Think of the fiver as a supplement for not having to queue every time you want a piss
Very drole Jota !!
I am all in favour of female events for many of the reasons given above. Why not create an environment in which female participants are going to feel comfortable and able to enjoy their sport. If they exclude me, so what, let them have their moonwalk etc as it fulfils a very good purpose.
But then at least be consistent. Sexism like racism needs to work both ways. Let's cut out the bleating about male only clubs, events etc. Leave institutions like the MCC, the R&A alone. Overwise the excellent logic for female events falls flat on its face. So if most of these posts are correct, the consequential argument for encouraging more female Mtb outweighs the categorical imperative not to discriminate on the basis of sex?
Just evaluate discrimination isn't negative doesn't mean it's not discrimination, possitive discrimination is illegal under the equality act
Also I wouldn't mind a men's only grass roots race (oooooh controversial) imagine how hard it
Is for young men to focus on learning to race with all them giggling girls.
Fizzpup - or constant chatting? I was running a 30m XC ultra recently in all the snow with three guys. For about 5 miles we were running at the same pace as another group including a very nice lady, except for the fact that she did not stop chatting (didn't even take a breath!). We had to put in a couple of fast miles just to drop her and regain the peace and tranquility of the countryside!! 😉
juan, men have to have their hair cut at least three times as often and if I wanted to change the colour evey week it would cost just as much. Anyway the hair money is soon rebalanced by the drinks not bought! 🙂
You do know that the steel city dh is for the greno wood appeal right? It's going to pay for trails that more men are likely to use.
It's also not a serious race, or even really a DH race. Is there any point getting worked up over it?
Also the people organising it are doing it off their own back for the love of the sport, nothing else. Is it fair to criticise something people are doing off their own back?
So if I had organised a race off my own back and said no blacks I'd be immune from
Criticism? Just because I love the sport. I wouldn't but that's the point your making
Well the main difference is that women in presence of men can behave themselves. It does sadly don't work the other way I am afraid.
bagstard if you don't manage to get the girls to buy you drinks you're doing it wrong 😉
juan,I wasn't talking about me! 🙂
Let's cut out the bleating about male only clubs, events etc. Leave institutions like the MCC, the R&A alone.
It is unfortunate that mountain biking is being touted as [i]the new golf.[/i] Some of the misogynism from over there seems to be leaking over already.
Oh and the girls can behave pretty badly in a female dominated environment!
So if I had organised a race off my own back and said no blacks I'd be immune from
Criticism? Just because I love the sport. I wouldn't but that's the point your making
[img]
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the average women earns less than the average man.
likewise children also get charged less.
ocrider - Member
Let's cut out the bleating about male only clubs, events etc. Leave institutions like the MCC, the R&A alone.It is unfortunate that mountain biking is being touted as the new golf. Some of the misogynism from over there seems to be leaking over already.
On the contrary, its just a simple recognition that single sex environments can be conducive to enjoyment. So let them be, but on all sides. Misogynism means anti-female, so how can it be misogynistic to support all female events, preferential pricing etc? But if we are to allow all female clubs and all female events or differential pricing for female participants, then the same should work in reverse, otherwise we are not being logical or fair - merely biased.
Disabled yet your ride mountain bikes? Hope you're not claiming.
[img] http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcScIRwt3BLaDWnP6M3vF-kto2AZGZLEPouZDRf0AiEzZRtzujFBsqf_ls39 [/img]
Is this thread a troll convention?
The opinions pointed out against the original point show a lack of understanding for the whole reason the sport is being made more accessible.
Single gender sport groups/events work well for females for a number of reasons, for which there is loads of evidence. If our culture was more balanced, there would be no need. However, it is currently very divided and to deny that is ridiculous.
This isn't just a sexist mtb thing, it's the product of trying to re-balance macho social environments which don't include large numbers of the population.
I'd like to see mixed gender events as well as single gender, but that would need a fair bit of social progress before we had a big enough female riding population for this to gather momentum.
As said by others, I'd love to see more females in the sport. £5 for a bit of progress is a bargain!
+1 to Herman Shake and the rest who aren't doing their best gumby impression.
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So if I had organised a race off my own back and said no blacks I'd be immune from criticism?
It's probably acceptable to charge women less for an event to encourage more women, but unacceptable to charge blacks less for an event to encourage more blacks ...
We're allowed 'women only' clubs/events, but not 'black only' or 'white only' ...
So it seems discrimination is ok if it's dressed up as being done for women for 'positive' reasons ...
EDIT: another +1 for Herman Shakes by the way.
As said by others, I'd love to see more females in the sport. £5 for a bit of progress is a bargain!
Hear, hear! And as a male ballet dancer, I am sick of paying more for my kit, more roles for girls and the whole estrogen-dominated society that ballet is. Its so intimidating. Thank goodness for Matthew Bourne giving us the chance to re-balance this distorted art/sport. I hope my club will give us blokes a 20% discount on our subs to redress the balance. 😉
The £5 cheaper element could just be 'sop' to keep the liberal feminist element of the MTBing community happy. The more radical will view it more as a cheap way of removing responsibility for tackling the wider mysoginistic elements at work within these events, the sport and society as a whole.
Just my thinking anyway.
Well my wife is (obviously) female, an absolute stunner and an ethnic minority! Surely that is worth free entry and a podium place?!
Well my wife is (obviously) female, an absolute stunner and an ethnic minority! Surely that is worth free entry and a podium place?!
POIDH.
Ah Peyote, I love satire, chapeau!
Dude, only birds complain about sexual discrimination. You're a bloke, BTFU.
Yep thats true ❓
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sexism
When you consider that in GB we have some of the top female DH racers in the world, top female cx riders in the world, top female road riders in the world, and top female track riders in the world, it is a shame that cycling doesn't get more media attention to encourage more young females to take up the sport.
Having said that, in my usual riding haunts there are a LOT of female cyclists riding for leisure and there are female teams entered into many of the 12/24 hour events, so it's certainly not all doom and gloom for the ladies 8)
Jesus wept, it's only a fiver. I think the OP needs to MTFU a bit.
joao3v16 - Member
So if I had organised a race off my own back and said no blacks I'd be immune from criticism?
It's probably acceptable to charge women less for an event to encourage more women, but unacceptable to charge blacks less for an event to encourage more blacks ...We're allowed 'women only' clubs/events, but not 'black only' or 'white only' ...
So it seems discrimination is ok if it's dressed up as being done for women for 'positive' reasons ...
EDIT: another +1 for Herman Shakes by the way.
Might want to read his post again seeing as yours contradicts it.
Well, I am organising a Womens race (as part of a night that includes a Mens race and a Family ride) and in the interests of fairness I will be organising some podium beefcake to present the prizes. If anybody would care to apply for the job please email me pics.
Hell, I might even give you a fiver for your troubles.
Hell, I might even give you a fiver for your troubles.
😀
Just for you grum and far from good pics.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/63889010@N03/6063011788/in/photostream/
Is this based on being genetically female? Will simply declaring myself female and dressing as a woman be enough to qualify for my discount or do I have to go the whole hog and get the op?
I'm surprised this thread has got this far. Last time we went over this it was about a women-only sporting that STW were advertising/featuring and the thread got pulled PDQ.
nealglover - Member
No one should be disadvantaged due to their gender.
Is anyone disadvantaged though ?
Men pay the standard rate and women get £5 discount.
Should I consider myself discriminated against at the cinema (As a 39 year old, non student in full time employment) as I can't seem to get any of the discounts available !!!!
But if there was a £5 discount for all females there, would that still be fine?
Do less women attend the cinema?
Bagstard, clearly my comment was an ironic critique of the misogynistic culture that seeks to judge women purely based on their appearance.
I'm shocked and appalled that you would expose her to such disgraceful male chauvinism by posting her picture on a bike forum for men to gawp at.
😉
Your welcome! 😀
Would men only events be acceptable?
We had International Women's Day a few weeks ago. I'm not quite sure what this is for or why their isn't an International Men's Day.
We either have equality or we don't.
I am curious - there seems to be general agreement from everyone that there are far more men in cycling than women, and on balance the majority of (presumably male?) forumites seem to support the idea of encouraging more women to take part. But, whenever the issue of gender in cycling is raised, or if anyone mentions any action being taken to address it, there is almost a backlash of "that's not fair".
So, open question, what do you think would be acceptable actions to encourage more women into cycling? Women-only clubs / rides / events? More female role models? Better coverage of women's cycling in the media? Cheaper prices? etc etc
We had International Women's Day a few weeks ago. I'm not quite sure what this is for or why their isn't an International Men's Day.
I'm honestly staggered that people are really this stupid.
Oh, and there is a men's day, it's just that no one GAF about it.
Sue_w - I would think that the best way of encouraging girls would be for their partners to lighten up a bit when offering to take them out cycling. It seems that most guys have to treat every ride as some sort if rave. Disappearing off into the distance or down a rocky drop and leaving your lady behind isn't exactly gonna do it.
Surely all this sexism talk is just twaddle - Its economics.
The men's race will be insanely popular - It's already sold out - Therefore people will get charged full whack
The women's race will be heavily under subscribed vs the men's - Therefore it makes sense to offer a discount to encourage a larger field and therefore have a better, more competitive women's race.
Supply and demand. Simple as.
And if you really feel that as a man your are being discriminated against, then get used to it. Despite what your mummy promised, life isn't fair.
A whole site for women who race mtb's [b]and[/b] they're organising women only races (one assumes there isn't a £5 discount for being female). [url= http://stilettosonwheels.com/ ]http://stilettosonwheels.com/[/url]
I think anythign that encourages people to get out the house and on a bike is a good thing.
If it's discounts for women or discounts for blokes with an unhealthy BMI then that's fine with me and I'll happily pay a bit more to make up the difference.
I'm honestly staggered that people are really this stupid
I wouldn't be. People are very good at being stupid.
Has anyone thought that the reason there aren't more female mountain bikers / cyclists is because they're just not interested, and no amount of encouragment, coercing or reduced costs is going to change that?
Provided there's no active prohibition of female participation, it's not mandatory to have an equal split of men/women in all aspects of life ...
Surely all this sexism talk is just twaddle - Its economics.
I initially thought you may have a point here. But economic test fails if you apply it to a racial discrimination scenario, eg: giving certain groups discounted entry to events where attendees are predominantly from other racial groups.
Encouraging more women into cycling is a good thing, but I think it needs to be done in a manner that is consistent with equality.
- Positive media coverage of female cycling and cyclists.
- Classes for women and men at the same event.
