[Closed] Titanium ,still not a bike for life?

depends what wheel size you order I guess 🙂 If you had ordered a 26 one a yr ago I'd suggest more like a 'bike for 5 yrs'....

If you want a "bike for life" get steel.
I have ti and steel so no bias here.
If the ti bikes get damaged I can't afford to fix them. If the steel does, I can, and will.

Why would anyone want a bike for life? So many things change as the years go by. I still have my steel frame from my first mountain bike (1991). No way would I build it up into a bike for any kind of meaningful riding.

[i]Is this still the case? Should I avoid ordering a made in the UK from one of the specialists? [/i]

I've a nice, custom fit, hand made in the UK, Ti frame. I figure anything over 20 years will be a bonus.

My cheap, Taiwanese26" hardtail is still going strong after 8 years or so. My Van Nicholas Amazon has several thousand miles of use under its wheels. My new Burls 29er is already racking up the miles. I reckon you've as much chance of a dodgy Ti frame as any other material - just stay away from that US manufacturer whose name begins with L.

A Google images search for "cracked titanium frame" should answer your question.
See if you can guess which one is mine. 😛

just stay away from that US manufacturer whose name begins with L.

I had a frame from the manufacturer beginning with L ,kind of hence the question

I't hasn't put me off just the £ to VFM ration.

I'd say that original adage was always misinterpreted. Ti frames were so expensive compared with the 531 or worse most folks rode it was a bike for life because you had to spent your life's toy money up buying the damn thing!

[i]I't hasn't put me off just the £ to VFM ration. [/i]

For me, cost wasn't the primary consideration. I didn't want a [i]cheap[/i] Ti frame, I wanted a custom made Ti frame and was prepared to accept that these two factors are mutually exclusive, imo.

Aye - still not cheap but my custom Burls cost less than Salsa wanted for an equivalent El Mariachi frame [i]at trade[/i]

[i]Why would anyone want a bike for life? So many things change as the years go by. I still have my steel frame from my first mountain bike (1991). No way would I build it up into a bike for any kind of meaningful riding. [/i]

This.

And

[i]Indeed, learnt this the hard way. Lynskey suck balls, fact. [/i]

Still have a Lynskey built 456Ti as my only bike - ridden 2-3 times per week and while the frame is still solid it has pretty much destroyed every component attached to it, more than once 🙂

And from a VFM point of view, very much value. £800 new and in its 7th year, so about the same cost as just paying for the servicing of a FS's shock/bearings etc, nevermind buying one (or more) in the first place.

My take, as someone who owns three ti frames, is that you buy Ti because you like the ride and the way it looks rather than because you believe it will outlive you. That said, like steel, it's repairable, it's just that it's harder to do because the process of welding titanium requires specialist equipment and skills.

As far as Lynskey goes, I cracked my Ragley Ti, they fixed it under warranty, twice, which is another story, but ultimately I'm happy.

Ti isn't indestructible, it's not cheap, and it's fiddly to repair, but it does ride nicely. But bikes for life? I'm not sure they really exist.

for those with nice Ti frames in 26er guise and a few yrs old, do you reckon you will be able to get forks and wheels in 3 or 4 yrs time ? genuine question

^ that is a valid question, my m8 Merlin ti frame is lovely (1 1/8 headset) but what going to happen when he can't get a 'nice' set of forks in few years time?
Also in all honesty a 29er would probably suit him better, so his 26er 'bike for life', is a leash too.
Stuff changes to fast for a bike for life IMO, just get a nice bike, if you can afford a Ti, then do it but don't expect it to last forever*

*Ok a rigid bike might fit the description better but who the hell (in their right mind [IMO of course]) wants a rigid bike as the bike for life?

[i]for those with nice Ti frames in 26er guise and a few yrs old, do you reckon you will be able to get forks and wheels in 3 or 4 yrs time ? genuine question [/i]

Well, mine's a road frame. However, why couldn't one use 29" forks with a 26" wheel, if required?

As for the wheels themselves, there's plenty of cycling exotica, from yester-year still knocking around and folk still finds parts.
I do not foresee a problem sticking with my 26" wheeled MTB.

Wheels? I don't think 26" rims are going to disappear any time soon so I can build what I want from those.

Forks: with tapered steelers and different wheel sizes, this could become an issue but how often do you actually have to buy a new set of forks? I have some SIDs and a set of Pace rigids that should see me fine.

If the feel of ti is important go for it but if I want reliable durability it's steel every time. All frames can be broken though. Where steel wins over ti for me is in its toughness.
Would I avoid a uk made ti bike? No, and I've got a fairly pricey ti bike. But I'd want to feel confident that they would stand behind the product in a way I was happy with.

Van Nicholas have a new fatbike frame coming out. I might just "need" it...

iainc

for those with nice Ti frames in 26er guise and a few yrs old, do you reckon you will be able to get forks and wheels in 3 or 4 yrs time ? genuine question

Consider that probably 99% of mountainbikes ever made over maybe a 30 year period have 26" wheels. The pre installed user base dwarfs the other wheel sizes.

And even if the major players decided to ignore the size in order to part more fools from their hard earned, there would soon be smaller manufacturers springing up to cater for this "niche".

Remember the first time you heard about fat bikes? Well someone, somewhere was making parts for them. Remember when 650b was just some obscure crackpot tweener size? Well you could still get parts for them. You can still get tyres for 50 year old wheel sizes so my answer would be yes, I think you'll get parts for them.

nice Ti bikes are nice to have. I have one from 1994 that I still ride and if you work out the number of rides/miles I've had out of it, its a bargain. I've had it repaired and yes getting it done cost a fair amount but after 20 years its one of the family and the price per mile still leaves it as a bargain.

As for new changes to design, sure they keep coming and the marketing blurb always tells you something is better, but to be blunt a bike is just a bike. Shut up and ride.

I've got a 10 year old aluminium Cannondale road bike, it's probably the same weight as a Ti frame, and I'll probably keep it indefinately, does that ironicaly make early 2000's era aluminium cannondales bikes for life?

I suspect like most bikes it wont be mechanical failure that kills it off, it'll be continuous improvements in new bikes and standards (BB30, tapered forks, disk brakes and 600g off the frame/fork weight, yes please!)

Simple thing is that your next bike is the bike for life.
With an industry shaking itself around I'd hold off a bold choice for a year ago.

Neither of my Lynskey frames broke. Another ti one did. Ti is nice to own but like others have said, why would you want a bike for life - unless you're already in your 80s.

like others have said, why would you want a bike for life - unless you're already in your 80s.

It's just a rubbish cliche that people bring out to beat ti frames with. If you think about it, it's complete bobbins anyway, what does 'life' mean when you might be run over by a speeding Audi tomorrow or live for another 50 years. My heart sinks every time someone drags the phrase out like a rusty Fiesta that's been sat on someone's driveway for 20 years.

Just complete nonsense 😐

Quite how you define 'life' in this context is another discussion, but I'd never want to 'invest' in a bike with any sort of sense of obligation that I had to keep it indefinitely because it was my "bike for life" or whatever.

Yes things may settle down and technology may not change as much in the future, but if it does then you'll be left with something you may not enjoy as much.

Going into a bike purchase with a predetermined idea of how long you'll have it is a sure fire way not to enjoy the bike IMO!

I have a brand new Cove Hummer 650b for sale 😉 Should last until the next wheel size change!

Seven

And even if the major players decided to ignore the size in order to part more fools from their hard earned, there would soon be smaller manufacturers springing up to cater for this "niche".

If you have (as said a Merlin XLM for example) a lightweight XC frame with 26" wheels and straight 1.125" forks try and find me some suitable top end replacements now? They're getting rarer and rarer already. Of course they'll never disappear altogether, the market's huge, but choice is definitely dwindling hugely.

Should I avoid ordering a made in the UK from one of the specialists?

who's making Ti frames here in the UK?

2008 Cotic Soda here - still going strong and still looks brand new despite regularly being thrown down things it probably wasn't designed to be thrown down.

bike for life - I hope so as its the best Iv ever owned

26" Wheels
QR axle
1,1'8 headset
27.2 seat tube

...but the geometry was ahead of its time (long top tube, short stays, compact frame, good stand over, relaxed angles.

No reason to change frames just to conform with the latest standards

Enigma still built custom frames in the U.K

No regrets at all re purchasing my 456EVO Ti.
Taper headset; 30.9 seatpost; 26" wheels but that's absolutely fine. Can't see any reason to change it for a good few years yet.... but "bike for life" is an ambitious claim indeed.

who's making Ti frames here in the UK?

I am well at least It seems like a good idea to go back to doing what I originally did 18 years ago when I worked in the USA ,Titanium which was followed by Carbon (a lot of people don't know that) but its what I learned to build frames out of and its one of my favourite materials to work with, this whole thread is why it's not worth arguing about materials ,people like to have a choice

convert - Member
I'd say that original adage was always misinterpreted. Ti frames were so expensive compared with the 531 or worse most folks rode it was a bike for life because you had to spent your life's toy money up buying the damn thing!

This...

I don't actually think Titanium is the "Best" material for a bike frame to be made from, it's not terrible but there are lighter materials and more durable/stronger materials available at lower cost, boring but rational...

A Titanium frame is really a "Heart over Head" choice IMO, if you can be honest with yourself about that, drop the "Frame for life" justification and you still find you just really want one still, then just get it... scratch the itch if you can afford to.

Yep - a Bike for life...its marketing cliche - for justifing a large spend...

Never really rated ti tbh always thought it was overpriced and a tad boring..

The whole Ti frame being a frame for life might have been the case 25ish years ago when the term was coined but not today. BITD. We weren't hammering our frames off 4 foot drops and other obstacles at trail centres and the likes. So back then compared to what we were riding back then a Ti frame would have lasted forever. Nowadays it would need to be a very well frame to last forever. Plus be built from top grade Titanium as not all titanium is equal. If the frame is cheap for example from XACD then there's every chance this is recycled Titanium and thus contains impurities within the metal which can lead to failure of the frame. Your top brand custom designers always use top quality Titanium. And by top designers I'm talking Kent Eriksen, Moots, Indy Fab, Seven, Crisp, Black Sheep, DeKerf etc etc. I would much sooner spend the money on a top quality steel frame than a cheaper Titanium frame.

that is a valid question, my m8 Merlin ti frame is lovely (1 1/8 headset) but what going to happen when he can't get a 'nice' set of forks in few years time?

Very valid question - I changed the fork on my Kobe Ti, still going strong after 8 years or more of service - but actually finding a decent 1 1/8 fork wasn't that easy, particularly as I'm still runnning QR9 wheels.

I've got some brand new Rebas 1 1/8th and QR9 for sale 😉

It's just a rubbish cliche that people bring out to beat ti frames with

I would quite like a Ti frame, have wanted one since forever, just don't want to pay anywhere near Ti rrp for one 😕

Never really rated ti tbh always thought it was overpriced and a tad boring..

That's bizarre I sit at the other end of the spectrum apart from the advantages you can get stiffness wise I think steel is a bit mleh and boring,

I've owned my '98 Hei Hei since new. Of course it's a bike for life, what on earth could replace something I love more than my first born?

Never really rated ti tbh always thought it was overpriced and a tad boring..

I think steel is a bit mleh and boring

*IANAMaterials scientist
**completely independent of how much it actually costs to manufacture

My experience of Ti frames suggests, just like with a steel frame, it's all about the tubes & the builder. Use silly thin (but super light) tubing...maybe you'll get a nice "compliant" (flexy) ride, but don't be surprised when it breaks. Having been down that road in the past (along with quite a few other people 😉 ), my current custom Ti frame is just about the stiffest MTB I've ever ridden due to being designed to not break.