It’s been a bit of a bucket list item to drive to the Nurburgring, do a few laps, then drive home again! (Not all in one day, mind!).
I’m no racer, and though I will be taking the Polestar which is a pretty powerful car, I’ll probably just drive round at ‘slightly faster than normal pace’!
Regardless, I’m a sensible boy and will get ‘track day’ insurance, as normal car insurance obvs doesn’t cover the ring despite it being a toll road!
Has:
a - anyone here been of late - where’s good to stay/charge nearby
b - what insurance company offers good coverage - it seems few offer third party cover, and just cover your own vehicle and 4k worth of railing damage. 3rd party to ME is likely to be the key thing needed.
Cheers!
DrP
Just cover your number plates up and drive round it in eco mode. 😉
Do Spa as well whilst you are over there.
I haven't been for a while - over 10 years!
But we used to camp which was OK - there were usually about 3 or 4 of us.
Insurance we 'may' have taken the company cars around for a lap or two...... but we generally rented cars for the weekend form one of the race-rental companies which worked out less stressful and meant if anything happened we still had cars to drive home in, plus they generally had decent roll cages fitted etc.
Taking my lad over as an 18th Birthday present later in July, so I'll be watching this thread with interest.
Plan is to pay for a Ring Taxi of the GT3 RS variant to take him for a lap. Whether I take mine round is up for debate. I consider myself to be an OK driver , but its the others on the track i would be more worried about. My insurance has a specific no Nurburgring clause.
An acquaintance used to go there. Had an old boxy 3 series on a trailer.
Insurance is a must.... Not just for your car, but also for the track.
Hitting a barrier can get really expensive really quickly.
My brother in law recently did it as a 50th treat, but had instruction and drove someone else's car - which I think is how I would do it.
He was raving about it and used these people; https://rsrnurburg.com/
Even with the instructor on board he had a slightly iffy moment in the damp (Hyundai, 2nd clip in this video)
Cheers all - for ME, the fun will be taking my own car.. I guess even if I pootle round, at least I’d have done it!
Will have an in depth google on insurance, and share findings here…
DrP
When a load of mates went a while ago insurance was very expensive. Most policies (even track ones) excluded the 'ring.
As said, insurance is a must. Even tagging the armco (4k won't go that far!) gets very costly, heaven forbid you have a track closure incident. Then there's recovery as well.
Lots of people think they're decent drivers but after 13 miles, dodging everything from have a go heroes to full chat race cars, and trying not to get carried away it's easy to have an incident.
I really would advise hiring something fully inclusive if poss. It'll be a lot more fun and less risky Rent4ring go from about 200 quid and have proper track prepped, caged, coilovered cars. It's a lot more fun driving on track when you're not coaxing cooked pads and melting road tyres.
Edit: oooft, just checked and Rent4ring standard prices start at a 12k excess and don't cover damage to the track!
'Premium' does and has a lower excess, but no indication of price.
Good luck with insurance. You can certainly get Armco insurance now. If you have an off you are charged for damage to the circuit as previously mentioned.
Do not be tempted to do a lap in the wet or damp, it’s way more slippery (or certainly used to be) than a normal road when wet and a waste of a lap.
I was last there in 2009 and I span in the damp, going pretty sedately, crossed both sides of the track and ended up a metre or so parallel parked next to the barrier. My wallet shit itself . I drove gently back and decided that was enough for me.
Eek… delving in deeper, I’ve found ‘me’ insurance for about £270, with 4k of barrier cover..
But the fear, especially on tourist day, is the third party…
I’ve no oil etc to spill out the polestar, but it seems scary to think that if I crashed into a Ferrari 250 GTO, I’d have to pony up (it seems that my Admiral insurance HAS to cover me third party, but then as it’s a track, they can then claim back from me!)
Hmm… hmmm… hmm….
Might have to reconsider… which is a shame. Cos all I want to do is drive around in MY car!
DrP
I've done loads of trips there in the past, but haven't been in 10 years. Last time I went it was chaos, the track closed several times. Things went down hill considerably after privatisation.
I never really pushed on track as the consequence of it all going wrong were terrifying. I know of someone who caused a major accident and it bankrupted him and the Mrs left too.
I used to stay at a brilliant place about 10 miles away, there was lots of good reasonably priced accomodation in Nürburg and Adenau.
Never quite seen the appeal (and I'm a petrol head!) - for a trackday I'd rather do more laps of a much shorter race circuit so you can learn it, push more and improve.
I'd spend all my time at the Nurburgring wondering what's coming up and being too cautious.
I’d not do it again in my own car, but I’m glad I did.
Anyone else watch that video and reckon its looks more on GranTourismo?
It was amazing when we did it 20 years ago. But the insurance and costs now put me off... As well as the general idiocy of some people. My car is a lot faster than the one we took and tbh, I can't limit myself on track and want to push. so I can't see me doing it again.
We spent hours on grant turismo practicing. Elevation changes really weren't apparent in the game but it defo helped me memorise it's sequencing of corners so that I didn't find myself off line and in a wall or gravel trap. Also spent a lot of the time looking in our rear view mirror.
Get a taxi to take you round. All the fun without fearing insurance etc.
^^^ this. Not cheap, but last time I was there I spoke to a few folk who'd done a taxi lap as well as driven their own cars. Every one of them said taxi again every time.
I've "done" the ring a few times but always on a bike. There's an offroad signposted route following the track: 26km and 620m of elevation gain. Great way to spectate and a decent enough cycle. Had picnic lunches sitting in the middle of Karussell a few times...
^^^ that gate shouldn't've been open...
I'd either hire something there or be a passenger with someone driving it properly. Or just get a PS5, PSVR2, steering wheel and Gran Turismo 7. Cheaper, safer and any car you want to drive round there is possible in VR.
I’ve no oil etc to spill out the polestar, but it seems scary to think that if I crashed into a Ferrari 250 GTO, I’d have to pony up (it seems that my Admiral insurance HAS to cover me third party,
Do they, even in a different country and a circuit that they've explicitly stated that they won't cover? Presumably the circuit requires insurance of some kind before allowing you in?
I think the ring has changed a lot in the past decade with accessible cars being much faster and YouTube making it much more popular with complete tools.
Just look at some of the videos from the likes of Misha Charoudin (complete throbber) who treat a TF lap as if it's qually session. The speed differential is huge and standard of driving massively variable compared to most track days.
Done it on a motorbike, most horrible place i've ever ridden. Going home on my mates 1199 Panigale to Cochem was 1000 times nicer than the Ring. Got offered a free 5 lap ticket the next time we went and said "no thanks"....
I wonder if even ringing your insurer to simply enquire about cover for a Nurburgring lap gets your premiums hiked on renewal? 🙂
The only insurance you really need is third party and you simply won't be able to buy it for a UK reg car. They may have to pay out but they will come after you and take you house if needed.
I took the risk and did around 300 TF laps over the years in UK reg cars but I switched to track days there in the end.
Rent a Swift if you want to do TF. Probably more fun that the Polestar.
I did a lap about 25 years ago, on my ZX9R which I'd ridden there on (lived by the Ruhr then).
I was overtaken by a car, while I was flat out...
If I was in to track days and had a decent/fast car then I'd do it - otherwise no chance, as above the speed difference between everyone else and me plodding about in a 'normal' car would be too great and so what's the point in doing a lap glued to the right hand side of the track. Having just driven across Germany to CZ the speed differences on unrestricted autobahns are quite pronounced and you really need to pay attention for high speed cars when wanting to overtake - I'd not want that as well as trying to concentrate on a lap of the 'ring.....all whilst potentially not being insured!
I did it as a bucket-list thing in 2023. The main aim was a Ring Taxi lap which I did in a GT3 RS, unbelievable how fast the driver was while giving a full commentary all the way round! I know the circuit well thanks to Gran Turismo and having visited before in 2003 (was there for the European GP so the track was closed to cars but walked all the way round it) so knew the topography and what was coming up next, that really helped in getting the most out of the experience. I didn't plan to take my car round but succumbed to the temptation towards the end of the session and did 1 lap, so glad I did as it really brings home how slow a normal car is round there!
A few bits of info that might help:
A Ring Taxi is definitely worth it, even at the ~£360 for a single lap. You can get the cheaper Hyundai option but it would be a waste to travel all that way and skimp on the reason for being there.
Avoid weekend open days as they attract a lot of throbbers who have no skills and no idea about how to behave.
The weekday evening sessions are much more chilled as it's mainly locals who really know how to have fun there safely. They fully respect newbies having a lap, giving them room and they are completely open about giving you advice on how to get round safely.
Don't go during the first few weeks of the Ring opening as it again attracts the idiots. Avoid school holiday periods too for the same reason.
Any regular insurance you have will be of no use on the Nordschleife, they all expressly prohibit it from their coverage. Specialist cover is available specifically for the Ring so look into it, although it's rather expensive.
I'd strongly suggest spending a few hours before the session wandering round the circuit via the local roads. Plenty of places are viewable from a car park or a short walk and if there's some test cars or a track day happening it helps give a perspective of the speeds, elevations and lines to take.
If you do want to do a lap in your own car then the best time to head out on track is towards the end of the session, they close the entrance 15 minutes before the finishing time so you can head out with very few cars coming behind you. You do run the risk of a Red Flag ending the session but by this time a lot of the idiots will have either binned it or broken their cars.
When on track remember that it is still a public road. Regular traffic rules apply ie only pass on the left, no drifting, no racing etc. The only two differences are that you should indicate right and stay right to let faster cars past and under no circumstances should you stop or even go slowly, that's just asking for trouble.
Overtaking in the slower corners is discouraged so you can concentrate on getting through them, indicate right then let people past on the straights. The same goes for if you catch others up.
Don't underestimate how dangerous going slowly can be, think fast B road blasting and that's cruising on the Ring.
Never underestimate a car around you! A lot of the locals have very rapid mundane cars that eat Porsches etc up all day, every day.
If you find yourself at the ticket kiosk about to buy a lap and have any doubts, don't go out. Saying that though nerves are a good thing as they help keep you safe, you need to respect the place at all times but it only bites if you let it.
Don't let the fear of a big crash put you off too much, they're rare and very unlikely if you're sensible. But saying that only you can weigh up your appetite for the risks you open yourself up to personally.
Seeing as you're planning on taking your Polestar I'd check their policy on EV's, it should be fine but just make sure. They've got a lot stricter on the type of vehicles they allow on in the last few years with a 140 kph minimum achievable top speed limit as an example. My Fabia just passed this rule as it's top speed is officially 102 mph, the joys of only having 70 bhp, and they do enforce this. I'm pretty sure the days of coaches and motorhomes going round has ended due to that rule. Note that doesn't mean you have to go that fast, your vehicle just must be capable of doing it.
Even if you just go there for a Taxi lap it's worth doing once, there's also the museum to visit and there's plenty of fun to be had just drooling over the cars in the car park at the entrance and exit.
Gratuitous picture of a slow Fabia nearly getting some air as it leaves the Karussel:
I used to go regularly, haven't been in a while... It's a magical place, an amazing drive, but.
You've had good advice here, long story short, you'll never be really covered for third party costs. If some one has a massive accident and it's your fault, you could be liable. I don't think i'd risk it anymore in my own car.
Far safer to rent something suitable, and then you'll be covered fully.
If you get a chance, take a bike. There's a cool MTB track that follows the circuit. I did a lap (backwards) a few years ago, great fun hacking down keselchen.
A mate was planning on doing a few laps on his Fireblade a good few years ago whilst riding back from the Moto GP in Mugello, after being told of the potential costs involved should he have an accident he paid to be driven round in a 911 GT3 by a driver employed by the track instead
Sigh. Do it. It’s a bucket list thing. Get insurance that includes recovery from the ring. It’s not impossible.
Have driven it many times & my brother in law has diverted via there on way to our winter holidays with the family for years. It’s a truly magical, mad, wonderful, bonkers experience. Yes people die. The Germans will shut it temporarily, sweep up the components and turn the flashing amber signs off. It’s all fine. This is normal.
Don’t try and learn it on a PlayStation or off YouTube, you’ll crash thinking “ahh this is metzgheforst, it’s flat isn’t it?” While your hips venture through your shoulders.
if you’re not confident, I’d get a taxi, rather than hire a swift or similar (though they are glorious for a stock standard steed). Apex do some really cool stuff & misha really knows what he’s doing. Have you watched the drivetorque podcast featuring him about cost of crashing?
the other thing you can do is go to the ticket machine, buy a 1 -lap pass and then trawl the car park for someone to take you out. Pretty much anyone with 888s or ad09s will know what they’re doing. If the tread has smeared onto the sidewall you’ll have a fun time.
This is the last video I watched regarding a lap of the ring.
I think watching videos helps. I watch lots of videos of stuff that I'll never probably do and then I reach a point where I don't feel as if I need to do it in real life.
Cheers for the info!
The polestar will be fine RE 'minimum requirements'.. micha took one round in a rather sporting fashion a year or so ago!
Lots of food for thought here..
Lots of swinging "should I..shouldn't I" still!
It's a gamble I guess... Especially the third party cover stuff...
I guess if I go for it, I'll avoid a weekend (which WAS when I was looking to go) and aim for a weekday afternoon...
DrP
Maybe I'm old, but I have done a fair few track days, and have a car that's easily more capable than I,with all the right parts to do it, and if I were going, I'd hire something much slower!
(I'm not claiming in a good driver. I'm not.)
I wonder if even ringing your insurer to simply enquire about cover for a Nurburgring lap gets your premiums hiked on renewal? ?
Probably. My ex-neighbour was an arsehole over parking on the public street, so I put his name, reg number, and home address into several comparison sites and ticked every "I'm a crap driver" box I could find in the hope that it ended up on an insurance company database when it came time to renew.
Specialist cover is available specifically for the Ring so look into it, although it’s rather expensive.
Not available for third party, which is the one you really need and the one the OP must fully understand before he decides to take his UK reg car past the barrier.
Sorry for going on about it but it's critical to be aware of it. The rest is fluff if you're not prepared to take the risk.
I've been a few times, last time a year ago. Never bothered with insurance, but I don't on any other tracks either. Always had a car cheap enough to not worry about getting written off too much (as in it'd be expensive but not life changing). It's a great trip, the Hyundai n cars are the go to taxis now. Ours was mega fast.
I'd you want you can do a destination nurburgring day instead of touristfarhen. Far fewer cars, less to hit, more expensive.
We just stayed at dorint. Next time I'm taking a bike an cycling a lap overnight.
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https://youtu.be/Wy8XXEo2TFg?feature=shared
I’ve been to the Ring without driving and had a great time. Loads of folks spectate, drink beer and party.
MTB Round the perimeter too.
Definitely worth a visit
I’ve had a lift round in:-
Heavily tuned Skyline - Brutal
Stripped out air cooled 911 - Smooth and quick
Bog standard MX5 - felt like lap of sideways
Polar Expedition Toyota - Hilarious/scary
It is available, there's a specific thread about it every year over on Pistonheads, but it's into the £10k+ level and really aimed at supercar owners who go there regularly. I talked to a UK owner of a SLS AMG in the car park about it while waiting for my Ring Taxi slot and he said it was £17k for him for the season with a £7k excess. That covered his AMG, a McLaren and his track-prepped M3 for 15 days a year at the Ring plus any other track days he did in Europe. He had it specifically for the 3rd party aspect as he was happy to risk his cars but would be gutted if he ruined someone else's. Like I said, it's expensive and understandably very specialist.
DrP - I only say avoid the weekends as you are obviously wary of the risks. The issue is that a longer day attracts the 'weekend warrior' type (same as trail centres really) who try and do too many laps in the day so are prone to more and bigger mistakes together with pushing their car to break. They forget that one lap of the Ring is harder than 8 at Snetterton, Donnington or Brands Hatch. Not just because it's tough but because you have much more track to learn and 2 laps is a full session anywhere else so they forget to give the car a chance to cool down, check things over and also take a break themselves.
Given the depredation curve on a P2 it’s not that much of a financial loss if you binned it so go ahead.
Brings back memories of foolish youth. I’ve ridden it a few times on motorbikes, first on a CB500S (lots of peg grinding!) and then on a Firestorm. Probably 20 years or more ago. Really enjoyed it and we just went round knowing we weren’t insured. My dad wrote off his ZX10R just ahead of me, probably doing well over the ton when it went wrong, which was interesting to see. He was ok, luckily and came home on the back of the Firestorm. Don’t think he damaged the barrier, luckily. Found the other drivers mostly very considerate, but mostly much faster so you just stay out of the way and let them go. You’d see folk going round in camper vans and the odd bus, which was a bit surreal. Think I was only slightly faster than the campers! It’s a great place to go and just watch, as others have said. I think I’d go round again in my own car. If you’re sensible and don’t get carried away I don’t think it’s all that dangerous. For thrills I’d go round in the ring taxi.
Just to add.. gt7 with a psvr2 has a really good stab at representing the track. Better than anything else I've used, so as a learning tool it's effective. There isn't a polestar in there but there is a Tesla m3p which has got to be pretty close
I do quite a few track days every year. Tracks in UK and Europe The one track I cba’d about is the Ring. Too much BS about the whole thing. Too many crap drivers. Too much potential for hassle.
I suspect it’s changed a lot since I went. This was before it really became such ‘a thing’ with being on top gear, etc. There were plenty of serious cars there and plenty of testosterone I guess, but it didn’t feel like there were too many idiots. Maybe best if I don’t go back and just stick with the memories.
