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He looks more and more like some sort of Marvel bad guy every time, it's scary how far through the looking glass we seem to have gone that this thread even exists, if you'd scripted this and cast that ^ apparition above as the main character you'd probably win awards...
That needs wider broadcasting - genius!
Is there any indication of when all of these court cases will take place?
That didn’t take long 😀
Is there any indication of when all of these court cases will take place?
Its wee bit out of date now but
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jul/28/donald-trump-investigations-criminal-charges-tracker
Edit : too slow 🙂
Nah, Orange Steal.
(Thanks Drac ;0) )
these are all Jury trials though right?
Yes. They're all jury trails.
I think the Georgia State and the classified documents are both, on the face of it, slam-dunks. the New York cover up I think will not stand up in a court room if Trump has hired even part-way decent lawyers, and the Insurrection one is by far and away the most important one for US democracy.
I’ve just had a look at the replys on that twitter post…
Makes very depressing reading..
The man on the right is 6ft3" and 215 lbs.
He’s been practicing that face in the mirror hasn’t he
Gareth Cheeseman?
Another point - why is the law enforcement watermark so much smaller on Trump's mugshot than all his co-conspirators? It's allowed him to basically crop it out for his Twitter post, I suppose it would detract from his Paddington 'hard stare'.
He’s going to win isn’t he?
Worth a tenner?
>I think the Georgia State and the classified documents are both, on the face of it, slam-dunks.
I'm reminded of Elons trial for defamation, which was also a slam dunk.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-50695593
I’m reminded of Elons trial for defamation, which was also a slam dunk.
Yeah, but have a google of the name of the lawyer who represented Unsworth...
I'm going to hazard a guess that the case was not conducted in an optimum way for him.
Also odd that they apparently allow them to self-declare their height and weight for the records. Trump, apparently, is six foot three and 215 pounds.
Please let these be the measurements used if he ends up needing an orange jump suit.
The last time I saw a face like that was on my 5-year-old brother when told he had to go and take a bath and go to bed RIGHT NOW. Trump looks just like any 5-year-old told to do something he doesn't like. I can't believe the Trumpists think that's a sensible picture to use to promote the orange one.
They'll be lapping it all up as it is a look of defiance and that is how he has sold his 'ideology'...defiance against the Man...the Man is against him but he isn't backing down, etc. (despite giving into the Man by handing himself in - as mentioned earlier in this post as well)...
The Trumpists will be worked into a lather over all this and be thinking Trump is making a stand and fighting...
Hilarious to watch from this side of the pond...probably what they are all thinking about our politics and how terribly our politicians are behaving (for those who actually have any interest in news outside their own state).
Hilarious to watch from this side of the pond…
I get it, and if this was somewhere relatively insignificant (like Italy or Brazil 😉) it would be hilarious but this is the US we're talking about and someone who has had access to the codes for the nukes.
It also gets very difficult to criticize other countries for their lack of democracy and human rights, when they can justifiably point out the hypocrisy of the "leader of the free world"
🤷
(Sorry, off on a tangent there...)
I don’t think he can win, but I think the Dems can lose with Biden. As much as I actually like Biden, he’s costing them votes.
I think Biden still has a slightly better chance of taking the EC vote, but I don’t think either will get a clear mandate in the popular vote. Both would be less than 50% and I think turnout for the pair would be low.
Resistance and martyrdom? I can’t see it. I don’t think he could cope for five actual minutes in a jail. He’s had power and luxury all his life. Jail is unimaginable. If he gets even a tiny taster so it’s no longer imaginary my money is on him fleeing the country to avoid the possibility. To somewhere with no extradition treaty. Russia. Maybe.
I don’t think he can win, but I think the Dems can lose with Biden. As much as I actually like Biden, he’s costing them votes.
Do the Dems even have a viable alternative to Biden? There's some noise around Gavin Newsom (current Gov of California) but I don't really know much about what the Dems are doing, their strategy or any contenders
Harris seems ok but a black woman might be a gamble
Harris doesnn't appear to be very popular though.
Will trump be able to resist saying something that breaches bail conditions?
Paddington 'hard stare'
Genius!
klunk- thats apparantly a fake vid.
As for an alternative to Biden...I had high hopes for Harris but she has been almost invisible; Newsom has ruled himself out but has shown a willingness to act as Biden's surrogate - for example, he has made repeated offers to debate de santis who has shown no appetite.
I have no doubt that Biden will be the Dems candidate; it would definitely help his cause if the investments flowing from the Inflation Reduction Act showed some tangible benefits before the election.
It's why he's been doing set pieces touting 'bidenomics'.
harris has been pretty invisible, but most VPs are TBF, and they're rarely given the plumb jobs that let them earn kudos. if the incumbent wants to run they're unlikely to try and stop it. it's difficult to unseat an incumbent president. (noted that Donny is the exception that proves that rule)
i'm eating popcorn but the place is starting to appear ungovernable, like a failed state, and that is not what the world needs right now. the shit coming out of the mouths of the republican candidates that actually 'debated' is frankly scary.
Beaten to it, and seriously, wtf
He looks terrified and angry, as though his world is about to implode, to me. 🤷♂️
Can you imagine just how completely orange the giant Wotsit will look in a prison jumpsuit? THAT would be a sight worth seeing.
His 'hard man' face - what a joke - will have been tested, along with multiple other facial expressions, with his campaign team to determine which would be most likely to shift merch to his base.
It's nothing other than a facial expression chosen for imagery and to satisfy a cold commercial calculation.
What makes me laugh is his acolytes see it as a hard man, the rest of us see a toddler having a tantrum
To a certain extent Biden is the problem, not Trump. If the Dems had a candidate that had more charisma, was younger and fundamentally both loyal democrat stalwart voters and the saner voters of the middle ground could be relied upon to go out and vote for Trump would be an irrelevance. The world could sit back and observe the right of US thinking implode and make themselves unelectable.
But they don't. Which makes Trump and the anarchy of electing a felon to the highest office of one of the world most powerful democratic states very very real.
Of course the other problem is Americans as a group of people. For a country to have such a significant number of voters who could even conceive of voting for Trump; not just as a concept as in 2016 but with a history and very soon a criminal record says something deeply distasteful about their group outlook. Don't get me wrong - 'we' elected Johnson. But even then we sacked him off pretty quick with only a fraction of the dirt there is on Trump. America manufactured Trump and America manufactured large swathes of people who hold him esteem even now. America's ****ed. Do you really want an ally like America?
acolytes see it as a hard man, the rest of us see a toddler having a tantrum
or a toddler trying to fill his diaper.
‘we’ elected Johnson. But even then we sacked him off pretty quick
We elected him - but "we" didn't sack him. The electorate can't take the credit for his downfall.
The electorate can’t take the credit for his downfall
We can indirectly - Tories got rid of him because he was making the leadership of the nation under their stewardship unelectable. Ie 'we' could be relied upon to do the right thing. Converse is true in America - GoP could have squashed Trump post the insurrection but haven't because they fear the reaction of the voting public.
The thing that astonishes me about that picture, is that someone in the court's staff thought it was suitable for release in the first place. Surely the instruction to the 'prisoner' is "Stand up straight, back against the wall, logo by your right ear, look straight at the camera, don't stick your tongue out, no leering or grimacing etc"
As has been mentioned upthread, a couple of the other photos look like the person in question was having a right old laugh. It's all decidedly odd.
A sympathiser in the place, maybe? Or just the Orange One simply refused to listen?
As has been mentioned upthread, a couple of the other photos look like the person in question was having a right old laugh. It’s all decidedly odd.
A sympathiser in the place, maybe? Or just the Orange One simply refused to listen?
Made me think of this
Can't think why there's different standards...
Should have got the British passport office to do it.
First lawsuit filed to prevent Trump being on the ballot box in Florida, under amendment 14 section 3 of the constitution. 👍
Thankfully all this nasty business doesn't seem to have affected his golf, he's still as good as ever.
https://nypost.com/2023/08/26/internet-blasts-trumps-claim-he-won-club-tournament-with-67/
First lawsuit filed to prevent Trump being on the ballot box in Florida, under amendment 14 section 3 of the constitution
Interesting.
Section 3
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
Yes it's an interesting bit of the constitution as it doesn't actually require a conviction - simply being of aid to or or supportive of an insurgent act whilst being an oath-sworn office bearer is enough. It's not actions in relation to the law of the land its actions taken in relation to the oath sworn as an office bearer. Its a state-level decision in each state to decide whether someone can legitimately be on the ballot paper and they'll each have local legislation that will dictate how they interpret that element of the constitution and any citizen can bring a case against the state government if they believe someone's on the ballot that shouldn't be.
But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
And basically the 'get out clause' is not going to happen unless a lot of dems vote in favour of Trump....lol
Party Breakdown
In the 118th Congress, the current party alignments as of June 6, 2023,6 are as follows:
• House of Representatives: 222 Republicans (plus 2 Delegates and the Resident
Commissioner of Puerto Rico), 213 Democrats (plus 3 Delegates), and 1 vacant
seat.
• Senate: 49 Republicans, 48 Democrats, and 3 Independents, who all caucus with
the Democrats.
It makes you wonder who of the other republican presidential candidates the same clause applies to. Theres a fair few who were either state or federal office holders at the time. They presumably swore the same or similar oaths.
How do you know he has engaged in rebellion? It just cannot be a simple complaint.
How do you know he has engaged in rebellion?
Its broader than 'engaged'
"given aid or comfort to" - to help, support, encourage. It doesn't require success in any effort either or that the help you seek to give is of any benefit.
Its an amendment that was drafted just after the Civil War - it has a very broad scope.
There's some evidence that he was in communication in the lead up to Jan 6th via intermediaries with the leadership of the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers, some of whom have now been convicted of seditious conspiracy.
I'm sure a lot more stuff is going to come out as a result of the special counsel investigation. It could be that the Florida lawsuit is a bit early, but I suppose they are just testing the water with what they've got, and could go back if we get a trial in early to mid 2024 and more evidence emerges.
Oh we know he was. But legally? Surely it has to be a court decision or vote somewhere
I think the same people bringing that lawsuut have succeeded in getting some small time politician booted under the same legislation. Convicted for j6 now can't be an elected politician.
Oh we know he was. But legally? Surely it has to be a court decision or vote somewhere
Yeah, I've just skim read this, and my god I think I just fried my brain...
https://www.npr.org/2021/02/10/966396848/read-trumps-jan-6-speech-a-key-part-of-impeachment-trial
Trump is not quite as stupid as we like to think, there's a lot in that torrent of verbal diarrhoea that comes dangerously close to insurection, but legally, semantically, it's tricky. For example:
And we fight. We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore.
Our exciting adventures and boldest endeavors have not yet begun. My fellow Americans, for our movement, for our children, and for our beloved country.
And I say this despite all that's happened. The best is yet to come.
So we're going to, we're going to walk down Pennsylvania Avenue. I love Pennsylvania Avenue. And we're going to the Capitol, and we're going to try and give.
The Democrats are hopeless — they never vote for anything. Not even one vote. But we're going to try and give our Republicans, the weak ones because the strong ones don't need any of our help. We're going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.
So let's walk down Pennsylvania Avenue.
I want to thank you all. God bless you and God Bless America.
The word 'fight' is said 23 times in that transcript.
'Fraud' 22 times.
Surely it has to be a court decision or vote somewhere
Sure - that's why exclusion from the ballot has to start with a lawsuit, which is what has been initiated in Florida.
Surely it has to be a court decision or vote somewhere
Sure – that’s why exclusion from the ballot has to start with a lawsuit, which is what has been initiated in Florida.
But the lawsuit isn't against Trump. It's against the state and their due diligence in facilitating the election. It doesnt need to be proven that Trump instigated or played an active role in the planning or actions of the attempted insurrection - just that there was one - which has been established by these convictions
he leadership of the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers, some of whom have now been convicted of seditious conspiracy.
and that he was was supportive of it
I think that ticks the 'given aid or comfort' box
Convicts cannot vote though, I don't think in the USA?
That said I'm sure that would logically be tantamount to bribery of, and encouragement of, supporters who might be encouraged to attempt another coup in future.
It's utter madness.
But the lawsuit isn’t against Trump.
It doesn't have to be. It's the state that needs to be restrained from putting Trump on the ballot.
Ta for the explanation
The day before 'super tuesday' - Ha!
I particularly enjoyed the judge slapping down trump's lead attorney when he was bleating about the date...defense should not have sat on their hands waiting for an impeachment.
So far the judiciary in the various cases have shown little tolerance of manoeuverings of trump and his legal teams; having said that, Judge Cannon in the Mar-a-Lago documents case is yet to say anything meaningful.
Trumps has delayed these court cases repeatedly - they can only blame themselves that they’re now in court running up to the election 🤷♂️
Hoisted by their own petard.
He is not getting much traction in these hearings. Its really not looking good for him at all.
What the betting he fakes an illness or becomes genuinely to ill to take part. Overweight, bad diet, no exercise. He is a prime candidate
What the betting he fakes an illness or becomes genuinely to ill to take part.
...while simultaneously boasting about what a superb Presidential candidate he is...🤷
Edit: actually I may have stumbled across something....Trump is the first human who can operate in a Quantum state...
Overweight, bad diet, no exercise
No way is 6'3" and 215lbs overweight.
And no exercise? He crushed a golf tournament just the other day.
Bad diet? Are you going to tell me that cheesebros are bad for you?
Re Trump being disqualified I read that the states can disqualify him and it would be up to him to fight in court to be allowed to stand
Baude and Paulsen maintain their theory is "self-executing." They say that means that public elections officials don't need special permission from lawmakers to disqualify Trump from the ballot: if they believe the argument is valid, they can disqualify potential candidates on their own.
from here
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/14th-amendment-section-3-new-legal-battle-trump/story?id=102547316
So does that aid the sedition stuff? Due to them going to prison, does it strengthen the fact that Trump aided (would it be classed as comforted?) this? (Suspect I've dropped some big words in there to make me sound intelligent and got it all wrong)
As an outsider to all this, it appears that there is overwhelming evidence that contradicts his innocence plea, so why is it taking so long to draw this out?
Absolutely agree with innocent until proven guilty, but this isn't just hanging on a shaky peg...it already appears to have smashed to the ground and covered the whole floor space.
'Comforted' is a legally very wooly term... And USA law seems to be quite different to UK law. Does a wink and a thumbs up whilst alluding to civil war count as comfort?
I guess we'll find out soon enough.
More Jan 6th cases coming through, 22 years for Proud Boy leader
22 years for Proud Boy leader
But Trump as the commander in chief and main instigator, is more than likely to see no jail time
22 years for Proud Boy leader
If Trump gets elected he will walk free.
Tbh, I'm way past thinking I know whats going to happen.
Trump can only pardon himself (if re-elected) for Federal Crimes, so not the election interference ones in Georgia, for example.
If Trump gets elected he will walk free
little Donny 2 scoops still had the power of pardon between Jan 6th-20th and didn’t pardon any of the proud boys or his legal team who are now jointly on the rap sheet. That decision is now playing out nicely with people flipping.