[Closed] Roundabouts and idiots.

It depends on if you have any intention of using your indicators or whether you drive an Audi.

Is there a conveyor belt?

this is the aerial shot.

https://goo.gl/maps/f4zoA

Edit: No Audis or conveyor belts, there is however one Skoda and one van.

EDIT. No markings but I would think it's reasonable to arrive in lane 2 to go left there. Presumably someone was in lane 1 and went straight ahead without looking?

Only if...
[list]
[*]If the number of cars in the left hand lane can be considered sufficient to hold you up more than your perceived level of self-importance permits.
[*]Your intention to travel North (or your realisation of which way is North) on occurred after you'd committed to the right hand lane, and you're not big enough to admit your mistake and just go around the roundabout.
[*]You're one of the army of people sent out each morning to destroy my belief that I've seen it all
[*]You're Mr Magoo
[/list]

Tick any/all that apply.

</grump> 😉

two lanes coming off, so I think it would be ok to be in lane 2 and go left onto the M271.

Prepared to be wrong on this!

The markings in lane 2 say straight ahead or left so left is ok I would say!
Lane 1 is left only.

Am I missing something - can't see any markings in lane 2.

EDIT. No markings but I would think it's reasonable to arrive in lane 2 to go left there. Presumably someone was in lane 1 and went straight ahead without looking?

Phew, thought I was turning into Mr Magoo.

The problem is, somebody "thinking it's reasonable to go left from lane 2" would complain like hell, if somebody "thought it would be reasonable to go straight ahead from lane 1".
The latter is the more reasonable, IMHO, as that is the normal, expected behaviour at roundabouts, whereas the formeris some nut-job at the highways department thinking that they're clever.

Classic case of the highways department presenting people with a choice, when they would be far better off ensuring that the wrong choice cannot be made.

EDIT. No markings but I would think it's reasonable to arrive in lane 2 to go left there. Presumably someone was in lane 1 and went straight ahead without looking?

but it would more reasonable for someone to go straight ahead from lane 1, and someone going straight ahead from lane 1 wouldn't be able to signal that so anyone trying to make a left turn from the right lane is going to get surprised that way. Theres nowhere for someone in lane 1 to be looking for them to preempt someone from lane 2 turning left. Also because the exit to the left has two lanes its not unreasonable someone from lane one turning left to use either of those lanes and again theres not a signal they can give to indicate that.

I'd say no, knowing that junction very well, as both lanes 1 and 2 can be used to turn right and head south. So there's very likely someone in lane 1 who will not exit at the first.

Of course not everyone engages their brain alongside first gear. (which lane were you in OP?)

My beef with that roundabout is with the next exit - two lanes approaching teh exit, two lanes leaving it, but for some reason they saw fit to squeeze them and omit lane markings on the bend just to maintain some (useless) hard shoulder. Causes no end of near misses.

Anyway it'll all be chock full of roadworks for the foreseeable future so we'll be crawling round anyway.

^^re comments above, turning left is a Road To Nowhere (Romsey to be precise). The majority of traffic turns right for the main route into Southampton (inc all the container lorries for the docks)

I didn't think anyone used the terms 'inside' and 'outside' lane anymore because its confusi g on roads with a bend. For example the indide of a curved road would be the inside of the curve so could be left or right.

The other side of the roundabout has markings to suggest you can go left in lane 2 (what I was originally looking at hence the edit). That's what I would expect on a motorway to motorway roundabout.

However as there are no markings there isn't a clear cut answer really. If you drive a lot on motorways you'll probably think it's ok to go left in lane 2 but if you drive a lot in town you might not.

I think on balance I would be wary at that junction as there is no markings.

Two cars first in the queue. The car in lane 1 stays in his lane and goes up the M271 north, car in lane 2 stays in lane (the roundabout has 4 lanes when it merges) and carries on up the M271.
The van behind in lane 1 behind both cars decides to overtake the car in front of him, changes lane and hits the back quarter of the car in lane 2.

The van driver seems to be an idiot.

So the van person drove into the back of a car? And thinks they are not at fault?!

The van driver beeped his horn *before* making contact.
The van driver after the collision failed to stop.

Oh well as long as he beeped...

The van driver in lane 1 was half a car length behind the car in lane 2, which in turn was half a car length behind the car in lane 1.
So in a staggered formation...

Did you get the number?

Were you in the car that was hit?

Whatever should/does happen at that junction, it is up to the driver changing lanes to check that it is clear before making the manoeuvre.

Driver in second lane would need to give way to whatever lane 1 decided to do, however its irrelevant, you were hit from behind and the van driver moved into your lane. If he had time to beep he probably had time to react, he probably gambled that you would swerve away.

There's CCTV all round that junction. I'd get on to Romanse (does that still exist?) or Hants Highways and explain the situation, see if they can provide info (or at least pass on to police).

Were you the van driver?

Ok, so I was the driver that was hit - i.e. in lane 2, the big red go faster stripes start on the rear passenger door and extend their way past the rear wheel arch.
I followed the van driver flashing and beeping for about 6 miles before he stopped. Tapped on his window after he'd stopped and he ignored me at first. Then he got out of the car swearing blind he didn't make contact - I politely pointed out his big red van matched the colour of my new big red go faster stripe, he said he didn't even feel any collision so didn't stop.

He then started getting aggressive and stating I was in the wrong lane, and it wasn't his fault.

I asked his name, he didn't want to give it.

Eventually he calmed down a bit and gave me a pre-printed copy of his insurance details.
He apologised for being a bit "angry" and we went our separate ways.

Genuinely the first I knew about it was when I saw out of the corner of my eye the van approaching the rear of the car next to me rather quickly, then he was on the horn and then he was trying to push me out of my lane!

In general the rules go don't drive into other cars.

My point being I don't want to be penalised for someone driving in to me, so my dilemma is do I pursue a repair outside of insurance, or do I go through the insurance and run the risk of getting a 50/50 result and a claim to my name.

Firstly report to the police, especially as the driver failed to stop and didn't notice driving into another car.

I was straight onto the police (hands free) when he didn't stop at first, and was following him with them on the line - once he'd stopped and I made contact, they said their involvement ended there.

left hand lane for turning left at roundabout unless specifically marked otherwise which it isn't, why on earth were you in the right hand lane if you wanted to go left?

Technically - IIRC - if there are no road markings the left hand lane is for left AND straight ahead, and the right hand lane for turning right. But this is generally ignored.

However - the fact that he made a manoeuvre without bothering to check that the lane was clear he was moving into should entirely nullify this. Someone overtook into the side of me a couple of years ago and hit my back door - this was deemed a 100% No Fault Claim on my behalf.

I would be reporting it to the Police and phoning my insurance company with his details asap.

Because the driver in the left lane was indicating left and its a motorway to motorway junction with no "left" turn, its an 11oclock exit that follows the contour of the road.

Look at the link.

Capt. Kronos - this is the kind of information I'm really after. Thank you.

I know that junction well. You were coming from new forest side of Southampton yes?

It is not unusual for people to go RIGHT from the left Lane there because of the traffic density going that way (the reverse of what you experienced). Volume of traffic going left there is nowhere near enough to justify turning left from Lane 2 in my experience.

Is it correct to be in lane 2 with the intention of travelling up the M271 north (i.e. left)?

No.

garage-dweller - Member
I know that junction well. You were coming from new forest side of Southampton yes?
It is not unusual for people to go RIGHT from the left Lane there because of the traffic density going that way (the reverse of what you experienced). Volume of traffic going left there is nowhere near enough to justify turning left from Lane 2 in my experience.

Regardless of traffic density, turning right (third exit) whilst in the left lane is just stupidity, and even I know that!

I hope people have actually looked at the link to street view before posting their answers and tried to understand the context.
Although I appreciate not everyone will agree with me (this is STW after all!)

slip road has straight on arrow in left hand lane, you were effectively cutting across left hand lane from right hand lane & in doing so you should have made darn sure anything in left hand lane was also going left, even when specifically marked that left hand lane is left hand only (which it isn't in this case) you have to be careful making the turning you made.

Edit - & yes I have looked at streetview

So the moral of this story from what I can gather - was my lane choice questionable?

Yes.

Regardless of my lane choice, was the van driver who swapped lanes and attempt to TPAC me 100% at fault?

Dickyboy, I stayed alongside the vehicle in lane 1 all along, he and I carried on without incident.
There are 2x lanes merging with the junction which itself is 2x lanes wide, upon merging there are 4 lanes (no actual lanes merge).
I disagree with the "effectively cutting across" when there is space for all traffic side by side.
The issue came from behind me when the van in lane 1 decided to try and overtake the car in lane 1 mid roundabout hitting me from behind.

if van driver was behind then possibly but you you've stated staggered so van driver perfectly legit to go straight on, for all they knew you hadn't cancelled your indicator after pulling off motorway & would have expected you to be going straight on or right, unless of course they actively turned right into the side of your car

He actively turned into my car. I could understand if I was behind him and he didn't see me, but I was in *front* matching the speed of the car next to me.

The issue came from behind me when the van in lane 1 decided to try and overtake the car in lane 1 mid roundabout hitting me from behind.

I kind of get it now, but still think you were hedging your bets by going left from the right hand lane, personally I'd accept knock for knock on that basis. There was no guarantee that everything is going left from the left hand lane so by assuming they are you put yourself in a risky situation & lost.

There isn't a "left" exit as such, yes it's the first exit (11oclock) but it's more of a continuation of the road (motorway to motorway). The second exit is just back on to the motorway you've just exited and right is well... right, so you wouldn't be in the left hand lane for that for sure.
All three drivers were going in the same direction (up the M271 north), so that wasn't the cause of the situation.

[quote=Dickyboy ]slip road has straight on arrow in left hand lane
...
Edit - & yes I have looked at streetview

Linky to the streetview which shows that - because I looked and couldn't see any. Straight on from there is nonsensical as you'd be rejoining the road you'd just left, which would be better achieved by just staying on it - the only reasonable option is either left or right. Of course there will be some people doing that and it's not illegal to do so, but given the number doing so must be far <0.1% of the people using the junction it's not a direction I'd expect street markings to suggest, nor one which merits a specific lane.

In any case the van driver involved clearly was going left, so none of that is at all relevant. The fact is he changed lanes without giving way to traffic in the other lane.

Actually chojin - I'd be interested to know [b]exactly[/b] where you were (ie how far into the junction) when the collision occurred. It might be relevant...