[Closed] Are you breaking the law - Stealth Driving Tax

And this is a stealth tax how? It is not a tax and the license have a clear expiry date on them

I have to renew my BC racing licence every year! It is a horrifying conspiracy to separate hard-working cyclists from their cash!

Seriously, after your passport it's the second most important piece of documentation that most people have. Do they really not check this stuff?

😯

[i]The date is listed on the photocard under “4b”. To find out what this means, a driver would have to turn the card over and study even smaller print in an explanatory list, which says “4b licence valid to”. [/i]

Oh yes - very stealthy.

[i]To add to the confusion[/i]

What's confusing about a date in a 'licence vaid to' space? If you find that confusing, I would suggest you shouldn't be given a licence in the first place.

[i]Edmund King, president of the AA, said the DVLA had not done enough to inform drivers of the need to renew photocards.[/i]

Apart from printing the expiry dates on the cards?

Stealth tax? Stupidity tax more like.

Well, it's not really a stealth tax (I went a bit Daily Mail there!), more a hazzard for stupid people!

i for one, have never checked the 'expiry date' on my driving licence, and neither has anyone i know. It has never occured to me that it has one. Maybe i've forgotten over the course of 10 years or so. guess i deserve everything i get...

My licence expires in 2040, so I don't think I have to worry for a while yet.

I don't agree that its a stealth tax - but it is pretty annoying to have to pay and go through the hassle of renewing. I need to sort out mine - didn't realise it meant I might not be insured though!

Do DVLA write and warn you that your licence is about to expire?

aracer - the photo card expires in 10 years, regardless of when your paper licence expires. From your expiry date (when you're 70 years old so you were born in 1970), you would probably have held a licence longer than the photo licences have been about so if you haven't since got a photo licence then you have nothing to worry about.

didn't realise it meant I might not be insured though!

that would probably be an unfair contract term. It says you're still entitled to drive, but in breach of the requirement to surrender the old license, which the insurance company is not required to police.

I've still got a paper license so the expiry doesn't apply to me yet. I remember hiring a car in the usa though and the computer wouldn't accept the fact my license expires in 2050. I actually need to get a photo card now as i've moved recently. the fact that there's no guaranteed turnaround time or fast track service for licenses is a right pain in the bum for getting a photocard and renewing if you hire cars on a semi-regular basis.

Do DVLA write and warn you that your licence is about to expire?

Don't be daft. That would cost money, so they just let your licence run out then fine you. That way they gain twice. No expenditure and guaranteed income.

I've still got a paper licence, and intend to keep it.

clubber - I knew that, but thanks anyway!

[i]so they just let your licence [/i]

[i]They[/i] let your licence run out?

Do DVLA write and warn you that your licence is about to expire?

Don't be daft. That would cost money, so they just let your licence run out then fine you. That way they gain twice. No expenditure and guaranteed income.

Er - yes, they do. Did you read the report? Or just ASSUMED that they're all out to get us?

In fact, it is mentioned twice!

The DVLA said that more than a quarter of drivers due to renew their photocards had not done so, despite being sent reminders.

and later -

Edmund King, president of the AA, said the DVLA had not done enough to inform drivers of the need to renew photocards. “Even if the reminder is sent to the right address, drivers may think it is a piece of junk mail because they assume their licence is valid until they are 70.”

I still have a paper license. It's in a right old mess though, I'll keep hold of it until it actually dissolves. When the wife went to get her car serviced they got all arsey when she presented her photo id license for the courtesy car as it doesn't have a start date on it.

And then they gave her an 2.0t petrol A3 for three days!!! 200bhp in a courtesy car. I had to test it out to make sure it wasn't too powerful for her, obviously.

I have a paper one but, having moved, I'd have to get a photo one (which is more than just the usual cost of a photo update or an address change) and since my parents live at my old address and my current address is liable to change regularly I'm inclined to ignore it.

Photo card licence was a stupid idea, I mean for anything other than a cursory check by a cop on the street, anything involving any level of detail check (producer etc) requires producing the paper part anyway - what the hell is the point?

I'm confused.

I have a two-part license - green paper / pink photo card. The only expiry date I can see is twenty years from now (when I'm 70).

Ah - I see it now. Weird!

You need to look on the photocard bit - that's the bit that expires and you need to get that re-done with a new photo every 10 years

I thought you didn't pay anything for your first photocard if you had an addresschange at the same time

Look at the photo card; on the front it says 4b. 17-1-10 (or something like that)

Turn it over. In microscopic print it has the codebreaker for all the info on the front; of which 4b. Expiry date

Your licence to drive is valid until you are 70 but your photocard needs renewal every 10 years. Because people get older, and their photo changes.

so you have to move when you get a license?

It *is* a stealth tax, it's the governments way of stimulating the housing market.

druidh - look at 4b

[img] [/img]

I'd have to get a photo one if I wanted to have a "clean" licence - hence my SP30 will be staying on there in all it's glory for anybody who cares to see. Might just have to stay living in this house until I'm 70 as well (though the thought of moving all my other junk rather dwarfs the issue of photocard driving licenses!)

My SP30 has stayed on since 1995 as when I changed in 2000 to the photo licence they wanted even more cash to take the spent points off.

I thought you didn't pay anything for your first photocard if you had an addresschange at the same time

News to me, possibly these days - not sure, haven't bothered checking but I suppose I should. Curiously my insurance didn't seem to care that my licence was registered elsewhere to the car.

Looking through the DVLA site I found this:

MS30 Play street offences

What the hell are Play street offences?!

Licence type exchange Fees
Add entitlement to full licence Free

Photocard to photocard (including removing expired endorsements)
£17.50

Paper licence for a photocard licence (including removing expired endorsements)
£17.50

Full Northern Ireland licence
Free

Full valid EC/EEA or other foreign licence including Channel Island & Isle of Man if previous full GB licence held
Free

FFS; why don't they just put a chip in everyone's head, and be done with it???

Just to go off at a slight tangent, is there any disadvantage to having expired SP30s on your licence, assuming you're not embarrassed by such things? Am I missing something?

I am under the impression it makes no difference to have the points removed from the paper part as the police are not meant to look at this part if they stop you (if you have lots of 'live' points it could influence whether they charge you or not)

[i]Just to go off at a slight tangent, is there any disadvantage to having expired SP30s on your licence, assuming you're not embarrassed by such things? Am I missing something?[/i]

If it's expired, it doesn't matter. Probably makes things simpler if you need to hire a car or something if there not there.

[i]Photo card licence was a stupid idea, I mean for anything other than a cursory check by a cop on the street, anything involving any level of detail check (producer etc) requires producing the paper part anyway - what the hell is the point? [/i]

I think you mean that photo card licences implemented in the way they have been in Britain are a stupid idea. Any other country in the world would have found a way to entirely replace the piece of paper with a plastic photo card, but not Britain, oh no, that would be too easy.

I agree with others above, it's not a stealth tax at all, more of a stupidity or ignorance tax.

I like my photo license. When I get asked for photo ID, I have some. Really useful.

I like my photo license. When I get asked for photo ID, I have some. Really useful.

They might as well just go for a full ID card....... 😀

[i]Stealth tax? Stupidity tax more like.[/i]
aren't they all? If the Mail and their like can apply the phrase 'stealth tax' to anything, you can guarantee that it's just something which will catch numpties out.

When I get asked for photo ID, I have some.

Well there you go, mine runs out in 6 months. Bleeding fantastic. I would never have thought about that.

Can't remember the last time I needed photo ID apart from when flying, where a passport is required anyway!

Casino was the last place i needed photo ID. And the lift pass place in the alps, as they needed a passport photo, but I had my passport with me.

I got a photo license when they were offered on a limited trial basis, as my old paper one had fallen apart, and on a trip to America back in the nineties the yanks couldn't cope with a driver's license as id without a photo on it, and I didn't want to carry my damned passport with me all the time. It has come in handy on a number of occasions, when I've taken out a new phone contract, for example, I've been asked for id and I've always got my drivers license with me inside a Jimi wallet.

It's licen[i]c[/i]e with two c's and no s.

i do think it's a ****ing joke we have to pay up constantly just to prove who we are.

isn't that part of being a citizen?

why the **** should we have to pay for new cards. not like it was our idea to introduce them.

and 72 quid just to leave the country. bullshit when you consider every other ****er in europe can travel on their driving license or ID card throughout europe. although i do concede 72 quid is a small price to pay to be free of the shithole i called home....