So the Army are being used as a Police force,
Peterloo
Bloody Sunday
Black and Tans
The army are not and should never be deployed as a police force.
So you reckon they'll be on good overtime rates? You're obviously not to clear on how these companies operate.
Also fairly naive to think that, once you factor in housing benefit, council tax relief etc, that you'd be better off living in central London on £6 an hour. It's called the benefits trap. There's tax credits of course. Which is a nice government approved phrase that means that we, the taxpayer, effectively subsidise companies like G4S, tesco etc to pay subsistence level wages, while they cream off enormous profits. Which they'll pay eff all tax on of course. Because that's what's happening here!
It's called the benefits trap. There's tax credits of course. Which is a nice government approved phrase that means that we, the taxpayer, effectively subsidise companies like G4S, tesco etc to pay subsistence level wages,
which is basically why in work benefits should be scrapped and the minimum wage set at a level where yu can afford to live.
Has anyone told the RAF they will have to work the weekends ?
It's difficult enough getting decent staff & paying that hourly rate will not help,but then it's only temporary, not very inviting is it..
Still no problem at all with any military function doing a bit of security work rather than polishing shoes/running around carrying rucksacks full of books/ camping on Dartmoor .... seems all leave cancelled will be re paid and any cancellation of holidays be compensated for.
Nope.. still can't see anything at all wrong with it. Its what we pay them for.
As for G4S then surely a refund/payback clause is in place. Contracts of that magnitude always have and always do.
Still no problem at all with any military function doing a bit of security work rather than polishing shoes/running around carrying rucksacks full of books/ camping on Dartmoor
No the army should be training to fight that is what we pay them for, they are not security guards or police men. The army have shown time and again they are not police. They are not trained to be police, they are not trained to restrain crowds.
Agree with you completely mrmo. We're subsidising these companies enormous profits. And to show their gratitude they move their head office to a tax haven to avoid contributing anything back to the society they're taking so much from
So this could be an opportunity to train them to do something else other than sitting around..or are you happy to see more tax payers money be under used ...
They will need extra training when they all leave at some point in their careers , there's an option..
Still don't see a problem with it.
So this could be an opportunity to train them to do something else other than sitting around..or are you happy to see more tax payers money be under used ...
No I'm not happy to see more tax payers money be under used. What we need is more wars to keep our military busy.
Or failing that, get them to do socially useful jobs like refuse collection, repairing roads, delivering the post, etc. It would save the taxpayer a small fortune.
Of course we could just make a load redundant and sack them - if there aren't enough wars to send them to. Has anyone in government suggested that ?
People are just idle.
And funnily enough people always get particularly idle when the Tories are back in government - and unemployment goes through the roof.
People always seem to be more keen to work when Labour are in government.
The army are trained to restrain crowds just no one likes how we do it.
People always seem to be more keen to work when Labour are in government.
Really?
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So the Army are being used as a Police force
Fear not, they're being used to cover gaps in security personnel, under MACA we hold the powers of civvies, not the police.
Cheeky and bike boys: nice trolling!!
I think a visit to your nearest RAF, Army or Naval unit would do you good if you genuinely feel that! You're clearly misinformed.
The Black and Tans were not 'the army', they were auxiliaries, albeit largely demobbed soldiers.
Peterloo was not 'the army', it was local yeomanry and Bloody Sunday comparisons are frankly ludicrous. The armed forces (not solely 'the army') are not being deployed in a police role. Just doing the same tasks as bog standard security guards, only in all likelihood far more efficiently. However, they shouldn't have to and it's a disgrace that they'll have holidays, leave, weddings etc disrupted due to this clusterf@@k.
Er, bikebouy, are our armed forces just sitting around are they? With the way the Forces are paid, i'd not be surprised if they don't get any extra pay for this while others are clammering for extra during the Olympics.
However, has anyone told the RAF they will have to work after 3pm and the weekend won't start and end at wednesday?
G4S/Serco/Crapita: profiting hugely from the fragmentation of public services [i]and[/i] making a pish-poor job of running things.
Where's all the 'efficiency' we've been told about? Or did it just appear to Oliver Letwin in a dream?
Edit: given the numbers of troops who are being recalled from leave to save the shambles that is [s]Theresa May[/s] the Olympics, perhaps now is the time to dig up Old Ironsides and have him march on Parliament (again).
The whole thing issue is a shower of %$£*
this sums it up
Dear Serving Soldier,
I appreciate that you may be a bit busy at the moment, but just before I give you the sack would you mind awfully helping out at a small sporting event we are holding in London this month. You see I have just spent £475,000,000 on a private firm to do the security but they trousered the money and can not commit. I have managed to wangle an old warehouse for your accommodation & some rat packs for food, but you should be used to that by now.(Gotta keep the cost down L.O.L).
Many thanks David Cameron.
P.S. You're my favourites!
the crabs arnt to happy
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/477759-olympic-call-ups.html
or the pongos
http://www.arrse.co.uk/current-affairs-news-analysis/184647-sports-day-additional-3500-troops-g4s-drops-ball-but-not-bill.html
not sure about the Navy boys
Oh and for those who dont know but there isnt overtime or bonus for the armed services unlike the Police,tube staff etc
Not impressed here either:
[url= http://www.navy-net.co.uk/current-affairs/66243-armed-forces-olympics-standby.html ]Rum Ration[/url]
[b]bikebouy[/b], here's an idle thought:
"[b]bikebouy[/b]... what a cnt."
The word means nowt without you.
Had a paratrooper scan my bag on my way in yesterday. can't see it a valuable use of resources. nice enough guys and certainly more switched on than the g4s lot who just congregated in packs pointing and speaking in broken English. don't feel any safer though. in a crisis the best than can manage is a Chinese death grip, as they don't have weapons.
No fear, G4S will simply change their name again. As Group Four Security they made a total b*ll*cks of prisoner transportation (paid for by us of course)so meet the new boss. same as the old boss
Zulu-Eleven - MemberPeople always seem to be more keen to work when Labour are in government.
Really?
Yes that's right ......... unemployment tends to be considerably higher under Conservative governments than under Labour governments.
Of course I don't expect you to accept this fact Z-11, because you so clearly despise the truth.
BTW Z-11, you still haven't responded to my claim that the the Olympic security contract was awarded in March last year - when there was no Labour government in power. Are you accepting that you were lying earlier in the thread when you falsely stated that the contract was awarded by a Labour government ?
not sure about the Navy boys
The word you're looking for is codheads.
Make that 3 on this forum who knew a month ago... Unfortunately certain organisations, outside the military, seem to have buried their heads in the sand and ignored warnings - Dannatt summed that up quite well last night on Newsnight.
Oh to be able to speak freely about it without getting in trouble...
And you'd think with all of those Work Programme recruits sold to G4S that they couldn't train enough of them in time...
I spoken to a guy two weeks back at a party whom's son is in the Army
and his sons's Platoon was told that whilst they was in Cyprus preparing
to go to Afghanistan they will be split in half and one half will be going to the Olympics.
The worrying thing is the guys going to Afghanistan are thinking
they are going to be the lucky ones ?
I would say I would rather see and be protected by the Army than the two bob people
G4S hires
At least the Army would give 100% to protect you
Just to add a little more, the military that are being sent are NOT getting any extra money BUT are being CHARGED food & accommodation to work at the games.
So to sum up, I've lost my leave and going to be massively out of pocket to work for 4 weeks.
The MoD have an in house civilian security service (MGS) that are perfectly qualified for the job* ........ shame they've already started making them redundant.
*probably cheaper than the services too.
Cheeky and bike boys: nice trolling!!
I think a visit to your nearest RAF, Army or Naval unit would do you good if you genuinely feel that! You're clearly misinformed.
I did visit the RN careers office back in 84' after that I did a 12 year stint, loved it but John majors government made me redundant, one thing I did learn was a man without a sense of humour is normally a bit of a walt.
The MoD have an in house civilian security service (MGS) that are perfectly qualified for the job* ........ shame they've already started making them redundant.*probably cheaper than the services too.
Cheaper yes, but take them to do the security at the games leaving MoD establishments unguarded means the troops will still lose their leave as they'll have to backfill MGS guarding MoD establishments so makes no difference who from within the MoD is taken for London. Except maybe all the civil servants sat around in the re-deployment pool...
The MoD have an in house civilian security service (MGS) that are perfectly qualified for the job* ........ shame they've already started making them redundant.*probably cheaper than the services too.
Cheaper yes, but take them to do the security at the games leaving MoD establishments unguarded means the troops will still lose their leave as they'll have to backfill MGS guarding MoD establishments so makes no difference who from within the MoD is taken for London.
Some of the MGS were trained up last November to fill in for other public servants, they've now been told to expect a nice holiday in West London next week.... So not available for venue security.
The military looked after all the security for the Barcelona Games in 92, I think they are best suited for the task in hand.
The military looked after all the security for the Barcelona Games in 92
That surprised me so I checked, and apparently the military did not look after all the security for the Barcelona Games. Quote :
[i]In 1988 a security model was adopted that integrated public and private resources under the authority of the Commission for Olympic Security and integrated the efforts of the National Police, the Guardia Civil, the Mossos d’Esquadra (Catalan Police), the Barcelona City Police, other local police forces, the Army, the Navy and the Air Force
Due to the locations of the venues, training sites, athletes’ village and official hotels, the National Police had responsibility for about 80% of the Olympic facilities security[/i]
It would seem that the military were mostly responsible for security at airports, the port of Barcelona, essential public services such as water, fuel and electric supplies, broadcast stations, telephone relay points, transportation services, water competition areas and territorial waters.
http://www.iwar.org.uk/homesec/resources/olympic-security/maples.htm
Security at the 2004 Games in Athens was also mostly supplied by civilian government organizations. I suspect that the best recent example of the extensive use of the military for security is probably the Beijing Games. Yep, we're becoming more like China, and less like other European countries.
