Swedish, have I miss read it or is your max heart rate actually 220, or have you just not adjusted your max setting?
Those are the default ones, my cycling max is around 178.
Will adjust accordingly.
Revisited the FTP test today with the 20 minute test. Rather more successful than the 8 minute test last week. 254w FTP, still a way to go to get back to the halcyon days 🙁
Chef, that looks rank! Think I'll stick with sweet spot stuff for now....
Mr Blobby, careful you don't leave skid marks on the kitchen floor 😀
I felt good on today's club run 😉
[url= http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3721/11780024285_61f7469739.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/36927256@N00/11780024285/ ]Untitled[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/36927256@N00/ ]monkey****er[/url], on Flickr
80rpm, that's quite a gear you must be turning 530/11?!
Impressive eh, no EPO'zzz or nuffin, had one of those thingies like Guy Martin but biggerer.
Scylla today, 2 minutes under then 1 minute over FTP (+/- 5% iirc). 3 blocks, 12 minutes each with 6 minutes recovery between.
Pretty hard going after a couple of days out, sat here now with that lovely leg burn.
Monkeyfudger... watt happened there?! 🙂
Haze, over/under sessions are tough but well worth the effort. Not done Scylla for a while, shall plan it in.
Did 'The Thumb' yesterday....once again I had to knock it down to 90/95% but then I realised my resistance settings on the turbo had slipped and we're wrong. Managed to get it back up to 100% for the last 2 3min VO2 intervals
Doh
Gazhurst... I do like The Thumb, a good session. Always feel like I'm never going to be able to complete it after the first few intervals but then get into a bit of a groove after about half an hour and really enjoy it.
I think my problem is my Turbo (not making intentional excuses). I have the Elite Superchrono with 8 varying resistance levels but that exact turbo isn't listed on TrainerRoad so I have used the closest one to it. The one on TrainerRoad has 5 settings so I set it to 2 but had it on 3 on my turbo.
I was looking at the various trainer settings. Noticed that the Elite PowerMag has 8 settings on TrainerRoad. Wondered if this might be a better match for your trainer? I guess as long as you always pick the same setting of turbo and resistance setting then it's not such a big deal. May not be accurate but at least it will be consistent, which is probably what's important.
Thinking of signing up for the trainer road... seems pretty good.
Just wondering what sort of file it produces?
I have used the Virtual power for my Kurt Kinetic trainer on Golden cheetah before (matches the powertap exactly, just smoother) and can upload the Golden cheetah file up and it produces wattage figures for analysing. I have since moved onto using WKO so would like to be able to upload my trainer road file up to it and get accurate wattage figures for it without always using my powertap
Ultimately i can always just use my powertap wheel and Garmin head unit as well to record it all for that purpose, but changing tyres and wheels about and setting it up takes 10-15 minutes of my life that I would rather spend pedalling furiously of course.
so would like to be able to upload my trainer road file up to it and get accurate wattage figures for it without always using my powertap
You won't. Virtual power gives you a repeatable number, but it won't be comparable to your PowerTap numbers, so fairly meaningless in WKO.
I just use my PowerTap, obviously means tyres don't last as long as they might, but it's not that bad, and means it's genuinely comparable.
What njee20 said.
Though worth having a play with the virtual power and the power tap and seeing what the discrepancy is. May not be too bad depending on what you're trying to do on the turbo. I did try this, it wasn't too far out, but found it quite sensitive to things like tyre pressure and how tightly the roller was up against the rear tyre. In the end I just use the powertap all time (but then I hardly ever use it outdoors so it just stays on my turbo setup.)
I was looking at the various trainer settings. Noticed that the Elite PowerMag has 8 settings on TrainerRoad. Wondered if this might be a better match for your trainer?
I have the same Elite Superchrono trainer as gazhurst and I actually emailed trainerroad about which turbo to choose on the software. They suggested the beta version of the 8 level Elite Powermag would be a better fit.
The Kurt Kinetic has a mapped out power curve that has accurately measured the wattage recorded by my powertap, so yes, it does in this case!
[url= http://www.kurtkinetic.com/powercurve.php ]http://www.kurtkinetic.com/powercurve.php[/url]
As Mr Blobby points out the set up is important. If you measure the roll down, It is definitely on the money in my experience.Unless you are knocking our threshold intervals at 1400 watts 😆
Anyway - can anyone answer my question about the file type? I can't access the Trainer road support desk via my work internet
On the side - I think a lot of people might be struggling so much initially when increasing their FTP setting on TR due to a lot of turbos not having a progressive curve of resistance? So 5% increase in wheel speed at the sensor is actually a lot more than 5% increase in the wattage required to turn that speed perhaps?
Just wondering what sort of file it produces?
Oh and you can dump out your workout from TrainerRoad in TCX format so easy to load into WKO. I do almost exactly this (into TrainingPeaks.)
Edit...
On the side - I think a lot of people might be struggling so much initially when increasing their FTP setting on TR due to a lot of turbos not having a progressive curve of resistance? So 5% increase in wheel speed at the sensor is actually a lot more than 5% increase in the wattage required to turn that speed perhaps?
Would assume this is just because the workouts become harder 🙂
Don't use the virtual power, but would have assumed that the power curves are built up from a discreet set of data points then some interpolation used to determine the intermediate points. Don't know how many discreet data points are used but would hope a fair few in order to make the interpolation less of a guess.
Cheers!
Would be interesting to see a TCX upload to another system from someone who does use the Virtual power.
Would be interesting to see a TCX upload to another system from someone who does use the Virtual power.
I had to do this a couple of times when my powertap had a flat battery. Just looks like any other TCX file with power data. What you expecting to see?
mrblobby - MemberWould be interesting to see a TCX upload to another system from someone who does use the Virtual power.
I had to do this a couple of times when my powertap had a flat battery. Just looks like any other TCX file with power data. What you expecting to see?
Thats what I was hoping to see, thanks 🙂
If I'm getting the gist of what you're asking...in Career, there is a 'button' at the top called 'download'. Click on this and it downloads a file to your computer. Simply upload this into either TrainingPeaks or WKO. It works, I have done it and do do it
I have the same Elite Superchrono trainer as gazhurst and I actually emailed trainerroad about which turbo to choose on the software. They suggested the beta version of the 8 level Elite Powermag would be a better fit.
Awesome. I kept meaning to email them but kept forgetting
I was looking at the various trainer settings. Noticed that the Elite PowerMag has 8 settings on TrainerRoad. Wondered if this might be a better match for your trainer? I guess as long as you always pick the same setting of turbo and resistance setting then it's not such a big deal. May not be accurate but at least it will be consistent, which is probably what's important.
I do have a Stages powermeter on my race bike (mtb) but have been struggling to connect it to the turbo as it's a 12 x 142 rear axle. I have managed to source a Kurt Traxle so that issue is now solved but the Traxle is slightly too wide to fit my turbo. Once I have sorted it, I intend to use the mtb with stages rather than virtual power
Just used Trainer Road for the first time and did the 20 minute FTP test.
To be fair I havent read up much, but I was a little confused.
During the 20 minute section should I being going all out as hard as a can sustain for 20 minutes, or trying to keep my heart rate at the 'target heart rate' suggested. I pretty much kept at the target rate suggested (around 157 bpm) which didnt feel right.
Any advice?
Ta
It's meant to be the max effort you can manage over the 20 minutes, no holding back. Should be no more left in the tank at the end of the 20 mins. You may be better off doing the 8 minute test initially. That's 8 mins as hard as you can, then a bit of a rest, then another 8 mins hard as you can. A percentage of the average of both gives you an FTP estimate. Reckon it's easier to judge what you can sustain for 8 mins rather than 20 mins.
So why does it suggest a target heart rate on the left then?
Would assume that's just based on the default setting for LTHR. If you have an FTP setup then the target for the test will be to achieve that FTP value.
6 *4 minutes off 3 tonight. Completed the session which I failed to do last week, (stopping after 4 intervals).
Just on the edge of utter misery but made it through thanks to yesterday's day off and being fueled by cake from the boss earlier in the day.
Came back to Trainerroad after 2 weeks "off" - one doing the Festive 500, and the other actually off. Managed Cardinal as part of the Sweet Spot Base 2 and didn't feel nearly as bad as I did after I upped my FTP before Christmas.
Slide Mountain again for me, got a little carried away on the last stretch when Media Player spat out some Dead Kennedys!
Felt very good though 8)
Felt very good though
I have never done a turbo session that felt good. All mine are horrible hatefull experience 😉
I did one called McKinley a couple of days ago. Outside it would have been fine, but on a turbo it left me feeling a bit traumatised. On the bright side I think it used 2400kj so should help shift the xmas belly.
Pretty interested in this as a way to make my roller sessions a bit more targeted.
One question is how much difference does what model of roller you select make to the workouts? I've got an old set that look like the Minoura Action Advance rollers ([url] http://www.cyclexpress.co.uk/minaction/?gclid=CKX-usvN7rsCFTHLtAodzwcAqw [/url]) but have no clue what they actually are! (no resistance)
As well as that is it just an ANT+ sensor and USB stick I'd need?
Ta
You need something with resistance (or a power meter) for it to work.
I did Haeckel last night
First time on a new turbo (Elite Novo Force) and using the Stages Powermemter on my race bike.
First thing I noticed was how erratic the power was. If the target was 269, I was reading anything from 230 to 320. Is this right? If so, how do I make it smoother? I had it set to 3sec smoothing
I also realised how difficult it is to ride at the higher end of FTP when using a 1 x 10 set up with a 32t front ring and 11-36 on the back. The session was supposed to be 3x4 intervals of high force targetting a cadence around 60rpm but I found I was doing 110rpm just to get the power in the biggest gear.
Saying that, I thought it was a VO2max session aimed at high cadence....ooops not surprisingly, I struggled AGAIN
Fixed resistance turbos are a generally designed for road wheel size and gearing, so little wheels and little mtb gearing doesn't tend to work well. And power meters do tend to fluctuate a lot more than virtual power if your pedalling isn't that smooth.
Awful session last night. Didn't get on will after 8 as trouble getting the boy to bed, was mentally knackered. Abandoned after a few minutes 🙁
That's quite a wide power range.
I use the 3 second smoothing and run +/-20 watts most of the time.
1*10 is not going to lend itself to low cadance work, stick to the road bike for that.
I also realised how difficult it is to ride at the higher end of FTP when using a 1 x 10 set up with a 32t front ring and 11-36 on the back.
1*10 is not going to lend itself to low cadence work, stick to the road bike for that
The Tacx Booster is awesome for 1x Turbo training and low cadence stuff. I forget the exact numbers I calculated for 1x10, but max power at 90rpm is around 550W on 32T and 11-36. That should be plenty for everything but very short sprints in the fitter people- certainly plenty for useless me!
What rollers are people using then?
One I'm using at the moment is a borrow so if I need something with resistance I'll have to splash some cash.
Prefer rollers to turbo...
I use the Elite ones with resistance, here:
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/elite-v-arion-parabolic-inertial-rollers/
Work well, not the easiest to ride I've since found out, a little too much plastic in the build, but have lasted two winters kept in a damp shed in minus temps.
but max power at 90rpm is around 550W on 32T
Not sure 90RPM counts as low cadance, but fair play that's quite some resistance.
Ta
I use the 3 second smoothing and run +/-20 watts most of the time.1*10 is not going to lend itself to low cadance work, stick to the road bike for that.
+1 to both of these.
Just got the Planet X resistance rollers. They look pretty good (made by SportsCrafters) but not really had a chance to use them properly yet. Plenty of resistance there though (actually a little worried there's too much!) Looks sturdy and the drums are nicely machined. Use a power meter so not bothered about virtual power, but notice that the sports crafter rollers are supported, which I think are identical.
Not sure 90RPM counts as low cadance, but fair play that's quite some resistance.
90rpm and ~550W was to illustrate a high usable range and of course the max W generated at 70rpm for example will be lower but still more than high enough for most people and applications.
Reviews of the Tacx Booster noted that most testers could barely move the cranks on a road bike in the highest resistance setting 😯 How smooth it is at that level of resistance I'm not sure as I'm not doing anything anywhere near that level at the moment
My turbo bike is an old 26" mtb set up 1 x 9. It is setup with a 46t ring on the front and 11-25 cassette on the back, which gives a good range of resistance, although I hardly ever pedal it in 46-11 - maybe for a 10/10 sprint at the end of a Sufferfest workout. That is on a fixed resistance Cyclops Fluid Trainer. If I used a normal sized front ring I would be spinning madly all the time.
Fluid trainers get harder the harder you pedal though don't they? They Elite (IIRC) one I had did. Wasn't a linear resistance curve.
I've been using the Cycleops rollers with the resistance unit for some workouts. Pretty decent, I can get enough power down despite using a compact.
Last nights workout was one I put in myself again, meant to be a ramp test with 8, 8 sec flat out seated sprints at the end but I got distracted at work and missed off the final part. Duh! Ended up having to do a few rewinds on it. Was hoping to get a bit higher up but the old legs just weren't having it. FTP targets are meaningless in it but I just find it a hell of a lot easier to do workouts on TrainerRoad with the laptop rather than using the Garmin. Need to edit it so it's correct, actual workout looked like this.
[url= http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3683/11850892144_e9a4af672a.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/36927256@N00/11850892144/ ]Untitled[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/36927256@N00/ ]monkey****er[/url], on Flickr
Reattatched the road bike last night and did Warren. Even though it was 2hrs 15mins, I found it quite enjoyable. Back to using Virtual Power and it was much much easier to keep to a target power.
I use an Elite Supercrono power mag with 8 levels, and I suggest to train with level x and set level x+1 in TrainerRoad.
I'm sure that the difference between the VirtualPartner and the real power is 20/30 watt.
So if you are using level 2 of trainer, with level 3 on Traninerroad you obtain a "more real" power.
It should be helpfull if Trainerroad allow the possibility to set the difference.
