[Closed] STW Zwift Autumn Series 2

@v7mfp you are pretty competitive in the points standing though and the next race is easy to lose a minute one way or the other if you get on the wrong side of the split at one of the hills.

I am moving my home office (well desk, monitor and chair) back downstairs next week (as my wifes business can reopen) which means I will have access to a bigger screen again which should help a lot! As well as a proper keyboard!

No ZP results? 😭😭

I checked but no - to be fair not everyone is likely registered on ZP so I wouldn't use that for results anyway and also it helps everyone to improve without bumping up a cat which helps savoyad's quest for a perfect TTT team!

Robbo - reckon it'll be useful having another sheet (or column on the results page?) on teh google doc, with the FTP on there?
Just so people can review and let you kow it's the latest one?
Not sure if you saw, my FTP is now 292 (from 270!) following last night!

A few others went up too...

DrP

Not sure if you saw, my FTP is now 292 (from 270!) following last night

I did spot you were doing remarkably well on the flat bits. You sure you've calibrated that new PM right 🤔

That was another tough evening. No-one ever seems to ease up, even for a second. I ride in a constant state of stress about losing the wheel. The start was brilliant. I enjoyed seeing "STW Race Series" up in lights.

The forward KOM was great in our group. We raced up, full on, positions changing back and forth, but everyone ended up together over the top. I don't think I've ever raced up there without it changing the make up of a group like that.

I did my level best to pull away from my group on the ramp into the esses after the sprint near the end. It nearly worked - at one point I got a 4 seconds gap and within 3 seconds of @Phil56 ahead (I could see him!) but the attack up the hill left me with nothing through the rolling bit of the esses. I think as a pair it might have stuck. As it was it just left me with no legs for a sprint, rolling across the line last in the group. I'm not a particularly aggressive rider usually, but I like how this series is a chance to try stuff.

I had a crazy moment near the first sprint - I pressed space to use my powerup but (I have no idea why) this took me into viewing the race from @scaredypants perspective. Which was interesting, but a bit panic inducing. I didn't even know this was possible. And I have no idea how I stayed in my group while I fixed that.

Next week looks attritional.

Ref. a FTP column: Without wishing to sound like a pain in the a**e, there's a personal data/GDPR thing that I think Zwiftpower had a few issues with in 2018. It might be worth liaising with Mark at STW towers as that data would effectively be hosted via this website. Having said that, I'm confident Robbo is on the ball so I personally don't see the need.

Brian.. As much as I can calibrate it..!

Zero offset before each race, and the 4iii comes factory calibrated anyway...

Last race I was at (old) FTP the whole way round..270watts... as it was flat.. I just seem to be able to make more power on the hilly bits (wheras Weeksy is more powerful on the flats.. we've chatted about this!)..

I've been avoiding alcohol in the week and using zwift to train a bit better..

I think I'm just focussing more on 'actual training' and cycle technique - for example I've figured I can make and sustain power better in higher RPMs (circa 100-105) on the climbs, rather than standing and mashing... the ZA workouts have taught me this...
Using recovery rides to help sore legs...

I'm warming up with more focus, and stretching before the events...

TBH, I think (and feel) that I'm getting fitter - I lost a lot of strength in my WHOLE body after the big crash (with teh broken wrist and ribs).. using the core and arms to really focus power through the legs etc...

My MTBing is suffering though, as I'm not going out on the hills as much!!

DrP

The forward KOM was great in our group. We raced up, full on, positions changing back and forth, but everyone ended up together over the top. I don’t think I’ve ever raced up there without it changing the make up of a group like that.

I was in the group with you wasn't I??
I crested the KOM arch first, thinking 'wahey'... they you bastards all swooned in straight away!!! All that effore thinking I might be able to break, but it amounted to nothing!!

DrP

I ride in a constant state of stress about losing the wheel

I'm glad it wasn't just me then.

The forward KOM was great in our group.

It was brutal when all those feathers appeared.

I had a crazy moment near the first sprint – I pressed space to use my powerup but (I have no idea why) this took me into viewing the race from @scaredypants perspective

I can see that'd be disconcerting, you suddenly disappearing entirely from view an' all 🙁

All that effort to get 0 points 🙁

I'll try harder next week 😀

All that effort to get 0 points 🙁

You're in Good Company

Just watched the first ten minutes or so of the streams and it seems I'm pretty appalling at drafting!

Should have been quite clear how lazy I was for the same time period 😆. The draft is an odd one, at times barely any effort will keep you attached.

Kirky.... your finish was fantastic! The right effort and the right time!

I felt right on the edge most of the race...HR at close to 180 most of the time!
It’s interesting Watching the YouTube feed back... I can see that I REALLY could have done with a PU after the final sprint...being given NOTHING was bad times!!!!

Was happy to take the wind at the front, but.... think it drained the legs for the final few Km...maybe next time I’ll hold back and save a bit!
But...I think cos I’m pretty light (70kg) I just need to hold high w/kg to stay up with the fast lot.....

DrP

Yeah, I noticed you bimbling along at 250 to 280 and me falling through the group at 320 or more.

It's interesting seeing how little the gaps go out to the group for the relative work - especially DrP's feed as there's a few bits where he's off the front chasing me - for the effort you're putting in, even when he's not drafting seeing his lower wattage relative to mine and how little the gap moves.

But…I think cos I’m pretty light (70kg) I just need to hold high w/kg to stay up with the fast lot…..

You were doing plenty well enough early doors!

I only see w/kg when I look at other riders output. So I spend my time trying to remember how heavy they are to work out how much effort they are putting in? Is there another setting I can enable to see what real time wattage everyone else is generating?

Nope 🙁

You were doing plenty well enough early doors!

You have to! Hitting 500 ish watts off the line is needed to stick with the front... it soon 'calmed down to a steady 270-300w... but if you miss the first mega effort there's no catching up i reckon...

Another interesting thing to see in my video is even in the group, I'm having to kick out 4w/kg, yet others are at 2.7w/kg... I guess if they weigh 90ish kg, then our actual watts are pretty equal.. its that how it works on the flat?

DrP

Another interesting thing to see in my video is even in the group, I’m having to kick out 4w/kg, yet others are at 2.7w/kg… I guess if they weigh 90ish kg, then our actual watts are pretty equal.. its that how it works on the flat?

Less so than I thought. I've 10kg on you and I'm regularly putting out as many or more w/kg to stay in that same group. Nixie (who I imagine weighs about 6kg when wet) sits at a much lower wattage. I think mostly its the draft its just a bit bobbins

I’m having to kick out 4w/kg, yet others are at 2.7w/kg… I guess if they weigh 90ish kg, then our actual watts are pretty equal.. its that how it works on the flat?

To an extent yes. I'm massively off form currently, but on the flat you really can bimble at times when people are flying. I was putting out <200w yesterday for chunks of a race with people at the front piling on 300+. Not because i wanted to, but i'm just really struggling LOL.

Nixie (who I imagine weighs about 6kg when wet) sits at a much lower wattage.

75Kg at the moment. Too heavy to climb really fast and not heavy enough for the flats 😆.

I think my draft had to improve as in fast races A/A+ races I've a significant disadvantage. At times I'm on the limit just to draft so got plenty of practice.

75Kg at the moment. Too heavy to climb really fast and not heavy enough for the flats

I think Tuesdays performance may make everyone think "Yeah right, of course ..."

😀

75Kg at the moment

Now you're going to tell me you're not 5'2" either and it's not natural advantage, I'm just not fast enough 😂

Now you’re going to tell me you’re not 5’2″ either

6'2" so plenty of drag. Sadly got the the verification videos for both to prove it for tonight's TTT as well.

Sadly got the the verification videos for both to prove it for tonight’s TTT as well.

In your bibs? Where [s] can I [/s] could a friend get a copy?

No bibs, some old cycling shorts and top I use for indoor. Weight is on Zwift transparency FB group. Height linked from my ZP profile. Neither are that interesting, nearly 40yo man who hates being on camera mumbling (:yawn).

even in the group, I’m having to kick out 4w/kg,

I found your video very educational @DrP - and I was impressed with the amount of time you spent on the front of our group.

Kirky…. your finish was fantastic! The right effort and the right time!

Yes, @kirky72 did a beautifully timed sprint - I followed as he passed me but there was no way I was going to get anyway near.

I find my main problem in the blob is being too uneven with the power and drifting onto the front or off the back. - I was impressed to watch on his video how much smoother @nixie is on the flat.

I think one factor in the draft is available power. @nixie can roam the group, sit back a little in the first few km (like he does; watch the stream) because if a gap does open he knows full well he can bridge it. So he can ride closer to or even right at the minimum power needed to sit where he wants to sit. For those of us with less of a reserve to sort out a mess, the risk is too high so we end up riding edgier, wasting energy but as a trade off with gambling.

That's a good point @savoyad, it also means I don't need to push it quite so much at the start as I can cruise the strung out line to get to the front. I've not seen him for a while but I used to do a lot of events with a rider called Johnny Rocket. He always seemed to have a massively lower power output than the pack and could always be found just hanging onto the group (until the sprint!). For me hanging at the back is so I can use the draft to gain speed for attacks and then jump off the front without having to go too far into the red (attacking from the front is a killer as you are forced to go big to get your speed up).

Eventually found the link @DrP, thanks! Better seeing it from our groups point of view as opposed to just watching Nixie riding solo (no offence Nixie!). That second climb felt brutal without a feather-was just clinging on hoping everyone else’s feathers would just run out! One thing I notice is that the esses really are my enemy. Just can’t seem to get the power right through them. End up really having to gun it to keep up-should thank you DrP for dragging me back up to the group after the second sprint!

@paino 😀 no offence, it doesn't make the most interesting viewing after the initiating attack. I've tried playing with camera views but that can only do so much.

In the esses I tend to spin up at the bottom while resistance is lower. Then by the time the gradient hits and my cadence has slowed back down (through the increased resistance) I'm onto/over the top.

Too heavy to climb really fast and not heavy enough for the flats

For those of us with less of a reserve to sort out a mess, the risk is too high so we end up riding edgier, wasting energy but as a trade off with gambling.

This. Exactly!
I'd rather sit near the front, panting away at 300 watts (too much, but I know i can hold that for some time) than cruise at, say, 240, but with the risk I'll need to smash out 400+ watts if I fall out the back...

I brick it if i feel myself drifting backwards, so up the power..hence why I spend probably 'too much' time at the front for my own good....!!

I guess if I got better at this aspect of zwift, I could still cruise with the fast group will less wattage being spent..

DrP

Some of it is pack size and also knowing common attack points. In a larger pack you can drift back knowing that you don't need to increase power much to stabilise your position. Knowing the common attack locations (or at least guessing from course profile) means you can move toward the front to cover those off.

@DrP instead of a big increase when going back try a smaller increase and give it 5-10s or so for your speed to pick up. That should stop you bouncing straight back to the front.

instead of a big increase when going back try a smaller increase and give it 5-10s or so for your speed to pick up. That should stop you bouncing straight back to the front.

I guess this is my mistake/fear.. I feel like as SOON as I'm moving back, I SHOULD bang out the watts to stop it.. I guess I just need to do this more gradually, and leave it 5-10 seconds...

I definitely am guilty of the 'drop bounce drop bounce' approach!

The other thing I found on tuesday was I needed gear 4.5!! Gear 4 I was spinning at 105rpm... Gear 5 was about 89... I kept flicking up..down...up..down!

DrP

The other thing I found on tuesday was I needed gear 4.5!! Gear 4 I was spinning at 105rpm… Gear 5 was about 89… I kept flicking up..down…up..down!

What bike are using? Is it MTB ratios so big gaps between the gears?

Nah... roadie block. I think it's just the course/speed/group... not had it before!

DrP

Yeah that just happens sometimes. Really annoying when the pack is at just the wrong speed.

Sounded like a big gap but I have had it in the TTT before as well.

Nah… roadie block. I think it’s just the course/speed/group… not had it before!

DrP

Basically we've twigged that we can watch you pedaling live so can see if you're getting irritated or grimacing with pain, at that point we know we're doing something right.

When you resort to a nibble of your sausage we know we've got you.

🙂

The sausage comes out when victory is acheived... 😉

DrP

Ah so you were shaking it like a champagne bottle! All makes sense now but I feel sorry for who ever was holding the camera.

@robbo1234biking A wee update to my numbers if you've time to update the sheet.

Steve ross STW
75kg, 212w.

Many thanks!

All done @svladcjelli. Glad you triggered me as I had forgot to post up the handicaps for the race tomorrow night.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1iTgJtFVOo3QzWHBY8iS-D2s2a52AB3awdMBMRtyWpNM/edit#gid=1758506376

Here they are!