It’s really not a cause for self-congratulation.
My contribution goes further than the tax I pay. As does yours, I’m sure.
To continue contributing, in whatever form, is perceived to be complicit with current government actions in my mind, and to many outside the uk.
Although I’m currently contributing to discourse on important matters on a uk based forum. So I guess I’m still part of the problem!
To continue contributing, in whatever form, is perceived to be complicit with current government actions in my mind, and to many outside the uk
No because the country is more than the government.
To continue contributing, in whatever form, is perceived to be complicit with current government actions in my mind, and to many outside the uk.
Hang on, let me get this straight, are you saying that anyone who contributes to the UK in any way, as in by living here, is complicit to government actions? Is this the new remainer line, that anyone who is against brexit should leave on a point of principle? And you wonder why you lost the referendum? I’m sorry but that’s deranged.
Is this the new remainer line, that anyone who is against brexit should leave on a point of principle?
(slow clap)
You got them all bang to rights. Good sampling. I've followed this thread with interest and much sadness, yet it’s finally cheering to know that Brexit was won not by years of drip drip austerity, drip drip (then gush gush) tabloid lies and propaganda. Not by a successful misinformation campaign and giant hoardings of swarthy looking immigrants queuing for 1000s of miles to get in and ‘break’ us. Not by fake news at all, no sir. Jonathan Swift is absolutely not spinning in his grave like a gyroscope.
No. It was because of one bloke on an MTB forum.
And you wonder why you lost the referendum?
My angrily victorious Most Brexity Friend Forever loudly protested to his friends and family last year that ‘anyone who didn’t vote Brexit doesn’t want the best for This Country and they should **** off to Europe’. He hadn’t been drinking either. He didn’t say the word ‘traitor’.
And yet he wonders how he won the referendum.
(Fantastic work Holmes. No really...)
But I’ll take your one disillusioned and angry mountain biker and raise you 150 Brexit supporters winners
A Conservative councillor has started a petition to make opposing Brexit into an act of treason.
Christian Holliday's petition, on the House of Commons website, calls for an amendment to the Treason Felony Act to make supporting UK membership of the European Union a crime.
Three days after its launch, the petition had gathered around 150 signatures - far short of the 10,000 required for the Government to respond or the 100,000 needed for the proposal to be debated in Parliament.
No wonder they won the referendum, eh?
Stayt and Munchetty set for the naughty step/rubbish bin? Another nail in the BBC coffin. Etc.
If only they hadn't taken away our freedom of movement...
Simon Heffer just wrote in the Telegraph:
Are we ‘there’ yet? Can’t tell right now if the Telegraph is the Rochdale Herald or 1930’s-era Daily Mail.
Let’s check Simon Heffer’s reckoning:
Yep, definitely not enough white middle aged people there. I wonder who he could mean? Oh.
@salad_dodger how else would they have stopped the people leaving. I still think remainers should have been given the option to keep their EU passports as long as they left the UK and stayed gone. Some kind of amnesty deal with EU countries.
Then there is this scandal from our racist government
this man should have been working to reduce the pandemic. He had the skills, he was offered the job, Westminster refused him a visa and he is going to be deported. utterly scandalous and simply racist
I still think remainers should have been given the option to keep their EU passports as long as they left the UK and stayed gone. Some kind of amnesty deal with EU countries.
Well as per all Brexit U.K. half assed U.K. deals they didn’t .
If you’d actually voted by your feet before Brexit day you got the right to reside/work in a host country not the full Kahuna of being able to reside/work in any of them.
The stench of Brexit stills lives with you until you have enough years to get your host countries passport.
Everything about that case stinks TJ. Utterly depressing. Britain is sliding into something very troubling.
The stench of Brexit stills lives with you
It will stay with all of us for a very long time.
The shame and ridicule this has brought upon us internationally will take a lifetime to erase. Even if we start acting like grownups right now.
Everything about that case stinks TJ. Utterly depressing. Britain is sliding into something very troubling.
Very much so.
The stench of Brexit stills lives with you until you have enough years to get your host countries passport.
Sweden has been good to UK migrants (or as my friends here call Remainers: "political refugees"). They said that, as long as you were in the country at the time Brexit happened (with a job or the means to support yourself), then you could apply for residency and, after the qualifying number of years, citizenship. No work visa etc in the meantime.
Today I am driving to the next city over to have my photo taken for my residency permit and, next month, I hope to be able to apply for citizenship here. I left because I wanted to and, luckily, I could. It cost me a lot, emotionally and physically, but I have zero regrets. Ok, maybe one or two.
Everything about that case stinks TJ. Utterly depressing. Britain is sliding into something very troubling.
England not Britain - the two are not synonyms
*runs for the hills *
‘anyone who didn’t vote Brexit doesn’t want the best for This Country and they should **** off to Europe
The results would be hilarious! Half the country and nearly all the well educated affluent professionals.
It’s a rich man’s world
[ contains some lovely donkeys to soften the message a bit, thankfully ]
https://twitter.com/jamesmatesitv/status/1374255999360626688?s=21
Is this the new remainer line, that anyone who is against brexit should leave on a point of principle?
No Daz, that’s a syllogism you’ve created. And one which doesn’t stand up.
No Daz, that’s a syllogism you’ve created. And one which doesn’t stand up.
Par for the course.
Daz is the brexitiest remainer I know.
Still needs addressing, honestly. Johnson & Gove picked one option to “get Brexit done”, but they now need to admit/explain it to the public, and put the work in. The government can’t just pretend the border checks aren’t going to be there.
https://twitter.com/emporersnewc/status/1367478313074188291?s=21
Last week there was a minister on Nihal on Radio 5 taking questions. Said EU wouldn't enforce immigration rules with UK nationals (but we would with EU national). "They need us more than we need them".
Just WTF.
I assume your travel insurance would no longer be valid if you overstay your visa among a million other but but buts.
Daz is the brexitiest remainer I know.
I'm neither to be honest. I just don't attach much importance to being a citizen of either the EU or the UK. All of you ranting about English nationalism but then looking at the EU as if it's some utopian heaven are not much different to the brexiters you say you despise. You're still identifying yourselves as part of a tribe based on who governs you, the only thing that differs is where the borders are drawn and who the leaders are. Personally I just get on with my life without worrying much about whether I'm English, British or European because I have no control over that. I'd rather we were still in the EU, because it has some benefits I'd like to take advantage of, which is mostly being able to move abroad some day and my kids having the option to work in Europe if they want, but outside of that it makes little difference.
looking at the EU as if it’s some utopian heaven
Stop making stuff up.
the only thing that differs is where the borders are drawn
And how we treat people just because they happen to cross those arbitrary borders.
but outside of that it makes little difference.
To you, maybe.
Tell that to the various food exporters, hauliers and other business owners presently looking at bankruptcy due to all the post-Brexit paperwork, and their employees about to lose their incomes.
I think they might want to correct you on that statement
You’re still identifying yourselves as part of a tribe based on who governs you
It's not quite that simple. It's belonging to a tribe based on certain key values - anti-nationalism and co-operation rather than damaging rivalry.
The world is a fantastic place, and many of us want to feel close to other countries, to feel like we belong to an international community. We identify with the community, not the EU government. The UK is acting like the person at the restaurant who refuses to let the bill be split equally, or the person at the pub who only ever buys their own drinks and won't accept them from others. It's just shit. THAT is what I am against, it's nothing to do with simple affiliation.
Stop making stuff up.
There wouldn't be much left, though...
But thanks for calling out daz's monumental strawman doggybollocks again.
From my point of view the EU is not some utopian ideal. I do revel in EU leaders making 'our' leaders look stupid in the same way that I would most other moderate leaders doing so.
But we all know the one who is really laughing his tits off is Putin.
We're busy spunking billions on nuclear warheads where we will still have to rent the delivery system and he's done more damage to the UK already with a few Facebook ads and bunging the likes of Farage, Banks and Cummings a few quid.
Shall I write daz's next post for him? Save us the time?
"It's all very well for you middle class elites on a bike forum to go on about cooperation and internationalism but that doesn't help the poor whites of the former Red Wall put food on the table, if you've got nothing* to look forward to then any change is worth voting for".
*Apart from:
Free healthcare at the point of use
A welfare system
Broadband internet
Etc. Etc. Etc.
Tell that to the various food exporters, hauliers and other business owners
We've already covered this. Most of the food exporters etc trade in stuff I'm ideologically opposed to anyway so I'm not worrying too much about them for obvious reasons.
and many of us want to feel close to other countries
I want to feel closer to people, not countries. Where we're going wrong is nationalism itself, not a particular flavour of it. English nationalism, UK nationalism, EU nationalism, it's all the same to me. You are perfectly capable of being closer to peope in France, Germany etc through your own personal relationships with them, rather than through their governments. It really shouldn't make any difference whether you are governed by the same politicians and civil servants.
The UK is acting like the person at the restaurant who refuses to let the bill be split equally
Totally agree, but I don't feel any guilt or association with that just because I live in the UK. What the government and our politicians do has got bugger all to do with me.
You are perfectly capable of being closer to peope in France, Germany etc through your own personal relationships with them, rather than through their governments.
If only there was a way to reduce the barriers that governments put up to keep people apart.
Bundles of red tape and costs deliberately designed to stop you having to work with people from France, Germany etc... https://pbisemployers.campaign.gov.uk
If only there was a way to reduce the barriers that governments put up to keep people apart.
Indeed. I've said many times borders are stupid and should be removed. Like I said, the problem is nationalism itself, and its physical manifestations in the form of borders etc.
We’ve already covered this. Most of the food exporters etc trade in stuff I’m ideologically opposed to anyway so I’m not worrying too much about them for obvious reasons.
Just to clarify, you dont care what happens to person X based on your personal ideology?
Indeed. I’ve said many times borders are stupid and should be removed. Like I said, the problem is nationalism itself, and its physical manifestations in the form of borders etc.
Yet as a UK citizen I now feel like my EU passport has more stupid borders on it, not less. How is being a citizen of one country now somehow better than being a citizen of scores of countries with FOM?
It’s certainly novel hearing someone opposed to the EU on account of it being ‘too nationalistic’. That’s like not supporting Rock against Racism back in 1976 because ‘some rock bands are racist, and anyway, rock music is just another way to steal music from black people...’
We’ve already covered this. Most of the food exporters etc trade in stuff I’m ideologically opposed to anyway so I’m not worrying too much about them for obvious reasons.
The phrase you're looking for is ****'em!
Well as long as all the trees and bunny rabbits are ok....
you dont care what happens to person X based on your personal ideology?
Do I care about fishermen, live exporters and pig farmers? In a word, no. I'd rather they all did other stuff, and if brexit helps with that then that's fine by me.
And what about all the vegetable, fruit and mushroom growers? Spoken to any of them about any of this yet? It's not looking good for them.
^^
Brexit is the choice for veganism and ethical farming. You read it here first. Meanwhile, why does UK law not recognise animals as sentient beings?
*Edit: Wait, am I being trolled by DazH or by The Guardian? Could be both I suppose...
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jul/28/brexit-likely-to-create-a-rise-in-uk-megafarms
Brexit is the choice for veganism and ethical farming. You read it here first.
Nope, not what I said. But you have to look for silver linings where you can find them.
What about the cheesemakers?
Or any manufacturers of dairy products?
Just popped back into this thread for a mo, and yes, you're all still arguing amongst yourselves. As a thread, its become pointless.
What about the cheesemakers?
Or any manufacturers of dairy products?
Do I care about fishermen, live exporters and pig farmers? In a word, no
That's a really dodgy precedent you've set there.
I'm vegan btw.
^
you have to look for silver linings where you can find them.
Chapter 6, Page 142 of ‘Crisis Capitalism’?
“close the borders and start making soap from flesh because the upshot is good news for those clean-looking Nationalists and the nice man at the soap company”. Win-win”.
That’s a really dodgy precedent you’ve set there.
I care as much about pig farmers as I do the jobs of public executioners, manufacturers of weapons of mass destruction, arms traders or other professions which benefit from death and suffering. I don't know why that would be a surprise. I'm not going to celebrate the fact that brexit is the vehicle for their potential demise, but neither am I going to feel any remorse.
What about the cheesemakers?
The same pretty much. Although the difference with cheesemakers is that they could easily turn their skills to making cheese out of plants rather than animal products, and I think many eventually will. Have you seen the massive variety of vegan cheese in your average supermarket?
