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Bloody hell, hoped I would never have needed to consult the forum on something like this.....
Sold my 57 plate S Max last week, top spec, 77k, FSH, new EGR etc etc. Three days later the fella phones me up and says the heating isn't working. He has spoken to his garage of choice and they suspect water pump or thermostat, taking it in on Tuesday. Now the receipt I gave him said "sold as seen" but I did say if he had a problem with it shortly after buying it I wouldn't just walk away, he seems a reasonable bloke (despite being a triathlete) and I like to think I am too. OK says I, keep me posted and we'll work something out.
So he texts on Tuesday and says diagnosis isn't good, could I speak to the garage and provides the number. I phone them up, speak to the main man who again seems a straight down the line sort of bloke, he says there is oil in the water, next to no coolant in it etc and it looks like it has been run dry and the head gasket might have popped. I checked the coolant when I cleaned it up to sell it and it was right between the lines, it had only been in another garage a few weeks earlier for the EGR and nothing was mentioned, I also never noticed the temp gauge go high. We had the bonnet up when he viewed it a week later but I didn't look and I assume neither did he as the coolant level must have been down by then. I had to ask him if he wanted me to pop the bonnet for a look, he didn't seem too bothered. He collected the car nine days after I had checked the coolant level and three days after viewing, I had been driving it daily in the interim. Not sure if the car has a low coolant level warning or not. I had noticed the car heating seemed to taking longer to warm up but didn't really think anything of it.
Garage ran a compression test today which confirmed no external leaks on the coolant level, upshot is a price for new head gasket, timing belt, water pump, thermostat, over 10 hours labour of £1300. If the head is warped another £1200 on top of that. So it seems that the head gasket was on it's way out when still mine but I wasn't aware and didn't mislead him, for his part he failed to check the car over properly or get a professional to do it for him.
So with all this in mind I spoke to him on the phone this evening, told him a good compromise leaves everyone unhappy and offered to pay 50%. He was thinking more along the lines that I pay £1000 and he pays the £300. We didn't even get onto the scenario of the head being warped but if he had taken me up on the 50% offer I would have applied it to that too. Anyway, he says he will check with the garage tomorrow of the cost of doing the work not strictly related to the head gasket (timing belt, not sure on water pump, stat etc?) and get back to me.
I am flat out at work and could really do without this right now but hey ho, it is what it is as they say. What says the forum, am I being reasonable? Sorry for rambling.
if it were me i'd tell him tough titty... he should be utterly amazed that you've offered to pay a penny towards it... it worked fine when it left your hands and he could have done anything to it in the mean time, he got a test drive and wasn't put under any pressure before buying it(i assume)..
politely tell him to do one
Just give him his cash back, easy, get it fixed and resell it.
That was a mistake, saying that. But you already know that. You've made a rod for your own back I'm afraid.
I'm frankly astonished you'd say that.
Assuming it was a private sale you're being overly reasonable.
Agree with robgc - you've kindly offered him £650 - accept that or nothing.
Now the receipt I gave him said "sold as seen" but I did say if he had a problem with it shortly after buying it I wouldn't just walk away........ told him a good compromise leaves everyone unhappy and offered to pay 50%.
You did what now??
Not sure why you're concerned about some other guys car.
Why write "sold as seen" and then offer to pay for it,if it was the other way round I think he would tell you to go swivel
.
Knew I'd get the extremes on here. I a had loan on the car and have used the funds to pay that back as I'm now getting a company car. I'd need to take out another loan in order to repay him which I really don't want to do.
In terms of telling him to do one it looks like the problem was under way before he bought it and I told him I wouldn't have that attitude if something did go wrong within a short time frame. So I think my 50% offer seems like the middle ground but have to admit to feeling somewhat narked he doesn't see it that way. It's painful for both of us and he told me he sold his Merc 2 days ago for top dollar....
You've made a frankly incredible offer (for many reasons), if he doesn't like it then that's his problem. You are not a dealer, he bought the car fully aware that he doesn't get dealer service i.e. he just needs to suck it up.
I'm not sure but I recommend you research what [u]his[/u] legal rights are because I have a feeling that he does have some reasonable expectation the car he's buying is not a lemon and has a certain amount of time after the sale to gain recompense. As I said, I'm not sure about this. I think you should check out his, and your rights.
Edit:
[url= http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/action/how-to-complain-about-a-second-hand-car-to-a-private-seller ]null
[/url]
So - he drove it away and and without any warning the car had no water in the cooling system and no heater 3 days later - sorry but that sounds more like atone through radiator or split coolant hose to me - and even if the garage had explained that it would be his problem.
Sounds like a scam to me garage mate top tip to get money back of soft private vendor - Block his phone number and call the police if he makes any threats other than small claims court.
Do you have any proof that the car is knackered and in the garage? A 5 year old car with FSH, that you checked shortly before it was sold... Alarm bells would be ringing for me.
legend - Member
You've made a frankly incredible offer (for many reasons), if he doesn't like it then that's his problem. You are not a dealer, he bought the car fully aware that he doesn't get dealer service i.e. he just needs to suck it up.
Exactly. When you buy a car privately you take a bit of a risk, and in turn should pay less than you should from a dealer. When you take a risk it doesn't always pay off, otherwise it wouldn't be a risk! If fairly list the item and tell the buyer what you know it is up to them.
He collected the car nine days after I had checked the coolant level and three days after viewing, I had been driving it daily in the interim. Not sure if the car has a low coolant level warning or not. I had noticed the car heating seemed to taking longer to warm up but didn't really think anything of it.
You drove around in [i]his[/i] car for three days before he picked it up?
OP, I don't suppose you could go 50/50 on a bit of rust removal/spraying I need doing on one my sills.
Be about £100.
Cheers.
8)
You could try and get a cheaper quote if your really bothered about sorting it out,in fact get a couple and see if he's trying to skim some cash off you,and maybe his mate is the mechanic,paranoid or what.....but it happens!
The scam angle had occurred to me but I don't think so, garage details check out and they have emailed me the quote.
I do think I'm being bloody reasonable though and his attitude makes me want to tell him to do one and we'll settle it in small claims court. I have done a bit of googling and whilst a bit of a grey area it looks like the onus is on him to prove the car is not as described or that I deliberately misled him, don't fancy his chances to be honest.
I do think I'm being bloody reasonable though and his attitude makes me want to tell him to do one and we'll settle it in small claims court
Do this. Worse case scenario, you might end up having to pay what you are already offering.
I hope you sort it out,I hate situations like this and usually ends in loss of sleep,not like he can give you bad feedback though is it ?????
He bought it for £8300, was listed at £8750 which was on the high side. He then said on the phone earlier that he had done a valuation using the autotrader tool and it had come about between £7200 and £7700 and that he had paid what he felt was a dealer price because of the spec and condition and because I seemed so honest. Firstly I always find those valuation tools under value what cars actually sell for, secondly bit bloody late for that kind of sob story!
@suburbanreuben - he agreed to buy it on Saturday but didn't leave a deposit. I didn't drive it Sat or Sun, he paid by bank transfer Monday evening, I took it to work and back on Tuesday because the hire car didn't get delivered until then.
dealer price because of the spec and condition
So he inspected and was happy with the condition. Yet another reason why this really isn't your problem.
Post his number and we'll see if we can help 🙂
Blimey,he's 'avin a larf!
Tell him your 50% offer is withdrawn, pronto!
tell him if he wanted a warranty he should have got one from warranty direct or the car from a dealer.
He got top dollar for his mercedes - did he pay top dollar for your ford? Or is he getting the best deal from everybody?
I'm with Jamie,tell him straight then show him the door and tell him not to contact you further only through your solicitor,bet your bottom dollar his solicitor it or will also show him the wood in the hole.
When he came out with that I did have to bite my tongue.
Slightly annoying thing is that I had a Warrantywise warranty on it, cancelled it the day after selling it to avoid paying out another £40 on the first of the month, gah! Still, hindsight is a wonderful thing when you look back on it.....
That is probably the saving he made over buying from a dealer and the chance he takes from buying privately.
Unfortunately you offered and he is chancing it.
From my past experience, oil in coolant was a oil cooler failure - a second hand item as the car was over 200k, not a lot of labour and coolant flush.
One of the reasons people spend thousands on a brand new car is the guarantee you get from the manufactuers warranty and dealer support. Your buyer saved money by buying a second hand car privately sold as seen, so hes not entitled to any comeback. You have already been far too generous imo. Perhaps the buyer needs to be reminded what he is legally entitled to, to give him an idea of how generous your offer already is.
Perhaps the buyer needs to be reminded what he is legally entitled to, to give him an idea of how generous your offer already is.
This. He has absolutely no comeback if the vehicle was sold as seen. If he missed something, it's his problem.
Tell him you have taken legal advice and have been told to offer him nothing. If you subsequently agree to contribute to his costs without prejudice he should be very grateful.
Well as above mistake 1 offering somekind of verbal warranty
mistake 2 offering cash
Rectify both by withdrawing offer and saying good bye, check the receipt sold as seen.
Y'know it's painful for me and it's painful for him. I told him I wouldn't just walk away if it went wrong soon after sale so I won't. Regardless of what he comes back with tomorrow I'll restate my offer of 50% and if he doesn't accept then it'll have to be court. I think the fact I didn't get it sorted out under the warranty I had is proof enough that I wasn't aware there was a problem.
Dave. Your heart is in the right place, but you are not a dealer.
My VW T4 is in need of a new clutch soon.. dont suppose you fancy going halves on it..
I told him I wouldn't just walk away if it went wrong soon after sale so I won't.
You haven't walked away though, you made him an offer and now he's being an arse - his problem.
Don't mention the warranty, that'll probably just complicate your discussion further
Jamie - Member
Dave. Your heart is in the right place, but you are not a dealer
Car Dealers like estate agents don't have hearts, just cold metallic pumps
And don't mention you drove it and noticed the heating was acting up after he had payed for it...
When did you offer tosee himright if anything went wrong? before orafter he agreed to buy it?
Did the garage get the impression you were assisting with the repair cost
Still withdraw the offer if he continues to demand more. 50/50isstillover generous.
Bollocks,myspace barhasgone...
I say well done for being a decent human being. Few and far between these days...
Don't mention the warranty, that'll probably just complicate your discussion further
And don't mention you drove it and noticed the heating was acting up after he had payed for it...
So in summary, just stop talking, Dave 😉
M'kay.
You're definitely going a step too far in my view. I bought an 08 plate car a dealer a few weeks ago ( make and model withheld to avoid tree hugging hatred). There was a fault with a return pump for the heater, I didn't think for a minute to go after the dealer. Instead I used the warranty cover that I purchased seperately and if that didn't cover it I would have forked out myself...... Buyer beware, end of.
if you're keen to make amends and he is taking liberties, begin to reduce your offer until he accepts.
M'kay.
I miss Talkative Dave 🙁
Isn't this why the AA offer vehicle inspections to potential buyers? Buyer beware for sure.
i know you are getting stick here for not telling him to go and do one but I for one salute you sir. you are being more than fair and he shouldnt try and push his luck.
personally I'm not sure what I'd do.
I wouldn't be paying anything at all, and I'd especially avoid agreeing to pay a percentage. What if more problems get discovered?
Dealers charge more money because they've factored in these costs (though they almost always try and wriggle out of them or steer you onto the warranty).