I heard his opening line and tbh we are actually discussing the same thing - fiction with a polemic 😉
Boom, tish!
Neil, no worries.
As someone has said already, to the believer he is king to them right now, but we also believe he will literally be King one day. Revelation for example, a prophetic book in the bible, speaks of a time that is yet to come.
If they leave me alone and stop preachin I am in
The ironic thing is that these threads have been dominated of late by Mike Tually, molgrips, Woppit and JY, none of whom are believers - so who is doing the preaching?
Well we dont do organised services to our followers on a sunday so what do you think?
We dont send letters to like minded folk telling them to oppose gay marriage or whatever view it is we may have.
We dont have an exhaulted place in schools where by they have to do a daily service of worship re our ideas.
Should I go on?
best not might be a bit preachy 😉
Revelation for example, a prophetic book in the bible, speaks of a time that is yet to come.
Ah. So any prophesies Jesus failed to fulfil, that's because he's saving it up for next time?
I have to say, looking through that very useful list, a lot of those prophesies are very shaky: He will be born of a woman (no kidding). He will be called a Immanuel (by his mother) - not Jesus then? He will be called a Nazarene..I look at Matthew to see that Joseph took him to live in Nazareth "So was fulfilled what was said through the prophets, that he would be called a Nazarene." Yet, when I look at the OT scripture that supposedly supports this, it says "Out of the stump of David’s family[a] will grow a shoot". It makes no mention of what town the messiah will be associated with. When I looked into this a bit I find that nowhere did "The prophets" say he would be called a Nazarene. This little quote is forced into the job because of some obscure pun to do with Nazarenes and shoots.
And so it goes on. It all looks a lot like people looking for prophesy with the benefit of hindsight and then endowing vague and opaque phrases with meaning. I still say, you got the Wrong Guy!
i do not think it is possible to 'debate' with so called theologians, they are misguided at best, and apologists for tyranny at worst.
"Ah. So any prophesies Jesus failed to fulfil, that's because he's saving it up for next time?"
My comment may look like a 'get out' on the face of it, but its not. There is a distinct portion of biblical prophesy that hasn't happened yet, or has happened between the writing of the bible and now. For example, the seven church ages described in Revelation, six of them have happened, one of them is currently coming to pass. The reforming if Israel happened after the 2nd world war, etc. (Have a look at the prophesies of Daniel and the world kingdoms that have come and gone, interesting stuff) The fact that not all prophecy happened in biblical times actually confirms the bible to many believes rather than discrediting it.
Well we dont do organised services to our followers on a sunday so what do you think?
Well perhaps you shouldn't go if you want to be left alone.
We dont send letters to like minded folk telling them to oppose gay marriage or whatever view it is we may have.
I didn't realise you were on their mailing lists, perhaps you should ask to be removed if you want to be left alone
We dont have an exhaulted place in schools where by they have to do a daily service of worship re our ideas.
I had not realised you send your kids to a church school, perhaps you should choose another or indeed opt out as you are entitled to do.
Should I go on?
Perhaps you shouldn't
Would it them be okay to say that you don't think any fat people should wear leggings?
Leggings may not be the best way to flatter your figure - yes
Put it away fattie your corpulent hulk disgusts me - no
molgrips;
Does that involuntary knee jerking cause you pain?
Sorry, not following.
so who is doing the preaching?
I'm trying! Although it didn't end well for that other guy who tried to get people to be nice to each other.
PS enjoying the actual bible debate on here - is that a Jewish viewpoint?
🙄
Well perhaps you shouldn't go if you want to be left alone.
Eh I said we dont do them as i was accused of preaching [ a reasonable point to be fair] so that makes no sense as I have nto said or suggested I go to church
I didn't realise you were on their mailing lists, perhaps you should ask to be removed if you want to be left alone
See above - it was also widely reported in the press they had done this and what the letters said
I had not realised you send your kids to a church school, perhaps you should choose another or indeed opt out as you are entitled to do.
Point 1 - All schools need to do this legally not just religious ones - I know imagine if aethist were doing this - aethist service every day in a religious school.
Point 2 - you have the right to go to the religioous school of your choice you do not have the right to not go to a religious scholl if you choose to- ie they send ou to the nearest school and if it is religious tough luck
TBH i am not really sure what the point of your post was as you seem to have stretched what I said to breaking point.
If you must do this could it be funnier?
They are rolling in the aisles here.
To be fair the world of comedy is not missing either of us
Leggings may not be the best way to flatter your figure - yes
Put it away fattie your corpulent hulk disgusts me - no
If the person saying the latter is someone with a history of insulting the obese, perhaps you should turn the other cheek and not engage with them?
Well, I suppose prophesies may get fulfilled if enough people who believe them devote their lives to bringing them about. Jesus clearly believed he would be back pretty quickly:The reforming if Israel happened after the 2nd world war, etc.
"Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom." (Matthew 16:28)
And yet this hasn't happened. Did he change his mind? Did he lie to his followers? Or was he THE WRONG GUY...
If the person saying the latter is someone with a history of insulting the obese, perhaps you should turn the other cheek and not engage with them?
Touche.
This game is fun:
"And a harvest of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace." James 3:18
There's some interesting stuff on the genealogy issue and OT prophesies on this (admittedly obviously biased) website: http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/paul_carlson/nt_contradictions.html
Some good points Neil,
I agree that you can make something happen, but your example of a nation re-forming is unprecedented, this (as far as I'm aware) has never happened before in history; and if your saying that the Holocaust happened to achieve this, well thats pretty extreme measures to make a single bible verse 'come true'. Think about it, Israel wasn't at its strongest when it reformed, there was something very meaningful about this.
Regarding Matt 16:28, have a look what happens in the next few verses. many people believe this is the fulfillment (the transfiguration of Christ). Some say its Acts chapter 2 (Pentecost) where the power of God's spirit is given to men. I'm undecided which, personally, but happy to accept either.
