Tyre clearance. 100+ mile offroad is better with fatter rubber. In my humble opinion, of course.
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Everytime someone posts one of these threads I end up with a different bike to consider, sigh.
That orange Sutra is nice but the blue one is nicerer. I'm sure that someone on here has one.
Kona Sutra LTD 2016 [url= http://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/road-bikes-c5/touring-c41/sutra-ltd-adventure-bike-2016-p17104 ]clicky[/url]
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please stop showing the Kona sutra ltd............ 😆
I realise I'm going against the trend here, but i now use a 29er for this sort of stuff. It's a Pinnacle Ramin with 100mm forks with lockout (and it takes a rack).
It's far better than my drop bar bike was off-road, especially for 100 mile rides, and barely any slower on-road with some slicks.
I used my old Mk1 Salsa Fargo for commute all through autumn and winter for last couple of years, with 2" Specialized Fast Trak. Very capable bike and could easily hold 15mph on it.
Secret is not to run 1x gearing, stay a front mech so you can have a decent size ring at the front
That Kona really is very nice!
that kona is a lovely looking thing, much nicer colour than the 2016 CdF 20, which is beige!
The 2017 CdF 10 is mustard, it's actually quite nice in the flesh!
El Shalimo -
32" inside leg. I did find a size chart online somewhere and was lucky enough to fall into the middle if the band for a Large (if I remember correctly).
yea the 2017 colour in the cdf range is good, but I can get a 2016 cdf 20 for £800 (originally £1200), no spec changes just colour, so its a lot to pay for a prettier colour perhaps...
I had a Cotic Escapade, followed by a Surly Ogre and now a Surly Straggler. Each meet a similar brief to the OP, with perhaps a greater emphasis on tarmac riding.
I'd recommend the Escapade or Straggler, depending on what your needs are. The Escapade is slightly lighter, more upright, takes slightly narrower tyres and has fewer bolts for fittings. The Straggler is obviously the inverse of that and gives, as a result of a lower stack height and front end, a slightly wider range of options for experimenting with ride position.
I consolidated a lighter road bike and commuter/tourer (Ogre) into the Straggler, with two wheelsets:
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In case you were considering the Ogre, I can't recommend it. It was nice to have a dedicated commuter / tourer, but - unless it was loaded with luggage - it rode uncomfortably.
This is my escapade
[img] http://s105.photobucket.com/user/Burko_73/media/IMG_8337_zpsyhukym6t.jpg.html ][IMG] http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m202/Burko_73/IMG_8337_zpsyhukym6t.jp g" target="_blank">http://s105.photobucket.com/user/Burko_73/media/IMG_8337_zpsyhukym6t.jpg.html ][IMG] http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m202/Burko_73/IMG_8337_zpsyhukym6t.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL][/img]
[url= http://s105.photobucket.com/user/Burko_73/media/Bike/IMG_8343_zpsxvkutecg.jpg.html ][IMG] http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m202/Burko_73/Bike/IMG_8343_zpsxvkutecg.jp g" target="_blank">http://s105.photobucket.com/user/Burko_73/media/Bike/IMG_8343_zpsxvkutecg.jpg.html ][IMG] http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m202/Burko_73/Bike/IMG_8343_zpsxvkutecg.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]]Hanging around....[/url]
9 sp xt cassette 11-36 with sora, helpfully mtb and road 9 sp all works togetherGot some alpkit wheels with 42c tubeless wtb nanos for winter. Kept the original wheels with conti file tread slicks. These are good on rough roads and great on gravel fire roads in the summer.
I'm loving it, most ridden bike of 2016
AWOL?
Steady as a rock on road, good fun off.
Wife's small came in a bit lighter than my Disc Trucker.
Base model is pretty much spot on.
Nothing needs changing, apart from the resin only rotors.
No overlap, even on a small.
Better than the Disc Trucker off road, but a bit barge like on tarmac.
The Surly feels more connected on tarmac, more like a road bike and takes heavy loads better too.
Feels odd on singletrack though like your always going to lose the front.
Fine off road otherwise and will climb seated up stuff I'd have trouble walking.
Both have no new standards, take huge tyres and are good fun.
i reckon the disc trucker is a good shout. strong enough to carry a 20 stone bloke and 4 panniers on mixed terrain tours, and quick enough to also carry him on a 100 mile road ride.
mine is shod with 48c tyres and guards at present. reckon a 2'' would fit in without guards.
rode it with nitto rando bars, also flat mtb bars and bar ends, just done a month with jones bars on (felt to short and twitchy) now gonna try some flared drops to see what they feel like.
perfect bike for most stuff i think, without too many compromises.
If you needed lighter off road capability then I'm sure I saw the Genesis Equilibrium disc 20 2016 with 105 was in stock for most sizes a few days ago somewhere on the web for £899 down from £1500+. Maybe there's a similar deal on last year's Cdf out there somewhere. Might be worth asking a dealer to ask their rep.
In case you were considering the Ogre, I can't recommend it. It was nice to have a dedicated commuter / tourer, but - unless it was loaded with luggage - it rode uncomfortably.
Interesting! In what way was it uncomfortable?
ampthill - Member
The Corriayairick pass is for my the defining low point of riding a rigid bike. On a modern bike that descent would be brilliant. Even on a rigid MTB it hurt. So whilst it might possible with 38mm tyres that doesn't make it desriable or ideal.
Which is why I use 2.35" tyres (Schwalbe Big Apples). I didn't recall any particular discomfort on the Corrieyairack.
Volume makes all the difference. Now that high volume tyres are available for road use, I'm surprised more manufacturers don't use them on their non race bikes.
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looking at an off road tourer/adventure/ do it all bike.
Why look at bikes with drop bars, out of interest?
A swept bar that takes MTB brake levers makes more sense for off-road touring use ime. If it's mixed terrain then neither MTB or road bars (flared or not) have the real advantage but unless a bike works well as a road bike and you're doing plenty of road miles on it as well I'd forget about drops, personally. I like drop bars for most uses inc off-roading but also think they're a bit silly off-road : )
And I agree with epicyclo, the bigger the tyre the better if mostly off-road. 45C is good. 2.3" can be great.
(cue pic of Tomac out-riding any of us on his drop-bar Yeti)
Next time I am in the market I'd like to build one of these. Soma Wolverine - think Singular Peregrine without the toe overlap.
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I'd forgotten how great mudguards were until i fitted some to my AWOL. Whatever you get, make sure it can take 40c tyres and still have room for mudguards particularly if you're going to commute
Here's my specialized sequoia......
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I'm not going to lie, it's pretty weighty at 29lbs as it sits there.......but I'll also say that the weight is not an issue.
Before all the weight weenies say otherwise, I'll quantify that statement! For the first hour or so, you notice it on the hills and on acceleration, but when you've been riding for a bit, and find yourself doing stupid cornering moves and taking rubbish lines just for fun, you'll realise what I mean.....the weight becomes momentum, and once you're up to ramming speed, it stays there with minimal effort! It's also massively comfy!
It can also run 650b wheels with ease, but comes fitted with 42c sawtooth tyres, which are excellent. I would only change the tyres for the gumwall version for aesthetics!
My bike is built around a Kinesis Pro 6 frame for the sort of riding the OP described.
I got both a Genesis Croix de Fer 2016 and Cotic Roadrat mk1.
The Roadrat is very soft but also very comfy on bridle road and over potholes, 37c tyres+fender and 2x10 Tiagra flatbar(rimbrakes) but I don't use it for longer journeys - I just don't feel comfy enough on it, loaded or not.
The Croix de Fer is stiffer, faster and fully trust it for longer journeys. But not as forgiving(I'm okay with that though), BB is lower, 2x11 105 dropbar (hydraulic discs). You'll get [u]toe overlap[/u] with fenders on the Croix de Fer!
I work in a bikeshop where we have Straggler, RLT9 steel, CaadX, SuperX (no Genesis or Cotic though). [b]My recommendation:[/b] Croix de Fer, RLT9, Straggler in that order
That orange Sutra is nice but the blue one is nicerer. I'm sure that someone on here has one.
Oh, me! Yes, a blue one - yes, I love it. The colour does help. I love riding it down long fast bridleways; I pretty much ride it like I ride my XC mountainbike. About to upgrade to tubeless, went with Nanos but thinking I should've gone fatter. It's good to have that choice.
I highly recommend it. Perhaps not completely sold on 1x11 but that's tweakable.
(I started out wanting a Straggler after seeing one in the LBS, but after looking around, the Kona just seemed a lot better value for money.)
Soma Wolverine - think Singular Peregrine without the toe overlap.
Ahhh this is my exact situation, my Peregrine is perfect apart from the toe overlap and the short chainstays which mean fitting a front mech is a pain with mudguards.
I think I will end up going for a disc trucker, but the Wolverine does look good.
Malvern Rider, what tyres are they?
I've had a Croix de Fer, now got a Sequoia Elite
Sequoia is better in every way.
Bigger range of gears, more comfortable, waaaay better off road, better tyres, more braze ons, lighter etc etc.
As a non roadie, my roadie is a disk trucker.
Bit of a tank for a road bike but I'm totally happy with it, can see me having it a very long time.
me too Olly. perfect road bike for a 20 stone gorilla like me.... 😀
Many of these available frameset only?
looking at an off road tourer/adventure/ do it all bike.
needs to cover short commute (13miles) but also taking family out, going camping (so racks/packs) and knocking off 100mile 'off road' rides. im thinking old railway lines, smoother bridelways etc.
I know the roads are in a right state but when did any of those things become adventures?
The above comment is directed not at the OP but at the bike industry who came up with the dumbass idea of calling a bike made for commuting and towpaths an adventure bike.
Malvern Rider, what tyres are they?
WTB Nano Race (60TPI, folding) 2.1
I know the roads are in a right state but when did any of those things become adventures?
100+ offroad is definitely an 'adventure' for my creaking frame. But I do agree, marketing BS. I tend to call my bike an 'ATB'. First production bike I ever bought (1990) was an All Terrain Bike - Dawes, thumbshifters, butted chromo , rigid, 'Mountain Mix', Deore, Exage etc) and this, probably the last - Genesis, bar-end shifters, butted chromo, rigid, Deore.
Same old. This is better for touring than my first ATB as it has bigger wheels, more tyre clearance, better standover, disc brakes and fixing points mid-fork.
Though as someone else said, the rear stays are short, fitting guards is a pain, and there is toe overlap. I'm sure there are good reasons for these things...
Our old drama teacher used to ride a Holdsworth touring bike into work everyday. Since when was commuting considered 'touring'?
He carried stuff in panniers though. I guess that's why he bought a touring bike. I never considered that he may well spend 6 weeks every summer exploring Europe or Asia.
But back then bikes upowhich one toured were called 'touring bikes'. There was no special prefix. No-one need an 'adventure' tacked on. Touring was an adventure, whether leaving the West Midlands mid-morning to arrive in Herefordshire for a pint late-lunch and back over the Malverns, or whether circumnavigating Spain and Italy. It was touring. It was adventure. Now nothing at all is an 'adventure' unless you have a Go-Pro, oxygen tank and are in pursuit of a World Record.
'Adventure' in this new context is a silly Millennial prefix that ironically sucks the real 'adventure' out of anything, simply by the now-confirmed association with marketing buzz-phrases. We are addicted to minutely labelling (and therefore negating) everything as an 'experience' or some kind of multi-favet hyper-nobbery. 'Darling, I'm just nipping out on my bimblepoon for a pootle, maybe call in supermarket, no, the express supermarket, to buy some premium World Cuisine food from the chiller. This afternoon I'll be semi-adventuring on my Gravel/Adventure N+1bike. Look forward to tonight, we can maybe chill after supper with some HD streaming media, you choose the genre? Shall we go Thriller or Action Thriller?
Bike industry - go with 'Touring'.* And then decide 'Road-Touring' or 'All-Terrain Touring.'
Gravel touring? WT...
* Yes I know, everyone thinks of a 1980s teacher on a Holdsworth with a cotton duck roll bag.
Touring brings to mind red socks and cycling capes, miserably pedalling slowly all day in the rain and then pitching your heavy canvas tent.
Adventure cycling is dynamic and exciting - can mean an hours blast or a multi day epic on and off road wherever your spirit takes you.
Basically what mountain biking was before it became all about trail centres and bikes became useless for anything other than trail centres.
wzzz - I reckon' you might have a good point there.
I think my first "adventure bike" was a hand-me-down Raleigh Grifter in the late 70s. Wherever I went that was new and beyond the local fields (where I was allowed to play) was definitely an adventure.
If a bike could bring back that feeling to a cynical fat bloke in his mid 40s then I'd gratefully welcome it into my life
If a bike could bring back that feeling to a cynical fat bloke in his mid 40s then I'd gratefully welcome it into my life
It's not the bike, it's the cynicism 😉
I don't mind the Adventure Bike tag. It differentiates it from CX which is what lots of folk were calling them previously. CX should be reserved for light, racy things with no mudguard or rack mounts.
If a bike could bring back that feeling to a cynical fat bloke in his mid 40s
Fat is just speed waiting to get out.
@Malvern - you must work in my office 😉
so at the weekend I committed!
got a 2016 Croix de Fer 20. £800 down from £1200 with pedals and shoes thrown in. very pleased, although curly bars have taken a bit more to get used to than I first thought! now gotta get it out and get it muddy!
Not a fan of labels, to me these are just what a bicycle should be.
I'm glad practical, useful bikes have made a comeback.
The roadie dream puts off as many people as it attracts and the alternatives were often stale, under developed tourers made by complacent manufacturers.
It's pretty amazing that you can now buy almost anything from a track bike to a cargo bike, off the peg, with compromises to suit your intended use.
I think many newer riders have realised that pure road bikes aren't for them and many people, happy on road and off, have been itching for more capable, modern touring/everyday bikes.
Positive progress.
ravingdave - Member
so at the weekend I committed!got a 2016 Croix de Fer 20. £800 down from £1200 with pedals and shoes thrown in. very pleased,
🙂 nice one ! I an on my second CDF and really like it as an allrounder. Great for back road touring, good on off road stuff when required :
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so at the weekend I committed!
Result! What colour did you get? I must admit I was casting a greedy eye over the green one hanging up (even as I laid down the deposit on a Vagabond).
Pics when it's muddy mkeh?
We need now to find a bike for ElShalimo to rekindle his spirit!
Grifter 27.5+ anyone?
I'm thinking a year on a rusty 1980s ATB? Think of it like a meditative/punitive journey towards Knowledge Of The Adventure Bike Holy Grail.
After a lengthy succession of hardly-ridden lightweight XC MTBs - my cycling malaise was surprisingly cured by a West Country odyssey one long summer astride a second hand Raleigh Apex ATB. What a beast! I literally don't remember what it cost me so it must have been low double-figures or maybe even a freebie.
The frame was forged by grumpy dwarves from a single gargantuan slab of octagonal unobtanium (Reynolds K2). It was slowed via barely-functional cantilever brakes and plastic brake levers. Must 'fess up that I ditched the Flexstem. Even I have some standards.
A unique collapsing rear wheel design was furnished with rounded-off nipples that required me to carry a hefty pair of pliers for trailside truing purposes. i fitted a quill-stem riser adapter and high sweep bars which kept me upright so I could at least see what rock/tree/cow I was about to collide with.
Forget choosing a line, it goes where it wants to go. Much grinning was had, and fond memories retained. The Apex decal was missing the X so it was affectionately named 'The Pink Ape'.
Sometimes it's just the thing to swing your leg over whatever you have and pedal like a loon to places where it shouldn't really go. It's the doing it that counts. Just get the right saddle and it'll be golden 8)
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