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If its so ****ing easy in the public sector and the grass is so green come and ****ing work in the public sector. If not stfu!
No-one forced you to work in the private sector, you knew what you were gettiong yourself into, you had choices, just like we did. We signed up to x and have now had it changed to y, i am 100% sure that you lot would have a ****ing fit and throw your company Audi keys in!!
fair point well made.
+1.
Having worked in both sectors, it's the Private sector lot who seem a little shy of putting the graft in.
+1
Done both and the public was a joke. The ability to just dream up new job roles for people was incredible!
i am 100% sure that you lot would have a **** fit and throw your company Audi keys in!!
no we just get on with it as that's life in the real world, not some cosseted little fluffy bunny world of easy rides like you tossbags have had.
What gets me is for years the private sector laughed at the public sector wages and all the public sector could come back with was at least my pension is good. Now the public sector has been hit they seem to think It's our god given right for our pensions to be crap too
^ envy (Tazzy)
FWIW I am back in private, and let's be honest...the public sector work much harder. IME/IMO etc
no we just get on with it
LIES
Well that was a well thought through and communicated argument in favour of public sector workers. I bet you've won over a fair number to your cause.
Don't even start me on inefficiency in public sector, at least in the private sector employers are addressing it. In most cases.
And the public sector aren't?
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
(meanwhile, on planet Earth...)
I suspect most of those in the private sector could not do the jobs - I am certain they couldn't do mine or Mrs TJs jobs as they simply would not have the required skills - nor would they do it for the wages.
tazzymtb - Member
no we just get on with it as that's life in the real world, not some cosseted little fluffy bunny world of easy rides like you tossbags have had.
I think you're mistaking the public sector for the banking sector.
I don't know why that would be the case given that average public sector wages have been greater than average private sector wages for some time now.firestarter - Member
What gets me is for years the private sector laughed at the public sector wages
Don't even start me on inefficiency in public sector, at least in the private sector employers are addressing it. In most cases.
Give me a personal example...
druidh - Member
I don't know why that would be the case given that average public sector wages have been greater than average private sector wages for some time now.
Are you going to quote the tax payers alliance's research?
Having read the last 9 page thread, what stands out to me is the level of ignorance of some as to what A) the unions in their history have achieved for [b]all[/b] workers, and B)exactly what consists of a public sector job, a large proportion of council operations are carried out by private companies but because they are working on behalf of the council are presumed to be public sector. Quite shocking 👿
Druid average wages doesn't mean much , its like for like jobs where the difference shows
Bazz - Member
Having read the last 9 page thread, what stands out to me is the level of ignorance of some as to what A) the unions in their history have achieved for all workers, and B)exactly what consists of a public sector job, a large proportion of council operations are carried out by private companies but because they are working on behalf of the council are presumed to be public sector. Quite shocking
Spot on. Plus both 'sectors' are so diverse creating a dualism only plays into the hands of people who want to dumb the argument down to us vs them.
What i find interesting is that everyone i've spoken to who is employed in the public sector says they think private sector pensions should be of the quality as they receive, yet the proportion of people in the private sector who want that is much smaller. It appears many want parity, but based on a lower standard.
A fairly bitter and Indeedy pointless thread. We are all in the mire and really should ALL roll our sleeves up to find a way through it. You get wasters in both sectors. I do think there is probably more job roles that arnt needed in the public sector, I have always presumed various governments create them to be able to show unemployment going down 🙂
Tossbags?
Is that really the best insult you can think up?
Spot on. Plus both 'sectors' are so diverse creating a dualism only plays into the hands of people who want to dumb the argument down to us vs them.
Exactly.
druidhI don't know why that would be the case given that average public sector wages have been greater than average private sector wages for some time now.
Not when you actually look at equal skils / education / training =- private sector are far ahead.
Mrs TJ
degree in law, 25 years experience in her field, £20 000 pa
Me
diploma and degree qualified, 25 years experience in my field - £26000 ( fte)
And we are both doing jobs that not one of you private sector people could do
Argueargueargueargue.
Maybe we need a pay comparison thread?
here is a thought, lets stop asking whether the public sector or private sector is having a hard/easy time, and start asking why we accept being shafted by our bosses in both sectors. Are you telling me that senior civil servants are going to suffer in the changes? just like the way directors have suffered in the private sector.
Divide and conquer.
No - [url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14028848 ]The Office of National Statistics[/url].CaptJon - Member
Are you going to quote the tax payers alliance's research?
Mrmo - actually they will do. Managers in the public sector almost all are a part of the same pensions, operate under the same t&cs and will get shafted the same - its another difference between the sectors.
And I'm yet to see any convincing evidence that making some old people poorer than they would be is going to save the country. We have been ****ed over yet again by a ruling class, a group of people who take our cash and our labour and use it to make their own lives better, to send their inbred offspring to private schools, to get their ailments dealt with in private hospitals, to live lives as far removed from that of ordinary people as their fetid sweaty grasping hands can achieve.
Divide and rule, make the poor private sector workers turn on the public sector workers while the SAME OLD BASTARDS RUN OFF WITH THE MONEY.
It's your country too y'know, and if you let them get away with it, they'll carry on.
Druidh - you need to look at equal qualifications then yo willfind a big difference.
From your link
Comparing the pay of these graduates flips the pay gap around, with public sector workers earning 5.7% less than those in the private sector.
TJ, not talking line managers, go further up the tree, MPs, civil service heads of departments
miketually - Member
Maybe we need a pay comparison thread?
Really?
The much bigger divide is between the unemployed, employed and the self-employed.
No - The Office of National Statistics
Did you read all the way to the end?
Over the past 10 years, the trend for low-skilled jobs to be outsourced to the private sector has continued, pushing up the average wage among public sector workers.In 2010, some 38% of workers had a degree or equivalent qualification in the public sector, compared with 23% in the private sector.
Comparing the pay of these graduates flips the pay gap around, with public sector workers earning 5.7% less than those in the private sector.
Within the two sectors, the gap between the highest earners - in the top 5% - and the lowest 5% of earners is greater in the private sector than in the public sector.
Really?
No 🙂
druidh - Member
No - The Office of National Statistics.
Seriously? If a first year came to the conclusion you did based on what that story says I'd fail them.
Fair point, well made.
So maybe our teachers should go to a profit making business to teach....
oh, hang on a moment...
Some sort of private sector school? What a spiffing idea!
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Me: Tax & NI collected this year 120k, Vat Collected and Paid 600k, my wages 20k my Mrs 20k my pension 10 k p.a. if I''m lucky after contributing for years.
The Public sector? Don't they educate the morons that can't read and write, the so called graduates that still have difficulty spelling the word. Don't they collect the bins er only once every two weeks these days? Don't they pay themselves more money than the PM yet withdraw care packages for the elderly? I seem to remember those Union Chiefs are paid from some of that tax money I collect.
Isn't it the public sector that'll put me in jail if I don't pay my VaT, yet wasn't it the public sector that lost millions in iceland and no-one was held responsible. Those Politicians that have ****ed things up, are they not in the public sector?
Yep lots of sympathy from me for the Public Sector.
I haven't got a pension, should I be worried?
Never worked in the public sector but I've worked for it, I've seen Quangos with half baked employees piss money up the wall and some of these should be fired no doubt about it. There are easy life jobs out there but by no means is this everybody in the public sector
You couldn't pay me enough to be a teacher / nurse / social worker, these people provide essential jobs and are on the whole underpaid. I'd be mighty anoid if my employer (me) decided to change one of the good things about my job.
So I say go ahead and stand up for your rights and Strike!
(if you're a teacher though can you strike at the weekend please because it's a right pain in the ass 😉 )
Derekrides - as you are a known troll, I am delighted to disregard your ill-informed ramblings.
So pleased you could contribute though.
Tossbags?
Is that really the best insult you can think up?
no I could tell you what I really think and get a very lengthy ban 😆
CaptJon - is this true or false...
The gap in average pay between workers in the public sector and those in the private sector has widened.Public sector employees were paid 7.8% more on average than private sector staff in April 2010, the Office for National Statistics (ONS) said.
This was a bigger gap than the 5.3% difference in 2007, the figures show.
Black and white, eh? Well, if you like thing simplified beyond the useful then you can have it, yes.
cruzheckler - Member
If its so * easy in the public sector and the grass is so green come and * work in the public sector. If not stfu!
I keep telling the wife to move into the public sector, problem is that it's a closed shop as they always require specific experience which can be only gained by training in the public sector for her profession
No-one forced you to work in the private sector, you knew what you were gettiong yourself into, you had choices, just like we did.
errr..... no, my private sector pension which was quite good and got screwed over by the firm and the Unions recommended we accept the shafting, just as they are now recommending accepting a non-consolidated payment in lieu of a pay rise which is shortermism gone mad. The same Unions that are recommending I support the fight for the pensions for others which they were too incompetent to defend in my own company.
We signed up to x and have now had it changed to y, i am 100% sure that you lot would have a **** fit and throw your company Audi keys in!!
I signed up to "X" and had it changed to "y", no company car keys to throw in
The arguments for reform would be a lot easier if the government shafted the MP/ EU pension schemes asap to show some leadership on the issue