[Closed] STW Zwift Racing League - Spring 2022

Sign me up too please 🙂
86kg 264w

though the ramp test I just did says 249w <shrug>

Handicaps are live for Tuesday

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SYEJq-_k2w-I3LUIgg6hoi5LAb7angXxiRasZfjvPE4/edit?usp=sharing

Anyone struggle to get onto Zwift tonight? Could connect via iPhone app but MacBook said it couldnt connect to update server and then said my login was incorrect. I vaguely remember this being an issue before and can't remember how it was solved

not that it matters but I presume I should be a C not B cat

Well tonight we are back in the pen!

https://zwiftinsider.com/route/wandering-flats/

3 sprints tonight (although 2 of them are pretty long for a sprint!) and we get to see the City and Countryside in Makuri.

Enjoy everyone, I’ll be missing this one due to ongoing back issues. Hoping it resolves itself soon, as I am missing gym and biking.

@robbo1234biking sorry for the super late message, but could I get the link for tonight please? 65kg and 284W

That's not so good giggsmaster, been a couple of weeks now hasn't it?

Aye, it’s starting to pee me off a little. I can actually walk now, but can’t really bend or lift anything.

I’m very hopeful I can get back on the turbo by next week, keeping my fingers crossed that the rest is doing some good.

The little gains I have made in the last month through these races and the TTT has been a waste now, back to square one!

Looks like I'm not going to make it tonight :(. Hope you all have a good race.

No point pushing it and doing more damage @giggsmaster, better to come back late than early and have to rest it again.

Hi robbo, can you sign me up please. Not sure on my FTP but about 295W these days and (sadly) 80kg. If my FTP change as a result of racing, as has happened in the past I'll let you know. Nothing like the incentive of a race to push your FTP up. Will join the one tonight if I get the link.

If you happen to see thiis in time. Robbo, please can I have an invitation to tonight's ?
(Unlikely to make any of the others)

optimistically 275W and sadly 79kg, if you care - please don't include me in the standings unless it's actually easier to do so than to leave me out

Oops nearly missed it!

Zwift crashed for me and couldn’t get back in time so missed the start. Really annoyed!

I was helping Jnr with his homework and got carried away!
1915 I realised and it was a mad rush to get any warm up!

Great 1st race though, that hill was just too much, I think I felt every one of the extra KG I have put on in the last 2 weeks.

Great break away, timed to perfection and that was it, the second group were pulling well fighting for 3rd place at the end I think.
One of these days I'll learn to read the course properly and not think I'm able to pull off a 400m sprint!!!

Great ride guys, see you next week

Chapeau Robbo!

Great ride guys and what a win Robbo. Loved the course and will ride it again.
Thanks for the pirate jokes , used them already and got a laugh!
Hope to join next week but Tuesday night mtb training starts soon .

Don't know what to make of that.

The good: I have a FTP increase to report, 232w which is a 10% increase since the last series!

The bad: You lot just buggered off as usual after 30-40 seconds. I thought I had a chance to hold onto the group for the first 30 seconds but then everyone just went up a gear and pulled away despite me going balls-out. That meant the rest of the 'race' was yet another solo TT, which is really getting depressing now if I'm honest. I'm producing much more power than previously, a little bit lighter and my stamina is massively better yet I'm not getting any result to show for it while doing these races.

Sorry for being all negative but the fun in all of this was the racing and jostling that the first two series had for me, partly down to me being fitter but also to there being a lot more riders who were around my level so there was tactics and the like going on. Will have a think over the next few days on whether I continue with the other races, which is no way a reflection on the effort that Robbo puts into these or anyone else. Reading all of your stories of what happened each race at the front and mid-pack is great but it just reminds me of what I'm missing out on.

Good ride tonight, I didn't get chance to ride it beforehand, but at least skimmed the route video so new about the hill at the end. I managed to stay in contention in the sprints as I expected it to all break apart, but it regrouped after each one, at least I think it did on the last one, and so it was going to be the hill that separated everyone, I managed to stay in the 2nd group and lukily had 2 feathers so that helped.

messed up the sprint a bit, I dropped back to get a run up, but left it too late, still very happy with 7th, and possibly a sprint point ( but I'm not holding my breath on that one )

Thanks Robbo, and well done to all, Robbo for the win, and John for beating me on the line, even though I won on MY screen 🙂

Roll on next week.

P.

That went about as well as it could have gone.

Got dropped from the lead group on the hill (how do you say “quelle surprise” in Japanese?) but managed to not blow completely - don’t think our little sprint for 14th place was too far behind the front pack.

Might have grabbed some sprint points too which will be nice if it is the case 🙂

Edit: @reluctantjumper keep going mate - maybe do a few more pickup races in the week so you can get better at holding higher power for a minute or so at the beginning. Took me ages to build that up.

Well that was a baptism of fire! The group split more than I expected in the early bit if the climb and I couldn't find the right gear to chase back on seemed I need to be somewhere between about 7 where the effort to claw the gap back was about 5-10rpm too high for me & 8 where was just a bit too grindy to make ground.

Made a couple of decent pulls to get back on when the group split earlier but they just took a bit too much out of me really.
Think I made a reasonable stab at all of the sprints too.
Spent most of the climb trying to reel a small group in then Doug Drysdale, finally got him with about 800m to go but hadn't got anything left for the fight for position on the road. Maybe should have played cat and mouse a bit more once I got into the four but the final charge is never my forte any how.

Great ride, all and thanks as ever Robbo.

Ohh and I set a new FTP of 301 which is the first time I've been over 300 in about 18 months so reasonably chuffed with that, though obviously not with the inevitable additional handicap.

Thanks for everyone for taking part in the series! Hope you all enjoyed it.

The results are provisional in case I have made any mistakes. Please let me know.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SYEJq-_k2w-I3LUIgg6hoi5LAb7angXxiRasZfjvPE4/edit#gid=1254292192

Race 1 - Wandering Flats

Overall Race Winner
1. robbo1234biking
2. Savoyad
3. yanboss

Overall Race Winner (with handicaps)
1. bails
2. mossimus
3. Paul-S

Tower Sprint Reverse
1. Straightliner
2. Yanboss
3. Jimdubleyou
4. slowpuncheur
5. savoyad

Alley Sprint Reverse
1. savoyad
2. straightliner
3. slowpuncheur
4. J-R
5. yanboss

Country Sprint
1. robbo1234biking
2. savoyad
3. straightliner
4. J-R
5. Slowpuncheur

Green Jersey Standings
1. Straightliner
2. Savoyad
3. robbo1234biking

I have set up a GoFundMe for people who have enjoyed the series. This time around we are raising money for Diabetes UK. Slowpuncheur has been a regular in this race series from the start. On Fathers Day last year he ended up taking his son to hospital as he wasn't feeling well. Many hours later they were delivered the news that his son is Type 1 diabetic. His son has adjusted well to the changes in life and continues to do everything he wants to. Diabetes UK helps his son and others like him through investment in Diabetes research and support for other Diabetes sufferers. I know there are also others on the forum who have diabetes or close family members with diabetes.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/e3732-stw-race-series-fundraiser?utm_source=customer&utm_medium=copy_link&utm_campaign=p_cf+share-flow-1

Please dontate if you are able to and would like to show your appreciation for the series.

@reluctantjumper

Might sound daft but when are you starting, are you waiting for zero or pedaling hard from 5-10seconds to go?
It's always hard holding on at the beginning (even back a few seasons when the start inevitably meant me sodding off up the road solo every time) but yoy need to be out of the blocks hard to hold the bunch, trying to ride into the draft from behind will absolutely ruin anyone that early on.

Do you do much other Zwift racing? The draft physics changed a while ago now and need a lot more practice to get right (I'm still pants at it) but it's hard to practice then outside of a fairly evenly matched race so might be worth living up a couple of crits (as they're short and hard so really reward or punish good Zwift technique) in the right category if you can?

Thanks Robbo and awesome riding on that course - looks like you rode it to perfection. Do we have a new Pogacar in our midst? 🙂

I forgot how hard these races can be, although I was pleasantly surprised the lead group stayed together for so long and didn't splinter. At least it meant more time practicing my yo-yo drafting technique.

No FTP increase for me, but I did achieve one long term goal - I got the 1.21Gigawatts badge which has been eluding me for a long time.

Thanks all - great "fun" (yes, stumpy, the "" are for your jokes 😜 )

Just didn't have it in me to hold on up that hill, despite holding a feather right from the start and randomly using it at just the right point.  Great work Robbo

@reluctantjumper - stick it out.  If you made it to 30-40 seconds you were probably really close to hitting the first lull in the pace.  It doesn't feel like it because the speed of the pack+draft means it keeps pulling away but nobody* just smashes on at full gas beyond around a minute.

(I assume you know to start your race power 5-10 seconds before the "go")

Interesting - all that grovelling at the back of the TTT must be teaching me something.  My Whaaaats were way down on what I was expecting.  Not even an FTP jump

@reluctantjumper - I for one really hope you keep going with it Neil.

It's not going to be long before Robbo adds in some hills, and normal service of you leaving me for dead is swiftly resumed 🙂

Cheers All! These races do make for a far more exciting Tuesday.

Pleased the jokes went down so well!

I'm not sure what happened on the hill. I think it was lack of race tactical awareness....one minute it was all tickety boo and the next I was on my own with everyone thundering off up the hill.
Not steep enough or long enough to reel anyone back in.

Great race though and well done Rob!!

Dare I look at the results?! 😁

Yeah. Stick with it reluctantjumper.

It'll come.

@reluctantjumper I’ve learnt to hammer it from the 10 second count down, it seems to keep me with the group until it starts to climb or there is a sprint.

Sometimes I can be with the front group for 5-10 minutes, then once you get dropped, there will be stragglers who will pick you up in their draft for a while, which helps out.

Definitely helps me if I can sprint hard for the 1st minute or so, while everyone else is just trundling along at an easy pace.

What a great start to the series. The front group was quite big for quite a long time. I thought the split after the sprint in neokyo might get away (me, @robbo1234biking, @j-r and @yanboss I think), but we never established a gap and eventually got reeled back in.
Then Rob just dismantled the field with a perfectly judged effort up the hill. The gap went up steadily and nearly everyone dropped away. @yanboss was up there, and ended up solo in no man's land. What a ride to to hold off the chase for 3rd. I knew Rob was sprinting well from the way he was grabbing points (he isn't moaning about his chainring today I see...!) so I tried to pull away from him with 1km or so to go, but he was like a limpet and that was my effort spent. A really deserved win.
Congrats @bails on the overall.
And @reluctantjumper stick with it. The gap is in reality much smaller than the times say - once you manage to hold a group in those first few minutes, it'll all be worth it again.

Well that was fun. Turned the laptop on 45 mins before the race, and it spends the entire time updating windows. Restarts itself with about 5 mins to go, and then I just get Zwift booted up and into the race about 5 secs after it started. I hoofed it at 400-500W for as long as I could, but the group just left me for dead. Couldn't get back on at all. Debating whether to upgrade my laptop, or get an Apple TV for next winter...

I managed to be still browsing the frame store when the gun went off - dead last the entire race 🙂

while everyone else is just trundling along at an easy pace.

🤣😂🤣

Thanks all for the kind words! Was a bit of a shock to actually win the race (might start giving points for the winner).

I stayed out of trouble mainly surfing the back of the pack apart from the sprints when I didn’t want to get dropped. Got lucky on the first one as I got a bit of momentum from being at the back of the pack and slingshotting through to win it.

It was a really big group still as we approached the hill. I just started pushing hard as I did in Yorkshire on the last series but this time people were more fatigued so I was able to gradually drop people. 3 of us went over the top together and the power stayed on. I thought it would be a bit of a ttt until the end but yanboss dropped back. I managed to stay with a few Savoyad bursts but think I got lucky as the course was downhill which suits my higher power and weight. 9min30 seconds at an average of 356w.

I was hoping to get a podium this series so pretty pleased after the first win. Well done Savoyad and yanboss for making it hard for me. Double header next week!

First of these races for a while (September) and ended up being a bit of a disaster. Thought the group initially set off quite steady (less frantic than the old days) so I found myself trying to hold back a bit in an effort to pace myself and use the draft, and ended up losing my rhythm and lost the group completely on the second sprint, leaving me 26/29 and cadence all over the place an barely able to hold 160W for a couple of mins.

Was hovering over the "give up" button but then steadied my cadence, found my rhythm and last two thirds of the race were epic, but left myself too much to do. Recovered to 11th which in the end I was pretty pleased with.

Different tactics I think for the next race.

Oh and that late surge saw my FTP go up to 314W... highest it's been for a while.

Crazyharry....

Came past me like an absolute missile at the top of the hill.

@crazyharry - came up to me like a god-dayum express train.  I wondered why you were back there

@reluctantjumper

If you decide it isnt for you anymore then no worries - the series is there for people to have fun and that should be your main aim when getting on a bike (indoors or outdoors).

I would however be sad to see you go and a 230w FTP should be close to keeping you in the front group at least on a flat course for the first part of the race. Stumpy has a similar FTP. Looking at the data from last night you were within 5w of his average power so the gap isnt as big as you think. There was one surge that he did for about 40-50 seconds at 340w to cover the sprint but other than that your power could get you on the back of the group.

You have been doing a lot of training work on the Build Me Up plan but this will also leave you more fatigued until you get used to it.

RANT ALERT NOT RELATED TO RELUCTANT JUMPER

Zwift training plans work for some people but they are also a lot of intensity very quickly. The Red Unicorn (Week 1) has 8 min O/U with only 2 mins of recovery between each set! That is far too much intensity in a short space of time 1/2 weeks into a training plan. They also focus far too much on specific cadences. Your natural cadence looks to be around the 80 mark - forcing you down to 60 rpm is going to cook your leg muscles and increasing it to 90-100 rpm is going to tire you quickly. The focus should be on small adjustments to your natural cadence in order to achieve the most efficient cadence for you. Everyone is different hence i cant understand why they are so prescriptive. That's not to say that cadence work isn't beneficial but doing it every single workout is wrong. Even going as far as specifying a cadence for a recovery segment!! You should be able to focus on recovering not worrying about what cadence you are doing.

I would think the compliance rates to the Zwift workouts are very low because of the reasons above. A training plan should gradually build intensity and confidence not start hard and get even harder.

END RANT

Dont be too harsh on yourself and I believe you are close to making that breakthrough.

The usual for me, hung with the main bunch until there was a hill, then hung no more.

Managed a 'after-you sir', 'no after-you I insist' gentleman's agreement with Zilog for the last 4k until the last 1k when my aero helmet won out.

@reluctantjumper - check the stats for the race on Zwiftpower - despite being 13kgs heavier than you, and putting out less average power for that race I finished ahead - I put that down to being able to hold the initial surge for a teensy bit longer is all. Staying in the draft is everything in the first part of these races.

You are so close to being *in* the last bunch of tail end charlies with me and the other usual suspects, rather than just off the back of it.

Having you just behind me also keeps me honest when I think I've done all I can. It might look like we are cruising ahead, when in fact I'm close to jacking it in.

If I can suggest anything it is a proper full half hour walm up, and managing that initial surge from the off for as long as possible - you have to micro manage your position in the blob - if you are just near the back when there is a push, it can be gone in seconds.

The other thing is lots of races - the 'category enforcement' series is great because it ensures those in the race with you are similar speed - meaning less sandbaggers, so tactics are more important.

Hope to see you at the bottom of the next hill.

@reluctantjumper From just reading your frustration of being spat out the back soon after the race start, it's something I can very much see where you are coming from, because it happens a lot for me... Especially since recently being marginally promoted back to Zwiftpower B (and also the new "in progress" Critical Power based ZwiftHQ pen enforcement category races that are now spreading to some community events) on the back of now two relatively good 20min+ power days.

It's still very much a work in progress, but short 10-15min races like the Mon-Fri 1215 sprints such as https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=2858212 today (pen enforce test now) and the Monday Arena Games Super Sprint Races such as https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=2771644 (which had ~170 riders a couple of days ago for second week) are helping me stick with fast starts and then not blow up so soon.

List of current races using pen enforcement https://zwifthacks.com/app/events/?key=621b895261613

Fun race predictor https://zrace.bike/

Congrats on the win last night @robbo1234biking

The bad: You lot just buggered off as usual after 30-40 seconds. I thought I had a chance to hold onto the group for the first 30 seconds but then everyone just went up a gear and pulled away despite me going balls-out.

Managed a ‘after-you sir’, ‘no after-you I insist’ gentleman’s agreement with Zilog for the last 4k until the last 1k when my aero helmet won out.

Well my legs are cooked today!

Reluctantjumper.....

Stumpy has a similar FTP. Looking at the data from last night you were within 5w of his average power so the gap isnt as big as you think.

It's true! 🙂
I used to be in a similar position to you in these races, I think. As mentioned above, it is the start & keeping with a group that really makes the difference - hanging on for 15s more can make all the difference.
Regular training has got me fitter, but also more confident of my ability to push & recover. I used to tire in the initial burst & then feel that I needed to back off or I'd be dead, whereas now I understand my ability a bit better I know that there will be the opportunity to recover at some point.

Don't get me wrong - the slaughter still happens at some point in the race; it's just normally a bit further down the road, than it used to be. 🙂

EDIT to add: - anecdotal perhaps, but I bought some Bulk All-in-One recovery powder at the start of the year & have been using that after every workout, race & hard session.
It's hard to say whether it has made a real difference as i have no 'control' to measure against. But, I definitely feel fresher the day after than I used to & it seems to help with the tired legs feeling. Perhaps this might be something to try?

@reluctantjumper - One other metric I find interesting - look at the race on ZP, reverse sort it by finish time so us tail end charlies are at the top - put the power chart into watts mode, and select the little pie chart on the end of each users row to see their power lines.

This will add/remove them from the power chart - add yourself also.

You can then compare others with your own chart.

You and I are quite different for up to 1 minute power - but after that pretty much the same. Generally those who finish just ahead have either an elevated one minute power or can hold it for longer than a minute, but after 5 mins are not far different profiles.

One other thing to bear in mind - these STW races have quite a small field and wide range of ability - so inevitably a wide spread of finish times. Larger fields and in a closer range are a lot more fun.

Zwift races are also not comparable with general outdoor performance - after a year and a half on Zwift as a strong C nearly B I changed my trainer from a Elite Direto (which I kept religiously calibrated) to a Neo 2, and went straight to D, dropping 50+ watts the same day. Only just clawed my way back into C. The absolute finish position is largely meaningless - its about your own personal fitness improvements.

That was another 37mins of type 2 fun, even though it was a disappointing result with my end of race FTP estimate 15W down on normal.
Maybe it’s the effort I put into the sprints this time, especially a mistaken early solo effort on the first one before being overtaken in the last 100m by @robbo1234biking and @straightliner. Or maybe I’ve got a virus (not The Virus) or am feeling the effects of not riding much the last couple of weeks. But when we got to the hill I couldn’t thin out the group or shake off @paul-s, which I had found easy up the hills in Yorkshire a few weeks ago. And when we all sprinted for the finish line I just didn't have enough left in the legs to stop him just inching past in the last few yards.

Well done everyone - a good start to the series.

Was an enjoyable first race. I quite like the flat ones, as i can now stay with the front runners a lot longer.

I managed to stay in the top ten up the only real climb and about 6 of us stuck together until the end. The sprint went off early and despite cranking out 600 plus watts i couldnt get anywhere near.

So happy with a 10th place finish (on the road).

Although i am very aware that numbers are down a few these days.

One thing i do struggle with is extracting the last 5-10% of effort out of my body. It feels like a bloody good work out and at no point is easy, but once i finish i always feel like i could've given more... i just dont know how to! Maybe its a subconscious fear of leaving nothing left for the final few km's.... i dunno??!

But yeah, cheers everyone, was good fun 😀

I noticed how well you climbed on that hill @v7fmp. Big improvement since autumn I reckon. As for sprints, some Vo2 workouts might help you.

I had nothing left when Robbo engaged his inner Wout van Aert so was happy to ride in with you guys. Those 3 sprints fatigued me alright. I like that fast downhill sprint at the end. Just about held off a fast finishing @straightliner on the line.

Big congrats to @robbo1234biking. Must be pleasing to see the training pay off.

Stumpy has a similar FTP

Don't be fooled - stumpy's race pace includes typing at 90 words per minute