Cummings brought to life what many already knew about Johnson’s failures
But do enough of them (us) care?
No obvious cats dropped overnight to distract us though
Only Hancock stating he wasn’t aware of Cummings revelations as he was too busy “...saving lives...” by managing our excellent vaccination program. What a hero.
As far as that Guardian article... there’s just an apathetic mood, I suspect the public will just see this as business as usual and like the good reserved Brits we are we’ll just keep calm and carry on.
Only Hancock stating he wasn’t aware of Cummings revelations as he was too busy “…saving lives…” by managing our excellent vaccination program. What a hero.
Russell Kane covered this in a video that my wife was watching last night. Yes, he / Boris / them have done well with the vaccines (or was it them, was it standing aside and letting others get on with it - contrast to 'I like chaos because they then have to come to me for answers....')
But that doesn't give a free pass for all the other stuff.
As RK said - Ted Bundy painted some nice watercolours. Jimmy Saville did some marathons for charity. Surely we can overlook a few murders / a bit of noncing on that basis?
But do enough of them (us) care?
Nope. Local BBC news channel last night interviewing Door Matt’s constituents: ‘they’ve done the best job they possibly could’, ‘vaccine vaccine vaccine’, ‘he/they may have made mistakes but it’s only 150,000 dead’, ‘we love you Joris’*
Oh, and don’t forget, says Andrew Sinclair: ‘Dom is a lying scumbag who can’t be trusted’.
* not strictly accurate, but you get the gist.
Cummings’ revelations aren’t revelations at all, everyone who cared to look knew what Bohnson and his crew were up to, but are more than happy to be drip-fed sewage from the billionaire media moguls.
Just go out and listen to the absolute shit that people spout when going about their business. A good old Suffolk boy on Monday actually said to the butcher (I can’t do the accent) ‘Road map’s goin’ ok ain’t it’? See! ****ing idiots.
If Dom has been let loose to deliver Gove for Murdoch why hasn’t there been “Dumbojo must go”headlines?
That Johnsons incompetence and indecisiveness over lockdowns led to 10s of 1000s of deaths is well known, his 40% core simply dont care, culture war nonsense means they are too entrenched, they've also voted him in so won't want to admit they're complicit on this.
Hancock on the other hand is damaged, if as suspected and Cummings claimed he held back testing to hit his target he should be in court (he won't be, but proof he did this week as him fired)
Vaccine rollout and opening up will keep the Tories safe
why hasn’t there been “Dumbojo must go”headlines?
Because Joris is VERY popular with the voters. Why upset the applecart now? Wait until your ratings drop, if they ever do, as he seems to be able to do absolutely ANYTHING and people still love him.
As RK said – Ted Bundy painted some nice watercolours. Jimmy Saville did some marathons for charity. Surely we can overlook a few murders / a bit of noncing on that basis?
I always think about Harold Shipman tbh.
Funny the Boris apologists.
Because Joris is VERY popular with the voters. Why upset the applecart now? Wait until your ratings drop, if they ever do, as he seems to be able to do absolutely ANYTHING and people still love him.
When he goes he takes the blame for Brexit an covid.
It’s just strategy and as he’s polling fine it’s not his time to go.
When he goes he takes the blame for Brexit an covid.
It’s just strategy and as he’s polling fine it’s not his time to go.
Harsh but true.
Too many Tory voters have told me "we knew what Boris was like, but better than the alternative"
They need to be made to face up to the fact that they voted in the team responsible for 10s of 1000s of extra deaths. The core will double down, but a lot will think twice. Given the track record, who will you vote for as they may have to face up to another national emergency?
Labour need to be planting those seeds now.
Which is why Boris won't be PM at the next election
Or “tally”. But we won’t count that one.
V v good - I'm pinching that for when the opportunity arises.
Does anyone know what the parliamentary procedure for lying to parliament is?
At the moment it seems like accusations are made and Boris (This applies to others as well) says words to the effect ‘Oh no I didn’t’ and they move on.
As far as I can see the system is based on MPs being ‘honourable’ and there is no come back when they aren’t. Do we have to wait 20 years or more till the papers are released to see who is telling the truth or is there some mechanism which enables the Speaker to investigate matters? The committee system, with a few exceptions, seems to be staffed by entirely partisan members.
Parliament is meant to hold the government to account but doesn’t seems to have checks and balances for something as simple as lying
They need to be made to face up to the fact that they voted in the team responsible for 10s of 1000s of extra deaths.
What about the Labour Party Centrists who did so much to help Boris Johnson by queuing up to attack their party leader and briefing the press against him, do they need to face up to their responsibility too?
You can be sure that the Centrists are very happy that Johnson, not Corbyn, won the last general election.
Christ on bendybus. Give it a rest Ernie.
Or at least keep the paranoid delusional ramblings to the Kier Starmer thread 😉
Cummings was dead right about one thing yesterday. Its a truly sorry indictment of our political system when the two options available to the electorate are Boris Johnson or Jeremy Corbyn
Basically, do you want your huge shit sandwich on brown or white bread?
Yes of course binners it never happened, the centrists didn't do anything to help Johnson win the election, Mandelson never said that he spent everyday undermining Corbyn.
It's all in my mind.
The Centrists did everything they could to make Corbyn PM.
It's all the fault of stupid voters.
We have a Tory government with a huge majority not because Lisa Nandy or Jess Phillips thought Jeremy Corbyn was a bit shit, but because the electorate thought so by a whopping great margin. So shit in fact, that they saw Boris ****ing Johnson as a considerably better alternative
Its as simple as that
So shit in fact, that they saw Boris ****ing Johnson as a considerably better alternative
So focus on that binners. The next time you start ranting about how terrible Johnson is just remember how considerably better he is to Corbyn, that should help to calm you down.
But the point is that Cummins was absolutely right. He was bang on!
Neither of those clowns would be anywhere near the levers of power, never mind the top job, if we had a functional political system.
The fact those 2 complete muppets of the highest order were the best that either party could muster shows how utterly ****ed the system is, and how poorly served we, the electorate, are 'by it. It's actually embarrassing.
And don't forget that, just like Johnsons incompetent cabinet of barely sentient thicko's, it isn't just Corbyn, its the no-hopers he was surrounded by, whose only discernible ability was loyalty to that idiot. The only attribute also demanded by Johnson.
So while Hancock was rightfully being lambasted for being completely hopeless, in a Corbyn administration the job of health secretary would have been given to a thick-as-mince dullard like Richard Burgon. So I doubt that would fill anyone with any confidence that the alternative to the present clown circus would have coped any better. A point that plenty of people have been all too ready to (correctly) point out, not least Dominic Cummings
A quote from Dom’s blog in Aditya Chakrabortty‘s guardian piece yesterday:
he anticipated the absurdity of today’s carnival: “The political-media system,” he wrote in a 2017 post, “actively suppresses thinking about, and focus on, what’s important.” Which hopefully proves my point above.
Neither of those clowns would be anywhere near the levers of power, never mind the top job, if we had a functional political system.
The fact that 2 complete muppets of the highest order was the best that either party could muster shows how utterly ****ed the system is, and how poorly served we, the electorate, are ‘served’ by it.
Don’t forget that it isn’t just Corbyn, its the no-hopers he was surrounded by, whose only discernible ability was loyalty to that idiot.
Oh binners I'm so sorry, I thought that pointing out to you that the alternative would be even worse would help to calm you down.
I now see that it's completely backfired and you now appear to be even angrier.
Oh dear never mind, it's bank holiday weekend! And I don't know about you but it's really sunny down here.....chin up
A quote from Dom’s blog in Aditya Chakrabortty‘s guardian piece yesterday:
he anticipated the absurdity of today’s carnival: “The political-media system,” he wrote in a 2017 post, “actively suppresses thinking about, and focus on, what’s important.” Which hopefully proves my point above.
That drive to Barnard Castle did him the world of good, his hindsight is 20:20!
I now see that it’s completely backfired and you now appear to be even angrier.
Do you not get it? This is a thread about Dominic Cummings and the most important thing that came out of yesterday was him pointing out the woeful performance and abject failure of those nominally in charge. How absolutely unsuited they are to deal with issues so serious
I wish more people were angry about the tragic mess that our political system is in. Both main parties are an utter shambles stuffed with completely useless nonentities. Third rate journalists, and privately educated chinless ****-wits.
The choice we were offered at the last election was between two gangs of absolute muppets. We were forced to choose who we reckoned would be the least awful.
You should be bloody angry! Everyone should.
But instead of anger we seem to have passive acceptance. Theres something very British about that
in a Corbyn administration the job of health secretary would have been given to a thick-as-mince dullard like Richard Burgon.
Jonathan Ashworth, darling of the labour right, was shadow health secretary. His girlfriend (wife maybe?) was named in the 2017 report as being one of the main players in the party working against the leadership and the 2017 election campaign. Are you saying he would have been worse than Hancock? Why are you blindly repeating the nonsense that a Corbyn government would have been worse in dealing with the pandemic that you hear from voxpop idiots on the news? They clearly would have handled it better, as their focus was on public health, not the economy. Before Starmer came in Corbyn, McDonnell et al were asking some serious questions of the govt response to the pandemic from day one and demanding action. Then Starmer appeared and basically supported everything they did and gave them free reign.
I wish more people were angry about the tragic mess that our political system is in.
This is a very odd comment from someone who supports the people who want to keep it exactly the same, and routinely derides anyone who suggests radical reform of this system as a sixth former. I'm confused.
Not normally interested in politics will admit but I think Boris has had to tread a difficult balance of lockdown/economy/keeping everyone happy. I respect all views above regardless of whether I agree with them or not, but...
Rather than just slagging off everything, why not list how you would have actually managed the pandemic differently? How would you have saved 1000's of lives, kept the economy going, kept every part of the country happy, vaccinated everyone more quickly and got the pubs open more quickly 🤔
You should be bloody angry! Everyone should.
But instead of anger we seem to have passive acceptance. Theres something very British about that
How about putting the kettle on binners?
I'm sure you'll feel a lot better after a nice cup of tea.
Rather than just slagging off everything, why not list how you would have actually managed the pandemic differently?
This is exactly what Cummings did yesterday. He listed all the occasions where Johnson was advised to take actions by experts which he then ignored or just dithered until it was too late.
He's still doing it now. He's learnt nothing. Just repeating all the same mistakes of the last year. Have you not seen the latest figures? Despite the vaccination programme, infections are steadily rising again
Rather than just slagging off everything, why not list how you would have actually managed the pandemic differently?
Shutting the borders for a start - look at Aus/NZ for starters. But no, the government put the economy and holidays first and wilfully allowed care homes to take the hit.
Not normally interested in politics will admit but I think Boris has had to tread a difficult balance of lockdown/economy/keeping everyone happy. I respect all views above regardless of whether I agree with them or not, but…
Rather than just slagging off everything, why not list how you would have actually managed the pandemic differently? How would you have saved 1000’s of lives, kept the economy going, kept every part of the country happy, vaccinated everyone more quickly and got the pubs open more quickly 🤔
It's pretty clear that earlier action in 2020, light touch restrictions and travel restrictions a few weeks earlier, would have made a huge difference in outcome. It's easy to say this with hindsight, but Cumming's criticism is that a) Boris didn't take the Virus seriously, b) that the system was poorly structured and prepared to react and c) that experience from other countries was ignored.
This is a very odd comment from someone who supports the people who want to keep it exactly the same, and routinely derides anyone who suggests radical reform of this system as a sixth former. I’m confused.
I'm not interested in ideology, radical or otherwise. Whats sadly lacking in our present political class, on all sides, is even the most basic level of competence.
Look at them all. You wouldn't trust them to run a ****ing bath
Matt Hancock is presently on his feet in parliament, like all the accusations of gross incompetence on his behalf, which directly led to the deaths of thousands, never even happened. Not even acknowledged by little Matty. Doesn't even care.
Rather than just slagging off everything, why not list how you would have actually managed the pandemic differently?
There is a whole thread on this. Have a read. You'll see that all though the pandemic the advice that Johnson was ignoring (from people with expertise that extends beyond his of writing fiction dressed up as fact) was informing debate in there, well beyond "it's all very difficult, don't be hard on him".
This is exactly what Cummings did yesterday.
So at the start of this thread the problem was that Johnson was doing what Cummings told him. 65 pages later the problem is that Johnson wasn't doing what Cummings told him.
From zero to hero binners?
We need to get the message out that a lot of people in care homes survived Hitler's bombs but couldn't survive Dumbojo's incompetence.
The most fervent gammon would have to agree.
Not normally interested in politics will admit but I think Boris has had to tread a difficult balance of lockdown/economy/keeping everyone happy. I respect all views above regardless of whether I agree with them or not, but…
Rather than just slagging off everything, why not list how you would have actually managed the pandemic differently? How would you have saved 1000’s of lives, kept the economy going, kept every part of the country happy, vaccinated everyone more quickly and got the pubs open more quickly 🤔
The problem with your question is people on here don't/didn't have access to the resources Bojo & chums had.
I agree that the job was incredibly difficult and mistakes were inevitable but not turning up to Cobra meetings and allegedly lying about facts are quite inexcusable.
Why are you blindly repeating the nonsense that a Corbyn government would have been worse in dealing with the pandemic
I don't think a Corbyn government would have done any better. They were no better prepared or skilled to deal with a pandemic. They may not have made the same mistakes but they would have made other mistakes. I don't know if you ever saw Cornyn when under pressure, he wasn't very good!
However, that is besides the point as Corbyn wasn't the leader and we can only tackle the actual mistakes made by the government in power at the time.
Blatant mistakes such as sending people back to care homes without a test (which the NHS also have to take some responsibility for) need to be addressed
Here's hoping to day really does reveal the properly damaging stuff that has been hinted at, Cummings may well be an integral part of the mistakes and chaos we now have but he definitely knows how to set up a storyline to deliver a bombshell at the end.
Interesting paper headlines this morning, Express stating its all about revenge, more sane editors going with the the tens of thousands of preventable deaths headline, and the others trying to find the middle ground that fits their demographic.
No obvious cats dropped overnight to distract us though.
I feels to me like they are all waiting to see which way the electorate go on all of this before really pulling out the knives. In normal times this would be the start of a media assassination of the government leading to a General Election being called but due to the government's seemingly untouchable majority and incredibly favourable opinion poll lead no matter what they do every media outlet is taking the middle ground for now. Report the facts, add in the odd opinion piece that aligns with the paper's normal bias and wait to see how the readers react. The issue I see is that we have a sunny Bank Holiday about to happen and that will sway the mood towards the government as lots of people will just remember that the vaccine has allowed them a few days on the beach, in the pub and seeing friends. The 140k+ dead will be seen as a unavoidable sacrifice that was required to allow us left to go back to our normal lives.
Please let today turn the tide in favour of getting this lot out!
So at the start of this thread the problem was that Johnson was doing what Cummings told him. 65 pages later the problem is that Johnson wasn’t doing what Cummings told him.
From zero to hero binners?
The way he was portrayed was at the real power, the one really taking the decisions. What we learnt yesterday was that in reality it was Boris and he mainly ignored what Cummings and everybody else advised.
he mainly ignored what Cummings and everybody else advised.
So it turns out that what you thought about Cummings was wrong???
It's really time to sit down and have that cup of tea binners.
Binners wasn't working in the Cabinet Office last year Ernie, he has only heard Cummings' take on his time in government at the same time as the rest of us.
So it turns out that what you thought about Cummings was wrong???
Yesterday seemed to confirm that we were all wrong about Cummings role. Rather than some all-powerful Machiavellian puppet-master, he was simply another adviser who's recommendations Boris ignored
What we learnt yesterday was that in reality it was Boris and he mainly ignored what Cummings and everybody else advised.
"**** attempts to shift blame".
Maybe, but having been (pretty tragically) glued to the whole thing yesterday, his account seemed all too believable. It simply confirmed what a lot of us already thought. A sorry tale of chaos and incompetence among people wholly unsuited for such responsibility
I don’t think a Corbyn government would have done any better. They were no better prepared or skilled to deal with a pandemic.
Pointless to speculate.
How about putting the kettle on binners?
I’m sure you’ll feel a lot better after a nice cup of tea.
I'm disappointed in you, ernie. I expected you to at least recommend a specific kind of tea - what with you being a world-renowned expert on the subject, just like every ****ing thing else...🙄
