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well I stand corrected
What benefits do you find they have over the more modern alternatives?
or is it a “we’re in too deep to change our processes now” kind of arrangement?
They don't transmit so can be carried around sensitive electronic equipment.
They're intrinsically safe so long as you use an approved battery so can be used in DSEAR zones.
You're not reliant on a phone having signal or charge.
You don't have the same signal issues you do with mobile.
Any one fancy a wireless dropper ... I can only imagine the carnage that would cause if that goes off without warning.
This is going to get very messy.
Just yet more criminal acts to lay at the doors of the Israeli government led by Netanyahu, lets hope the ICC reports on Friday with an International arrest warrant for the prick
That maybe correct but it seems hardly likely that pagers used by racist, fascist, terrorists, are going to carried by innocent civilians.
Why would they want them? For what purpose?
I still stand by my statement that is a very precisely targeted strike against their enemies.
How do you feel about agents spreading nerve poisons on doorknobs? That’s a pretty precisely targeted strike, right?
We all know Russia won't accept any criminal acts but the West needs to stop Netanyahu as these are crimes. It has to stop.
We all know Russia won’t accept any criminal acts but the West needs to stop Netanyahu as these are crimes. It has to stop.
These attacks are war crimes, they will no doubt inflame tensions, but Hezbollahs rockets are even more indescriminate and 30,000+ Israelis have been evacuated from homes in northern Israel since Hezbollah started their latest wave of attacks.
I still stand by my statement that is a very precisely targeted strike against their enemies.
Innocent civilians including kids have been wounded and killed by the pagers, you can't send 1000s of explosive stuffed gadgets into a country and not expect collateral damage.
What's bonkers is that by nenetnayhus standards it was restrained
Pagers traditionally dont use rechargeable cells, but use AA cells.
There is an N cell available, same diameter as AA but half the length.......giving space for an explosive material.
Also, access to the POCSAG operating system has been gained and then the access to send the radio transmission as an 'all call'.
(Spent 5 years with a UK based pager manufacturer......well before all of this happened)
but Hezbollahs rockets are even more indescriminate
Certainly Israel has easy access to the most advanced precision weapons in the world (who would have thought it) but Hezbollah is currently building up an arsenal of Iranian manufactured precision missiles. Their ability to hit precise targets is likely to increase significantly in the near future.
This is going to get very messy.
Just yet more criminal acts to lay at the doors of the Israeli government led by Netanyahu, lets hope the ICC reports on Friday with an International arrest warrant for the prick
I think he was referring to this thread 😉
****in Religion again eh... FFS
There are international agreements banning the use of booby trapped items, the use of which constitute war crimes.
Israel are a signatory...
Netanyahu is a war criminal.
I am fairly sure that Netanyahu is a nonbeliever fossy, so I have no doubt that he would agree with your sentiments. Although the religious nutters in his far-right government I dare say wouldn't.
Netanyahu is a war criminal.
I don’t think we needed any exploding pagers to come to that conclusion. That threshold was passed quite some time ago
The Israelis are genocidal and just think they can do whatever the * they like with complete impunity
I used to work with an Israeli, who was and is an utter * and an avowed Zionist. I have him added on social media and his posts over the last 12 months has been a fascinating insight into what people like him think about all this
This is what he reposted yesterday. Hilarious, I’m sure you’ll agree. There were lots of laughing emoji’s as commments
They - the Zionists - are all genocidal monsters and I think we’re only just scratching the surface of what they’re prepared to do to wipe out their ‘enemies’, real or imagined, with little or no regard for the collateral damage they inflict
God only knows what they have to do before they get seriously taken to task about their murderous ambition
Starting another war seems to be a given
He’s just posted this. Yet more hilarity. Those zionists eh? They do like a laugh
A short piece taken from The Atlantic, the rest of the story is paywalled, but it gives a bit more background info:
Yesterday, pagers used by Hezbollah operatives exploded simultaneously in Lebanon and Syria, killing at least a dozen people and injuring thousands. Today brought another mass detonation in Lebanon, this time involving walkie-talkies. The attacks are gruesome and shocking. An expert told the Associated Press that the pagers received a message that caused them to vibrate in a way that required someone to press buttons to stop it. That action appears to have triggered the explosion. At a funeral in Beirut, a loudspeaker reportedly called for people to turn off their phones, illustrating a fear that anydevice could actually be a bomb, including the one in your pocket.
Don't fear the beeper......
And no one will be going to a Plant and Paige reunion......
Apparently a lot of the wounded will be particularly to face and eyes as the pagers bleeped first, so they were held up to be looked at. I’m guessing the numbers of those blinded etc will come to be known in the next few days. Horrendous.
I can’t see this causing long-term issues for Hezbollah
It's likely a prelude to an Israeli ground invasion of Lebanon, they've effectively cut off communication between Hezbollah fighters and with their c&c in the short-term so now would be the time to exploit that.
What benefits do you find they have over the more modern alternatives?
or is it a “we’re in too deep to change our processes now” kind of arrangement?
They use them in many factories as well. They're robust, simple and small, it buzzes, you read a short text message on screen, you put them away. Minimal distraction in a noisy/dangerous environment.
I think the term 'targeted' has been overused here 'profiled' is perhaps more apt.
The other thing that it raises is the question of when is an attack over a border, not an attack? If the IDF had simultaneously popped 1700 odd guided missiles into Lebanon all heading towards the best estimate location of a number of Hezbollah members it would have been called a military attack, and the high probability of collateral deaths would have drawn criticism.
This is only really different in that it uses a non-ballistic device and the explosive power of each device is much smaller. But it seems to have wrong footed the international community a fair bit, many of them seem unsure how to respond/comment on pager attacks despite it still being a clear escalatory action.
Seems like Israel's final solution to the Palestinian 'problem' was already very well planned.
And I use that phrase, with all its connotations, deliberately.
I'm bereft of hope. Netanyahu knows he can get away with genocide and he's doing it. Right now in 2024.
I’m bereft of hope. Netanyahu knows he can get away with genocide and he’s doing it. Right now in 2024.
My view as well. Of all the people to understand the horrors that entails, defies belief.
It’s likely a prelude to an Israeli ground invasion of Lebanon
You would have thought but all the evidence so far suggests that it isn't.
He’s just posted this. Yet more hilarity. Those zionists eh? They do like a laugh
Is he based in the uk? If so that post is straying into hate speech territory...
Seems like Israel’s final solution to the Palestinian ‘problem’ was already very well planned.
Honestly it isn't, that is the whole reason why Israel is in total chaos in dealing with the worst crisis it has ever faced.
It is a deeply polarised and divided society which cannot agree on the extraordinarily limited options they have in front of them.
Israel is losing its "war" Gaza, it is not defeating Hamas in any significant way and it is costing them massively economically, militarily, and politically, plus it is increasingly isolating them internationally.
A ground invasion of Lebanon would be suicidal, if it can't defeat Hamas it has considerably less chance of defeating Hezbollah, and all out war with Iran would quickly bring the collapse of Israel.
Yes Israel has access to the most advanced weaponry in the world and it can destroy a lot and kill a lot but it is a tiny country with a small population, a small land mass, and little resources, it simply cannot sustain a long intense war, like Iran could, it can't sustain its war in Gaza. There is a reason why the 6 Day War was so successful......it only lasted 6 days. Those are the sort of wars that Israel can fight.
But perhaps the fact that expanding the war to Iran and Hezbollah would be suicidal for Israel is precisely why Netanyahu appears to be determined to go for that option. The situation with the Palestinians is not sustainable, they are growing every stronger and more determined, Oct 7th proved that, and the support they are recieving internationally ever greater. They are in a stronger position now in 2024 than they were in 1948.
Israeli society is falling apart and it looks as if the game's up for the zionist experiment. Attack Iran and Hezbollah and things will deteriorate rapidly, and this is the gamble...... would the United States allow Israel to collapse with all the consequences of how much it would strengthen those in the region who don't care about vital US interests, such as Iran?
Perceived wisdom says no, the United States would never allow Israel to collapse so this would force the US and its allies into a full-scale war in the region which would, if it goes to plan, destroy Israel's enemies in the region thereby securing Israel's existence. It's obviously a huge gamble but frankly Israel doesn't have a lot of options, the current situation is not sustainable.
This is only really different in that it uses a non-ballistic device and the explosive power of each device is much smaller. But it seems to have wrong footed the international community a fair bit, many of them seem unsure how to respond/comment on pager attacks despite it still being a clear escalatory action.
An important difference is that there is no smoking gun showing that Israel did it. It's widely believed that Israel did it but they haven't acknowledged that and nobody can prove that they did. The people who might be able to prove that Israel did it are the security and intelligence agencies of other countries, but they all utterly loathe Hezbollah too so they will be quite happy to not help out on this one.
Israeli society is falling apart
It really, really, really isn't. Source - I'm here at the moment.
Eh? No smoking gun? The smoking gun is that Hezbollah was targeted. Israel not claiming responsibility is how they have always dealt with issues like that.
No one has any doubt at all that Israel is responsible. If they weren't they would be denying it.
But it seems to have wrong footed the international community a fair bit, many of them seem unsure how to respond/comment on pager attacks despite it still being a clear escalatory action.
I imagine many of them are frantically checking where their own handheld electronics come from and how good the supply chain and security vetting is as well as wondering if they could pull off the same move if they needed to.
Israeli society is falling apart
It really, really, really isn’t. Source – I’m here at the momen.
Well you are hardly going to hear anything other than a positive spin from the government and its agencies.
My many sources include Maj. Gen. Yitzhak Brik, a commited zionist and former IDF ombudsman.
Pagers traditionally dont use rechargeable cells, but use AA cells.
There is an N cell available, same diameter as AA but half the length…….giving space for an explosive material.
Seems quite likely - it would be much easier to switch AAs than gut each pager however deep you are into the supply chain. Likewise the same AAs could possibly go in walkie talkies too. Not sure how would you detonate them though?
Not sure how would you detonate them though?
Isn't the suggestion that an extra circuit was included at the production level?
Well you are hardly going to hear anything other than a positive spin from the government and its agencies.
My source is being in Israel and walking about, seeing people buying cars and eating in restaurants and dancing in nightclubs and going to work and demonstrating en masse against Netanyahu and his government. You know, things that happen in a functional not-falling-apart society.
According to reports they were very hard to detect... swapping out the battery for a half size one plus a lump of explosive doesn't seem very stealthy.
My source is being in Israel and walking about
With respect I think I will trust the assessment of the situation provided by Maj. Gen. Yitzhak Brik former head of Military Colleges and IDF ombudsman rather more than yours.
Even though he paints a picture even more dire than I had imagined - he is expecting Israel to collapse some time next year, which sounds extraordinary.
Btw I suspect that Yitzhak Brik is also walking about.
Btw I suspect that Yitzhak Brik has his own agenda....
Possibly.
it would be much easier to switch AAs than gut each pager
Apparently, that model pager has a lithium battery, not AAA cells.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_Apollo_AR924
According to reports they were very hard to detect… swapping out the battery for a half size one plus a lump of explosive doesn’t seem very stealthy.
Reports are that each pager had about 3 grams of explosive, so probably quite easy to disguise within the case. There's no confirmation of where the tampering was done. The obvious way to do it would be to buy a bunch of the same model, fit the explosives and program the malware somewhere secure where you have plenty of time to work, repackage them, then swap the shipment somewhere between the factory and final destination. Warehouse staff, delivery drivers, etc. can be bribed, or your own agents get jobs working in the supply chain.
Yitzhak Brik has his own agenda….
Possibly.
Possibly ? No absolutely Yitzhak Brik has his own agenda. The preservation of the Israeli state. He is a commited zionist.
Netanyahu is destroying Israel. October 7th 2023 was Israel's greatest crises, the very last thing Israel needed was for Netanyahu and his far-right government to take it to where they have taken it.
With respect I think I will trust the assessment of the situation provided by Maj. Gen. Yitzhak Brik former head of Military Colleges and IDF ombudsman rather more than yours.
Well, I mean obviously. If you accepted mine then you'd probably have to rethink all the "end of the Zionist experiment is near, Israel is eating itself" nonsense.
My source is being in Israel and walking about, seeing people buying cars and eating in restaurants and dancing in nightclubs and going to work and demonstrating en masse against Netanyahu and his government.
Ii’m sure you’re correct and things are as normal. Killing Arabs. Voting for a fascist government. Applauding genocide. Everything you expect from a depraved degenerate society built on oppression.
But I’m sure another UN resolution will bring them to their knees.