oneoneoneone: sorry, I meant reduced FROM £600, I just didn't type that! 😳
QR skewer on RHS can prevent rebound adjusters from falling out.
Not that I do it mind, its just a tip 🙂
Why is it his fault, a bike shop should know how to put a bike together!
They should. Should also be able to service a bike when it goes in and not make it worse than when it went in.
Sounds like bad luck to the OP. can't see how it happened but freak things do happen. Hope one way or another it gets sorted.
I had my bike serviced by the reprobates at Berkshire Bikes a couple of years ago. They made an ass of servicing it, and when I took it out the shop (about 30seconds) the bars spun round when I dropped off a kerb because the stem / steerer bolts were loose. I took it back 1 minute after leaving to complain and got told "I must have loosened them off to make them look bad". Not much you can do unfortunately, I just slate them at every opportunity.
QR Levers on disc equipped bikes go on the right. If it's not in 'the rules' it bloody should be.
Way back when there was that thing about QR wheels ejecting themselves from disc forks (the Annan effect) I did a lot of scientific testing and found that fitting the lever on the left prevented the skewer loosening under vibration.
Anyhow, something doesn't add up here - a bike with a completely loose front QR isn't rideable.
im guessing it was tightened by hand but then the lever not flickd to close, on the road was ok but it wasnt long after we went onto the offroad baths the vibrations would have made it looser causing the accident and damage occur.
Im not here to slag of hargroves they are a well known retailler and i was shocked that they even needed time to think on it as i thought they would have resolved tis immedietly i hope they will tommorow.
I just came on here for a bit of advice like if he did have any rights and what he could do to resolve this not wanting to kick up a fuss or sue anyone just want to be able to go riding with my mate on a safe bike.
Not to fan the flames here but....
Did he get the instruction book with he bike?
It will carefully explain over the first 1-100 pages that Cycling is dangerous and that you should check your bike before doing anything and that if anything happens it will generally not be anybodies fault....
I'm guessing the bike shop like some people on here can't fathom how the QR did what your saying.
Im not here to slag of hargroves
Your first post contradicts this. Any other 'facts' from the OP you've had rethink over?
You'd be amazed how many people think you tighten a QR by turning it rather than by camming it over.
Anybody who jumps on a new bike and rides it without giving it a good check over must be pretty trusting. I certainly wouldn't trust anybody else, shop mechanic or whoever to set my bike up.
A Q/R lever simply can't foul the disc, they don't/can't move that far in.
Got bikes spanning six decades and none can, some Mavic ones only have 90o of movement.
Am I not right?
Though my new Giant wheels caught me out, the Q/R levers aren't standard like we all know. These you do actually tighten by turning, then pull out the spring loaded lever to put it into the position you want.
In 20 years I've never seen a QR come undone. Even if the lever hasn't been torqued closed with enough tension the last part of the cam requires force to undo it. If it was so loose that it could flop open then you would notice the wheel moving in the dropout.
It's not hard to see why the shop wouldn't be falling over themselves to accept responsibility is it?
The story is basically: bloke falls off bike, on inspection after the accident the QR lever is open. This is hours after it left the shop, they don't know if he had the wheel out to put it in the car or whatever.
Probably plenty of us on here have noticed our QRs have loosened while riding for one reason or another, or had a crash and wondered exactly how part A has ended up jammed in part B.
That's not to say who, if anyone, is at fault, but you can see how it's far from black and white from where the shop is standing.
Heres a picture of the bike after it happened -[img] 
[/img]
Ive never ever experienced anything like this before and it happened to a barnd new bike not even hours out the store, i think it was because the quickrelease wasnt tightened but i guess it could have been something faulty out the factory
[img] [/img]<
i think it was because the quick release wasn't tightened but i guess it could have been [s]something faulty out the factory[/s] my mate fiddling with something he didn't know about
FTFY.
So have you heard back from the shop then? Maybe told them about how you're making these claims on a mountain bike forum?
Yeah think the QR lever is a red herring although working pics would help 😉 Doesn't sound great service by the shop although if you're demanding new forks etc. I could see why they'd be a bit hesitant - although you'd hope the bike was safe to ride I'd still do a few cursory checks myself before riding it. Your thread title isn't likely to get you any further with them either...
click for bigger. looks weird.
[url= https://photos-1.dropbox.com/si/tbd/L17tkToRc8jdSq36jpTCLldcQAOqyTvy76hdAx2N5CY/15434122/1340110800/7e15bee/IMG_0639.JP G" target="_blank">
https://photos-1.dropbox.com/si/tbd/L17tkToRc8jdSq36jpTCLldcQAOqyTvy76hdAx2N5CY/15434122/1340110800/7e15bee/IMG_0639.JP G"/> ?size=1024x768[/img][/url]
That picture just makes it look like the wheel has not been put back in right after whatever happened. Can't see any broken drop out, just chipped paint.
Not everyone who buys a bike is a competent mechanic. If you bought a new car would you check every nut and bolt before you drove it? The shop has a duty of care to provide the bike in safe and usable condition, that's the purpose of a pre delivery check. If they've neglected to do this then they are at fault, but your mate will have a tough time proving it, as they would be admitting liability. If their workshop is run correctly they should be able to trace who did the PDC and see the checklist. If the QR was tightened by hand and not cammed over then I think it's possible the wheel could have come out when cornering causing the damage to the dropout which, in turn, could've caused the QR to contact the disc.
ETA Can't see the pics, so judgment reserved.
Crazy legs no i havnt heard from my mate today or hargroves, just from reading comments and people saying that it shouldnt happen even if loose then perhaps its a factory fault weak skewer that bent under pressure.
im trying to figure out what happened exactly so can best aadvise my mate.
[img] 
[/img]
Hi Sam not sure if "Hargroves nearly killed my friend" but i do think you should be aloud to come on here for advice.
My advice is contact some at Hargroves, manger or someone like that and see if you can sort some thing out. best if you do it with you friend as you know more about bikes than him.
If I manage/work at Hargroves I would fix the bike or offer to pay for half or some, just for the positive publicity.
Never bought anything from Hargrove but this happening wouldn’t put me off.
What would put me off is if I had any issue and they would help me out it.
Sorry SW but if you think a weak skewer that bent is a possibility, you must know diddly-squat about bikes.
globalti- my chain snapped in two places at the same time last year, which i though was impossible but it happened.
But agree its not going to be a weak QR.
Cant see from the pic which bit is broken. Its it broken or scuffed paint?
Its going to be beause it was loose to start with.
If you look at any of the Shimano technical documents for front disc hubs and wheelsets, the orientation of the QR lever is always on the non disc side of the hub. That's how I've always done mine and always will.
globalti- my chain snapped in two places at the same time last year, which i though was impossible but it happened.
That happened to me once. I never worked out why, knocked me out and dislocated my fingers though.
ignoring all the other parts of this post for a moment...
I think it's a bit harsh all of you saying things along the lines of "he/she should have checked the bike before riding, idiot if you trust them etc etc."
Do you guys do the same with cars/electricians/gas boiler repair men as well?
Do you check all the wheel nuts on your car when you pick it up from the garage?
Regardless of *if* the original story is true or not you can't expect normal non-enthusiast cyclists to have the same intimate knowledge of their bikes as your or I, Any mechanic working on a bike in a shop has a responsibility to make sure it leaves in a safe condition.
Even when bikes go in for job X, you would still check stem bolts, QRs, crank bolts etc. as a matter of course and if anything obviously dangerous you alert the owner when they pick it up.
Do you guys do the same with cars
No but I would know if a wheel was loose, the fact it doesn't go in a straight line is a give away.
Can't see much from that picture - are there any other ones?
turns out as he turned the corner the quick release skewer lever swang into the disc and snapped the dropout on the fork bent the disc and skewer.
Which drop out is snapped - the one on the other side to that showing in the picture posted?
No but I would know if a wheel was loose, the fact it doesn't go in a straight line is a give away.
As previously mentioned on this thread, a lot of people don't get that you have to cam-over the skewer, they just spin them to tighten up.
They normally stay tight for a little while, especially on gentle terrain, but throw some bumps and hard breaking in and they unscrew pretty quickly, so it is not always immediately obvious.
And if you were referring to car wheel then again, not always, friend of mine almost lost a wheel on the motorway after having new tyres fitted, and the garage forgetting to tighten the wheelnuts on one wheel properly, but it took about 3-5miles before it went and it was very quick from "whats that rumble?" to "holy fudge, we're weaving all over the shop!" having been totally fine up until that point.
Point is not everyone would notice, you must have seen the type i mena, wobbling along the road with buckled wheel, or massive amounts of play on hub bearings. A lot of the time thats 'normal' to them if they've only ever riddent he same shonky bike.
I remember being totally shocked when I had to explain to a mate once that it was not normal for the back end of his (supermarket special) full sus bike to waggle around sideways like that. pivot was totally ****ed and he just thought it was normal.
You can't credit everyone with the same level of mechanical/bike knowledge as you and the vast majority of people on this forum.
From the photo it looks like a fairly simple case of skewer not done up properly (whether shop or rider is still up for debate), and resulting disc-skewer-interface maglement occuring.
(those cheaper cam skewers DO often open more than 180 degrees, seen it quite a few times where owner has just screwed them to tighten while in the open position...)
Almost looks to me like it wasn't done up in the first place and it's bounced loose. If that IS the case, then either the skewer never worked at all or your mate didn't check it properly.
That skewer is in the open position, and has swung open so far that the end of the lever has poked into the disc and been pulled around in the disc. When the lever then contacted the base of the fork, the continued pressure on the end of the lever pulled the axle out of the dropout.
To me, this looks like a case of 'loose QR', and knowing how well Shimano QRs work, I would have to say that it is likely that this wasn't fastened correctly before riding.
As to whose responsibility that is, ask a lawyer...
Do new bikes not come with warning stickers and stuff all over them?
that picture is weird
the skewer looks to be in the closed position yet the wheel is out of the drop out.
I have to ask if this is as a result of the crash, as opposed to the cause.
its not an easy one to answer
and if your mate locked up the wheel in a corner is it not reasonable to assume that he simply locked the brake.
just asking questions.
[img] 
[/img]
Do you check all the wheel nuts on your car when you pick it up from the garage?
Yes ALWAYS. And every time I do at least half of them are not torqued correctly.
I do it on the forecourt before I drive anywhere now.
I have never checked them and found them all to be correct. And that's from both Main Dealers and Backstreet Garages over about 20 years.
But I do get your general point.
If you look at any of the Shimano technical documents for front disc hubs and wheelsets, the orientation of the QR lever is always on the non disc side of the hub. That's how I've always done mine and always will.
However if you look at all the photos in the current parts manual all the hubs have the QR lever on the disc side.
[i]If you look at any of the Shimano technical documents for front disc hubs and wheelsets, the orientation of the QR lever is always on the non disc side of the hub[/i]
Pretty sure I have seen a Shimano doc where they specifically state the QR lever should be on the opposite side to the disc. But then Hargroves should know that.
For the record, I've used Hargroves loads (Fareham branch) and they have always been [s]exemplorary[/s] [s]exemplerary[/s] [s]exem[/s] excellent..
Here's a close up, full size.
Looks like the skewer is "open"
[IMG] 
[/IMG]
Hmm yeah that's pretty bad :p looks like when the open QR hit the fork it bent it inwards into the disc, probably wouldn't have rotated that far back on it's own. I see why you want a new fork now as well...
Obviously worth pursuing with them and considering legal action if it comes to it but this thread title is still a mistake
..but this thread title is still a mistake...
And If I was the owner of the bike shop, and threatened with legal action over the bike.
I would certainly threaten legal action back at you for the thread title.
Regardless of fault. It's a bloody stupid thing to do.
Just saying.
I woundn't threatened with legal action, just speak to them and get i sorted!
Hang on - for that skewer to be where it is (guessing it is now open), wouldn't it have to have been caught in the rotor and dragged round to there? ie. From the CLOSED position??
There isn't room for it to fit where it is without being dragged (maybe better: "ripped") round.
Unless the QR was inside the fork from the start...
scottfitz - Member
I woundn't threatened with legal action, just speak to them and get i sorted!
No! Silly! Far better to post inflammatory and possibly slanderous nonsense on the interwebz!
No! Silly! Far better to post inflammatory and possibly slanderous nonsense on the interwebz!
I don't agree with the title, i would change that if I was OP.
Should of kemp the shop name out of it.
But if the OP wants some advice on how to handle the situation why not ask us?
Still the best think to do is to contact Hargrove’s and speak to them!
Somethings wrong there in that pic.
An opened QR lever doesn't/can't double back on itself. Even locked it can't travel into the spokes. The amount the lever can travel is limited in both directions.
My best guess would be that the QR was loose and the wheel has dropped out and back in again trapping the QR lever there. That would explain why the axle hasn't returned to where it should be. Of course I'm just speculating. Though I stand by the fact that with the wheel in place the QR just can't foul the wheel.
Somethings wrong there in that pic.
An opened QR lever doesn't/can't double back on itself. Even locked it can't travel into the spokes. The amount the lever can travel is limited in both directions.
That's not true with the kind of cheap QR pictured. The lever that sticks out of the side of the end cap HAS got enough movement to double back on itself (and stick in a disc and then finish under the fork as pictured). I've a bike with that kind of QR in the garage and I've just been in to open it. You can even see the curve of the lever in the picture above.
The QR has flopped fully open, stuck in the disc and jammed up under the fork, forcing the QR endcaps out of the dropouts, destroying the tabs.
This probably happened due to the QR not being done up tight enough. It may have happened due to a faulty OR that does not close properly, but if that is the case then the QR will still be faulty and impossible to close properly - this should be easy to test.
Of the bikes I've seen recently purchased, all but one have had the QR lever on the left next to the disc (the exception being a Trek hardtail).
But a quick whizz around the Trek, Specialized, Giant and Cube websites shows all the QR levers next to the discs. Every single one.
