[Closed] iPhone X

You know the whole wireless charging thing..

Presumably that means that now, instead of carrying round a little powerbank or USB cable to charge your phone up when going away for the weekend, you are now going to have to carry round a F-off big wireless charging pad in your bag?

Wirelessly charged phones have been around for ages. Every single one is also able to be charged with a wire.

Face recognition. It's going to be great on a cold day in a cold country when you have a scarf over your face.

does it still have pin code entry then? Didn't know that.

You moved from "bullshit" to "may have a point" quite quickly there.

does it still have pin code entry then? Didn't know that.

Every single one is also able to be charged with a wire.

Ah, but apple are on the case now... see headphone jacks as an example, USB ports on laptops as another 😉

Face recognition. It's going to be great on a cold day in a cold country when you have a scarf over your face.

I wonder if there's a way to remove the scarf?

It's rather clever really.

Release 8 and X at same time. 8 is barely different from anything already on the market, and X is MOAR shiny new new shiny. Hence, the iColytes will all have to buy X. Because, shiny.

Disclosure: I haven't watch the whole keynote.

The FaceID thing must be using some incredibly granular scanning to be able to do what they showed it doing. Being able to wrap a mask in detail over a face in realtime is extrodinary! And Mr Ives little showcase at the end showed a ladies face in lots of scenarios, that indicates a good intention to get this done right.

With this in mind, the map it builds of the owners face to enable unlocking must be very detailed and able to use a fairly low % of match to allow the unlock/athentcation to happen.

i.e. if you have sunnnies on, full pirate with eye patch, Zoro fetish outfit, its not too much of a worry because the map of the rest of the face is so detailed that it provides a good enough match.

As it's also a 3d map, I would imagine that the approach angle to the camera/scanner thing can be quite acute and still work.

This is all congecture of course until all the keen people get their real fisogs pressed to the screens.

Interesting Peter - and it got me thinking - is it *really* doing the sort of facial scanning that their little graphic demos show or is it really just a slightly more sophistimicated version of current facial recognition? It does smack a bit of Minority Report / Mission: Impossible to me and I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the reality isn't quite so sexy.

Some notes from a Grauniad journo who has actually used FaceID

[url= https://theoverspill.blog/2017/09/13/start-up-apple-pay-on-iphone-x-russias-fake-americans-yelp-accuses-google-and-more/#link3 ]https://theoverspill.blog/2017/09/13/start-up-apple-pay-on-iphone-x-russias-fake-americans-yelp-accuses-google-and-more/#link3[/url]

I’m pretty sure Ron wasn’t at the Apple event, so didn’t get hands-on time with the iPhone X. I was, and did. Apple Pay with facial recognition is a key question I’ve raised myself in the past, so asked for a demo.

The unlocking works at easy arm’s length; it’s not like Samsung’s formal version. It’s quick – probably as fast as the first-generation TouchID. For Apple Pay, you could double-click the side button while it’s in your pocket, pull it out, face unlock as you walk (towards a TfL terminal, say) and hold it to the reader. The pay system remains active for 60 seconds. Plus – an advantage – you don’t have to “end-hold” it, where it’s liable to fall or be knocked out of your hand; you’ll be holding it in your full hand grip.

Interesting Peter - and it got me thinking - is it *really* doing the sort of facial scanning that their little graphic demos show

Some notes from a Grauniad journo who has actually used FaceID

re FaceID and MTB.. what if I happen to wear a full face and goggles on the bike but need to stop to open my phone to check something? Presume i'll have to remove those to unlock the device? instead of just a glove for TouchID now.. potential annoyance for motorcyclists too? 😐

I wonder if there's a way to remove the scarf?

Of course, Mr Sarkypants, but the point is it's extra faff, and not necessary when using a finger print scanner. You do need to remove your gloves, but you've probably done this already to use the phone.

Presume i'll have to remove those to unlock the device?

No, you can just enter your passcode instead. Same as TouchID.

No, you can just enter your passcode instead. Same as TouchID.

Ah, of course. what a silly billy i am.

Of course, Mr Sarkypants, but the point is it's extra faff, and not necessary when using a finger print scanner.

Not for a scarf no but it is if you're wearing gloves even for the lock code.

You do need to remove your gloves, but you've probably done this already to use the phone.

So not a big step to remove a scarf or use the lock code then?

[i]So not a big step to remove a scarf or use the lock code then?[/i]

Fercrissake just go indoors wouldja

So not a big step to remove a scarf or use the lock code then?

Yeah, it's more work. We should be making things quicker and easier, not more faffy. Doesn't sound great, so far, but we'll see if the market likes it or not.

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I wear gloves much more often than I wear a scarf, taking one off to unlock my phone has never seemed the ordeal that pulling down a scarf is being represented as.

FaceID people where asking about beards earlier but Apple said thr tech kearns and adjusts, sonif you start growing a beard / putting on weight it learns your face is changing and adapts

I imagine it'll be like the face scanners at passport control no? On my passport I haven't a beard but I still get through now even with my lustrous mane...

I wear gloves much more often than I wear a scarf, taking one off to unlock my phone has never seemed the ordeal that pulling down a scarf is being represented as.

Oh for goodness' sake!

Of course it's not being presented as an ordeal. I am talking about the ergonomics of something you do dozens of times a day and personally, I like that to be as near to instant as possible.

There's no doubt it'll work. The question is whether or not it'll be better than a fingerprint reader.

The question is whether or not it'll be better than a fingerprint reader.

for use on a desktop/laptop there's no question it'll be better than a fingerprint reader IMO

Agree. Windows Hello is great in that application.

But we are talking about phones aren't we? And they have removed the fingerprint scanner from the phones, so it's this or a pin, isn't it?

Makes me lol the way everyone queues up to poor scorn on anything new instead of showing a little imagination/optimism.

To me faceID seems a viable option, along with passcode it's a similar process as now with the fingerprintID and passcode.

The action to hold the phone up to fingerprintID currently means I'm 99% of the time looking into the phone as is, this new option means I've no need to bother wiggling the phone around to get my thumb in the "correct" position. Also, on access using fingerprintID as now, I'd say 60% of the time it fails to recognise my thumbprint and I have to passcode myself in anyway.

So in my conclusion, it'll take me about 5 mins to get used to faceID UI and probably have similar access issues and have to passcode myself in as I do now.

No real bother.

I'm all for the Emoji AR animations in texts me 😆

On my Samsung the home button is the scanner. So I press home to wake it up, and it also magically unlocks.

The action to hold the phone up to fingerprintID currently means I'm 99% of the time looking into the phone as is, this new option means I've no need to bother wiggling the phone around to get my thumb in the "correct" position. Also, on access using fingerprintID as now, I'd say 60% of the time it fails to recognise my thumbprint and I have to passcode myself in anyway.

Maybe I've just got cake all over my thumbs 😆

in somewhere crowded like the underground not having to look at your phone to use it would be good.

You will be able to take a call and/or use siri for functions that do not require unlocking just as you do now, exactly how many other functions of a smart phone are there that doesn't require you to look at the screen.

In that case the Apple fingerprint thing sounds crap in comparison to others then...

The only problems I have had with apple's fingerprint scanner (other than wearing gloves) is if my hands are a bit wet, ie mid workout, but I just wipe my thumb on my shorts and then it works.

There are as many if not more potential problems with a thumb reader as their are with face recognition if both are done to a decent standard. But face recognition is not something that makes me want to upgrade.

fairly easy for say the police to stick the phone in front of your face and POW it opens

whereas now you can refuse to use the fingerprint scanner or passcode to unlock your phone there is no legal protection to having the phone put vaguely in front of your face

https://tfl.gov.uk/fares-and-payments/contactless/other-methods-of-contactless-payment/apple-pay
The article was specifically talking about using apple pay for the barriers on the underground and stuff like that.

So when do we think the 'deals' will start to come out?

My out of contract 6 doesn't have enough memory, and the battery is dying.

So I'm thinking of a 7 which will hopefully become cheaper. Really cant see what more I would get from an 8?

I would go for the SE, but if I am going to start a new contract, I may as well have waterproof.

in somewhere crowded like the underground not having to look at your phone to use it would be good.

fairly easy for say the police to stick the phone in front of your face and POW it opens

whereas now you can refuse to use the fingerprint scanner or passcode to unlock your phone there is no legal protection to having the phone put vaguely in front of your face

I think there is a potential problem there, one that isn't just about technology, but about privacy rights under law and authoritarian process. But I would like to see how technology could protect the individual rights in that circumstance.

[i]not having to look at your phone to use it would be good[/i]

What would you be using your phone for where you don't look at it??

Of course it's not being presented as an ordeal. I am talking about the ergonomics of something you do dozens of times a day and personally, I like that to be as near to instant as possible.

Do you wear a scarf all day?

What would you be using your phone for where you don't look at it??

bikebouy: sounds like you need to set up TouchID again. I have thumb and forefinger of both hands registered and can't say I ever have much bother getting it to work. Most of the time it unlocks before I've even thought about it.

What would you be using your phone for where you don't look at it??

Driving is the obvious one for me. Siri won't read out incoming text messages unless the phone is unlocked. Having TouchID means I can unlock it without even looking at my phone.

Paying for stuff, unlock tap and go

I am not sure where you see the extra delay for face recognition instead of a thumb reader in that process.

Of course it's not being presented as an ordeal. I am talking about the ergonomics of something you do dozens of times a day and personally, I like that to be as near to instant as possible.

Yes it does well certainly with CarPlay is does.

Having TouchID means I can unlock it without even looking at my phone.

You're driving why are you touching your phone?

I am not sure where you see the extra delay for face recognition instead of a thumb reader in that process.

fairly easy for say the police to stick the phone in front of your face and POW it opens

whereas now you can refuse to use the fingerprint scanner or passcode to unlock your phone there is no legal protection to having the phone put vaguely in front of your face

They've introduced a new "anti-police" feature where if you tap the power button 6 times quickly it disables FaceID and wont open anything without passcode.

Link:
https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/17/16161758/ios-11-touch-id-disable-emergency-services-lock

100% pointless phone and I'll be laughing (on the inside) at anyone that gets one over the next 18month until #11 comes out and then I'll repeat the process....