[Closed] Trail closures at Woburn from July 1st

Is the Centerparcs rumour true?

I wondered this but it was some time ago now and in a different area from the trails but being a sceptic I feel there may be an agenda at work here! I mean in reality the bikers are growing in numbers but i have never heard of any major clashes with other users of the woods...well maybe the horse riders and there might be the problem!

Didn't they say this would happen a few years back when they pullled down all the 'shore stuff & big jumps? IIRC it was a case of "stop building this stuff & you can carry on riding the natural trails - build it again & we'll ban cycling altogether".

I'd heard that a load of stuff had gone up again since they started charging over at Chicksands - if that's the case then I'm not surprised the estate owners are unhappy.

Really, really hope this turns out to be false. I can't say I've been riding Woburn that long, but it the place I go to most often nowadays. I've never had any type of negative vibes from walkers or horse riders I've met. The majority of the manmade singletrack is slightly tucked away so I doubt there is many problems with cyclists blasting past people on foot and I wouldn't say it's an eyesore at all.

It's interesting to hear that the area is considered to be very busy. Even though you see plenty of bike racks in the car park, I'm always surprised how few people I actually see when I'm out riding for a couple of hours. I'd call the cyclists pretty unobtrusive to be honest. The exception to the unobtrusive point (and eyesore point) is obviously the activities in the jump area, and I do have some sympathy with other users of the area in that respect, as even I find vibes from the stormtroopers less than welcoming at times.

The other problem is that if the trails were shut then other "local" riding spots that people tend to head to from London; namely the Surrey Hills and Swinley - both areas that I would say definitely have more issues with the numbers of bikers using them - would see increased traffic. And then how long before access to one or both of them is called into question as well...

Only had one trip there but the jump area is pretty impressive and would be a shame if flattened but if it's all unofficial then it's understandable, some of the jumps looked pretty mental.

I can state that it has definately become far more used in the last few years and a fair number of new singletrack trails have sprung up aside from the jumps area which has seen massive amounts of work done so it was always going to be an issue to someone but as the cyclists will still ride the area regardless of the few obstacles put in their path, plus some of it is publis access so i cant see why some form of trail manaement cant be applied....look at Cannock and other centres for instance, i know they limit the trails to one main ridable track but this would keep it seperate from other users and possibly more managable/chargable and keep us marauding hordes out of harms way...just a thought.

Still haven't made it to Woburn yet, going to have to go in the next month then so I can get there before everythings ruined.

I had reported the threat from info I had from the councils and the Greensand Trust, but I haven't been told about any imediate threat.
I've been riding there since the 80s and the thing with Woburn is to keep a low profile and remember it's private land. However trail modification has got very aggresive lately and people have actually been signing these 'cheeky' trails.
Another issue is permits. Well watch the warden try and get permits from the riders in the jump area....he wont because people don't want to buy them then make it worse by dishing out abuse.
Then there were biking businesses running in the woods, which in theory is like someone setting up in your back garden!
There are users forums, but I've never seen any other cycling clubs etc at these meetings.
The maintenance of the area is paid for by the council, who in turn sub it out to the Greensand Trust IIRC. However due to cuts the Duke was asked to chip in, and I think his attitude was 'if you want it you sort it' if you don't I'll just close off the lot, roughly speaking.
The problem with the biking community is that in this case it's all take take.
However, it's not all bad news. There are a lot of people on our side. And at the end of the day it's mainly plantation and could be flattened anyway 😥
Edit; That last bit came out a bit wrong i.e it's plantation and not SSSI

Just had a word with someone about this, and yes the threat is now serious.
Basically what was agreed was that the old quarry pit could be used as a play area as it was out of site. However the development has gone up the banks into full sight and the digging is undermining the trees. Also the digging has gone wasy further out and is considered an eyesore (I agree with that part)
It needs to be properly sorted, but I believe even the CTC coundn't get anywhere.

is this about closure of the jump spot or acess to the whole estate? it'd be a real shame to lose access to everything but the main bridleways.

they've had signs up about the digging damaging the trees and drainage etc for a couple of years and the digging's carried on, sounds like communication hasn't been too good in either direction? sad - it's a great spot and there's a good scene based around the jump spot

This is what i was told but the guy went further to say the threat was to the whole area i.e. all of the non public access routes with trails on. If this is policable is another matter. i partly agree about the unauthorised digging that has been done in the bowl but i do kind of enjoy bits of it too, after 20 years of riding the trails and saying wouldn't it be good if we had some jumps etc and now we have it's soon to be flattened.
I dont suppose our local tory council have any plans for such recreational facilities!

It would be the whole area.
Thing is they don't mind some of the stuff, some of the recent trail work is very subtle as well as being very good.
However some of it is dreadful and when I rode through on Sunday I did see some stuff that made me think 'oh FFS'
As for policing it, yes that would be hard but they would fence off sections which means to access it you have to commit criminal damage.

If Woburn shut i think i would just give in and get a road bike.....Woburn is the closest decent stuff to me and that is an hours drive 😥

I felt very much the same as it's only 10mins away from home or 5 from work, other than Woburn we are forced to visit the Chilterns and other areas none of which I know, otherwise i'll be up the M6 to Cannock on a Sunday morning...3 hours of driving and about £40 all in... 🙁

"Another issue is permits. Well watch the warden try and get permits from the riders in the jump area....he wont because people don't want to buy them then make it worse by dishing out abuse."

That's a shame as most of the guys i photograph there seem to have no issue paying up, maybe they're just a little bit more moral than other DJers

there's still no decsision.

Been riding Woburn for many years without any real problems from other users. Iirc the permits were originally issued mainly for insurance reasons due to the amount/type of use.
I think that now the building has spread up the hill along with the other visible purpose built trails crossing bridleways are causing the issues with other users

Btw they are still selling permits!

[i]I felt very much the same as it's only 10mins away from home or 5 from work, other than Woburn we are forced to visit the Chilterns and other areas none of which I know, otherwise i'll be up the M6 to Cannock on a Sunday morning...3 hours of driving and about £40 all in..[/i]

Not wishing to sound antagonistic by are there no bridleways nearby?

My first ride with ventanarider and showerman yesterday and what a great day. I was SUPER skeptical before i went, how could ANYTHING near MK be good?? How WRONG i was, super quick, twisty, jumpy, steep trails. WAAAAY better than Cannock IMO

I have 'used' the woods for the last 30 plus years and held a ride permit for as long as I've been riding there. This ongoing official approval to ride specified tracks is at odds with this thread. I am never totally confident that we ever get the full story on here.

Lots of scaremongering, but has anyone actually seen or heard from the Bedford estates first hand anything to corroborate the rumour mill Are we really likely to turn up on the 1st July and find barbed wire everywhere? If access is to be restricted in less than 5 weeks surely someone must know something for certain now?

i am in contact with keith from greensands and he says nothing is confirmed at all

Presumably if this happened we could still ride the bridleways and once you're on them people will just ride off down the trails which surely they haven't got the time or manpower to block off.

And if they block the trails then this would also mean no access for horse riders or walkers either.

Surely this isn't going to happen.

bridleways will remain open

Are we really likely to turn up on the 1st July and find barbed wire everywhere?

There already is, i have the scars to prove it! 🙂
With regard to the rumours, could anyone be more specific? it a big old place. i ride up there every lunchtime and have paid for a permit but this is news to me. if its only the jump bits the kids have made, fine, all the proper Singletrack is nearer to bow brickhill anyway, it would be impossible to close that

The first I heard of it was in a mail from the council via the Greensand Trust.
The council and the Greensand Trust are pro biking.
Thing is the threats always been there, is it coincidence that this stirs as the place gets more popular and after recent trails have been made?
Jase I think the worst case senario would be that we would treat it like we did a few years back. Public ROWs would remain open.
It's a shame we couldn't get involved years ago, there's ample room for trails there.

People need to turn up with just their bikes. Saw a group of 6 or 7 lads on Sunday, half of them armed with shovels and this was no where near the jumps area

Jedi. You appear to be in the know. You say no decision has been made yet.
Does that mean there has been an official proposal to close the trails down?

ctc is involved in talks to see what can be done

I'll mail the guy at the council tomorrow. Tony I'll drop you a mail if I hear anything, as the Greensand Trust folks were keen for us to voice our opinions.
Who's the CTC rep any idea? IIRC Mr Warby tried some years back and had no luck.

dunno

Hi All
I've just had a quick skim through most of the above and thought I'd add a bit more info. My dear old mum is on the town/district council in Leighton Buzzard, a few miles from Woburn and knowing I'm a keen biker told me what she knows about potential closure of the trails there.

It is very likely that the trails and surounding area will be closed, and fairly soon. As another forum member has said the council are fairly pro-cycling and the Duke who is not really for or against cycling was quite happy for this area to be used for jumps etc. Within reason.

More recently however, trail construction has spread over a wider area, which was only really a minor concern to the landowner, the real problem as I think he sees it, is the usage of the area by a wider , more unsavoury spectrum of the population for non-cycling related activities (dogging/drugs/parties etc) once all the healthy, wholesome bikers are at home in bed.

I don't know what, if any, evidence there is to support this - but that's his feelings at the moment, so I'm lead to believe. A very unfortunate situation indeed, but the usual story of some idiots spoiling things for the majority of sensible landusers. I don't even think discussions with the landowner would help here, unless the biking community can police the area - not likely.

I'll hassle the old dear for more intelligence as soon as she knows anything !! BTW she didn't explain dogging - any ideas ??!!

yeah loads of dog walkers use the area

Will the Stockgrove side also be affected? I seem to recall that this part had a different land owner!?!?

If Stocky remains open surely all the unsavoury types will just go over there and therefore it just shifts the problem without actually resolving it.

It's certainly another permit. And actually there was talk about letting us extend the man made trails there.
Also a BMX and pump? track was built nearby in one of the old quarries. So you see they are willing to help.

What's interestg about markcdo's comments is that if that is the case, why then the recent surfacing work on the Byway which only encourages more cars and people with dog related hobbies.

FOR OLD GIT

Someone on the cyclone forum was asking about a pump track do you know whereabouts in MK it is

Pump track in MK?? Where please tell...

I appologise if i have wrongly reported any info on the matter as i said I am not really in the know but this has come from several different parties now plus all those signs and markers have disapeared which is apparently the start of the closure process. It is good to here from those of you with more inside knowledge so please keep it coming as many folk I ride with up there are quite disapointed about the prospect of closure.

Does any one know if there will be any public meetings where regular users can have an in put or any contact deatils so we can find more about what is going on? At the moment it looks like a forgone conclusion which strikes me as very sad for all the considerate users and those of us who have paid for permits.

I would love to know how the closure is going to be managed as there is good access from bridleways across back wood, bow brickhill park, aspley heath and aspley wood. Surely it will be impossible to stop access to these, all that can be achived is the closure of the jump site and the removal of the small trails that come off the main routes.

I cant see how any of this will help with the more dodgy stuff that happens in the evenings.

Cheers to those who are letting us know what is going on.

The pump track is (apparently) in Heath & Reach in the old quarry near the Cock Inn. I haven't seen it myself.

donks the signs going isn't anything to worry about, those little obvious things like signs and bits of shore always disappear. It's as I said earlier, if kept out of site of all the paths and other ROWs it seems almost acceptable. I think there are two reasons for this. First of all the people who have a general interest in the natural state of the area don't like it and rightly so. Secondly (and this is only hearsay) the Duke is worried that if anyone is injured on what appears to be 'sanctioned' trails and man-made obstacles i.e 'look we've built this for you come on and ride it' he'll face claims.

the pump track is in the play area!

don't forget that the duke had a big claim from a horse rider who broke their neck a couple of years ago. Horse riders were not welcome for over a year I believe, until that was sorted.

I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't worried that something similar will happen with all the crazy new digging. I think he's right, but I'd hate to lose access to some of the best singletrack in the south east.

BTW, a load of 'no riding' signs appeared about a year ago, in the area around the roller coaster. Not sure of their legal status...

Guy's Guy's Guy's pleeeeeeease - I had to join this site just for the need to try and abate the idle gossip until some facts are known.

What is happening with trails legal or not and the said closure of them and the shore over buttermilk woods has allot to do with the gossip on these types of forums - Some of the well known trails you love and have done since the early 80's (without blowing trumpets have been some of my work) before the jump park was built - I stail maintain them and other trails, bramble cutting, raking etc for my sins - The shore was fine for ovder two years until it got wide spread on forums the secret was out then it lasted a matter of months before it vanished, enjoy but don't advertise the fact - other people read these forums as a covert insight into whats going on - Ok off soap box now.

Being members of the IMBA UK & British Cycliing i have contacted Bedford Estates london office who put me through to Woburn estates office. I have explained the issues that have been flying around as i ride the trails and the jump park and have sent detailed OS maps for clarification of Bedford Estates coverage - The estate manager is on vacation until june 7th who will advise us whats covered by the Bedford Estates / Woburn estates / and private lands.Greensands trust are only voluntery park wardens covering a small part and do not cover back wood charle wood and buttermilk wood(Roller coaster / RC2 & Hgans Run side of things off London end Lane this is the road the roller coaster spits us out on.

British cycling are now working with the forestry comission to work with local land owners and comunitys to promte mountain biking, build trail centres & trails and hold events, offering much needed revenue into local comunitys - I have fed this information into Bedford estates also, I have asked for a face to face meeting so lets see what comes of it.

The jump works well now apart from the little being left by idiots with no brains but still follows the guidlines set down when the threat of closure loomed many years back - when dump trucks full fullers earth where put there for us to build jumps (no woodedn structures) and i kind of think the lads have adhered to that.

With a logic head on I can't JCB's and bulldozers flattening all the trails over the 800 acres, as that will just make things an eye sore, it may transpire they flatten the jump park ??? why when it captures bikers to ride there and dig there?? many locals ride there and have sculpted the runs? Would the Duke & Dutches sitting on £490million be that close to the action/woods? all these questions will i hope be answered on the 7th of June or soon after - please feel free to drop me a mail if you want more info or want to be kept in the loop as to whats going on, and i'll send you the british cycling/forestry comission stuff.

thanks for your time in reading this - lets keep our fingers crossed things work out - mrspesh@gmail.com

Mark you heard anything yet?

mrspesh have we met, were you at any of the users meeting or involved in getting the Oak wood trails cut?
I've just had a word with a friend who is in touch with the chairman of the Greensand Trust and is our only direct link the the Duke.
The feedback I got sort of matches the gut feeling I've had recently which is basically don't do anything yet.
There have been times like this before and they've blown over, this might as well. What I'd really like to know is what sparked off this recent threat, which is not gossip or if it is it came from both the Greensand Trust and the Council.
Why now after allowing the construction of the jump site, the permit system and authorised trails until recently we have even been given permision to take 4X4s to trail management areas.
Even when we took up the ofer to show the MBR guys around permission was sought and granted from the Greensand Trust. And IIRC there was talk of extending the man made trails at Oak Wood?
All very confusing.