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then fire him at a later date ( 11mths in work )
they have pretty much nothing to protect them then unless you pick gender o/religion or sexuality
IMHO just sack them because it has "Not worked out" to avoid any potential aggro
TBH why has no one challenged him or at least poisoned the bloody stiff he knicks with Picolax?
You have the right to ask why you were dismissed, in this case it was over some mini eggs and possibly some petty cash. The victim can then claim it was then who reported that incident, as a whistle blower, where's the OP evidence it was investigated he didn't just sack a whistle blower. I mean after all only the OP had the key to the locker.
Why complicate it. Just sack them with no mention of the mini eggs.
they have pretty much nothing to protect them then unless you pick gender o/religion or sexualityIMHO just sack them because it has "Not worked out" to avoid any potential aggro
Bloody hell! Junkyard and I agree again.
I think that's twice now.
IMHO just sack them because it has "Not worked out" to avoid any potential aggro
The kid clearly has problems already, otherwise he'd not be thieving (based on his suspended sentence, not the OP's assumptions) - I wouldn't be surprised if there's some level of mental illness (which STW is usually very sympathetic about) or lousy parenting...
... and sacking him without evidence of his crime or even giving the time to defend himself helps in what way, exactly? Sounds like an excuse to victimise him...
Why complicate it. Just sack them with no mention of the mini eggs.
So sack him as you feel like it.
I think it might have been his birthday yesturday as well, hence the day off.
As I stated. I read and re-read this thread and took some advice . I decided on the Verbal warning all official and on record in front of a witness, then a car park chat of the reality of the situation. I will not tolerate petty theft in the workplace.
Fed up of having my ear chewed off because all the choclates are gone, or all of the cup cakes that were left for us. 2 for each of us, someone had 7 and some staff got none.
Imagine you worked in a big office with 12 people in it, and it was your 40th birthday. You bought 12 cakes , but only 4 people got one as the others had mysteriously disappeared between 0800 and 1230
Had to seperate a warehouse shouting match because the lad in question had nicked another employees lunch ,as hes a mate and therefor it would be ok.
Jeez , You lot will be suggesting we all link arms and let each other fall backwards and be caught as a trust and team building exercise, never, ever going to happen.
Go Karting ( Im paying ) followed by getting smashed in an all day drinkathon is the favourite thing they wanted to do.
Nice one, OP, for treating him like an adult. Everyone deserves to be treated like an adult in the first instance IMO.
It sounds like he's got some really challenging behaviour if nicking other people's stuff is his natural way of getting his needs met - and frankly I'd struggle with knowing how to deal with that - and to be fair that's your manager's failure, not yours.
They're clearly not giving you enough support to deal with this lad. You need to push higher up the chain and ask them for support and training... that's taking responsibility.
Where I'm going to disagree with you is that treating people with respect isn't some nancy-fancy nonsense - treating people badly screws up your business... I've seen at least 3 collapse and effectively go bankrupt because they failed to learn this lesson - had to sell themselves before they ran out of cash...
Timpsons has a revenue of £169m and their philosophy of "If you treat people well, it is blindingly obvious that they will do a good job" (from Wikipedia) might have something to do with that... certainly in my experience if you support people at times when they're struggling, they'll pay you back in spades
Whilst I agree with much of what you say its pretty hard to treat the thief like the one who is being picked on here.and sacking him without evidence of his crime or even giving the time to defend himself helps in what way, exactly? Sounds like an excuse to victimise him.
Yes it might be a mental health issue or he might just be an amoral scumbag - we cannot tell. Does he deserve sympathy- I dont know he seems pretty systematic in his disregard for other people's property.
My suggestion was to help the OP not the thief
OP he gains employment rights at 12 months - just checked its now 24 mths so you have time to offer him support if this is the route you prefer
TBH in some of the workplaces i worked the car park incident would not have been a polite chat but a shooing. I dont agree with this but folk dont like working with people who steal from them;this has been my universal experience.
EDIT: I agree with treating people well in the workplace and staff are your greatest asset. However very few employers will put up with that sort of behaviour and to get respect you also need to earn it. Stealing from your "mates" is a spectacularly ineffective method of achieving respect in the workplace or wider society,
You've made the right decision, good on you and hope it works out.
No one has suggested linking arms they're grown ups too so if they can't between themselves sort out cakes and chocs then tell them to grow up.
This was an April Fool's, yes?
The employment laws here protect the employee and work against the employer.
Since I started this job, I have removed 4 members of staff, all long term, all have taken us to the labour courts. All have lost, but it has taken a huge amount of my time. One we only lost because I spotted criminal activity and the threat of 6 separate charges each up to 9 years ago made him back down.
I have a particularly weak teacher on staff, who was warned three months into his first year that if he didn't sort out his teaching he was out, support was in place. Exam results came out it was clear he had to go, first day of the new school year I told him his contract wouldn't be renewed and to start looking for work for the next academic year.
It took half a dozen or so separate meetings for him to get the message. It has had a huge impact on his wife and kids who are also at the school.
Eventually I convinced him to resign so that I didn't have to say in any future reference he hadn't renewed his contract.
I can't give him a decent reference, he is shit at teaching, although I have put him in touch with some schools who will hire anybody.
Personally I can't stand the guy, or his wife. I have never, ever, worked with anybody as naive as the two of them. It is very hard to keep those feelings separate when having to yet again speak to them about some stupid thing they have done or said.
His nickname among the staff is manchild.
12 more weeks and they are gone, but there are feelings of guilt that I haven't supported him enough, or his wife.
. It also surfaced today that he somehow escaped a custodial sentance for theft, just got a suspended sentance.
Convicted thief stealing? Who'd have thought it? If you employ known thieves it's going to happen.
I'm not sure about "offering support" to someone who, not only isn't very good at a pretty easy job, but is also a thieving scumbag.
If I stole from my workplace (yeah, I've done the dishwasher tabs thing), I would expect to be immediately sacked if caught. No chances, no support, sacked. Thieving is wrong, no ifs or buts, and no tolerance would be expected from me. But then I wasn't stupid enough to be caught, I suppose if you're that thick, you don't quite understand the difference between right and wrong and therefore need regular hugs.
[i] If you employ known thieves it's going to happen.
[/i]
The OP didn't employ him.
So, not an April Fool, then...
But then I wasn't stupid enough to be caught,
This guy hasn't been caught just suspected.
@ Quirell your guilt shows you care and that you did the right thing/as much as you could for the manchild. TBH bad teachers, we have all seen them, should just be put on a list somewhere to stop them cycling through the system
It is horrible sacking folk - even folk you dont like as you wonder if you are just doing it due to the personal/petty reasons.
Its also making folk redundant.
I have seen folk of all ages and all genders cry at the decision point SOme were genuinely upset. SOme wanted everyone in the room to feel like shit.
What is this dishwasher tab business? Why do workplaces have dishwashers and not sinks? Is this a new trend?
As I stated. I read and re-read this thread and took some advice . I decided on the Verbal warning all official and on record in front of a witness, then a car park chat of the reality of the situation. I will not tolerate petty theft in the workplace.
That sounds a good step. If he messes up now - he knows the score and what will happen. You've done the right thing.
Fed up of having my ear chewed off because all the choclates are gone, or all of the cup cakes that were left for us. 2 for each of us, someone had 7 and some staff got none.
Imagine you worked in a big office with 12 people in it, and it was your 40th birthday. You bought 12 cakes , but only 4 people got one as the others had mysteriously disappeared between 0800 and 1230
I think most people can understand why you would feel that way.
You lot will be suggesting we all link arms and let each other fall backwards and be caught as a trust and team building exercise, never, ever going to happen.
I'm not sure many of us would support the above. I think several of us were suggesting that you shouldn't take steps you may regret,because from your posts it wasn't clear you had fulfilled some key management responsibilities. If you get hard proof of his wrongdoing, get rid and make sure he knows why. That would be the appropriate course of action then.
Whilst I agree with much of what you say its pretty hard to treat the thief like the one who is being picked on here.
Do we actually know if they ARE the thief yet?
Have you considered turning the office into an ISIS caliphate?
You could chop his hands off with a big sword then.
Do we actually know if they ARE the thief yet?
It's the OP, isn't it. I'm on to you, sir.
Can you claim unfair dismissal if you believe you are being held responsible for a crime you didn't commit?
No, but you can escape into the Los Angeles underground.
If you can find them, maybe you could hire the light fingered team.
And as part of my new management skillz I have contacted the supplier of the chemicals to try to get new, different labelling and /or packaging to make it stand out from other raw ingrediants . I have also put in place a double-check / double signiture policy on those specific deliveries.
Now you've got it. 😀
Pudding for you.
Pudding for you.
Unless the thieving git gets to it first 🙂
I do like the genuine source of good advice, blended with p##s taking and sarcasm, that the hive mind provides. Congrats to you all and the OP for having the sense and confidence to take it in board and admit so on here.
My money is on the thefts continuing so some locked away celebrations laced with a variety of chemicals would still be a good plan (a red food dye injected would be a good indicator).
[i]source of good advice, blended with p##s taking and sarcasm, that the hive mind provides.[/i]
It's why we come here innit 🙂
No, but you can escape into the Los Angeles underground.
Only if you intend to survive as soldiers of fortune.
It's why we come here innit
STW. You'll come for the bikes; you'll stay for the bollocks.
You'll come for the bikes; you'll stay for the [s]bollocks[/s] mini eggs.
If you can find them, maybe you could hire the light fingered team.
Having regained a sense of humour this morning, I have to admit to a chuckle at that. 😆
Good candidate for STW quote of the decade.
Cougar - Modernist
STW. You'll come for the bikes; you'll stay for the bollocks
"I do like the genuine source of good advice, blended with p##s taking and sarcasm"
Me too.
Nice one o.p. , here's hoping he takes heed of his bollocking.
Fed up of having my ear chewed off because all the choclates are gone, or all of the cup cakes that were left for us. 2 for each of us, someone had 7 and some staff got none.
Sorry that was me...
Though as a general rule turn up for cake time or miss out.
Cougar - ModeratorSTW. You'll come for the bikes; you'll stay for the bollocks.
There are bikes?
There are bikes?
what's a bike?