Derbyshire police are looking for an army of volunteers to wash their cars, put up posters and complete their paperwork.
Too busy eating Doughnuts maybe?
Volunteers will be asked to take messages, arrange meetings, take minutes and update computer records.Others will help by distributing leaflets, putting up posters, washing cars [b]or doing other manual tasks [/b]which would previously have been paid.
I'm volunteering for that beating a confession out of the suspect task. 😈
Nothing like sacking all your paid staff and then realising you needed them after all.
Perhaps they could ask their new police commissioner to muck in? He'll be on a nice wedge.
[i]wash your Local bobbies police car & paperwork [/i]
Isn't washing paperwork what they do following a disaster at a football stadium - make sure they come out with no stains?
I know that some of what is being said here is tongue-in-cheek, but I have to take issue with the cynicism.
Yes, there is a scandal surrounding what police did a couple of decades ago in one region, and there will probably be others; but really, the police exist to serve us, and deserve our support.
[/earnest mode]
Yes, there is a scandal surrounding what police did a couple of decades ago in one region, and there will probably be others; but really, the police exist to serve us, and deserve our support.
I totally agree. I remember talking to a friend some years before the event you talk about that we shouldn't sully the name of the West Mids serious crime squad for their hard work as it was just one region, etc.
I ****ing love the big society.
Isn't washing paperwork what they do following a disaster at a football stadium - make sure they come out with no stains?
BOOM! SATIRE!
Could they ask the early retirees to do it? Or the ones signed off with stress, surely it's not stressful washing a car?
If I drive around in a works van it's my job to keep it clean and tidy, something wrong with doing it little and often?
I'm sure Andrew Mitchell could volunteer.
but I have to take issue with the cynicism.
Take issue all you want!
The Police are not immune to criticism, though I`m sure many would rather act as state employed bullies!
There are enough 55 y/o retired coppers on a full pension who'll have time - maybe they could 'help'?
@cheekyboy: Criticism and cynicism are not the same thing.
Others will help by distributing leaflets, putting up posters, washing cars or doing other manual tasks which would previously have been paid.
Dont they have captive prisoners who could do that for them, or the drunks ,first thing in the morning.
Others will help by distributing leaflets, putting up posters, washing cars or doing other manual tasks which would previously have been paid.
Dont they have captive prisoners who could do that for them, or the drunks ,first thing in the morning.
Bah, you lot call yourselves tories ?! 🙄
Clearly, we must make the unemployed do it
the police exist to serve usyep that blind man was just crying out for a tazer, it's a new aid for the visually impaired you know.
and
Ian Tomlinson just really wanted a little sleep on the pavement and the nice PC Harwood was just helping him to lie down and get comfortable 😆
IMO the Police deserve 98% (precisely) of the criticism and cynicism that is directed their way - Hillsborough, the newspaper vendor, Birmingham Six, Stephen Lawrence and so on and on. They do get some tough gigs but mostly they are inherent bullies, petrol heads, lazy and anti cyclist.
They are the last unreformed and reconstructed organisation in the UK. Even politicians have been brought down a peg or two but not the boys in blue. Too much early retirement, too much overtime, too much pension entitlement. Too little accountability, too little brain power, too little care.
If the Torygraph is criticizing them then it really must have got bad.
hh45, just out of interest, what is your job?
Maybe you've not replied because you have gone to bed. I'm at work in 45 minutes so a bit of time to kill, might as well waste it here.
I was bullied at school, hate cars, would like to be lazy but that is not an option these days, and I am a cyclist, on and off road. I appreciate most people have had a bad experience with a cock of an officer who was a bit rude about them not wearing a seatbelt, but I have a similar experience with the odd teacher each time |I go to my son's parent teacher evening or take him to the doctors. Not all teachers or doctors are crap, just the odd one.
Maybe I am lucky and will be considered to be in your acceptable 2%.
Sorry, forgot to mention, I am police. Just got the 9 o levels and 3 A levels so am considered a bit of a thicky amongst most of my colleagues who have degrees these days.
And breeeeaaaath
And i have washed my own police car lazily for 19 years now
langylad, I'd like to think anyone with half a brain would recognise that there are some fabulous intelligent hard-working honest Police people out there, possibly a great many of them.
Just as there are amazingly talented and dedicated NHS staff out there.
But both our Police Services and the NHS get justified criticism because as a whole they are pretty damn poor.
Qualifying statement: My partners late father was a Policeman, including IRA years Bomb Squad and subsequently Royal Protection Officer. She works for the NHS. Both would be the first to say their respective organisations are deeply troubled and in urgent need of overhaul.
Incidentally, and I'd be surprised if you didn't already know this, no qualifications are required to join the Police Service, and many criminal convictions (including firearms related ones) are acceptable.
What has hh45 job got to do with the validity of his opinion?
Are you saying only people with a job you approve aof re entitled to express an opinion on the Police?
Incidentally, and I'd be surprised if you didn't already know this, no qualifications are required to join the Police Service, and many criminal convictions (including firearms related ones) are acceptable.
As a serving Police Constable I have very mixed feelings over criminal convictions; to say that anybody with a criminal conviction is not allowed to serve is akin to saying that I do not believe people can change or be reformed, which in turn undermines the whole criminal justice system. However, seeing as many of the criminals I come into contact with are generally career criminals who consider prison to be an occupational hazard, I do wonder...
With regard to qualifications, what are people's thoughts on this? I personally think its a non-issue; it's just as easy to have a rude, aggressive, violent, sulky, bully-boy graduate as it is to have a polite, efficient, hard-working, sensitive, empathetic person without any academic qualifications. The Police service is supposed to reflect the society that it serves. Do all your neighbours have degrees? Why should the Police?
For what it's worth, 4 out of 8 on my shift have degree or post-grad' qualifications with a further 2 having A-levels and the others have very good professional qualifications gained prior to joining. This is pretty much reflected throughout my dept. again, I don't think qualifications have any bearing on being a good Police Constable, but seemingly the Government do, and this is the only reason it is currently being pointed up. The current bunch are trying their damnedest to portray us as a bunch of blue-collar thugs, & that the only way to change us is to introduce graduate entrance and an 'officer class', similar to the military.
The current bunch are trying their damnedest to portray us as a bunch of blue-collar thugs, & that the only way to change us is to introduce graduate entrance and an 'officer class', similar to the military.
Well prove them wrong then, if you want to gain, retain or improve your public image why not start start policing from within, sort out your own bad apples, what really irks me is when the Police refer to the public as civilians the Police are civilians, only the armed services are non civilians.
what really irks me is when the Police refer to the public as civilians the Police are civilians, only the armed services are non civilians.
Whether it irks you or not, dictionaries would disagree. Police constables are not civilians; there may be civilian members of the Police Service, but serving officers are not.
Whether it irks you or not, dictionaries would disagree. Police constables are not civilians; there may be civilian members of the Police Service, but serving officers are not.
Consider yourself well and truly castigated and put in your place, cheekyboy.
Consider yourself well and truly castigated and put in your place, cheekyboy.
Yes, quite, and don't forget to wax the Volvo or its a night down the cells with the big white bunny rabbit.
They are the last unreformed and reconstructed organisation in the UK. Too much early retirement, too much overtime, too much pension entitlement. Too little accountability, too little brain power, too little care.If the Torygraph is criticizing them then it really must have got bad.
The torygraph is towing the tory line. The tories have always hated the police service and had planned to implement the Sheehy Enquiry reforms (which the 'independent' Winsor review mirrors, along with a Cameron speech from before they took power). However, the miners went on strike, and Thatcher's tories realised the police would be crucial in helping them break a powerful union, so the reforms slid onto the back burner.
The police has been under constant reform in the 10 years Ive been in. Our "gold plated" pensions always cost us 11% gross, which is increasing to 13+%, how does that compare with other private and public sector pensions?
Too much overtime? I work it because I have to not because I wanted to. I'd rather have more officers and a better quality of life, overtime is a cheap way for an organisation to manage resilience and staffing in a service/industry with variable/unpredictable demand.
Too little brain power? Ive got a PhD and I'm not the only one in my nick.
too little accountability?
?why not start start policing from within, sort out your own bad apples,
I spent 2 years on a dept that deployed the same "covert" techniques on suspected criminal coppers that we use on serious organised crime.
This was my first job on the team
and my very last job on that team led to a copper going to prison.
http://chesham.buckinghamshireadvertiser.co.uk/2011/05/police-officer-jailed-over-chi.html
what really irks me is when the Police refer to the public as civilians the Police are civilians, only the armed services are non civilians
Our employment status is unique and we are bound by regulations that rule our lives (on or off duty). We dont have a contract, we hold a sworn office. I have to ask for permission from my chief officer to move house. I can lose my job for an act committed off-duty that is not criminal.
The OPs complaint is thanks to this governments cuts and filling the void with volunteers and the police service is not the only service being affected (look at the cuts in the regular armed forces and expansion and re-naming of the T.A). The impact of cuts on police is two-fold; not only are we being cut, we are catching what falls through the gaps in other (cut) services. A substantial portion of patrol officers time in my area is taken up dealing with people with mental health problems who would be better served by social/medical/mental health organisations.
Brilliant@wwaswas
SaxonRider et al OK That was an isolated incident involving over 100 officers not one of which manned up and which the police force coerced to keep covered up for 23 years.
Additionally we could kill people walking through demonstrations for them just like Ian Tomlinson, didn't Simon Harwood get off with that after his previous chequered disciplinary record.
Sean Price a senior police officer fired this month for shenanigans?
Ali Dizaei another senior officer fired.
OK so they are all isolated incidents but it strikes me there are far too many isolated incidents that these paid corrupt thugs get away with.
I was actually with a barrister today who simply stated that I would be astonished by the amount of times the police perjure themselves in court. I probably wouldn't actually.
I also appreciate there are many many good police. However when you see these things, notably Hillsborough and Ian Tomlinson it is apparent that there are not enough good officers and the levels that some will go to within the police to protect themselves. Or in the case of Mr Tomlinson the actual mechanisms to deal with those bad apples are completely ineffective.
As I have said here previously I want to be an advocate of the police force however at times you do make it difficult. I do not believe its an education thing but more a duty to uphold the office you have chosen. There are too many lazy thugs in the force. Too many officers on the sick etc. Your job is difficult as the front line of our criminal justice system. Often frustrating when that justice system lets you down. But when it does it also lets the public down.
Reform yourselves from within and people may start to believe in you.
I hope all of the officers here are above reproach and trust them to work hard in a difficult environment. BUT there do seem to be far to many bad apples and examples of closing ranks.
In fact the whole police and justice system needs reform from the police force through the IPCC to the court system.
OK so they are all isolated incidents but it strikes me there are far too many isolated incidents that these paid corrupt thugs get away with.
That's exactly the problem, though - the scandals are scandals precisely because they aren't isolated incidents but manifestations of standard practice and consistent institutional failure. A cop assaulting a newspaper vendor out of the blue is an isolated incident; a cop whose repeated violence and poor disciplinary record is allowed to slide because of management complicity and negligence culminates in him battering a newspaper vendor and causing his death is the outcome of practice and institutional failure. A detective that fits up a robber once is an isolated incident; a whole squad that does it repeatedly over an extended period isn't. The "few bad apples" line just can't cut it in an extremely hierarchical institution that spends so much time and effort institutionalizing the people who work within it!
I say let them drive around in dirty cars, helps go with their filthy piggy demeanour.
Lot of late night replies from serving bobbies, hope there not at work?
shouldn't they be washing cars or doing paperwork?
Better still how about venturing outside & looking for some crims?
Ooh that means the car may get dirty & more paperwork 🙂
What's next in the big society, lay off all the front line staff and then ask for volunteers for that, then nurses, then doctors......
Pik n Mix - Member
I say let them drive around in dirty cars, helps go with their filthy piggy demeanour.
LOL
a cop whose repeated violence and poor disciplinary record is allowed to slide because of management complicity and negligence culminates in him battering a newspaper vendor and causing his death is the outcome of practice and institutional failure.
100% agree, the MET was complicit in Ian's murder.
A detective that fits up a robber once is an isolated incident; a whole squad that does it repeatedly over an extended period isn't.
Anyone remember the West Midlands Serious Crime Squad? They spend 10 years fitting up innocent people for a whole host of crimes. Took a load of bribes and wasted millions in legal fees with huge lengthy appeals before all suddenly retiring on huge pensions.....
surely tesco could offer free use of their £2 car washes for emergency vehicles that'll fit as a big PR gesture?
I think that the vast majority of Police officers do a difficult job well.
Most of their work appears to be dealing with the car crash lives of their 'regulars', herding people behaving like drunken toddlers around on a Friday night or dealing with the people at the most difficult times of their lives as they are victims of crime or accidents.
There does *appear* to be a culture of senior officers protecting 'the service' above all other priorities but I can see that this is partly down to pressure from below and also a result of wanting to appear almost infallible.
There will always be mistakes - like any service organisation (which is in essence what they are) it's how those mistakes are dealt with. It appears that, too often, this is where the Police let themselves down.
Note: I am not a police officer although my sister is a Chief Inspector and District Commander. She previously spent a number of years working in child protection as a sargeant and DI and, frankly whilst it's not a job I'd want anyone to have to do, she did it well and I'd like to think helped some children avoid or escape horrendous situations.
And there was that police officer who was convicted of forgery and drugs offences but allowed to carry on working and then killed someone when on duty.
Oh my bad he was a doctor - are they / the NHS worse than coppers? 😉
And there was that police officer who was convicted of forgery and drugs offences but allowed to carry on working and then killed someone when on duty.Oh my bad he was a doctor - are they / the NHS worse than coppers?
Dredging your unreliable memory for sensationalist cases that turn out to be completely irrelevant wont really help this debate...but given where we are, why let that stop you?
Dredging your unreliable memory for sensationalist cases that turn out to be completely irrelevant wont really help this debate...but given where we are, why let that stop you?
I was just teasing but given you sanctimonious stance I'll bite. He was convicted of offences and allowed to carry on his duties and then used his role to kill people. Obviously he was a rotten apple but some people (not me i was teasing) might say as he is a doctor we can use the police bashing logic - no such thing a s rotten apple, all are tainted and protected by their employers to extrapulate that all doctors are the same. My memories fine by the way.
The number of police in the UK is approximately 130000. Compared to the NHS at 1.3 million or any other large UK based organisation the number of "bad apples" would appear disproportionate.
Its the lengths and depths that the police appear to go to in order to protect themselves and their colleagues that makes the public feel we are being let down.
I recognise that the justice system is not the police and it is there where convictions are meeted out but take the example on here of the guy that recovered his bike. His case was closed without him being notified therefore he felt let down.
Now as I said above convictions are dealt with in the courts and we can't expect every scrote to be locked up. I also believe that government targets on police to have a clear up rate of x% do not help where I believe small convictions keep the "conviction rate" artificially high when if the police could concentrate on solving crime that would make a difference in the public eye would be considerably more beneficial overall.
I guess this is simply another part of broken Britain. An ineffective and apparently troubled police force, a health service that cant cope with the requirements of its customers. A central government full of stupid ideas.
some people (not me i was teasing) might say as he is a doctor we can use the police bashing logic
Ok then. Great tease that...so if I were to find out what you did for a living(just as a tease) then dredge the internet for an example of someone in your profession in trouble with the law - because lets face it I'd really have to want to find this out, as very few jobs/professions are covered as sensationally by our wonderful free-press than policing.
Then if I couldn't find another example in your field - I could either make one up, or choose an example completely unrelated as well as completely irrelevant to your job and use that as an argument to prove that the original wrongdoing I mentioned was emblematic of systematic wrongdoing in your profession.
I get it now. Carry on...
I've dealt with Derbyshire and Cheshire Constabularies as part of my job. From an organisational/ management perspective I'd say they are both good/ very good. Their hearts are in the right place, they see the over-riding priorities, they both spend their (our) cash pretty carefully I'd say.
If Derbyshire want to try to tap into Cameroon's big society then, why not? If there are volunteers out there who are willing to help then more power to them.
I'd hope that one of the benefits of the cutbacks will be a breaking down of the 'them and us' division between the public sector/ public servants and the wider public. Derbyshire Police appealing to our better natures is an example of this I think.
If Derbyshire want to try to tap into Cameroon's big society then, why not? If there are volunteers out there who are willing to help then more power to them.
I doubt they want to, but they are being forced to try 'innovative approaches' because they are not being funded sufficiently. IME they will spend at least as much time and money organising/managing the volunteers as they would have done employing people though.
