).
Just to call this out, this isn’t bravery on my part. I’m being clear and honest deliberately because I need help. The title of the OP is indicative, I’m just getting body blow after body blow right now and even writing this tedious shit down helps. A problem shared etc…. I know as demonstrated there’s a lot of people with good and kind advice, so I was prepared to take some stick to find it.
Walking when you have a family and mortgage means having somewhere to walk to, preferarbly with greener grass. I've quit objectively good jobs and literally walked out of one but I didn't have an expensive lifestyle at the time. When other people are going to be impacted you don't just walk; you pack a bag, take a map and compass and have a destination.
When Madame and I decided that we wanted a change from the business we'd been running she worked on getting a new qualification and guaranteed job to go with it while I kept all the balls up in the air for the final years of the business.
On the other hand when single I sold anything saleable, resigned and put a passport in my pocket. But even that was planned to some extent, I'd spent a year brushing up my languages in my free time and bought a book on How to Work your Way around the World.
Those sitting pretty might not have noticed but the economy is currently shit for many businesses and the survivors will be those that adapt their models. Some will no doubt take liberties with their staff knowing the risk of losing them in a recession is low and even if they do recruitment won't be as hard as it was a few years back.
If you have to be a sales rep for a while, Kryton, be the very best one you can for as long as it takes to find a better alternative. In your position I'd be reading up on sales and marketting, and updating my CV/professional profiles rather than reading self-help books.
In my first post I said I didn't think this was the time for anything rash, the more information you've given us the more I'm convinced of that. Someone might make a decision for you one day but in the meantime you've got a job and enough to support your family; a good base to launch from, hang on in there till you can fly.
As for age, the problem is more the way others see you than how it impacts your performance.
Edit: crossed posts, you can ignore much of what I've posted as you're clearly doing it.
Edukator thanks, it helps even to get an opinion that validates my thinking.
In your position I’d be reading up on sales and marketting, and updating my CV/professional profiles rather than reading self-help books.
I do do that also, I'm one of these people that can read & digest 2-3 books in parallel.
Thinking this through I think it boils down to accepting it and keeping quiet until something new is found, or making a educated evidential protest with my line manager before carrying on to help protect myself from performance issues later down the line... before accepting it and carrying on.
@Kryton57 - all the advice and links above can be viewed as a set of tools in your newly extended mental toolkit to help you get through the current problems. Dip in and out of them as required but don't take them too literally and don't get hung up if you don't make rapid progress.
An alternate point of view is that you absolutely not be reading books on sales texhniques. You're already plenty good at it, and all you'll learn is more stuff you perhaps should be doing, and then you can worry you're not doing it. You need to learn to dissociate yourself from these abstract targets you are applying to yourself.
For those like me I found Romesh’s interview very good, especially at 22mins “dealing with the voice in my head” section:
you absolutely not be reading books on sales texhniques. You’re already plenty good at it, and all you’ll learn is more stuff you perhaps should be doing, and then you can worry you’re not doing it
This occurred for me for the self help / psych books also. Maybe get on with living day to day rather than procrastinating over these
Just an update really, so reorganising my weekend and a bit of luck has conspired to give me some rest /perspective.
I - politely - expressed my issues at work, my son returned from Japan, and I reorganised my weekend to reduce my bike training allowing lie ins, a bike ride with my son yesterday and time/cooking with my daughter today. It makes a big change from cramming in my weekends at pace like I usually do.
Together with the Daniel Talks Money "Richer than you think / signs you're doing well" video (not quite what the title suggest it is) and Diary of CEO episode with Johann Hari, I've "breathed out" and enjoyed my time with the family a lot more. I need now not to get back in a rut. There a saying in Sales - "Don't focus on the big number (the target) it'll eat you up. I'm guilt of that in reality and as an analogy for life - I need to continue to step off that train.
