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Yes we do.
I thought that was resolved - with the main now modified & legal, and the result from earlier race was ok too (and not subject to change) because they’d passed measuring that day, even though non-compliant.
nope, another rule infringement could lead to a DSQ from one race. crazy that a boat protesting is able to overrule the measurement committee and lead directly to a potential penalty. Fair enough to protest, rule change/clarification, and everyone needs to then comply or be imposed a penalty.
Yes, the Italians have behaved like litigious ****@s over this whole issue.
Yes, the Italians have behaved like litigious ****@s over this whole issue.
and over the running backstays rule (they don't think they need them, everyone else does). they tried to claim that they could have them attached to the mast and rolled up in the sail, and that would be fine. they lost
Yes, the Italians have behaved like litigious ****@s over this whole issue.
They've got plenty of previous for this.
It’s almost like rich businessmen don’t like losing and resort to legal bullying.......
hard to imagine
Start of the finals (Prada Cup) tonight. Any predictions? Experts thinking it's too close to call. If only I was working, actually nah, happy to watch in the morning.
I predict there'll be too little wind to race on Saturday, so no racing until Sunday.
Then hopefully it'll be quite windy, where I think Ineos have the advantage, and take at least one win.
Going to be close. Probably 😉
Hmmm
Well, that's not what we hoped for.
Prada just had that extra bit of speed at every point. No tactics just boat speed (didn’t watch R1)
R1 Ineos fell off the foils in the Prestart and were always behind.
Pantage.
Yesterday:
R1 Ineos fell off the foils in the Prestart and were always behind.
Today, not so much falling *down* off the foils! Amazing how they recovered to still start almost even in R4, but still a pretty comprehensive bating, lost time almost every lap.
They look faster downwind, bur but slower upwind. If they can win the start they may match race their way up the first leg and control it from there, but it looks tough to come crack from here. Fingers crossed it is a bit less one sided next block
Auckland is in covid lockdown, races postponed until further notice.
Wow! Didn’t see that coming!
Yeah, just spotted that. A responsible attitude to take and at least I don't have to be awake at 3 am Wednesday for my regular racing fix now.
interesting, i thought that the foils had to be either up or down, and couldn't have them somewhere in the middle unless transitioning from up or down. They can make "low frequency" adjustments (or the way i see this, maybe change a setting during a race, but not every tack), but not high frequency ones, or effectively trim the boat during flight. So what Prada is doing is wrong??
A genuine question....how is this all financed or monetized?
It all looks frighteningly expensive. Building craft good for one series and the whole general setup. But I'm seeing nothing of it in the mainstream media. I'm a sailor and I admit I'm not naturally drawn to it but surely you need to reach the likes of me as a relatively easy win to break even financially as marketable sport. But if it wasn't for seeing this thread title pop up I wouldn't know it was ongoing. I wouldn't know where to find it on TV and don't see it mentioned on the TV news or papers (electronic versions). It's 6 clicks from the BBC landing page to find an article on it.
Or is it not really monetized - do the team owners and the sponsors just know they are spunking away their money away and are fine with that? Or is it generating banker shots for future Pirelli advertising campaigns or whatever.
It genuinely baffles me.
Well, I think Prada are supplying some of the money. Perhaps.
They seem to think that the exposure & marketing are worthwhile.
Belstaff aren’t targeting me with my their products or advertising so I’ve no idea if their media output is stuffed with boats. But they think it’s worthwhile. Ineos clearing sent a big cheque too.
Not sure what Airbus think they’re getting g out of it, especially on an American boat, but I doubt AM painted it there for free.
You’re right in that they must be burning huge piles of cash, but it must be coming from the sponsors. And they must think it’s worthwhile, or just love having their name out there.
Jim Ratcliffe (Mr Ineos) also owns Belstaff, so I thinks that's just part of his funding deal. Ditto the Grenadier - I'm sure there's some of those stickers on the boat somewhere too!
It's almost entirely rich man's willy waving rather than a strong marketing case. And I think the America's Cup has almost always been like that. You'd need to sell a lot of anything to get back $200m profit.
Airbus involvement is interesting. Maybe part of it is one-upmanship on Boeing, who I think were previous sponsors of the American team. And maybe partly they treat it as R&D spend because they are involved in the aero/hydro-dynamics.
Shame to see GB at less than their best, but LR were impressive. The time gaps weren't big in the 4 races, so could yet be tight.
I have heard it said that the only reason JR got involved was to wind up JLR, the previous sponsor..(All about dropping the Defender)
I don't think the team are badly paid, the guy I know on the boat (Neighbour of a friend) whole family moved out to NZ last year courtesy of the team. What a job, looks fun, but a little high pressure right now.
How much "Profit" does a bike team make though, got to sell a few bits of lycra and £10k road bikes to get that back! And consider that none of us (Probably) are likely to be direct Ineos (Chemicals) customers. Though probably are indirect customers because they are involved in carbon fibre production!
I still choose Mapei every* time** I buy tile adhesive.
Think of the return on that cycle sponsorship a few years ago.
I should add I’ve been enjoying the Mozzy Sail stuff on YT. Worth a look if you have seen it.
*mostly
**this does not happen all that often
It’s almost entirely rich man’s willy waving rather than a strong marketing case.
I think that was what I driving at. I can't imagine the people actually running/working at the teams are making a loss but why those who are financing them (and the event) through sponsorship are bothering.
The troubling conclusion I'm coming to is the reason BA's team is not just called Ainslie Racing any more (with some jingoistic union jack daubing if it makes you happy) with Ratcliffe as a behind the scenes sugar daddy spaffing some of his vast fortune on a hobby is because if you can put the veneer of Ineos 'marketing' (a brand that does not really need marketing of this sort) on it you can write the vast majority off against tax. Same with his sponsorship of the cycling team too I guess. Doesn't sit easily with me.
Convert, Broadly I agree but he is spending vast amounts of money on UK sport, UK business and UK engineering. That's a good thing.
The world would be a much duller place if we hadn't ever had an Americas Cup, Felix jumping out a balloon in space, Motorsport of any kind, loads of extreme sports stuff and lots of great cycle sports. (To mention just a few). Lots of things just wouldn't happen if it wasn't for very wealthy people or business throwing cash at stuff they like the look of. I suppose you could say the same was true at the Colusseum though!
Ooh, can we talk about football sponsorship too?
I see very little positive coming from Football.
Football sponsorship's different though; lots of companies with target markets that overlap directly with football as a live & TV "product". They're directly addressing their demographic, pretty much all year round and on their screens all day every bloody day
It’s exactly the same. The sponsors feel they get value. Wether it is bragging rights, raising brand awareness or just blagging free tickets and stuff 8p1 don’t know but it is their call. There will be a reason that makes sense to them,
Well, yeah, they all must have a reason. What I'm suggesting is that in upper league footy it's a fairly obvious direct commercial one a lot of the time - if I don't advertise my online betting on somebody's shirt, all the punters will go to my competition who do exactly that. Exceptions for super-wealthy oligarchs (or oil states) where, yes, it's vanity (and a little bit of sportwashing)
And also your online betting logo on that shirt will be seen my millions and millions weekly across the globe for a season that is months and months long.
Most of the videos on the America's Cup official channel are getting the number of views that would embarrass your average 'pro' teenage gamer making videos in his bedroom.
Looking forward to tomorrow with all fingers crossed , surely not a rout. Save us Ben , you must be mad by now...
LOL @ video
Great video 😁
The troubling conclusion I’m coming to is the reason BA’s team is not just called Ainslie Racing any more (with some jingoistic union jack daubing if it makes you happy) with Ratcliffe as a behind the scenes sugar daddy spaffing some of his vast fortune on a hobby is because if you can put the veneer of Ineos ‘marketing’ (a brand that does not really need marketing of this sort) on it you can write the vast majority off against tax. Same with his sponsorship of the cycling team too I guess. Doesn’t sit easily with me.
Making less money means you pay less tax, but Ineos makes £2billion profit a year, AC campaigns are in the order of £50-£250million. It's somewhere between a drop in the ocean and 10% for him. I spend more than 10% of my disposable income on bikes 🤣. And it's not really saving you money spending 100% of it on sponsorship Vs 20% on cooperation tax. And of that 100% there was something like 150,000 man hours put into the prototype boat alone, that's a lot of people's wages paid.
Some discussion arround the economics here:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ft.com/content/cfc0d884-f004-11e9-a55a-30afa498db1b
And it gets even more expensive if you win - you've got to do it all again!
Whitewash averted.
LR are so strong, Ineos have to bring their best to beat them, and happy to see them do that today. Second race was good stuff.