[Closed] New bike thoughts: Bronson - Over hyped??

Isn't every bike over-hyped? they're just bikes at the end of the day, they've not fundamentally changed for decades, and everyone knows the best bike in the world is the one they've just bought. I can't imagine any bike, road or MTB, truly justifies a £4k price tag. That is the price the manufacturer can charge as some people will spend that. There doesn't have to be a link between price and cost/worth or even how good a bike it is.

I love my Covert, but i'm sure I would have equally loved the Rocket, Shinobi, Rhune and whatever other bike I considered at the time I was buying.

Carbon is a better frame material in my experience, as well as the obvious advantage of being lighter, I've found the stiffness to be the biggest gain it offers. Is it worth the extra money? Only if you can afford it and it's worth the extra to you. You're doing a demo ride, that's the only way you'll really know.

In reality the Santa Cruz should be about as much as a trek, they are about the same in the USA. However, Santa Cruz charge the UK importer the same for a bike as they do a US dealer and so by the time they get over here the price is up to "boutique" brand levels. Only good marketing has got them to be as revered over here as Intense or yeti.

http://bicyclehabitat.com/product/14trek-slash-7-650b-27.5-193725-1.htm?variations=123319

http://www.cambriabike.com/Santa-Cruz-Bronson-Carbon-Matte-Carbon-Orange-Medium-BCRKOOM.asp

Assuming the two models above are what you are comparing based on the prices you have given, considering the Bronson is carbon the extra £500 isn't so bad. But over here it is £1700 more.

So, to an extent, it is just hype that convinces people to pay for a Bronson in the UK.

I think there's some logic to it being worth more than the Trek.

Not necessarily anything to do with build quality or ride quality, but I know I would value it for longer, because it's not a 'model year' bike.
I would personally build up a frame though, so that I could get the bits I wanted (Hope hubs and brakes for example).

How much extra that is worth for you, only you can decide.

Also - they'll probably ride quite differently - test ride if you can.

Some owners and testers have reported that it's got some negative riding characteristics.

Definitely plenty more bikes out there worthy of consideration.

Lapierre Zesty/Spicy, Norco Sight, BMC, Cube, Canyon, Kona etc.

oh - and the whole frame vs whole bike thing extends down to much cheaper bikes than Santa Cruz.
Banshee and Cotic for example. Transition used to be cheaper too, but I think they're nearer the high end now.

Only good marketing has got them to be as revered over here as Intense or yeti.

And what, marketing aside, inherently makes Intense or Yeti better than Trek/Santa Cruz...?

In reality the Santa Cruz should be about as much as a trek, they are about the same in the USA. However, Santa Cruz charge the UK importer the same for a bike as they do a US dealer and so by the time they get over here the price is up to "boutique" brand levels. Only good marketing has got them to be as revered over here as Intense or yeti.

Yeti prohibit the sale of their frames/bikes by US dealers outside of US, Canada and Mexico (as do many other US "boutique" brands). The MRP at current exchange rates for a Yeti SB-66C frame in the USA is around £1820, the same frame costing £2695 in the UK. They're all at it as Alexsimon says above, not just Santa Cruz. It's up to the consumer at the end if the day, if you want one and it's worth it to you then that's fine.

Complete build kits on the likes of the Bronson, Carbine 275, SB-66 etc are not value for money though in my opinion as you're also paying the import tax on the parts as well. Buying frame only then speccing the bike yourself using UK online prices will give you a total price for the Bronson that is closer to the Trek price.

Big brands have to make sure there bikes are suitable for a wide audience and are easy to ride. Hence why for experienced riders they often feel dull, sure footed and a bit slow. For smaller brands like Yeti they know all their customers are experienced riders and they have a smaller more specific market so can make bikes that are a lot more twitchy and often feel faster and more alive. It's the same with cars between large and small manufactures.

Remember US prices often don't show VAT until the checkout.

I went through this with a Bronson and I couldn't justify 4k on a bike with poor components. Shop around there are loads of quality bikes about. Look at the Devinci Troy or Dixon

http://www.bikeactive.com/PBSCCatalog.asp?CatID=1592727

I got my Bronson back in June and have done everything from XC to full on Munro bashing on it. Can't recommend it highly enough and it has definitely got me doing things I couldn't do with the old bike which was a Blur LT.

Is it worth the money? I think so but then realistically I have not done a direct comparison. I bought it because I had the Blur for 6 years and loved that bike for its ability, reliability and crash resistance.

When I bought the Blur I did back to back tests with a Trek and a Giant. On paper there was no real difference except the price, but riding them was like night and day. Like jumping out of a Golf 2.0l diesel and into a GTi. Having read the ride reports on the Bronson it was reasonable to assume that SC have done with the Bronson what they did with the Blur.

So for me at least, it's not marketing hype, it's real life experience and reading reviews. You will only find out with a test ride. Worth noting with SC that buying a complete build is usually not saving anything. Often cheaper to go for the frame and specify the build you want with your LBS, or build it yourself

Big brands have to make sure there bikes are suitable for a wide audience and are easy to ride. Hence why for experienced riders they often feel dull, sure footed and a bit slow. For smaller brands like Yeti they know all their customers are experienced riders and they have a smaller more specific market so can make bikes that are a lot more twitchy and often feel faster and more alive. It's the same with cars between large and small manufactures.

Really? Since when did Yeti's forward thinking approach of longer, lower, slacker bikes result in them feeling more twitchy? Likewise Banshee - my Spitfire feels awesomely stable and balanced, perfect under a decent but not brilliant rider like me: I'd love to see a pro taking it to its limits, it honestly feels I'll never have the skills and bravery to reach them. Most shops can get them in, highly recommended!

If you turn your point on its head, claiming that niche manufacturers sell frames that need to be ridden hard and aggressively to make them perform (my Spitfire only turns if you throw it on its side like you mean it) then you'd be much closer to the truth.

I love my Bronson now, but it has taken the longest of all the bikes I've own to dial in. Also had to change the rear shock to get the most out of it which is disappointing on a £4000+ bike. Carbon v alumunium carbon lighter, looks nicer but needs care I've now got loads of light scratches on the top tube from a particularly muddy wales trip 🙁

Chiefgroove just waiting on my Banshee Rune to arrive 🙂

The actual US price isn't the issue, more the vast difference in the increase in the difference between the cost of the two bikes from the US to the UK.

Chiefgroove just waiting on my Banshee Rune to arrive

Awesome! CCDBair?

Yeah in 650b flavour as well 🙂

Big brands have to make sure there bikes are suitable for a wide audience and are easy to ride. Hence why for experienced riders they often feel dull, sure footed and a bit slow. For smaller brands like Yeti they know all their customers are experienced riders and they have a smaller more specific market so can make bikes that are a lot more twitchy and often feel faster and more alive. It's the same with cars between large and small manufactures.

Errr... Bollocks.

I concur...testicles.

Agreed.....complete nonsense

and you said 'Hence why'...

If you can afford to spend 4k on a bike fair enough I say. I would have to be riding competitively to justify it myself. Is carbon worth the extra cash or would it be better spending that money on a nice holiday?

Will the price of Santa Cruz bikes go down when the two most expensive DH riders in the world retire I wonder?

I'd ditto what captain mainwaring said.... I've only had my Ali bronson 2 weeks (XT build with pikes and kashima shock upgrade) but I absolutely love it. Previously I'd a giant trance x1 which I was getting on ok with but there were certain trails I just couldn't get right....I got on the bronson (after demoing a heckler and solo) and on the same trail (Kirroughtree) it was like night and day. The thing climbs like a mountain goat. It's the same one every trail I've been on since (Mabie, GT, Cathkin).

My OH has a 2014 orange five pro. We swapped bikes the other day to see what the difference was. They are very different bikes indeed. The bronson handles so much better than the orange and feels much more planted. The orange was better on the tight twisty stuff but we're not sure about the fox kashima forks, so swapping these out for pikes when we can get hold of some. Where the five bottoms out, the pikes hold up very well.

As others have said a bike is worth what you're willing to pay for it. I'd definitely recommend the bronson but I am entirely biased.

@jutzm - interested in your thoughts on the differences between the Bronson and the Solo. Currently on a BLT2 with a 150. Fox on front, which I love but is getting on. I'll demo both eventually ( when I can afford to buy one) I also run a very old Blur Classic for the tighter stuff - hence the question. Bronson with a Talas?

@blurboy... My experience of a Talas was not good on my trance although 'twas a 32.

The solo really surprised me tbh. It does not feel like a 130mm travel bike. It was a small I demoed and I would usually run a medium. I was really I impressed by it. Very similar to the bronson indeed. Only reason I went for the bronson was because I intend to take it to lake garda in the summer and think the longer travel would suit better. All our bikes have Fox front and back but our experience with the Fox on the 650b Five has been so hit and miss that I was tempted by the hype around the pikes. I've not been dissappointed. I particularly like the progressive compression as hadn't experienced this before.

Both the solo and the bronson climbed amazingly well. Hardly any bob at all. The solo hadn't even been set up for me, but I could not fault it.

I have no idea why people pay a premium for a Bronson. The market is flooded with 67 degree 140/150mm 650b bikes. Some with better suspension than the Santa Cruz.

It's just the status IMO. They're more expensive so they must be better right?

JCL you never mentioned the word 'kinematics' once...what's wrong? 😀

The pros:
very light
very stiff
very nicely put together, a premium feel?
attracts lots of attention
climbs very well
very 'sprightly' feel across flat terrain

the cons:
very stiff
attracts lots of attention
centre of gravity feels high/perched
slightly steep head angle by modern standards
chattery ride
fox shock doesn't work particularly well

It's a good frame, but I wouldn't say its a great frame. Personal opinion of course!

@jutzm. Thanks for that. I was planning to keep the BLT2 for the odd trip abroad but most riding is woods, Woburn, etc where you don't need a lot of travel. I'm running a Talas set at 120 on the Blur Classic. Both are fitted with Fox both ends. I think I will try the Solo first but was there a reason not to go carbon with your Bronson?

the cons:
very stiff
attracts lots of attention
centre of gravity feels high/perched
slightly steep head angle by modern standards
chattery ride
fox shock doesn't work particularly well

That's an awful lot of 'cons' for a £3k frame, from someone who owns one!

Plus one for you will find out on a demo. Spent a lot of time narrowing down the numerous bike based on geometry that works for me. Spent day half on SC Bronson C and that convinced me it was the bike for me. It's the ride that counts. Currently still riding a 2010 Zesty which I will keep while waiting for delivery of SC but my Zesty is still a great bike. I thought I'd just replace it with a 2014 model. But on demo I just didn't get on with it. It was too long in the top tube for me and chain stays were too wide for my pedalling. So try before you buy and ignore the forum twaddle about price, industry hype, over biked etc etc It's the ride that counts and were all different.

I don't think buying the bike you really want works out that much more expensive,because in my experience if you stinge up and get a cheaper bike than the one you really wanted you end up lusting after the dream bike every time you see one.once you build up the piggy bank funds you can't resist getting one after you've spent shed loads of money on upgrading the cheaper bike to make it better.if the bronson's a realistic option ask yourself which bike you really want

neallyman,

Are they that light? What isn't with Enve's/240's and XX1?

Well put together? I dont't think they're anything special. The cable routing is a mess and those preload pivots are an over complex faff. Frame wise the Trance is certainly more elegant and Enduro more impressive IMO.

I agree with your points though. I think it's a good trail bike for big heavy guys who ride flats.

My brother bought a carbon bronson xt model rrp£5800 already weve changed the bars to a 30mm rise -took front mech etc off to put a rf narrow wide chainring on - ive had a couple of runs on it and feel as if he could ulgrade the rear shock (fox ctd) a monarch rc3 or dbair cs . Having spent a small fortune on it abd having to spend more is ridiculous (

When do you stop, this is the question. Does it really matter that some new part could/might feel a bit better? Some people seem to spend so much time researching and spending time trying to make their bike better I bet they hardly go out on the thing.

I can assure were not one of those ! My point being for a bike that cost alot it should feel spot on with no need to upgrade

Does everyone put this much thought into buying a bike? My only consideration was would it be big enough for me without being too big (i'm 6'5" but don't like big bikes). Head angles and suspension design didn't come into it. I also bought without any test rides and i'm very happy with my choice. Pretty hard to imagine a better bike really.. Ok it wasn't £4k but it was easily the most expensive bike i've ever bought.

Does everyone put this much thought into buying a bike?

No that's why people buy Bronson's 🙂

@blur boy.... Very female reason for not going carbon, although makes sense to me. Occasionally I do very stupid things and I was afraid I would break it. I was told that the carbon is extremely strong with blunt force but a sharp force in one spot could break the frame. Case in point....first ride out, I went OTB on a flat trail through the forest that I've done loads of times before....because I picked a really stupid line.

Must admit the colours on the carbon are much nicer.

I was very up for a Heckler before I'd tried the Solo and it was the VPP that totally changed my thinking.

Not sure why people aren't happy with the SC Bronson spec? You can have it built up from the frame to your spec? Sent the bike shop a complete list specifying every part. Saves buying twice. Guess it pays to research your purchase first.

shieldsmtb damn right it should.

neallyman,

Are they that light? What isn't with Enve's/240's and XX1?

I was very up for a Heckler before I'd tried the Solo and it was the VPP that totally changed my thinking.

I have a demo on a solo to fit in at some point and a bronson if I can get hold of one, just to see, I expect to be keeping the Blur for a good 5 years.

Occasionally I do very stupid things and I was afraid I would break it. I was told that the carbon is extremely strong with blunt force but a sharp force in one spot could break the frame.

Comparing static head angles on paper for full sus bikes doesn't give the full picture too, depending on design the HA changes differently for different bikes. I'd be much more concerned by how they ride over how they are on paper.

One of the nicest things with dealing with SC is the ability to get the spec you want being able to mix and match forks, build kits and even components is great.

shieldsmtb - Member

I can assure were not one of those ! My point being for a bike that cost alot it should feel spot on with no need to upgrade

"Feeling spot on" is so subjective though, changing bars to taste or switching to 1x10 which is still a niche option is a pretty reasonable thing to have to do on a new bike, if you want those things.