[Closed] Are you glad you're British?

Glad to have been born and to reside in this country, not really into the flag waving/chest beating regional thing.
Thankful not to have been born in Scotland, Wales or Yorkshire with all the associated baggage that often comes with that.

MrSmith - Member
Glad to have been born and to reside in this country, not really into the flag waving/chest beating regional thing...

We'd like that in Scotland.

We'd like that in Scotland.

That's from no less an authority than the Ordnance Survey (3rd Aug 2011 "The difference between UK, Britain and the British Isles")

But they do.

"Technically, if you lose the ‘Great,’ Britain only refers to England and Wales."

It's not my selective memory, it's feeding off people around me, Molgrips. If Britain had Suez France had Algeria so I've never heard a reproach about Suez. French people are as likely to have heard of Enoch as Brits of Jean Moulin. Homosexuality has had a similar status in both countries though France had publically homosexual high ranking public figures a little earlier - not an issue people raise about the UK anyway.

If I tell people I was born in Birmingham it's quite pleasing if they say "that's where Robert Plant/Ozzy/Slade/Judas Priest come(s) from, right ?". Less so if they start ranting about cake and eating it. That's the evolution in people's perceptions of Britain I live.

Ok fair point Ed, you're talking about external perception. But likewise in the UK we think of sunshine, Alps, good food and Mediterranean culture when we think of France, because that's what we go there for. We tend not to think of Algeria, Le Penn, Vichy or Napoleon.

We think of our own countries differently, not least because we know our own histories better and generally when we're here we're not on holiday 🙂

I like what Teamhurtmore said.

Oh, and I am pleased that most of you have stuck to the word 'glad', and not confused it with 'proud'.

I picked proud as I am not because I was confused.

I like where I live and Britain generally. There's lots of other lovely places, but home is great. I'd miss pubs, real seasons, multiculturalism, sense of humour and lots more.

real seasons

You're joking, right? We get less 'real seasons' than most places outside the tropics! You can have the same day basically any time of year, and we frequently do.

Where my wife's from it's hot endless sunshine in summer, with the odd storm; crisp cool sunny autumn days with spectacular leaves; hard cold and deep snow in winter. Every year.

'Glad', but not enthusiastic.

A better question would be are you glad you were born in Britain? Which for pretty much everyone should be yes, absolutely. Being born in this country is a massive stroke of luck when you consider what many other places are like. Does that means I'm glad to be British? Not really, because being British is mostly a political construct resulting from centuries of wars and exploitation of the poor by the rich/powerful. If I could choose, I wouldn't be anything, but you can't, so there's very little point in either being pleased or p*ssed off about it.

English, but wish I could say that with the pride and conviction that the Scots do. I feel that England doesn't project much of its own identity.

I picked proud as I am not because I was confused.

Aren't you a Geordie, though? In which case, I get the pride thing.

upshift - Member
English, but wish I could say that with the pride and conviction that the Scots do. I feel that England doesn't project much of its own identity.

England is a great country. You should be proud of it. The virtues outweigh the negatives IMO.

Aren't you a Geordie, though? In which case, I get the pride thing.

Yup, it might help.

You're joking, right? We get less 'real seasons' than most places outside the tropics! You can have the same day basically any time of year, and we frequently do.

We still have seasons though.

I feel that England doesn't project much of its own identity.

That is a virtue.

We still have seasons though.

Yes but they are far less pronounced than in other parts of the world.

But more than others which is kind of the point they were getting at.

I think only the tropics have less seasonal variation than us.

Eh?

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-british-citizens-leaving-migration-impact-irish-passports-latest-eu-referendum-fears-racism-a7914606.html ]Exodus[/url]

Seasons are pish,

My best day in the hills this year, views etc.... 2nd of January.

English, but wish I could say that with the pride and conviction that the Scots do. I feel that England doesn't project much of its own identity

We are not allowed to, it upsets our less fortunate neighbours. Odd really.

We are not allowed to, it upsets our less fortunate neighbours. Odd really.

What I find odd is how people who claim to love Britain can have such a poor understanding of it. Welsh and Scottish nationalists aren't opposed to English identity, they're generally supportive of it.

real seasons
You're joking, right? We get less 'real seasons' than most places outside the tropics! You can have the same day basically any time of year, and we frequently do.

Didn't read everything, but the point being brought up about embarrassed about brexit seems ludicrous. Was in Spain and France for several weeks. Interacted with the locals, and various other nationalities. Issue never came up, never had any negative flow from people and as far as I can tell, not even an issue for anyone. Really not a thing.

Probably didn't want to embarrass you.

I don't correlate nationality to where I live. I wasn't born here but there is no other country where I want to live for a variety of reason and despite the recent populist penchants of the under-educated of late.

I don't believe in nationality anyway, I have found a similar proportion of morons and nice people in any nationality.

Nationalism has become the opium of the people IMO.

I have found a similar proportion of morons and nice people in any nationality.

Me too but that doesn't stop me believing that a country like Scotland would be best governed by people who live in Scotland

I'm glad I'm not American

Very happy and proud to be Brtiish

If I had to chose another nationality it would be Swiss mainly for the stunning landscape and pkayground of mountains and lakes at the heart of Europe

Is that not what I just said?

Great Britain is the entire island, and Britain is the southern bit that stops at the Scottish border, ie Britain is England and Wales.

Thus British = English and Welsh.

You realise you are using a definition of British that might just have held water about 2,000 years ago? I know you are always trying to forward a very virulent anti-British agenda but this is taking it to extreme levels of silliness.

English, but wish I could say that with the pride and conviction that the Scots do. I feel that England doesn't project much of its own identity

Not allowed to stick a St Georges flag up outside your house either cos that shows your'e a racist.
The Scots & the Welsh are allowed though. & probably the Irish too.

kennyp - Member
You realise you are using a definition of British that might just have held water about 2,000 years ago? I know you are always trying to forward a very virulent anti-British agenda but this is taking it to extreme levels of silliness.

Your rabid opposition to the right of Scots to seek democratic freedom is blinding you to what the Ordnance Survey says. Or do you believe it is infested with Scots?

They define Britain quite clearly. And that has been the definition for a very long time. The Victorians didn't call the Scots British. They knew the difference. They called us North British.

If you don't like the OS definition, tough, I can't change it for you, but if it really sticks in your throat that we call ourself Scottish, we won't be offended if you call us Great British.

As for me being anti-British, look a few posts further back where I say England is a great country and something to be proud off.

My agenda is political freedom for Scotland, and nothing to do with being anti-British.

So I'll always be Scottish not British (ie not English or Welsh).

Your rabid opposition to the right of Scots to seek democratic freedom is blinding you to what the Ordnance Survey says. Or do you believe it is infested with Scots?

They define Britain quite clearly. And that has been the definition for a very long time. The Victorians didn't call the Scots British. They knew the difference. They called us North British.

If you don't like the OS definition, tough, I can't change it for you, but if it really sticks in your throat that we call ourself Scottish, we won't be offended if you call us Great British.

As for me being anti-British, look a few posts further back where I say England is a great country and something to be proud off.

My agenda is political freedom for Scotland, and nothing to do with being anti-British.

You just don't get it, do you? I am all in favour of Scots having the right to decide their future in a democratic way. We had a vote in 2014 that your leader assured us was a once in a lifetime referendum and you lost. Do you understand that? You lost! The Scottish people spoke and what they said was that we want to remain part of the UK.

You talk about democracy, but a few months ago I asked you if you would accept the result of a second referendum once and for all. Your reply was no, you would want a third, fourth, fifth referendum, however many it takes till we vote the way you want. Where's the democracy in that?

And as for that old "England is a great country" thing, that's straight out the SNP propaganda machine. The thing they are all told is to stress how great England is because that's more acceptable. Plus it emphasises the difference between England and Scotland to encourage the thinking of them as totally separate. I as told that by an SNP insider.

I have no issue at all with you calling yourself Scottish. I'm Scottish too. I'll be at Murrayfield next year cheering Scotland on against the "auld enemy". The difference is that I recognise our differences get left behind on the sporting field.

Yes, I'm sure you do want what you think is best for Scotland. However you need to start realising that so do I, and so did the majority of the folk who voted to remain British. We are sick to the back teeth of being told we are traitors to our country or that we don't want what is best for Scotland.

Scotland isn't some English colony ruled by the iron fist of St George. We are a great wee country that is part of a great bigger country. We voted to stay that way Deal with it!!!

Apologies if any of this sounds personal. It isn't. I appreciate you want a certain thing. But get to grips with the fact I want essentially the same thing. Please.

Lucky, but not proud. The scary rise of the voice of PC in this country is worrying and embarrassing. There's no space for honesty or simplicity without fear of some group of people shouting how offended they are, how things should be another way.

The increase in culture of suing because you're entitled to. Voting in leaders nobody knows or wants. Interfering in global matters we have no right or place to be. Almost half of women rubbing brown sludge on their skin, black marker pens on their eyebrows and turning their hair a horrendous pale yellow. Almost half of young men wearing clothes that are too small for them.

Britain is quite embarrassing overall!

I'm very glad to be British and extremely proud of the way we voted Brexit, we will show Europe the way forward . . . Again

Says the Japanese car buyer.

kennyp - Member
...I am all in favour of Scots having the right to decide their future in a democratic way. We had a vote in 2014 that your leader assured us was a once in a lifetime referendum and you lost. Do you understand that? You lost! The Scottish people spoke and what they said was that we want to remain part of the UK.

Leaders, that's the thing about democracy they are not rulers. We don't have a leader, we have representatives. Whatever Salmond said on his way to his resignation has absolutely no relevance to what the rest of us think and was a throwaway comment, not binding law.

The Scottish people were extensively lied to in a propaganda campaign that sunk to depths unprecedented since the Germans were supposedly spiking babies on their bayonets while simultaneously raping Belgian nuns in WW1. Maybe Brexit came close.

You talk about democracy, but a few months ago I asked you if you would accept the result of a second referendum once and for all. Your reply was no, you would want a third, fourth, fifth referendum, however many it takes till we vote the way you want. Where's the democracy in that?

The democracy is in allowing people a choice, otherwise why bother having General Elections every few years, although it seems the Tories are working on solving that inconvenience.

And as for that old "England is a great country" thing, that's straight out the SNP propaganda machine. The thing they are all told is to stress how great England is because that's more acceptable. Plus it emphasises the difference between England and Scotland to encourage the thinking of them as totally separate. I as told that by an SNP insider.

Are they? I'm not aware of that. I am not and will not ever be a member of that party. I do know they try to tamp down on anti English sentiment, and quite rightly.

Decades ago, the SNP's biggest holdback was when it was infested with racial attitudes to England rather than attending to the real problem - which is the system of government.

Our problem isn't English people, it is the Westminster system of government. And for that matter I think the north of England gets a similar raw deal, but that's up to them to deal with.

Scotland isn't some English colony ruled by the iron fist of St George. We are a great wee country that is part of a great bigger country. We voted to stay that way Deal with it!!!

Not a colony? Then why do we have what is effectively a Governor General in the shape of an appointed Secretary of State for Scotland? Surely in these times of austerity that is a redundant position seeing as we have a Scottish First Minister who is more than capable of representing Scotland's interests.

We had a vote on the matter, yes. I am dealing with it. Democratically insisting on my right for another vote after the material changes in our relationship.

Apologies if any of this sounds personal. It isn't. I appreciate you want a certain thing. But get to grips with the fact I want essentially the same thing. Please.

Pleased to hear that, and once folk like yourself realise that the best people to govern Scotland are those who live here, it will be a better place.

Seems I need to clarify my post:

I admire the way the Scottish promote their national pride. Little things like how products in a supermarket are labelled as "Scottish" - I can't think of an English equivalent. It feels to me as though Scotland and Wales have a clear sense of their national story and the imagery around it, whereas for the English our "story" is woven into the "British" discourse and so we don't project or feel a particulalry unique identity.

I do disagree with the idea that "we're not allowed to fly" St George's crosses, but there is an issue with the negative connotations of the symbol having been associated with the EDL, football hooliganism etc.

To repair divides post-Brexit some significant cultural work should be done to encourage each UK nation to celebrate its heritage and achievements, but then have another national holiday, like Canada Day, to celebrate togetherness. By properly understanding each nation's stories maybe we can better understand our cultural differences and become more united.

I for one am proud to be both English and British and in the coming years we will all need a sense of pride and determination to push through the challenges our nation faces. Currently we're less productive per hour worked than many other European nations and a large number of jobs are about to open up in lower skilled areas as immigration limits take effect, so we need to become more productive AND be ready to take on manual jobs in the meantime. The answer is partly to develop automation to overcome those challenges, especially in the food and agriculture industry (which Brexit will hit hard). We've got a lot of work to do and being positive, realising our strengths and patting ourselves on the back will become important.

Scottishness is woven into Britishness, I think the english are often the other way round, they try and weave britishness into englishness. It's how you get things like the west lothian question, frexample, "How dare [i]they[/i] vote in [i]our[/i] parliament" or not understanding that you can leave the UK but you can't kick another part out. It's pretty understandable, obviously England is the biggest part and does most of the heavy lifting

I don't agree Northwind. I think Scottishness, aside from a particular romanticised vision of lairds and "dashing" highlanders is left out of Britishness. Personally I often cant tell the difference between Englishness and Britishness.
I wish Essel and many others felt they could fly their flag. Perhaps they should after all the flag belongs to all English people not just the EDL nutters.
This is also an issue in Scotland as I think KennyP said. Lots of Yessers fly the saltire in their gardens etc but no voters have as much right to that flag as anyone. I can't be doing with talk of traitors etc . Unionists referring to Natsis is just as bad. It also irritates me that some products that were branded Scottish or with a Saltire are being rebranded as British or with the Union flag. Bells whisky is crap whichever flag is on the bottle.

It also irritates me that some products that were branded Scottish or with a Saltire are being rebranded as British or with the Union flag. Bells whisky is crap whichever flag is on the bottle.

gordimhor - Member

This is also an issue in Scotland as I think KennyP said. Lots of Yessers fly the saltire in their gardens etc but no voters have as much right to that flag as anyone. I can't be doing with talk of traitors etc

Oh, absolutely, drives me up the wall this- nothing's more guaranteed to turn people off than this sort of crap. Quislings, traitors, "enemies of the people"...