Our two girls, 7 and 5, started at girls brigade back in about may and love it. It's super conveniently at the end of the street too so all good, except they've been struggling for numbers as they build back post covid. At the young age group they are combined with the boys and are now getting about a dozen kids reach week. Fun but I'm sure they could do many more things with a bigger group.
Now the eldest has turned 7 we've also found a local brownie group and she went last night and had the biggest grin on her face at the end when I collected her, so again all good.. except she told me there were only 6 girls there
Just wondering if this is just a local problem or are brownies, cubs, girls brigade etc etc all struggling to build back post covid? Or is it a seasonal thing? Will numbers increase now schools are back and winter nights are starting to draw in?
We've been telling other parents of school friends about the groups and will continue as our girls love it despite the small size, but I do hope they grow back bigger packs.
3 things I've noticed -
1 - Numbers do seem to be down on a lot of things...I think people have remembered how pleasant not dashing about like blue-bottomed flies feels like and things have been rationalised a bit.
2 - At the same time, there are also lots of clubs and things available as well and you can only attend one at a time so perhaps more choices mean fewer faces.
3 - Cost of living is also hitting a lot of people/families so not all activities are being done either.
I think things go in waves so the quiet stuff just now will get a bit busier again at some point then level off and either reduce or have another intake.
All my own observations and suspect it won't be the same for everyone else..
Half the problem is it's seen as cheap child care. It's rare that parents want to help out with the packs and therefore ratios take a hit. Lack of young leaders coming through to help out is also a problem. My wifes been a leader for over 20 years now and there's been a decline in parents willing to help or get involved. A pack can only be run with volunteers.
There can be a cross over depending on kids moving up to guides, or if none are moving up from Rainbows. Also bear in mind that this may have been the first week back from summer holidays so numbers may increase over the next few weeks.
If there's a poor leadership group this can have a knock on effect if the kids aren't engaged, also new badgework is extremely involved and organising isn't just a couple of hours a week, there's a lot of work behind the scenes particularly for volunteers.
Kids got out of the habit of clubs during Covid, and sports clubs in particular, and stopped coming through the system.
That said - local scouts and brownies in Stirling are over-subscribed and MrsSC now leads a new Scouts group.
There's always been a shuffling around of numbers but lack of volunteers is a real problem.
Eldest went to Rainbows/Brownies pre-Covid but hasn't returned. Too many other clubs/activities she's more interested in. Probably not helped by her other activities continuing in some form throughout Covid, or restarting far sooner than the Brownies: even dance classes managed via Zoom, but there was nothing - not even any communication - from our local Brownies group. Just a total lack of engagement, I'm trying not to be too critical as they're all volunteers at the end of the day
Half the problem is it’s seen as cheap child care.
^ Very much this. Mrs a11y and me are both volunteers with local clubs: MTBing for me, swimming for her, and somehow got roped into officiating/timekeeping with the swimming club too (all in my "whites"...). Our view is clubs won't exist for our kids if folk don't volunteer, so we'll do what we can within reason. Definitely in the minority though - many parents bugger off as soon as they can at sessions.
Same thoughts from me as @a11y and it is being seen a lot more as well - kids dropped off as the parents are wheelspinning out the car park! (slight exaggeration but it isn't far off in some cases)
Ooooh, that all sounds a bit worrying. Fingers crossed it improves, and at the end of the day my kids are getting fun currently so I'm happy, but know they could do much more with a bigger pack so fingers crossed it grows.
I went to the Boys Brigade for a few years as a yoof. Thursday evenings were Ok, an evening spent running about and often a tuck shop. I distinctly remember one function however when we were sat in the church. The Minister was reading from the bible in one hand and had a sword in the other. I left pretty shortly after...
@neilnevill - they might be looking for some extra helpers, is it something you can do to help? Depends what else you have on whilst they are in the clubs, but I'm sure the packs would appreciate the offer of an extra pair of hands if it was something you could assist with.
Indeed, my wife and I just went in a place we can commit to anything at the moment though, various things life is throwing at us. were things different I'd try helping.
Our daughter has just moved from Cubs to Scouts, they lost a few cubs over lockdowns when they didn't like the Zoom meetings as and haven't returned. Lack of leaders has always been an issue, quite a few left during Covid as well.
Both me and my wife were scout / explores leaders for 10 years but the behaviour did it for both of us, I had much less tolerance of other's badly behaved kids once we had one of our own!
My wife and I are running a family camp for the scout group this weekend, the ruse being parents need a DBS check. Once they're cleared they become eligible to come and help run evenings, perhaps even becoming a leader 😉
Understood and it is similar for many people, but I thought I'd ask just in case you hadn't considered it yourself.
I enjoyed the 'relaxed' time during the pandemic, but it convinced me that for my own things, I'm just an anti-social person so was quite happy being out there on my own. Once the things could restart I was straight back in to getting some club rides sorted and back to coaching as I enjoy both, but I have noticed how busy I was before the pandemic - several things (all bike-related - trailbuilding, organising club rides, organising social rides and coaching) as well as taxiing for a teenager - suddenly things got very busy again!
Sorry awful typing on the phone! I meant to say, wife and I just aren't in a place where we can commit to things currently. I think your managed to get the gist, despite the awful typing!
Wife's original Guide unit dipped after Covid toothed point of being almost wound up. Numbers now recovered.
She's just set up a second Guide unit closer to home - only 4-5 the first week but Brownies moving upstairs Christmas will bolster it.
I'm involved with Scouts - nationally and at District level numbers fell by a third after Covid but recovering now.
Biggest issue is leaders that have been lost, many having done many years saw Vovid as the time to take a well earned step back. Not just unit leaders, but background committee roles. I wouldn't want to be a unit leader, but sit on 4 group and District committees,
Anyone interested in supporting any youth organisations with experience in finance, management, estates, IT/website, ease contact your local youth/sports club and see if they could use your ability.
My wife and I are running a family camp for the scout group this weekend, the ruse being parents need a DBS check. Once they’re cleared they become eligible to come and help run evenings, perhaps even becoming a leader 😉
A familiar tale when new leaders come up before my AAC committee 🤣
Boys Brigade here - we have gone from 100 boys a week to maybe 30.
I, and many others, have given up the volunteering.
Families seem less committed and less interested than before.
And we too are feeling the OTT rules about officers and PVG/DBS checks. We have head office asking that every granny on coffee morning has a PVG/DBS....and every single time we meet boys that there are two of us, and one is an officer not just a PVG/DBS volunteer. So we just doubled the number of volunteers needed to give up a weekend for DofE. And yet head office are happy for me to sleep in a room directly connected with the boys bedroom at their outdoor centre...
I have volunteered for 9 years - and won't be next year. I have done my turn - both some other parents need to help, and someone at head office needs to know the ridiculousness of some of the 'rules'.
Our local beavers/cubs/scouts are over-subscribed with long waiting lists, getting and retaining sufficient leaders is the big problem. It was looking like both the beaver colony and the scout troop my respective kids go to would have to close as there simply wasn't enough adults.
Last night was my first session as a beaver colony assistant.
My sons Beaver group continued through Covid with zoom meetings every week and it was great for him as it gave him some interaction other than his Mum and I during Covid. I was really impressed the leaders kept it going this way as it was such hard work trying to run it on Zoom.
We got more involved in helping him and ended up doing lots of badges with him in our spare time/weekend sending whatsapp messages with videos of him doing stuff and he ended up getting every single beaver activity badge.
He got invested at Cubs last night and they gave him a book of all the cub badges so we will start work on those as well.
The group is really well run, they have lots of leaders and plenty of kids attending. They have just started a squirrel colony as well (4-6 years old). I appreciate how lucky we are and how much he enjoys it.
Involved in Bristol scouting and all our groups local are oversubscribed, with lack of leaders (not just parents helping occasionally) being the limiting factor on provision.
Aha! I'd forgotten beavers, that's cubs/scouts but younger and mixed isn't it... And yes it seems the scout hut a couple of streets away has a beaver group(pack ? Colony? ) We shall try they also.
Our experience is that Brownies / Guides does seem to have been more cautious in their return to normality, whereas cubs and scouts seem to have been a bit less so. Whether that's a national or locally defined ruling I don't know, but last night was the first time at Guides that we were allowed in the room to collect out children.
We had been told that our daughter would end up on a waiting list for both Guides and Scouts, but she's going straight in. Both troops seem busy enough but no waiting list.
I’d forgotten beavers, that’s cubs/scouts but younger and mixed isn’t it
6-8 years old and mixed. But cubs and scouts are mixed too.
We're not post Covid. It's still out there and people are still testing positive.
Ours beavers/cubs/scouts/explorers are pretty much full.
We lost a few scouts over covid, but have been building up since we started back in earnest last year. Both our groups troops have c20-25 scouts and we’ve had a few join who hadn’t been cubs.
The cub packs stayed fairly constant, any that left were replaced by ones on the waiting list as they were over subscribed.
Our beavers are over subscribed too as we only have one colony so any that dropped out made way for those waiting.
We’ve also had a few new leaders join up too.
Brownies / Guides does seem to have been more cautious in their return to normality
Think their default setting is cautious. They’ve only recently allowed girls to do Tomahawk throwing as an activity.
Think their default setting is cautious. They’ve only recently allowed girls to do Tomahawk throwing as an activity.
Big issue for any girls wanting more adventurous stuff, and why many go to Scouting I suspect.
In the early days of Guiding there was an aircraft mechanics badge ffs, Guides helped with humanitarian work in Europe after WW2 (if you get to chat to any of the few still remaining, they are incredible ladies) but culturally it seemed to go all jolly hockey sticks after that.
MrsSteve has led combined County Scout and Guide trips abroad and the risk assessments have to be lowered to the Guiding level, which socks. Seems to be a legacy of older ladies at all levels of Guiding with no experience or desire to offer more exciting activities, slowly being edged out by younger more adventurous souls.
Waves @CSB from 26th Scouts!
It’s a well run and well attended.
Just started a third scout troop.
Tricky thing is gaps in age groups and lack of experience in the ranks of kids. Nothing that won’t sort itself out in the end though.
Always a struggle finding leaders in Cubs and beavers. Mrsdts and I having both done a fair bit.
I’m lucky, my sister and her partner are both Scout leaders, so the last thing they want is me getting involved! Happy to help in any other way though.
Big issue for any girls wanting more adventurous stuff, and why many go to Scouting I suspect.
We recruited a few from a village fair that we had a tomahawk range at. When they found out that guides didn’t run that activity they transferred.
Both our troops are c50/50 split- on summer camp at Dorset this year we went to Bovington Museum. The girls were just as engaged with it as the boys.
Our Scouts went from 18-20 ish before covid, down to 3 (or 4, now - a new one turned up this week).
We had an informal meeting just over a year ago with our "new exec" chair and treasurer... and have heard exactly zero from them since. Area is not much better.
We didn't run anything over the lockdowns - where some people had a relaxing time on furlough, the other leader and my jobs went into hyperdrive - I barely spent any time awake with my family for the first 3 or 4 months. So that won't have helped, but certainly doesn't explain all of it.
My wife works in the third sector, and she says there are reports left right and centre of community groups folding post-covid, as members and organisers have (presumably) found other ways to spend their time.
Keep pushing the word-of-mouth, please, folks about your local groups - it's usually the best way to keep them going 🙂
Back to normal with good numbers in most groups here for Girl Guiding. Mrsmidlfe runs a Brownie unit and is district commissioner too. Says numbers decent across the age ranges, packed in some. Also notes the younger ones coming in to Brownies and Rainbows seem less able and social than pre C cohorts, the missed school time quite noticeable.
*#£&!!!! Somewhat deflated/frustrated. Beaver group that's under 5 mins walk away is full, won't put my daughter on the waiting list, only putting under 6 yo on the wait list, and refuse to put her on the wait list for cubs as all places are reserved for the Beavers. So if you're not on the list before 6yo you aren't joining that scout group. That feels a bit weird tbh but I've stuck my 5yo down on the list.
I'll investigate the next nearest but family circumstances would make it tough to get her to.
*&+£#&, I feel a bad parent now, she's missed out on other stuff (not our fault) and now I've been slow she doesn't even get to try our local scout group, which looks pretty good. Sometimes I think I'm doing ok at parenting, and then sometimes I don't.
Offer to help, see if they can get another pack/colony started?
Edit, it’s not as scary as it first seems and us very rewarding. Beavers easier than Cubs btw.
Cub leader here
Numbers still up but we ran a full zoom programme thru covid
The waiting list in our district is over 100kids
The reason is that there just aren't enough leaders volunteering
And since austerity effectively ended council run youth clubs there's little else, for £2.50 a night scouting offers fantastic vfm for your kids
It's hard work, but it's only a few hours a week and it is fun & rewarding @neilnevil volunteer as a leader and you should be able to get your kids to jump the queue
As above, we are shameless in our favouritism to new members whose parents are willing to step up. Have to be for survival!
It's the sort of thing I'd love to do.... And introduce kids to some of the things I've loved, rock climbing, cycling, hiking, camping, football, science, engineering...I think I could offer a good few fun things and enjoy it. As said though, currently family circumstances are tough so my horizons, my focus, is necessarily short.
That's the odd thing, from this scout group's website is clear they are very short on leaders/volunteers of all kinds so my assumption would be were they to get another volunteer or two they could/would expand the pack.... But they refuse to run a wait list, I dunno, I'm probably just tired and grumpy but my spidey-sense says I'm not getting the whole picture.
And I'd expected to see open nepotism and pleas for assistance in the emails I got, why not, win win for all if it gets another volunteer. No. Nothing, nada. It felt like.,.
[Insert shutters being closed gif here]
Again, also shameless nepotism in our groups 🤣
Also notes the younger ones coming in to Brownies and Rainbows seem less able and social than pre C cohorts, the missed school time quite noticeable.
Seems to be a big issue in the Cub/Scout transition, current Year 8/9 pupils missed a lot of things like Year 6 residential trips and stepping up to Scout camps and have lost that experience and maturity. Current Year 7s reportedly not as bad.
My lad who has gone through Beavers to adult section assistant is pretty horrified by some of the Scouts he has to deal with, he can't wait to go back to uni
Ooo, messaged this morning to say they will put both girls on the waiting list after all.
Yes it's socialising we went for them.
Big issue for any girls wanting more adventurous stuff, and why many go to Scouting I suspect.
Scout leader here, very popular group with waiting lists at every level (I think it helps that we're in a fairly 'outdoorsy' place, so parents want to get there children into that kind of stuff). I've heard a lot of our girls saying that they came from Brownies/Guides as 'all they ever did was crafts and colouring in'.
Oh, and if anyone's interested in becoming a Scout leader in Disley, let me know.
I'm a Beaver leader, and help with the cubs too (child in each)
Beavers and Cubs are full, and scouts gained 10 new young people after the summer holiday (I think another troop folded).
As has been said up there ^^^ its the lack of regular volunteers/parents treating it like child care. We have 2 leaders and a young leader for Beavers, 2 and a young leader for cubs, and 1 leader for Scouts. Our GSL helps with cubs and Scouts but shouldn't as she is a GSL!
We have a few parents who will help as much as they can, others are more interested in going to the gym instead of the summer camp meeting arranged even though they are the main person with concerns (the place we went had an incident a few months ago investigated by the HSE)
Scout leader here too. We're pretty much full, but always willing to accommodate more.
Our sections from Beavers through to Explorers have healthy numbers, but other in the district have folded. It is down to 3 things IMHO.
1) Keeping it going through COVID via Zoom and distance based outdoor activities when we could.
2) Having a varied and active program. Our best recruiters are the kids. They bring their mates along.
3) Plenty of Leaders who are enthusiastic and want to be there. We have a couple of parents who occasionally muck in too.
I left Cubs because I really didn't get on with the Leader. However, it was his section that he started from scratch and rocking the boat would have been disruptive to the Pack and unfair on him. So, I moved to Scouts where the leadership team is a much better fit for what I want to get out of it and my personality.
Engaged Leaders are the key. If you lose your Leaders you will lose your kids and then it will fold.
Well it's always worth going on a wait list, even it seems when first you're told there isn't one. My eldest, just 7, has now been offered a 3 week trial at the local beavers pack, yay. They look great on the website, they have their own hut and look to be well equipped and active and best of all for me and my wife, the hut is a 5-7 minute walk away from home. Fingers crossed she enjoys it! If she doesn't, fine, we will carry on with brownies as she's enjoyed that so far, but that's 20+ mins walk away, not their own space, and seems to be struggling with only 6-8 brownies and this week was cancelled due to a leader being ill/lack of leaders. Could possibly do both but with girls brigade as well which we will definitely keep as is at the end of the street and both her and our younger daughter really enjoy, the week could be too full!
We've had quite a few defectors into Cubs/Scouts from Brownies and Guides.
In Cubs/Scouts we set fire to stuff and do axe throwing*. This usually clinches the deal.
*All in a very safe manner I hasten to add.
We've got two teams taking part in this over the weekend.
Making Memories! etc...
