We were told school dances are off. Kids, who had already splashed for dresses etc., are holding their own. We've been told under no circumstances are we to have anything to do with them, applies to parents who are staff too.
We were told school dances are off. Kids, who had already splashed for dresses etc., are holding their own. We’ve been told under no circumstances are we to have anything to do with them, applies to parents who are staff too.
Sounds like the sort of policy which at first glance might seem sensible that probably backfires - an officially sanctioned even can have sensible precautions in place that won't eliminate but will reduce risk whilst the "underground" party will end up not only with increased covid, but probably other risks too!
Management weren’t that keen on it when the FM said but now the PM has the email has been sent out.
mmm... yeah I have a similar thing... but then I had to remind HR about Scottish tax bands being different this week so not sure I'm surprised.
Sounds like the sort of policy which at first glance might seem sensible that probably backfires
The 40 quip pp work subsidy is about the only reason lots of our people go, so they'll just not bother, me included.
As I posted on main CV19 thread last week, we had decided to stop all face to face work as of tomorrow anyway, across the UK. We had also decided to stop the Scottish Christmas swally as well.
We have decided today, in light of Scottish and Welsh government being more candid and suggesting mid-January for this work from home period, to extend that pause until end of January. I suspect we will be calling clients mid-January and extending that again...
I am finding it hard that not everyone is responding - we were due at a gig on Saturday, which is still going ahead as it is under the 500 people rules. There must be a scrabbling behind the scenes this week for a tightening of things like that...surely?
Nobeer - I'm sure that most employees won't care or perhaps do a small low key thing with their own small team (who may all be exposed to each other anyway). It was the schools cancelling dances thing - the pupils are still going to have a party, just in overcrowded, poorly ventilated spaces probably with drink etc...
Matt - I don't think you can expect venues to cancel events if the government have (a) not told them to (b) not offered any compensation. There's a tricky balance - but we must now have plenty of T&T data to tell us how big a risk different settings are in general, so I think there will be less willingness to cancel events without proof they are actually super-spreader events.
I am finding it hard that not everyone is responding
Gigs etc haven't been mentioned because there has been no material rule change, it's always been 'wfh if you can' up here, hasn't it?.
I think any form of 'lockdown' would be very interesting now, the fear has gone from a huge tranche of the population, folk (think) they know more, and as such will do as they please. And when those in power do as they wish, at the height of the pandemic, well.....
Fair point over gigs (etc) not being subject to rule or guidance changes. And I am making our decisions from a place of having supportive clients and funders, and a job that still pays....
I do wonder though if next week will bring some kind of lockdown light, without calling it a lockdown, with some guidance about closing things down some more.
The guidelines we have in place now are miles away from a lockdown.
Which is why they'll probably not make much difference and we'll get locked down early next year anyway
The guidelines we had during most of the lockdown were miles away from a lockdown tbh. I'd love to see the carnage if we went like some of Germany, nae covid passport, nae cairry oot! 🙂
it’s always been ‘wfh if you can’ up here, hasn’t it?.
Very much a guideline and in no way enforced. My missus just quit her job last month as she was back to a 3 hour round trip to Glasgow (including slack time walking from and waiting for trains) despite having no real need to be in an office.
Now working in an office but 5 minutes from the house.
The underground school party just means that all senior pupils will be returning to school with 4 days until the hols after a massive piss up. Just enough time for a superspread to happen and wipe out Xmas.
I do wonder though if next week will bring some kind of lockdown light, without calling it a lockdown, with some guidance about closing things down some more.
Would agree with this. I was expecting more to be announced this week. Strangely haven’t been hearing all the background noise we have otherwise heard over the past 24 months. Let’s see.
Unscheduled Covid update from the FM tomorrow.
I've just read letter from health protection Scotland. It was sent out to heads of education and headteachers, now sent on again to all members of EIS union.
To paraphrase: if NHS or local authority suspect Omicron = automatic 10 day isolation, this can be extended to secondary contacts as well as primary contracts/suspected cases.
Seems the message is don't mess around, isolate.
-
What are they going to base their 'suspicions' of omicron on? Is there different symptoms to Delta?.
Surely they have to go with actual test results.
The first line is about tested/NHS tells you.
The second line a little more 'hmmm'..
Dear Directors of Education,
Letter to all early learning and childcare (ELC), schools and higher and further
education settings: Omicron variant
This letter is to clarify what action is required of education, early learning and childcare
(ELC) settings in response to the Omicron COVID-19 variant that has recently emerged.
To date, the Omicron variant appears to be more transmissible than Delta. Evidence on
severity is still being gathered and assessed. The effectiveness of vaccination to protect
against severe disease is not yet known, but the booster is expected to provide
protection.Robust efforts to slow transmission are being undertaken while we learn more.
Therefore, local Health Protection Teams are contacting cases and close contacts by
phone and SMS to advise individuals linked to known or suspected Omicron cases that
more stringent self-isolation measures than for Delta are being applied.
Schools will be contacted to support case finding and risk assessment. It is
acknowledged that bubbling systems are no longer in place for most schools, therefore
contact tracing may necessitate whole classes to isolate if close contacts, as previously
defined, cannot be identified.
The advice to cases and contacts linked to Omicron cases continues to evolve.
Currently any Omicron case or contact identified by Test and Protect or the local
NHS Health Protection Team must self-isolate for 10 days. This applies to
everyone, irrespective of age, and the self-isolation period cannot be reduced by
testing negative or being vaccinated. Contacts should arrange for PCR testing at their
local testing site.
There may be occasions, following risk assessment, where secondary Omicron contacts
(contacts of contacts) may be asked to self-isolate and get tested. This would usually
involve households of contacts, and they (the secondary contacts) would no longer need
to isolate if they are negative on PCR test.
If a case is suspected of being infected with the dominant Delta variant, isolation
guidance remains unchanged (NHS Inform). However, in the infrequent occasions when there is a mixed variant picture within a setting, a risk assessment may lead to amore precautionary approach where all contacts are advised to isolate for 10 days.
We appreciate this will cause significant concern about the potential educational and
staffing impacts in areas where Omicron is identified, but we are taking action now to
prevent further measures being necessary and we are keeping them under continuous /
daily review. This is a fast moving picture and we will be in touch again soon.
[Cont. To usual advice]
29 pupils in my daughters class (she’s 6) - only 13 in today. Some parents are keeping their kids off to reduce risk of them getting it so they can do Xmas with the relatives as per normal, apparently.
The spectre of home schooling is on the horizon I fear - extended Xmas holidays?
We are planning on stopping nursery soon to minimise any risks over Christmas. As it is he does week on week off with coughs and colds just now.
Our youngest (S5) tested negative with a PCR test this week.
Thankfully!
It's most likely a cold or flu thing.
We've kept her off school anyways.
If no improvement in how she's feeling might get her another PCR.
I'm hoping they go for lockdown lite over Christmas.
Seeing more and more folks not using hand gel on entering places, I truly despair!
talk of lockdowns is a bit premature yet, we'll know more in a few weeks of the true nature of omicron, but the virus booster, while, not really having an effect on cases, as of yet, are certainly having a positive effect on deaths and hospitalisations, there's been a steady reduction in both over the last while.
So it's a wait and see what, if any effect, omicron has. The voluntary nature of the suggestion is proportionate, and there's no valid reason nor cause to go any further yet.
Cases alone don't justify any lock downs, and there's nothin really particularly unusual happening at the minut that hasn't been happening for the last few months. Only a significant rise in hospitalisations and deaths will justify further lockdowns.
Seeing more and more folks not using hand gel on entering places, I truly despair!
I for one have pretty much stopped gelling my hands. If you did it every time you were requested to it would be about 30 times a day and surface transmission really isn't a massive thing is it?
I work in social care. If I add together all the times I change gloves and/or wash my hands over the working day that's probably about 30 times during the shift. We're trying to use hand gel or soap and water where possible to cut down on the use of gloves to reduce the environmental impact.
Errmmm- hand gell is no substitute for gloves! check your infection control policy. At one point during an outbreak I was getting thru many more pairs than that.
I thought regularly washed hands were preferable to use of gloves? It’s not like the virus enters via the skin…
I for one have pretty much stopped gelling my hands. If you did it every time you were requested to it would be about 30 times a day and surface transmission really isn’t a massive thing is it?
@Spin - I believe you are right, the main route is now mostly accepted as air borne and the contact route pretty much needs you to contaminate your hands then very soon after touch someone or them touch the same object as you and that person then transfer the contamination to their airway. That is how many other cold/flu type diseases are spread but doesn't seem to be the way for Covid. Of course all those other bugs are still in circulation so good hygiene is still a good idea and may help reduce pressure on healthcare but probably isn't going to stop you getting Covid.
I've not completely stopped (and especially in the small shops where they've gone out their way to put it right at the door in an obvious place I'll do it to make them feel happier), but I'm more likely to do it on the way out of a public toilet or trolley licker supermarket than on the way in!
I work in social care. If I add together all the times I change gloves and/or wash my hands over the working day that’s probably about 30 times during the shift.
Maybe that's appropriate and proportionate in a care setting, I don't know enough to comment. I think the evidence suggests it's neither of those things for Joe Public.
The whole hand and surface thing has been a massive red herring (for Covid) but it's in the public consciousness now. I'm a teacher and I've got colleagues who get every kid to sanitise their hands on the way into the room then everyone sits there with the windows shut!
We've also got two cleaners who over the course of a day wipe every door handle and light switch in the school twice. Hard to see what purpose that's serving.
Sorry Tjagain I did'nt make it very clear. It's not for tasks which involve contact directly with the service user or even necessarily close proximity to the service user. Decision was taken at the top level and is in line with government advice.
That's a quite scary listen to Nicola.
Summary:
Omicron
Doubling time is under 3 days, closer to 2 days.
Today we are at 15% if cases Omicron, doubling every 2 days currently.
R number above 2.
Already issues of staff in hospitals, Scotrail not running trains due to lack of staff etc.
A move back to 10 day isolation for all household contacts alongside any covid case or suspected cases
That’s a quite scary listen to Nicola.
Yep
I greatly fear my Hogmanay plans (I plan to have my first lapdance in years just before a nice lunch followed by horrendous quantities of Class As) are in great peril!
That's all our youth clubs in shetland closed down until into the New Year in anticipation of announcements tomorrow. Christmas parties cancelled and local food establishments getting cancellations and some face to face meetings at work that had only really just restarted cancelled.
We're moving house to mainland Scotland at the weekend so I hope nothing puts a hold on that 🤞🤞🤞
Wee yins school announced her prelim next Monday would be brought forward to this week, then FM announces schools not closing early, school forced into u turn.
Muppets.
Wee yins school announced her prelim next Monday would be brought forward to this week, then FM announces schools not closing early, school forced into u turn.
That's shitty behaviour by the school. Bizarre that they'd try to jump the gun on that before getting confirmation.
Dammed if you do, damned if you don't. My son's was postponed because of the school having a couple of days without electricity and now has been brought forward to Thursday from next Monday. The sensible thing to do would have been to close schools on Friday, attendance next week is going to fall off a cliff with parents making their own decisions. But instead there will be restrictions on what we can do/ who we can see during the holidays, personally I am finished complying with their shite.
The sensible thing to do would have been to close schools on Friday, attendance next week is going to fall off a cliff with parents making their own decisions. But instead there will be restrictions on what we can do/ who we can see during the holidays,
Closing schools would not have meant an un or less restricted holiday.
personally I am finished complying with their shite.
It's not 'their shite', it's a simple equation, many more cases=NHS ****ed and the only remaining weapon is restrictions. With the transmissibility of Omicron and public fatigue, I wonder about how effective that will be but it's really all we've got.
Dammed if you do, damned if you don’t.
If you were talking about the SG I'd agree.
Having been told that due to mitigations we can't be infected in school but can as soon as we're outside. So I face to face 100+ kids per day +14staff and can't get it. But meet those same 14 staff in a restaurant on Friday after work and everyone is a typhoid Mary.
Yet no enhanced mitigations for senior pupils who are pressing ahead with a dance.
Yet no enhanced mitigations for senior pupils who are pressing ahead with a dance.
Our local authority put the kybosh on dances / parties some time ago, in fact I think the line was no right from the start.
Having been told that due to mitigations we can’t be infected in school but can as soon as we’re outside. So I face to face 100+ kids per day +14staff and can’t get it
Was there not a large scale study that showed teachers covid rates were no worse than any other profession a few months back?. Happy to be corrected though, I didn't really dig much past the headline numbers.
It’s not ‘their shite’,
Oh it really is. Schools/football stadiums/gigs perfectly safe,but as 100th says small gatherings not, they can wedge that. Likewise any other restrictions on small gatherings while large ones are OK. Each to their own but I am done with doing what I am told by 2 sets of politicians making it up as they go along.
Was there not a large scale study that showed teachers covid rates were no worse than any other profession a few months back?
I remember that, but since 100% of my 8 person department has had it, other opinions are available. Also done during a time when kids at least wore masks in school.
I remember that, but since 100% of my 8 person department has had it, other opinions are available.
Aye, hard to ever quantify where someone was infected, hence why I suppose we need to go with the headline numbers as a reasonable guide.
The thing is Duckman, I don't believe in two wrongs making a right.
I agree that larger gatherings carrying on such as football, gigs, the 200+ person weddings at my son's hotel etc is very much at odds with the larger message.
I also believe we are balancing other health issues against covid - our mental health as a nation is poor, and I think hidden in that elderly and teens to young adults are most hard hit. I also am watching family and friends having slow or no treatment of other issues at present, all under a caution around covid.
But, and maybe I am too compliant, I do think I can protect my family and friends by staying out their way at the moment.
"It's a shite state of affairs" I think sums it up for me.
I also note that First Ministers Briefing today at parliament is followed by TV announcement from St Andrews House. hmmm - 3 week Christmas circuit breaker....?
“It’s a shite state of affairs” I think sums it up for me.
Agreed.
I'm just trying to use common sense. My daughter's football team had a social event last Friday which we decided not to attend, it was going to be over 100 people, indoors and drink would be taken. Those all added up to a no for me. I've got tickets for Easter Road on the 22nd and if it's still on we'll be going. More likely to get hypothermia than COVID. Government ads are telling us opening windows makes a big difference so surely a stiff breeze from the North sea will do. I don't mind not going out, it's much harder for my son who is 18 and potentially has a much busier social life. He's also trying to qualify for the Commonwealth games and can't really afford to miss training so it's a bit easier to persuade him to give parties a miss but we're just trying to get him to pick and choose how he socialises.
hmmm – 3 week Christmas circuit breaker….?
Not a chance.
I’m just trying to use common sense
This. I haven't been in a pub in years, but tbh if I was a drinker, I'd be steering well clear at present, ditto works night out etc, anything indoors where drink is involved, it all goes to ****.
It's amazing how much life revolves around it though, getting a swally seems to be folks biggest concern in any new restrictions chat. Ridiculous.
